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hagatha 08-01-2007 10:31 AM

Quest for Meaning in Film
 
So, a friend of mine teaches a philosophy class at college and he shows films. The class is called "Quest for Meaning". The films he shows are intended to demonstrate an individual's transformation after a devastating personal event. For example, The Big Lebowski is one that he commonly screens for the class.
Myself, I'm not sure about that one, but we argue all the time so that's not unusual.
Anyway, I was thinking that this was probably the best place to get some feedback on films that would fit this criteria. To me, this is a common plot line but for the life of me I can't even think of one film that does it really well. I think it's just too hot to think.

ratbastid 08-01-2007 10:45 AM

The devastating personal event in Lebowski is that his rug gets peed on? :lol:

hagatha 08-01-2007 10:57 AM

its all relative...no?

Cynthetiq 08-01-2007 11:05 AM

isn't that what the dénouement of the story is supposed to provide?

Stewie describes it well...

The_Jazz 08-01-2007 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ratbastid
The devastating personal event in Lebowski is that his rug gets peed on? :lol:

But Lebowski never changes. The only one who changes is Steve Buschemi's character, and that's only because he dies. One of the things I love about this movie is that NO ONE learns a lesson. They're all the same assholes they were at the beginning.

Willravel 08-01-2007 11:46 AM

The Dude isn't an asshole. The Dude is all that many aspire to be. He learns not to bathe with ferrets. It's a lesson I repeat to myself every day.

I think that movies should be able to pull this type of positive transformation off in a subtle way. When it's overt, like in Peaceful Warrior or the latter Matrix movies, it can become like tedious, pseudo-philosophical fluff. I'd suggest that the quest for meaning was actually really well played in Casino Royale. It's arguable whether that change was positive, but character development from a philosophical standpoint was there. The nice thing was that they didn't make it the showcase. It was simply a part of character development. Take as another example Children of Men (one of the best science fiction movies of my generation). Here we see an apathetic outlook on life turn to hope over the chain of amazing events that make up the road of trials.

More importantly, no one can think in heat. Get to an air conditioned area and take a breather!

mrklixx 08-01-2007 01:30 PM

Batman Begins
Robocop (literal transformation)

roachboy 08-01-2007 01:40 PM

of course the dude doesn't change.
the dude abides.
that's what he does.
q.e.d.

thinking about the op question....
does the Important or Traumatic Event have to happen on screen?

hagatha 08-01-2007 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roachboy
of course the dude doesn't change.
the dude abides.
that's what he does.
q.e.d.

thinking about the op question....
does the Important or Traumatic Event have to happen on screen?

No, it doesn't.

by the way, good suggestions so far---and of course, dah, Robocop! Classic but also more of a statement on corporate greed and the dehumanization of workers.

Willravel 08-01-2007 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hagatha
No, it doesn't.

by the way, good suggestions so far---and of course, dah, Robocop! Classic but also more of a statement on corporate greed and the dehumanization of workers.

Yeah, they took dehumanization of police officers a bit literally.

roachboy 08-01-2007 03:18 PM

ok so here are some suggestions
my favorite for this kind of thing is also one of the most disturbing film i've ever seen--michael haneke, the 7th continent

other treats, all way existential:
czech new wave:

late august at the hotel ozone
daisies (vera chytilova)

and:
4 (vladmir sorokin)
solaris, stalker (a. tarkovsky)
persona, hour of the wolf, scenes from a marriage (ingmar bergman--r.i.p. monday)
ulrich seidl: jesus you know

the saragossa manuscript (dunno if this fits directly, but it's such a great film that you should watch it for yourself to see)

kieslowski: red/white/blue/the decalogue (especially the last one in the sequence)

j-p melville: army of shadows

still thinking....
badlands (terence malik)

Lasereth 08-01-2007 04:30 PM

Batman Begins is a really good one to mention.

ngdawg 08-01-2007 05:11 PM

Driving Miss Daisy(nothing devastating, but subtle realizations cause change)
Crash-but not all of the characters change or have an epiphany
White Oleander
Ghost Rider
Dogma

fresnelly 08-01-2007 05:51 PM

I was going to say La Femme Nikita, but I can't remember how it ends.

What about The Godfather, where Michael goes through hell and then becomes the opposite of what he wanted to be.

Does it count if the protagonist transforms into the true self that he's been denying?

hagatha 08-02-2007 03:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fresnelly
Does it count if the protagonist transforms into the true self that he's been denying?

That's a rather insightful question---to which I will say yes.

Jetée 08-02-2007 03:53 AM

I think the most recent film I watched had the entire cast(or least the ones worthy of due mention) shifting their thoughts and perspectives for the better and the worst. There was also the final scene where the character was just himself, in a different light, though no less or more than what he was.


Crash is really a perfect film.

dirtyrascal7 08-02-2007 06:27 AM

I definitely agree with Batman Begins and Crash, but I think the best example that demonstrates this theme is The Shawshank Redemption.

hagatha 08-02-2007 06:41 AM

I was talking to him today and he sited Donny Darko as another one that really demonstrates this idea. Hmmm. If I was able to really wrap my mind around that film maybe I would agree...but I was left just scratching my head. Some works are just too esoteric for me.
Given the excellent suggestions made thus far, I think I should be teaching this class.

Jetée 08-02-2007 06:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hagatha
I was talking to him today and he sited Donny Darko as another one that really demonstrates this idea. Hmmm. If I was able to really wrap my mind around that film maybe I would agree...but I was left just scratching my head. Some works are just too esoteric for me.
Given the excellent suggestions made thus far, I think I should be teaching this class.

The devasting part of the film was Donny losing his girlfriend. The dénouement is that Donny comes to terms with his apparent break in psychosis to learn that he was supposed to die that day the airplane engine crashed in his room. He sacrificed himself so that the world doesn't come to an end because he escaped his destiny. That is wht he was given exactly 28 days(or was it 29?) to set the event right to preserve the fabric of time and space. An implicit deux ex machina was given in order for the ending to make a lick of sense to the entire body of the plot and film.

At least, that's what I took from it. :surprised:



EDIT: and it is 'cited'. :p

roachboy 08-02-2007 07:19 AM

la jetée

Average_Joe 08-03-2007 11:20 AM

How about the movie "Regarding Henry" with Harrison Ford.

Lucifer 08-04-2007 09:33 PM

How about American History X? Going to prison was a life changing experience, or maybe getting raped in prison by the very people he aspired to be like...

hagatha 08-06-2007 04:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetstream
The devasting part of the film was Donny losing his girlfriend. The dénouement is that Donny comes to terms with his apparent break in psychosis to learn that he was supposed to die that day the airplane engine crashed in his room. He sacrificed himself so that the world doesn't come to an end because he escaped his destiny. That is wht he was given exactly 28 days(or was it 29?) to set the event right to preserve the fabric of time and space. An implicit deux ex machina was given in order for the ending to make a lick of sense to the entire body of the plot and film.

At least, that's what I took from it. :surprised:



EDIT: and it is 'cited'. :p

yeah but how is Darko transformed as an individual? To me it was like he spent a lot of time in a fugue state but then realized his role in events. he didn't really change as a character, he just fulfilled his destiny.

At least, that's my take on it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lucifer
How about American History X? Going to prison was a life changing experience, or maybe getting raped in prison by the very people he aspired to be like...


yeah, I see that ---the transformation was a literal one.

mixedmedia 08-06-2007 05:01 AM

Well, these might not be traditional in their interpretation of "devastating events" and "transformation" (at least not in a positive sense), but I've always enjoyed plots that show how people can transform when they come into large sums of money.

The silent film Greed by Erich Von Stroheim is probably the best example.

Treasure of the Sierra Madre.

Citizen Kane, of course.

Small Time Crooks by Woody Allen (an under-rated film in my opinion).

A more traditional choice might be Places in the Heart which is about a Depression-era woman who is left in debt with her children after the sudden death of her husband.

For that matter, Gone With the Wind might be a good choice, too.

I'll probably come up with more throughout the day.

Good thread, hagatha! :)

hagatha 08-06-2007 02:45 PM

Actually I was waiting for you to comment---I consider you one of the resident film aficionados on this site---thanks Mixed. And any excuse to recommend a good Woody Allen film never goes astray.

Lucifer 08-06-2007 02:51 PM

A Simple Plan is a good movie example of how money changes people.

Jetée 08-06-2007 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mixedmedia
Well, these might not be traditional in their interpretation of "devastating events" and "transformation" (at least not in a positive sense), but I've always enjoyed plots that show how people can transform when they come into large sums of money.

By this regard, then... you would have Trading Places and Brewster's Millions(a much better portrayal than the original, and easier to grasp the synopsis of it all).

mixedmedia 08-06-2007 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lucifer
A Simple Plan is a good movie example of how money changes people.

Yes!

Sullivan's Travels is a good one, too. An altruistic yet pampered film director learns about the superficiality of romanticizing people's suffering (also during the Great Depression) and the true value of his work through a traumatic and life-altering bout with amnesia. One of the greatest "serious" films that is, in fact, a screwball comedy. Brilliant! And you get the most fabulous Veronica Lake, too. :)

Not Right Now 08-14-2007 07:07 AM

Some modern (Post-modern, what have you) ones:
Fight Club
Fear and Loathing
London
Children of Men
The Libertine

Some classics:
Ugetsu
Sword of Doom
Seventh Seal
Detour
The Third Man

roachboy 08-14-2007 08:03 AM

Quote:

London
you mean the patrick keiller film?
his "robinson in space" is also great.
both would fit neatly here.

Derwood 08-14-2007 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Not Right Now
Some modern (Post-modern, what have you) ones:
Fight Club
Fear and Loathing
London
Children of Men
The Libertine

Some classics:
Ugetsu
Sword of Doom
Seventh Seal
Detour
The Third Man

who changes in Fight Club?

Not Right Now 08-15-2007 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Derwood
who changes in Fight Club?


Jack. He realizes everythign about himself that he didn't even know was happening. Just look at the difference in the way he even treated Marla at the end... not to mention all of the other pre- Tyler stuff as opposed to the post- Tler style of living.

Derwood 08-17-2007 05:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Not Right Now
Jack. He realizes everythign about himself that he didn't even know was happening. Just look at the difference in the way he even treated Marla at the end... not to mention all of the other pre- Tyler stuff as opposed to the post- Tler style of living.

I'm not going to get into spoilers on the movie, but I think it was more of a self-awareness than a transformation, if you get my meaning

The_Jazz 08-17-2007 06:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Derwood
I'm not going to get into spoilers on the movie, but I think it was more of a self-awareness than a transformation, if you get my meaning

Wouldn't his realization of self-awareness (actually, I'd call it an awakening, but that's more semantics than anything else) cound as a transformation? As it stands, he's much more clueless about himself at the beginning of the movie than the end.

Derwood 08-17-2007 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Jazz
Wouldn't his realization of self-awareness (actually, I'd call it an awakening, but that's more semantics than anything else) cound as a transformation? As it stands, he's much more clueless about himself at the beginning of the movie than the end.

sure, but by the end, it's too late


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