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ironpham 12-02-2009 10:21 PM

Ahhh, but I believe the old Konami code was up, up, down, down, left, right, left, right....I don't remember the a, b button combination though.

Zeraph 12-03-2009 02:52 PM

Apparently people have already started selling accounts :/

There was a level 30 on my team that was a complete newb and fed the other team nearly the entire game. This isn't normally too huge of a deal as you normally get at least one newb in random games..problem is the match making system gave the other team a legit lvl 30...that happened to be in the same lane...so you can guess how that turned out.

Jozrael 12-03-2009 02:56 PM

His ult gives 10/15/20% cd reduction. Recommended items are...recommended. Once you understand the game/hero, you're doing yourself a disservice by blindly following them and not seeing if there are superior items you can use in your build/teamcomp/counter to the enemy comp.

Heimer is getting a fairly big redesign. Enough that they still haven't figured out the half of it. That being said, like I said before, I don't think Heimer is super UP anymore, just that he takes a different style. He's certainly not top tier, but I don't think he's got his own little 'absolutely useless' category anymore.

And yea, the Riot code isn't quite the Konami code. They used it as their 'dev' password during patches for months. Basically, they'd turn on the servers without having the launcher update that, and manually enter with the code. Once we found out about it (like 1-2 months ago) they stopped using it for that xD. Now it's mostly used actually as a bugfixer, for people who encounter the Unavailable message when they shouldn't.

As a sidenote, the company they shipped their launcher out to sucks, and they're currently in the process of writing their very own :p.

By the by, I don't know if you noticed my off-topic post, but yea I'm putting LoL (and gaming in general) down for a bit. Gotta focus on school. I'll still swing by here to answer questions, and I'll prob be back to LoL at some point next year. You might've noticed I wasn't playing like 18+ hours a day anymore lately xD.

Happy LoLing :)

Zeraph 12-03-2009 04:51 PM

Yeah, I noticed :) youll be missed. Though I also have to admit its been nice playing in my own bracket :P Just finished a ~45minish game with 19/4/11! with katarina. Ahhh katarina, been itching to play her for awhile. Now that I finally have a handle on the game I don't wtf suck with her. But you are right, she's doesn't bring much to the table. She really only does well if your team is already doing well OR they have no CCers to stun you out of ult (in which case they prob arent doing well anyway).

I'm almost positive they don't but I figure I better ask just to be sure; Kat's bouncing blades or ult can't crit right? I woudn't think so but BB is one of the few abilites based on AtDmg and not AP so I'm not sure.

Jozrael 12-04-2009 01:19 AM

The only ability that can currently crit is Parrrley (but it is compensated by being the only dodgeable ability, not counting the new flash mechanic). Riot is slowly implementing quite a lot of atk-dmg based skills. I was going to be writing up a small thesis on that for them (on some balancing considerations) but I suppose it'll have to be later. Meh, that can wait.

Katarina MAY be due for a huge re-evaluation of her potential. Previously her ult, like Nunu, was just a big STUN ME button. Now, with the new cleanse functionality, I imagine that will be core on her (I'd imagine the mastery, too. It's worth giving up the offense/utility trees for). Katarinas ult can put out a crapton of dmg when it's not stopped, and now its not stoppable with cleanse >:).

No one in council has commented on this yet, but I'm sure they'll get around to figuring it out sooner or later. I'd rather not have to break my self-imposed silence, and hopefully I'll check the forums less as a result xD.

Someone needs to mention in Phreak's Council Digest (another thing I ended up not being able to do T_T) that cardmaster was bitched about, and at length :P. Not sure why he omitted that thread.

I'm glad you're ownin face in your bracket ;). Keep it up too long and you'll start moving up, though xD.

Vaultboy 12-04-2009 02:12 PM

bleh, all this system downtime sucks. haven't been able to play whole week.

Jozrael 12-04-2009 03:11 PM

Should be up by now. But yea, they had a LOT of stuff they needed to fix. They had patches, hotfixes, hardware that needed immediate replacement (and then followup work on that when it wasn't done perfect the first time).

And that's only what I know from browsing the forums, you guys might've had other ones too ;P.

On the plus side: CM is about to get focused on by Riot. Yay <3.

Vaultboy 12-04-2009 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jozrael (Post 2736182)
Should be up by now. But yea, they had a LOT of stuff they needed to fix. They had patches, hotfixes, hardware that needed immediate replacement (and then followup work on that when it wasn't done perfect the first time).

And that's only what I know from browsing the forums, you guys might've had other ones too ;P.

On the plus side: CM is about to get focused on by Riot. Yay <3.


Nope, still down. People are saying European IPs are blocked.

Jozrael 12-05-2009 10:46 AM

Lemme see what I can round up in H&S.

EDIT: Right you are. Here is the the thread detailing this. There is a workaround on the second page, but as Jesse says, please backup that file before deleting it, and replace it when you are done.

Vaultboy 12-05-2009 11:28 AM

doesnt work. The launcher tells me that all updates are up to date, and asks whether I am connected to the internet. No amount of log-changing or tricks changes the status. i'm tired of lol

Zeraph 12-05-2009 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jozrael (Post 2735975)
Katarina MAY be due for a huge re-evaluation of her potential. Previously her ult, like Nunu, was just a big STUN ME button. Now, with the new cleanse functionality, I imagine that will be core on her (I'd imagine the mastery, too. It's worth giving up the offense/utility trees for). Katarinas ult can put out a crapton of dmg when it's not stopped, and now its not stoppable with cleanse >:).

I think they need to re-evaluate her killer instincts. The brief dodge is nice after shunpo but it is by far her weakest skill. The added damage passive part of it for each successive hit sucks since she is all about hit and run and burst. Perhaps if they made it so that for every second she *doesnt* attack she builds up extra damage.

Vaultboy 12-05-2009 11:15 PM

pfft. just did a complete reinstall using the latest installer. Still says Server Unavailable "Are you Connected to the Interent" (sic), but installs all updates.

Jozrael 12-07-2009 08:42 AM

@Vaultboy: Use the Knowledge Database or the Help&Support forums to solve particular bugs. That one has an almost 100% fix with the arrow-code. (UP DOWN etc.) I'm sorry that it's not working out well for you, and I agree LoL is not as stable as it could/should be. On the plus side, it should get far more stable over time :P.

As for Kat, the Killer/Shunpo combo is AWESOME, as you said. I agree that it does not synergize perfectly with her Q. That being said, all the anti-healing skills got a major buff as of late, so perhaps it is better and I just haven't seen it in action.

But yea, Katarina comes up fairly often in high level play where she needs to be tweaked somehow. Not majorly redone like some heroes, just some tweaks here and there.

Vaultboy 12-07-2009 09:44 AM

Its fixed, for some unknown reason. Yesterday the arrows started working, and now its status is online again from startup. Nothing in the help forum mentioning a fix. The Store is black though.

On the plus side, a 40 minute game of LoL used to eat about 16Mb, now its down to 10. Hopefully soon they'll get it down to 3Mb, like Dota.

Jozrael 12-07-2009 10:51 AM

Wow, I didn't realize it ate that much of your bandwith. When I go back I'll try to talk to the devs about this.

Keep in mind they use vastly different netcode. DotA was P2P, LoL is client server. I'm not sure how either was specifically implemented, but obviously DotA's was superior for your particular concerns (minimizing bandwith).

(Disclaimer: I may have used one or several improper terminologies in the above post :P).

Vaultboy 12-07-2009 11:04 AM

Yeah, several of my friends dont play LoL purely because they play over 3G/HSPDA (ADSL is not an option for a vareity of reasons), but HSPDA bandwith is super-expensive, so 16Mb a game is unacceptable. I'm not that concerned, since I don't have a bandwith-heavy console game at the moment, or the time to play much.

What i like about LoL is that even with a latency of 300, I get great gameplay. With dota it was impossible to play on an international server - and even on a local server you struggled when pining > 100. The same goes for console games: I only ever play with local guys for the same reason.

Lasereth 12-07-2009 11:29 AM

Well I played Nasus and Tryndamere for the first time this past weekend and good god. I see why some champions are considered in different tiers now. As Nasus, SS every minion you can find, buy a bloodthirster and stark's and BF sword, GG. Walk into a team fight, watch your HP plummet, but then all of a sudden it's going back up. Fast. Critting people for 1/3 of their life bar everytime SS is up is amazing. I really like him.

Tryndamere took a practice match to get used to but the first normal game I played with him I went 18-1-15. This guy is sick. I've never seen DPS like this before, not even from Yi or Jax. Phantom Dancer + Infinity Edge and holy jesus...every attack is hitting for 500-750. Dropping same level champs in 4 hits is freaking hilarious. If the timing is right, and if your team sets up the fight correctly, Trynd can single handedly destroy the entire enemy team. I love this guy.

Zeraph 12-07-2009 12:34 PM

Yar, nasus has always been good. I actually got bored with him fairly quickly though for some reason even though he is basically my perfect character and the one I have always done best with. The new tryn is amazing. I can't wait to try him out. If your vs a competent tryn you *must* keep him CC'd and because of his invuln ult you basically have to wait and focus fire him last. This makes him almost an odd hybrid of tank-DPS/carry. He is Yi on steroids (i.e. useful). He obviously cant run down stragglers like Yi but his ult is 10x more useful in a competitive team fight. I have already seen it single handedly win several (because the team doesn't realize he poped his ult and wastes several valuable seconds beating on him).

My main prob with anti heal so far is that heal itself is too weak late game. I think all heals actually need a bit better AP ratios and slightly higher bases as well. I'd also give character based anti heal skills twice the dura of items like executioner. Seems kind of weak that you can get that same dang thing for ~1400 (plus crit plus lifesteal plus DoT). Sometimes I even get that on teemo for the lawls even when they don't have healers, cause I almost always get 1 or 2 kills from the extra dot from it.

I actually like playing chars like soraka and taric but I feel too weak end game. Early to mid game its great and awesome. But late I feel nothing more than a regen battery and near useless in the deciding team fights (of course, part of that I know is my play style, but I think the lack of sorakas and tarics speaks for itself).

So how does exp/ip work with ATs/premades? I was just playing a game with warstriker and didn't notice the normal -35% part but the numbers did seem low (86/64) so I'm wondering if they just don't show the -35% part anymore and it still applies or did they take away the exp/ip penalty of AT games?

Jozrael 12-09-2009 01:53 PM

Okiez, first up: My experience with the game is becoming slightly dated since I haven't played in several weeks. I mean, it's not like I'm totally clueless, but all I have to go on for new changes are patch notes, Council forum access, and intuition. It's pretty good, but not as good as actually playing the game.

Nasus is silly good. When playing against a Nasus, you HAVE to disrupt him. If you let him farm his SS to ridiculous levels it's GG. That being said, this is not very important right now as high Elo games are fast and furious in the current metagame. Most are over / decided by 15-20 minutes this patch. The pushing meta got totally revived as of late.

The real deal with Nasus is how gamebreaking his ult is in a teamfight. Tank him out (imo it's much better than going all those DPS items, since SS is item-independent. It obviously is better with items, but it gets almost as good when you're going tank, giving you the best synergy of invincibility plus ridiculous damage. Also with his the damage from his ult being item independent, it gives him crazy offense, and you itemize his defense, making the perfect hybrid) and own.

I haven't played the new Tryndamere, but *psst* there's some nerfs coming for him in the near future (next major patch). The next patch is gonna be awesometastic, almost as great as this one was for improving the meta. Long story short, yes, he destroys right now :p.

@Zeraph: Heal vs anti-heal is a very complicated meta problem to solve. Just last patch, healing was OP (at least in high tier games). You saw a Taric AND Soraka in most all competitive teams. People just didn't die; heal was far OP, even endgame. Now, this is where what I mentioned with my knowledge becoming dated comes into play: I'm not there to comment on the prevalence (or not) of S/T in high Elo play right now, cuz I'm not there ^^. But I don't hear people complaining that heal was overnerfed in Council, so I'm inclined to think that it's not yet a problem.


As for XP/IP: There never was nor will be a penalty for premaking. The 'penalty' for premaking is an artifical, temporary boost to your effective Elo. A 5 man premade has a HUGE boost to it's Elo, so if you're matched against solo queues, they will individually be much stronger players than you. As it is, 5 man premades statistically lose right now (they have like 40-45% chance to win from the matchmaker's point of view) because of all the QQ on the forums about solo v premade. MM 2.0 should fix a large part of these problems.

The penalty you were talking about comes from practice games. All practice games provide a -35% XP/IP gain. The teams must also be balanced (bots count the same as humans). This means you vs 5 bots earns you 0 XP/IP, but you vs 1 bot earns you 65%.

Also, once you reach level 11/12 (I forget which), you are only allowed 4 practice games per day. After 4, you receive 0% XP/IP.

86/64 seems pretty average for a nonboosted loss in normal games.

Zeraph 12-09-2009 02:11 PM

Interesting, I could have *sworn* I saw -35% a few weeks ago for premades. Thanks for clearing that up.

What does Elo stand for? I've asked this before and never gotten a straight answer :) With this talk of councils and whatnot sounds like some conspiracy lol

*All* else being equal, which should I go for, armor or magic resist?

Oh, and is there some exp hack? If I suspect someone is hacking, is there anything I can do? I was in this game yesterday were a tristana would go missing from the map (said he was jungling) then come back with several levels. He/she got to level 18 somewhere around the ~20 minute mark when everyone else was still lvls 9, 10, and 11 (BOTH teams). Everyone was like, wtf? She wasn't fed, only had 3 or 4 kills at the time, didn't have jungling items, etc. I've never seen anyone level anywhere close to that fast.

Jozrael 12-09-2009 06:27 PM

Elo = your invisible rating. You start with, I believe, 1200 or so. You gain Elo when you win, and lose it when you lose. A new account gains and loses a lot of Elo per game so the system can quickly find their rating. If you make an 'upset' (You beat a team that had a higher Elo rating than you), you earn more, and they lose more.

Council = one of the 4 community 'colored' names on the forums. Adjudicators (blue) were just in beta before July 14th. I missed by less than a week :(. Emissaries (green) are specifically tasked with helping the new player experience. They helped Riot write the tutorial, and wrote some other guides. They're very few in number and mostly idle right now; Riot will be retasking them soon. Council (yellow) have one or more of the following attributes: have a very very high Elo/are otherwise considered fantastic at the game, are or were part of an eSports backed team, run a league/other eSports function that's picking up LoL, or were invited by Riot/the Council. I'm not quite #1 quality, even back when I was top 200, but I hit #2 and #4. Wrenchmen (orange) are people who've spent a good deal of time helping out in the H&S forum. I'm one of these as well.

Keep in mind it's not just armor/MR, you also have to consider HP stacking (which, while more expensive, counters both types of damage). There is no one answer for armor magic resist, sorry. It's just silly to think you can reduce it to one or the other for even a general rule. It depends on your character, and your opponents.

There are currently no known 'hacks' for LoL. Bugs/exploits, there's one or two floating around. Are you somewhat exaggerating or are those numbers legit? 18 by 20 is pretty excessive. It is very possible to do a mixture of jungle and laning with certain chars, that is VERY potent. Basically, in between waves Trist rocket jumps her wraith camp, and picks up free gold/xp. It's very popular with certain champs. If he's grabbing runes, even more so. Other factors: they could've had someone getting them dragon (especially if she didn't help), towers, idk. There's a bunch of factors; I highly doubt it was a hack.

That being said, my eyes have bugged out a couple times too when the enemy solo just levels ungodly fast. I notice it most often with tryndamere when he combos solo mid with jungling.

Zeraph 12-10-2009 10:58 AM

What does Elo stand for? I mean, why call it elo and not abc?

I'm not exaggerating, the only thing I'm not as certain of is the exact time she reached 18. I know it was before the surrender point though because we ended up surrendering at about 30 minutes and she had been 18 well before surrendering was possible (it was so noticable because it was what turned the game around for their team and made us want to surrender). They had a zilean, but of course zilean, taking down towers, dragon and such helps their entire team, and she was just as far above her own team as she was above ours.

Oh I just reread what you were saying, yeah I guess that could have helped if she didn't leave her lane/solo jungle routine for dragon and such. Still seems wicked fast. And if its not a hack, I want to figure out the exact strategy for it so I can do it too :) For a DPS carry to be 8 levels above everyone else is a huge advantage. Especially since their own team didn't seem to take much of a hit in exp/team support.

Oh also, they weren't a premade nor was my own team, we were all mostly teens to low twenties (yay I hit 21) summoners and playing at about that level. Which is another thing that made me doubt some advanced strategy. So if it was legit she seemed to pull it off by herself.

Lasereth 12-10-2009 11:20 AM

I've seen a Warwick on my team level that fast. He was 18 when we were 10-11. He went 22-2-15 that match and was killing 3 enemy champs solo before they could retreat. He had like 17,000 gold earned that match so you can imagine his DPS.

---------- Post added at 02:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:18 PM ----------

BTW Fiddlesticks + Soraka laning together are DEATH <level 10. I was something like 6-0 before 10. We had 1st turret down at level 6, 2nd turret at 25% HP before level 10. We ended up losing because we stopped pushing lanes and began ganking and got carried away but good god. They traded lanes constantly -- Trynd, Rammus, Alistar, Soraka, it didn't matter who they threw at us, we had no trouble holding them off. Soraka as a lane partner is simply sick early game.

Jozrael 12-10-2009 11:37 AM

Elo <3.

I imagine he took the XP masteries, quints, and Zilean passive, and jungle/laned. His team got dragon every time it was up (and let him lane). Towers and kills round out the board (unless they got a reaaaaaaally early Baron, but I guess you would've mentioned).

And yes, Soraka is so good earlygame. :s. I'm not sure I like the way EC is changing the game: it's not out early enough to stop her earlygame DOMINANCE, but it shuts down any healing so utterly lategame.

Lasereth 12-10-2009 11:44 AM

Yeah no joke. I mean hell it's not too bad of a weapon to begin with but now it's a must for DPSers against any healers. Just right click on everyone during a fight.

Jozrael 12-10-2009 12:37 PM

EC was terribad before its buff; now its ehhh in some situations and dismantles healers in others. Not sure how Riot is going to approach it going forward.

Vaultboy 12-11-2009 05:46 AM

Lasereth, I think fiddlesticks + amumu/gang/nunu = anal rape if they ulti together. I've been in games (as one of them) where we've taken down 5 heroes if we time it right.

On another note, I think nunu is even more badass than nasus, simply because he requires zero skill to pwn with. With Nasus you need to learn to lasthit and item properly (to maximise that SS hit), but nunu is so easy I get bored.

But nasus in ulti form is terrifying. My cousin plays nasus and his runes are all crit chance and cooldown. He starts ( i think) with almost 15% crit chance, so you can imagine lategame he rapes face with 800+ crits and insane dps.

Lasereth 12-11-2009 06:22 AM

Yeah I usually do + damage as Nasus because Siphoning Strike is based on damage, and as far as I know, can't crit. A Bloodthirster and Infinity Edge on him is hilarious. SS drops them by 1/3 or even half their HP in one hit.

Zeraph 12-11-2009 12:40 PM

BTW tiamat (gives splash attack, dmg, regen, and armor i think? possibly lifesteal? I've only tried it a couple times), is a really underrated item, and while not great for hero killing (but not bad either) is a great first pick for many characters (I like ranged characters the most with it) because it allows you to get soooo many more minion kills its practically a free item after 15-20 minutes. My only hesitancy in taking it every time is how fast most games are decided now. And it doesn't offer as much as say malady would to a character like twitch. Although, apparently his ult works with it and makes it nice, but since he's such a roamer it makes it more of a borderline item again for him. I plan on trying it with tristana for some insane early laning power.

Lasereth 12-11-2009 12:49 PM

Man this game pisses me off like no other. Losing is one of the worst experiences I've had in videogames while winning is one of the best. Sometimes if we lose a close game I wanna uninstall the SOB right then and there, but then the next day I want to play it again. I'm really starting to get irked at how matches are single handedly lost by 1 player though. Yesterday I had a Twitch on my team, Summoner level 18. He used Ambush 4 times before the minions spawned at bottom and had 0 mana when the minions got there. Then he died at level 2 when he went through the river to try and ambush with no mana.

After dying, he came back to bottom lane after 5 straight minutes of sitting at the fountain. Now he was level 2. I was level 7, enemy laners were both 6. Of course they raped him as soon as he got near them.

We lost our turret soon after and he starts calling everyone fat niggers. How do people like this get paired with me??????? BTW first item he bought was Amp tome with no potions.

Zeraph 12-11-2009 02:04 PM

Hah, ya. I'm somewhat with you. I'm a little more easy going though and usually don't mind losing (hey, lowers my elo score which I kind of like :P).

EDIT above, turns out tiamat only splashes the 40ish damage the weapons gives. So it doesn't scale as well as I thought.

Zeraph 12-13-2009 11:09 PM

What's with the match making system the last 3 or 4 days? I'm getting paired with much lower skilled people vs the opponent team having all the higher skilled people. I'm carrying the team like, every time now and I keep losing. Used to win random solo queues about 2/3s of the time, now the ratio is more like I'm *losing* 3/4s of the time. Doesn't matter how well I do, I still often end with kills in the teens but my team loses.

Anyways, I don't recall it in the patch notes but did they implement that new match making system yet or have I just gotten a string of bad luck? What I really don't get is how all these losses haven't dropped my elo score so low I haven't been dropped down some brackets (and started seeing wimpier teams).

I know I know, ironic post coming after that last one.

Vaultboy 12-13-2009 11:42 PM

Just bad luck, i reckon. Some days I go on 8-match winning streaks, then on losing streaks. It comes down to being paired with high ELO players that carry wins, then ELO players being carried to wins. You can clearly see the difference: its fine when someone is just having a bad day, but when their understanding of team gameplay sucks, they have clearly been carried above their true ability.

What i would also like is for the matchmaker to match leavers with other leavers, and not with me.

YaWhateva 12-14-2009 12:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeraph (Post 2739120)
What's with the match making system the last 3 or 4 days? I'm getting paired with much lower skilled people vs the opponent team having all the higher skilled people. I'm carrying the team like, every time now and I keep losing. Used to win random solo queues about 2/3s of the time, now the ratio is more like I'm *losing* 3/4s of the time. Doesn't matter how well I do, I still often end with kills in the teens but my team loses.

Anyways, I don't recall it in the patch notes but did they implement that new match making system yet or have I just gotten a string of bad luck? What I really don't get is how all these losses haven't dropped my elo score so low I haven't been dropped down some brackets (and started seeing wimpier teams).

I know I know, ironic post coming after that last one.

I've been seeing the same thing lately, before my team would be all about my skill level but lately I've been getting people who are absolutely terrible and a few times the opposing team's lowest level was in the mid 20's. What is that? I hardly have time to play so I'm like level 12 and my teammates are all in the single digit level and the opposing team is in the mid 20's. One time though my team was in the late teens, and the highest level of the other team was 6. The match was over nearly instantly, it's getting kind of ridiculous.

Jozrael 12-14-2009 02:05 AM

Disclaimer: My personal experience with the game is stale; several weeks out of date. I'm still quite fresh on current Council/forum activity though, so my word isn't useless ;).

Wow I've missed this thread for too long @_@:

@Vault 127: No way. AoE was king last metagame iteration. Cleanse is king now. When the pendulum swings back a bit and anti-CC is nerfed a bit (maybe cleanse doesn't do such a good job at reducing magic dmg, if at all? We're hounding them on Council to fix Cleanse atm) AoE will be much more viable.

Nasus rapes Nunu on Summoner's Rift. Nasus is still god tier, whereas Nunu is mid tier. On TT, Nunu may easily outpower Nasus. Then again, this is at high Elo: you are correct that it takes less skill to roll with Nunu. Nasus' ulti is the main cause of his imbaness. I'm pretty sure I've gone into this before, but here is the reason Nasus is OP: Most champions have to choose between itemizing defense or offense, making tradeoffs. Nasus' offensive power is almost ENTIRELY item-independent: his SS and ult damage is based off non-item sources primarily. This means Nasus can itemize pure defense, making him a great tank, and still pack a super punch. This will be getting nerfed, unfortunately not soon enough.

@Lasereth 128: A SS can crit, but the extra dmg from SS is not critted. I.e.: If a normal hit does 100, and a SS does 300: a crit will do 200, and a SS crit will do 400. That being said, if you're not going pure tank Nasus adding crit is a great way to skyrocket your SS damage, even if the SS isn't multipled. Crit is crit xD. I have yet to achieve my goal of pure one-shotting someone with a SS crit, but I've done over 90% of their hp in one hit :(.

@Zeraph 129: Tiamat was considered UP before: it does give great all around stats, but doesn't excel in any one area (besides giving farm-shitty characters some viability there). I'd say it's a poor item choice on the large majority of champions: you hit the nail on the head that with games ending quicker, this is even more amplified. That being said, it's disgustingly awesome in some situations: I've seen Twitch, Jax, and others absolutely faceroll so many times when a team clusters too much in a teamfight.

@Lasereth 130: Unfortunately, it's a critical weakness of the genre that the weakest link often determines games. LoL both enhances and protects against this effect: death streaks and some other nifty mechanics make a feeder stop helping the other team nearly as much as DotA/HoN. However, LoL has far less capacity for 'supercarries', allowing you to ignore even multiple feeders on your team (see: Terrorblade / PA popping out of the jungle at 30-40 minutes in DotA and 1v5ing the enemy team :P). Rage afflicts everyone in LoL when you have an 'unjust loss', given to you entirely by poor play from a teammate. I don't mind losing close, good games, though, honest. They're the most fun I've ever had in any game, win or lose (though obviously winning is best ;D).

@Zeraph 131: Not quite. Tiamat splashes a percentage of your attack damage, so it does scale (it's just not 1:1). I believe it is actually roughly 20-40% of your attack damage that is splashed, though. It's been awhile since I examined the item, hence the large ambiguity.

@Zeraph 132: Bad luck. MM 2.0 is still quite a ways off :(, there's been no big changes lately. Luck has such a huge part to play in matchmaking just because of the sheer amount of human variance it can't account for. Premaking averages this out a TON, as you know. Also, your Elo dropping (when you don't premake) is not always a good thing, especially with bad luck. The poor players have almost as much of a chance to be on your team :P.

@Vaultboy 133: Very soon more harsh anti-leaving measures are going to be implemented (the CSS ones), and hopefully shortly thereafter the leaver/leaver queueing will be implemented (I know it's in MM 2.0, but hopefully Zileas will speed its entry with all the leaves going to be handed out once CSS leaving matters :P).

@YaWhateva 134: If your Elo hasn't climbed too much (as you said you haven't had enough time to play, so this is definitely the most likely case), you're probably seeing newb island premades. When people normally sheltered by newb island premake, they get kicked out into 12+ play, often with disastrous results. MM 2.0 solves this handily (or so Zileas claims).

Zeraph 12-14-2009 01:56 PM

Thanks for answering so many questions. I guess I've been pretty lucky up until now then, never had such a bad streak.

So with the new heavy penalties for leavers, will there be some kind of safeguard for disconnects? I'd really hate to get DC'd, get locked out for the portion of the game, AND get a leaver mark or whatever they're going to do. Granted, I see their problem as if they don't penalize DCs then the leavers will just pull their modem...Thanks goodness I have a decent connection.

Jozrael 12-14-2009 04:54 PM

The big change is CSS leaving. Basically, if you're in champion select screen (CSS), and you leave, you get a leaver mark the same as if you left during a game.

They're not changing the ingame system at all: disconnects won't punish you unless you still aren't back by the time the game ends. (Unfortunate if you JUST disconnected, though :P)

Zeraph 12-17-2009 04:12 PM

lawl omg, the new hero nidale is amaaazzzing. She has almost everything. AoE, sniper attack, traps, a heal *and* attk speed buff! She's really quick, and her cougar abilites don't cost any mana! Not even to shapeshift! Only thing she lacks is CC. Basically she went back in time and raped Udyrs essence. I still have a lot to learn though as she literally has 6 abilities, not to mention learning item builds. She's odd cause she needs standard carry items but she runs out of mana easily too, even with a chalice and really needs that mana in human form.

Despite all that though, she's not particularly good at ganking, can't go all godmode like nasus, is mostly good at just finishing, and pushing, and utility. A very solid hero, hopefully she won't get nurfed. I actually don't think she needs it.

Vaultboy 12-18-2009 12:26 AM

What i dislike a bit is that her two forms require completely different styles of play, possibly items too. I dislike the cougar form at present. Only useful for runing early.

I would have preferred her to have a slow skill (like bambi in dota) in human form, to align with the brush movement skill in cougar.

highdro69 12-18-2009 02:05 AM

Joz, do you know if passive poisons like teemo's and twitch's will proc off a Tiamat?

Lasereth 12-18-2009 10:41 AM

Right now I'm thinking Trinity Force, Guinsoo's Rageblade, Boots of Swiftness or Merc treads on Nidalee. She's fun as hell to play. Won a match last night as her, first normal game with her, had a positive K : D also. Her cougar form can put out some decent damage if you have a sheen type weapon on her. R and then QWE combo is pretty brutal, especially if they're low.

Zeraph 12-18-2009 11:17 AM

High- No it doesn't, I've tested it. Would be awesome sauce if it did :P

Vault- you must be doing something wrong with her cougar form then. Make sure you have sheen and eventually get either lichbane (if ap) or triforce if dps. Her cougar form abilities go off extremely quickly, my pounce is at 2.7 seconds. The cougar's Q can hit for crazy amounts if the champ is at low health, and the E cougar's AoE is pretty good. Pounce and the E AoE both hit for around 300 (both AoE) by 18 without any AP bonus. And both are on very short cool downs. Q can hit for even more. But like I was saying last night, she's not a true carry, so her cougar form isn't (and shouldn't) perform like Yi or something. And if they gave her a CC she'd be OP I think. She can already chase really well (use pounce while chasing even if you're not hitting them).

You should generally open in human form, spear, trap (since it has such a long placement), throw the heal on for speed, then cougar for burst dps, then back to human usually. I mean, the cougar form burst dps is like, ~1000 damage (2/3s AoE) before armor (not including sheen procs or auto attack dmg!) on like an ~5sec cooldown essentially. How is that not a good ult? The only drawback of course is that you have to go into melee and she isn't very tough.

Laserath- instead of Gunsoo's rageblade you should think about Nashoor's tooth. It's quite nice for her and has some mana regen. Very nice to build from after meliki pendant which I think is the best 1st item to get on her. I'm toying with even getting both, regardless of build.

Possibly, meliki, sheen/boots, nashors, then maybe rageblade. I know that doesn't seem optimal from a sheen/cougar point but it just seems to work with her. Not sure why. Then lichbane and rylais or triforce later of course.

Jozrael 12-18-2009 04:02 PM

Yea, I've been hearing fabulous things about Nidalee.

Tiamat doesn't splashes any effects; just straight up auto-attack damage.

And wow. I realize how outdated my experience is fast becoming by Zeraph's last paragraph :(. I can't comment on an optimal build at all T_T. Here's hoping I can come back sooner rather than later.

Zeraph 12-18-2009 05:37 PM

joz Isn't the semester over? What's holding you back?

edit: yikes. Just had the worst matchmaking experience ever. Them: all upper 20s literally 28s, 29s. Us: Me (24), a 2, 3, 5, and some low teen. And these weren't sucky high summoners and good low level summoners no, they played their level. It was over in 20 minutes. Total rape. My worst game ever. Didnt even get 1 kill. It paired us in like 30 seconds. It couldn't wait another 10 and give us a more appropriate match up? WTF?

Jozrael 12-19-2009 06:56 AM

Most probable explanation: Your team was a 4-man premade + you, kicking them out of newb island. The other team was all very medicore to bad level 30s/had had severe loss streaks/other human variance.

I mean, either that or an actual MM bug (which does happen, though rare). If you think it was too extreme a case, post it in the 'give me bad matchmaking examples' thread Zileas posted, with as much detail as you can (players in the game, time it happened and time zone, etc.) Maybe you'll uncover a bug :3. That's happened half a dozen times in that thread, and the MM code has improved as a direct result.

And I don't know when I'll have the time. I'm not home yet, and when I do there's lots of family issues going on (gpa with cancer, etc.).

Zeraph 12-19-2009 01:03 PM

Sorry to hear :(

Vaultboy 12-19-2009 10:49 PM

Ye Joz, sorry to hear about that. I know that psychologically it can be very draining.

Zeraph: I'm still not convinced by Nidalee, despite your 12-4 stats at one time. Maybe she's just not my style.

highdro69 12-20-2009 02:40 AM

Just tried my first hand at AP Sion, and I don't like it. The AOE dmg is nice for farming, and against a caster stacked team, I could see the shield being very nice, but I suppose I just prefer to be a head bustin' DPS Sion (infinity edge, black cleaver, last whisper, etc..)

@MM System. I don't think it likes my friends. Whenever I play solo, I 9/10 win, handsomely, going like 14-2-15. But when I'm doing AT with some friends, we 9/10 lose. But when they play without me, they seem to have a 50/50 chance of a win. I can understand my ELO putting me against crappy players, but if I've got such a "low ELO," wouldn't I usually get destroyed in my solo games as well? I dunno, you guys seem to have some better insight into the match making system than I do, was hoping for some solice hehe.

Jozrael 12-20-2009 07:32 AM

Well, if you're playing big premades (5 man especially), you get a boost to your effective Elo, meaning you face much tougher opponents. Also, if any of you guys have big differences in your Elos, the anti-smurf mechanic kicks in. Basically the lower player gets a several hundred point boost to their Elo (because the matchmaker doesn't want to give a team the capability to tank their Elo with smurfs for easy wins). This means your average Elo is WAY higher than it should be, and generally you get stomped. If you play enough of these games, your Elo will drop to the point where you are underrated. When you go to play solo queue, you get much easier games than you should be (90% win ratio is unheard of except at the very top .5% of players, so matchmaking definitely has you misjudged).

Thanks for the well wishes. I liked AP Sion when he was FotW, didn't play him too much afterwards. Never played phys Sion.

Lasereth 12-20-2009 08:16 AM

Still loving Nidalee. Even if I lose, I always have a good score as her. Her heal heals for a ton and is a great constant buff. The cougar form is fun too. She is really squishy though.

Vaultboy 12-20-2009 08:44 AM

Just played as Taric (probably the worst voice-acting evar, but I like him a lot), and laned with Nidalee. We pushed our lane so easily - could stay out and recall when my tp cd'd. We also had Mundo and Soraka (and Ashe), and just outleveled our opponents and pushed at the end. They had better heroes, but non of us fed and we controlled the game. Pretty boring stuff. Riot needs to find beter ways to kill heal. It reminded me of playing against Omni and Bambi.

Zeraph 12-20-2009 11:46 AM

Laserath- what do you mean by she heals a ton? I've seen a few people say this but her heal is the worse single target in the game (not by a lot but still). Or wait, actually is it? I can't remember tarics atm (but his heals himself too), either way, its at least the same and I don't see any Nidalee heal centric character builds in the future.

But yeah, she is oddly squishy even with some defensive items. In a game I was doing quite well in, I was easily above the enemy gangplank and he was by himself. I thought, easy kill! Ran up, and crit crit (he didn't even use his ult)..wtf there goes almost all my life...it was a close fight, I almost got him. But his parrley crit the shit out of me and got me before I could even shift and heal. She's a good character but I think that rightt here proves she is a hybrid and not a true carry or gank character and not in need of a nerf.

Vault- Did they use executioners calling (or called something like that). That right there is already a very good mechanic to stop healing during fights. Sounds like you faced newbs. Its a cheap item, like ~1400, (this is all just off the top of my head) and gives crit, lifesteal, a 50 point dot, and 60% less heals on target for 12 seconds! Plenty of anti heal. Anytime I see a competent healer in game I get that item on almost any of my characters. Early game the dot plus debuff almost completely negates healing received on the character im focusing. And that's only from hitting them once on an auto attack. Don't even have to activate it...Late game, frankly heals just don't mean as much (cause of the crazy burst dps and stuns possible) and the percentage part of the debuff scales well anyway.

Redjake 12-20-2009 04:02 PM

Nothing is as satisfying as building a fully-Feast-stacked Cho'gath with lots of HP and armor. You just move around like a huge fat pig and eat everything in your path. My last match I was taking on turrets by myself, even with Cho'gath's non-existent turret-buster abilities. The turret would take down less than one tick of HP per hit hahahaha.

Cho'gath gets fucking huge!!!!!!!!!

Zeraph 12-20-2009 04:56 PM

Cho is a beast.

In other news I just had a great game with fiddlesticks. There was a ~45 second period that belonged in an action movie were the henchmen come at the hero one by one cause I solo'd there entire team and lol'd :)

Zeraph 12-21-2009 10:03 PM

Any solid item builds for shaco? I normally thought sheen was a must have early item but now I'm not so sure. I just played a game against a really really good shaco who said trinity force cancels shaco's passive 20% bonus damage from behind. I forgot to ask if that applied to sheen as well but I assume it does as he didnt bother with sheen early game. He basically just built him all out DPS. Know anything about that?

Vaultboy 12-22-2009 03:30 AM

Hmm, I finally figured how to make nidalee work for me. I go:

Catalyst > Rod of ages
Sheen > Trinity force
and a third item depending on the matchup. I can go rageblade, veil, executioner, or lichbane, depending. Sofar the results have been good.

Lasereth 12-22-2009 06:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeraph (Post 2741402)
Laserath- what do you mean by she heals a ton? I've seen a few people say this but her heal is the worse single target in the game (not by a lot but still). Or wait, actually is it? I can't remember tarics atm (but his heals himself too), either way, its at least the same and I don't see any Nidalee heal centric character builds in the future.

You act like you have to modify her build to make her a healer. Just buy the same old AP hybrid build with trinity force and whatever else you want and her heal still heals for a lot. I checked it and her heal heals for much more than Kayle's, about the same as Taric's, and very slightly worse than Soraka's. Taric and Soraka are pure healers. Nidalee's heal healing for 5-10 less than pure healers is pretty good if you ask me!! Plus it's on a very short cool down. The cooldown is much better than Kayle and Taric's heal, and about the same as Soraka's. Plus her heal also gives you huge attack speed bonus. Not bad for a hybrid heal that doesn't even have to be built different than her trinity build!

Zeraph 12-22-2009 01:55 PM

Are you sure Kayle can heal? I'm not a kayle player at all, but looking over his abilities I don't see a heal skill. Also I wouldn't consider there to be any pure healers in this game. Soraka the most healerish ya, but she's not a horrible mage either. Her silence is pretty nice (silences for 3.5secs and does a decent amount of damage) and she has one of the best aoes in the game when you consider its cooldown (just under 3secs with only a little CD reduc). Once or twice for fun I've tried playing her offensively, and while I wouldn't recommend it (not nice taking kills from carries, won't work in truly skilled games) I've lead the team in killing blows with her. Taric can be a tank or a melee beast as well as a decent healer in skilled hands.

Anyways, you'd know more about it than I having played the healer champs more. But I have played a dozen games with taric and soraka and I have a much, much easier time keeping my team up with those two than nidalee. If I had to chose basing a team around a good soraka, taric, or nidalee, I'd pick soraka or taric everytime. I <3 nidalee but I am just not seeing the support numbers you are.

vault- glad to see you've found something that works. Keep in mind triforce and lichbane buffs don't stack.

I did some testing with shaco and got mixed results. Somehow I was occasionally getting the same damage whether I was behind something or not. It seems like there might be an occasional bug with his 25% passive. Sheen and triforce I don't think affected it but not sure.

Also, when he uses his ult, does his mirror image receive and apply all the bonuses from passives like bloodrazer? so essentially I get 8% health in magic damage from bloodrazor if my clone is out right?

I tried building shaco with some attack speed and more straight up carry type build and it worked pretty dang well. I just chew through people so much easier. I really thought speed and crit and such would be more of a waste than damage since those stats don't help his deceive skill, but now I'm finding that skill is more useful for position and escape than damage. Still good but his clone seems to be best, then shank, then deceive, then jacks. Wish they'd buff that. Make it so only 1 can be out at a time so they can have more immediate combat usefulness. I love the idea but they just generally suck right now.

Jozrael 12-22-2009 03:52 PM

In comp games, heroes aren't really built to be healers. Taric is an aura bitch, and Soraka has far more utility than her Q. She buffs single target armor, grants earlygame mana, silences, a great aoe with magic resist debuffs. Only her ult makes her more healery.

If you look at DotA, they mostly kept this theme. Dazzle and Omni for example: neither was a healer, but a hybrid that filled many roles at once. This is simply because straight out heroes are borrrring :P

And yes, Kayle can heal. Her W skill gives 10% bonus movespeed and a minor heal. At various times its interacted with Vengeance, but I don't think it has any correlation atm. I can't say with certainty though :(.

Shaco crits just fine with Sheen and Trinity Force: just keep in mind that THEIR damage is not amplified by his skill (they don't crit).

And yes...Shaco receives EVERY item effect. Its gross. His boxes were nerfed hard because of nests. Shaco players would hide 6 stacks of them, then lure opponents into them for absolute wtfkerpwn rape. And if they were in brush, there was nothing you could do about them.

I personally agree they need a minor survivability buff.

Zeraph 12-22-2009 04:48 PM

Ok, but does sheen add my original base damage or my damage after my items are taken into affect? I'd think the former and that seems to correlate with my observations but the wording is confusing as under stats panel items are included in base damage.

So if that was confusing:
base, no items: damage-100 + sheen I do 200 damage right?
base dmg-100, + 50 from item, + sheen, do I do 300 or 250?

This is not taking into account shaco's deceive (I get that part; its additive not multiplitive when criting)

Jozrael 12-22-2009 08:46 PM

Base damage. There's very few 'double damage' effects that take into account items. I think Rocket Punch might be one of them. I'd have to go back and cull the forums for the answers to these, sorry.

achillesheel 12-23-2009 02:18 AM

Are there any beta invites left? I'd LOVE to get into this game, it looks awesome! PM me please

Lasereth 12-23-2009 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeraph (Post 2742117)
Are you sure Kayle can heal? I'm not a kayle player at all, but looking over his abilities I don't see a heal skill. Also I wouldn't consider there to be any pure healers in this game. Soraka the most healerish ya, but she's not a horrible mage either. Her silence is pretty nice (silences for 3.5secs and does a decent amount of damage) and she has one of the best aoes in the game when you consider its cooldown (just under 3secs with only a little CD reduc). Once or twice for fun I've tried playing her offensively, and while I wouldn't recommend it (not nice taking kills from carries, won't work in truly skilled games) I've lead the team in killing blows with her. Taric can be a tank or a melee beast as well as a decent healer in skilled hands.

Anyways, you'd know more about it than I having played the healer champs more. But I have played a dozen games with taric and soraka and I have a much, much easier time keeping my team up with those two than nidalee. If I had to chose basing a team around a good soraka, taric, or nidalee, I'd pick soraka or taric everytime. I <3 nidalee but I am just not seeing the support numbers you are.

Her heal is so strong that it's getting nerfed.

And I'm not saying you should be a heal bitch as Nidalee, but in human form, it's ridiculous not to use it because it pretty much IS as good as the other heal abilities in the game.

Jozrael 12-23-2009 10:29 AM

@achillesheel or anyone else wanting to play:

This game is out of beta, and it is free to play. You don't need an invite, just head on over to League of Legends Index, create an account, download the game, patch it up, and start playing. If you need any help feel free to ask here.

Vaultboy 12-24-2009 02:51 AM

Hmm, Udyr is the bomb after his remake. Easy to learn, he is a flexible support hero. I dunno why people still complain about him.

Jozrael 12-24-2009 08:17 AM

And he's getting further buffedzorz. IMO, he's going to be at least moderately OP at the competitive level this patch.

The new champ is interesting. No consensus on him yet.

Zeraph 12-24-2009 10:29 AM

I agree. Just tried the improved Udyr. Wow, I can not only take on Yi, but chase him down! Granted he doesn't put out the numbers of course Yi can, but he's much more survivable. Its really funny to see Yi's come to gank me as Udyr, then turn around in surprise as I'm not running and chewing through his hps faster, then see him turn tail and run and boom, bear form biatch! hehe.

Udyrs main problem, much like nidalees cougar form, is that it has little place in team vs team skilled fights where there's tons of CC around. And if udyr can't shift/attack then he's fairly weak.

Jozrael 12-24-2009 02:50 PM

Theoretically, I'd imagine Udyr's stun to be incredibly useful assuming you can spread it around. What other character has a potential stun every single second?

Vaultboy 12-25-2009 01:00 PM

wow. just been on my worst run ever. 8 straight losses, the worst being 2-26 ( i ot one kill and one assist). Matchmaker sucks. Been matched with total noobs in some of the games - guys still learning to play.

Zeraph 12-26-2009 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jozrael (Post 2742615)
Theoretically, I'd imagine Udyr's stun to be incredibly useful assuming you can spread it around. What other character has a potential stun every single second?

Stun every single second, huh? Its once every 5seconds maximum for 1 second as far as I know. But I've only played him once and that's from memory. I'll check in a bit.

edit: ahh, its 1sec max per 5sec each person. so in theory you keep could keep everyone stunned 1/5th the time, assuming they all cooperate, stay within melee range, and you don't want to switch stances...

Zeraph 12-26-2009 07:15 PM

I find it amusing how many people QQ nidalee is OP, but now that she's off the roster no one's playing her. Apparently not OP enough to buy.

Lasereth 12-26-2009 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeraph (Post 2742932)
I find it amusing how many people QQ nidalee is OP, but now that she's off the roster no one's playing her. Apparently not OP enough to buy.

I think an overwhelming majority of people who play LoL don't buy anything. Not even the retail pack. Even a lot of the pros in the top 500 don't own the retail package, much less the champion's bundle. This is just from what I've seen on the forums though.

Vaultboy 12-26-2009 11:10 PM

This week's roster sucks. I cannot see how you can put 5 dps heroes in, knowing that Ashe is also present in every bloody game. I seriously think Ashe deserves a nerf just for that, or that she should be rebuilt.

Zeraph 12-27-2009 09:25 AM

Meh, Ashe seems fine to me. If her ult is down, which it usually is cause most people waste it, all she has is 2 skills, only one of which does damage. Volley's DPS (its actually fairly weak, its her auto attack dmg + 70ish but it can't crit) is mostly for last hitting/kbs, so she's basically auto attack with a slow 90% of the time. Easy to use, but hardly OP.

I like this week's roster, annie, cho'gath, anivia, the new udyr, and twisted fate. Mhmm. But I see your point about them missing another tank.

[/COLOR]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lasereth (Post 2742945)
I think an overwhelming majority of people who play LoL don't buy anything. Not even the retail pack. Even a lot of the pros in the top 500 don't own the retail package, much less the champion's bundle. This is just from what I've seen on the forums though.

Buy/unlock whatever. Everyone I know has bought or unlocked at least several of their favorite heroes if they haven't already bought the game. So i dunno what you're talkin bout. As well, every game I'm in there's almost always at least 2 heroes not on the roster in the game per side (once the newness of the new roster has worn off after a few days).

Vaultboy 12-28-2009 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeraph (Post 2743004)
Meh, Ashe seems fine to me....she's basically auto attack with a slow 90% of the time. Easy to use, but hardly OP.

I'm not saying she's OP - unless you feed her, she's fine (like Yi), but I'm tired of seeing her IN EVERY GAME. I'm saying she needs nerfing to push players towards playing other heroes as well. I would have said increase her price, but most players seem to own her already, so that wouldn't work.

Lasereth 12-28-2009 08:55 AM

I am sick and tired of seeing Ashe and Yi in every match.

Zeraph 12-28-2009 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lasereth (Post 2743207)
I am sick and tired of seeing Ashe and Yi in every match.

Indeed. But vault I don't think nurfing is the answer. That's a pretty dick move to people who love to play them as their mains and not because they're fotm or op or whatever. I think the next new hero needs to be an easy to play 450ip hero like yi or ashe instead of nidalee or udyr. Then I'd think you'd see less yi or ashe if there were more substitutes for them.

Jozrael 12-28-2009 01:22 PM

Nerfing a hero due to popularity is IMO a poor decision: finding ways to incentivize other behavior, as Zeraph said, is the better choice.

Zeraph 12-28-2009 07:29 PM

epic moment: 1v1 we both killed each other at the same time. Not through DoTs either, or travel time through air, but both on an auto attack at melee range!

Vaultboy 12-29-2009 01:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jozrael (Post 2743250)
Nerfing a hero due to popularity is IMO a poor decision: finding ways to incentivize other behavior, as Zeraph said, is the better choice.

Yeah, I agree, but there are enough easy to play 450 ip heroes. None of them can rape as much as ashe and yi do, however, so disincentives would work better than incentives. Or....
When are Riot planning to move on to other game modes? instead of blind picks, I'd prefer a Random Draft mode, which would allow for some counter-picking and deeper strategy.

Jozrael 12-29-2009 08:03 AM

That's pretty sweet Zeraph :D. What was the matchup?

@Vaultboy: It really depends on the player and Elo bracket as to which heroes dominate. Twitch, lately, has been DESTROYING at high Elos (especially when combo'd with Kayle).

As for game modes, we're IMPATIENTLY waiting on Riot to get its act together re: draft mode. It's quite late on that one >:(.

Zeraph 12-29-2009 12:10 PM

Ashe (me) vs Nasus.

Vault- in the matches I play I've never had an Ashe dominate, lead in KBs sure, but never really carry a team. Yi can dominate, but not really till he's fed and till mid-late game. Early to mid game he's meh. Which is about right for a true carry. I'd say Yi is about perfectly balanced, Ashe I think actually needs a slight boost (get rid of the +gold skill and add some sort of close ranged burst dps skill or an increase in survivability but not killability by maybe giving her a knockback arrow similar but weaker to tristanas ult).

So far my experience has been that the truly scary carries are well played (emphasis on the well played) shacos, tryndameres, and twitches. Shaco is seeing a big increase in popularity for some reason even though he's only had a very minor buff to jacks fear radius. Anyways, they all have the ability to get early reliable kills, as well as the ability for TPK (total party kills).

Ashe is like teemo, elusive and good dps but they lack the ability to plow through entire teams and go down very easily if caught unlike the above.

PS Joz looks like im going to beat you to 30 I'm 28 already! (I still don't think I'm as good as you though >< )

Jozrael 12-29-2009 05:12 PM

Haha, nicely done. I actually might be able to start dropping in this week. If not, the next probably. It won't be as often as before, though :(. Most of my LoL time lately is forums/trying to cozy with Riot so I can work there :p. T'is ma dream job :3.

I heartily agree with everything you mentioned Zeraph: are you sure you don't have Council access? That's pretty much what's going on in there right now re: those heroes.

Zeraph 12-29-2009 05:46 PM

Riot would be cool to work for. Put in a good word for me if you get a job ;)

What are you going to college for? Something in programming?

Haha nope. Thanks. I like analyzing things and have had a lot of practice.

Lasereth 12-30-2009 12:10 PM

I'm now to the point where I can play ~25 champions very effectively.

So far the champions I feel the most useful as are Blitzcrank, Cho'Gath, and Nasus.

The rest of the champions are very dependent on your team synergy and whether or not your teammates are >60 IQ. Playing carries is fun end game, but if your team screws up bad early game or mid game then the carries never reach their full potential, while Blitzcrank is useful at any level, any part of the game, regardless of how well you're doing.

Gonna try getting good with Annie next after she waltzed into my lane last night, only 1 level above me and my lane partner, and proceeded to double kill us without effort. :(

Zeraph 12-31-2009 12:11 PM

If you want a great defense against crazy annie ganks, get banshee's vale. She can only stun every 5 spells, so her combo is set once she gets that ready. Which means she can't knock it off with her quick casting spell (or she can but she'll waste her stun). After that you only have to worry about a very close casting cone which she shouldn't be able to get close enough to you since she didn't stun you, and tibbs her ult, which is well an ult and she can only pull off every so often.

She could of course, wait till 4x spell energy to knock off the vale, but then you'll have plenty of warning.

Sorry, but I have to brag a little. I'll probably never play this good again :P I just had an amazing game with Kat. I was so focused, got two quadkills (actually killed all 5 of em but apparently one was a few seconds too far apart to count for a pentikill) in a row! We were pushing around lvl 16, killed em mid, then when they respawned we had another fight at their inhib and did it again! Best game I've ever had. So damn close to that elusive pentikill though ><

Best part was I pulled this off against decent elo players, they had 2 30s (the rest 20s) on their team, several stunners, no feeders, a blitzcrank (i.e. kat'sbane) etc. Even with that push the game lasted another ~15 minutes. Ended the game with 24/4/11 ~40 minutes. Next highest score was 10kbs!

Lasereth 12-31-2009 12:36 PM

Damn!!!!! I've only got a handful of triple kills and never a quad kill. I see Fiddles get triples all the time, and even quads, but I've never gotten more than a double kill as him for some reason. I probably use ult too soon.

Lasereth 12-31-2009 06:09 PM

Just saw my first Pentakill in game. Enemy twitch was fed and was doing well so I put down a ward. We see him and kill him fast. Then his team comes in...and he resurrects from Zilean's ult, uses spray and pray and heal, and our whole team is dead in 5 seconds. Ha ha ha ha ha

Jozrael 01-01-2010 02:33 PM

Yea Twitch is getting silly atm :P

Zeraph 01-02-2010 11:47 AM

Ding, 30! Yay. And just for giggles; 146 won, 127 lost 0 left (about 90% solo queues,) 14! heroes unlocked all with IP, no cash spent (I realize I should have just bought it :P but I'm weird like that) full page of runes (mix of tiers..since I focused on heroes, don't care about being 2% better) ~8% CDReduc, 3% crit, 3% dodge, (and about to buy a quint) 1.5% move speed, and 30 health.

Considering that I'm still enjoying playing, this game has given me the best bang for any buck I've ever seen (being free). And at about 270 games, thats like, ~165 hours probably of play? Wow.

Lasereth 01-02-2010 02:36 PM

Yeah definitely an amazing game for being free.

I'm almost 28. I think I'm 86 won 78 lost right now, 75% solo queue, 20% with 1 friend, 5% with more than 1 friend.

I have all champs but Nidalee and Udyr. Udyr just wrecked the shit out of the enemy team last round with a couple of triple kills so I'm thinking about getting him.

So far I haven't followed any of the rune suggestions on the forums. I have 1 full page of tier 3 mana regen so at level 1 I have 9.3 MP5, with 13 something MP5 at 18. That means that I rarely ever have to buy mana regen for any champ which is AMAZING.

I also have a full page of attack speed runes. Right now I'm at 29% increased attack speed if I use that page. At level 30 it will be almost 35% attack speed increase. With masteries, almost 40% which is rofltastic if you ask me.

I just don't get why you would get like 3 health regen, 3 mana regen, and 6 attack speed. Or a mixture of others. I like a huge boost on 1 stat because it feels tangible. If I buy a Meki Pendant at level 1, and use my mana regen rune page, I can visually see my mana bar going up at any given moment. That's freaking ridiculous early game@!!

Zeraph 01-02-2010 05:00 PM

Indeed, its nice stacking 1-3 stats. My problem is I jump around a ton between heroes though. So I can't really plan for which runes to get. Now that I'm 30, and I think I'm done unlocking after I get teemo, I'm going to start thinking more strategically about rune pages...not sure which direction I'll go.

So how are the unique/utility quintessences? The less time spent dead ones actually seem a bit intriguing. With that plus mastery that's 25% off death time. I know a good team isn't supposed to die...but imagine a team based around that, + revive. You'd never be able to knock em out it seems like. Sooo many times when we're pushing we get the tower or inhib just as they're respawning. If they had respanwed even 10 seconds earlier they'd have had a chance to save it.

Jozrael 01-02-2010 07:13 PM

Consider that at endgame 25% off is almost 20 seconds, that's very considerable.

That being said, it is considered a useless/newb rune :P.

I lurve LoL, and I'm pretty inspired by the example Riot sets. Still working towards internship :s.

I hope the TR changes to Udyr don't go live. He's so ridic on those games.

Just been doing tons of work on LoL lately, t'is fun :D

Zeraph 01-02-2010 07:39 PM

How come your name on the LoL forums is Jozrael too but in game its Skystriker? OMG smurf account you cheater! ;P

OMG theyre buffing udyr even more?

What kind of work do you do? Is there anyway I can get involved?

Vaultboy 01-02-2010 11:15 PM

yeah, i've also been wondering which runes are best. I decided not to stack a page full of one rune, simply because i still have to unlock most heroes, so I've gone for a single flexible page that I can use for anyone. I have Red = Crit Dmg; Yellow + Black = regen; Blue = cd reduction. Not ideal, but its ok for now. I think I'm level 25, with a 88:84 win-loss ratio.

Lasereth 01-03-2010 03:47 PM

My flavor of the month right now is Tristana. Jesus H titty fucking christ her DPS is incredible once you get a top tier weapon. Now that's the definition of carry. Give her a Black Cleaver and Phantom Dancer, or Bloodthirster and Phantom Dancer, or any combination of those and it gets absolutely ridiculous. A true tank killer. Rammus runs in with damage shield up with all +armor items and he still drops in a few seconds. I really like her. I bought the elf skin ha ha ha ha ha

Zeraph 01-03-2010 06:23 PM

I like tristana, but my main issue with her is that her ult is rather weak. But maybe I just haven't found enough creative uses for it, as I don't play her much. One fun trick though, is as soon as you hit 6 and they get near your tower, rocket jump over their head and ult them into it :) Doesn't work on good players though, as they smell that trick a mile away. You should also try her with phage/frost mallet. Its one of her key items.

Oh, and as far as runes, I don't think its been said, maybe its obvious maybe not, but you get better returns for certain types stats on certain runes over others. Like blue is caster stats, where you get best CD reduc, ability, and mana regen. So picking 3 stats is the best bang for your buck. Red is physical DPS, IIRC, and yellow is defensive.

Lasereth 01-04-2010 07:07 AM

I was 86-83 last week. Then I started playing Tristana and now I'm 101-85. Definitely the biggest winning streak I've ever had in LoL.

Jozrael 01-04-2010 12:14 PM

I have multiple accounts cuz Riot is lamesauce and buggy. Long story.

And omg my brain does not have enough channels for all this LoLerey that I am trying to simultaneously accomplish. I need clones of myself.

Vaultboy 01-04-2010 12:15 PM

tristana has been my favourite from the start. you should play her on twisted treeline. rocket jump = absolute rape.


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