I'm Being Sued For Piracy... - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

X_789_X · 10-03-2005, 08:45 PM

I downloaded "Fast Times at Ridgemont High" off of Bearshare about a week ago and today, when I get home from work, I see a letter from NBC Universal stating that I'm being sued for $50,000

and that a court date has been set up on the 20th on this month.

I've always downloaded movies and music and have never had a problem until today.

Well, I'm scared shitless because:

1.) I don't have $50,000.
2.) I don't want to go to court because I know I'll lose and
3.) I don't want to go to jail.

So ummm... Does anyone have any advice?

(I hope this is the right forum for this...)

Cynthetiq · 10-03-2005, 08:53 PM

get a lawyer, if you can't afford one, then the courts will appoint one for you for no charge.

you don't need to have $50,000. If they convict you they can just garnish your wages until you've paid off the $50,000.

You can decide to not go to court, that will cause a default judgement against you and you lose automatically.

You probably won't go to jail, but there's a possibility that you could, albeit small.

As far as it only being a week, they probably targetted you a lot longer than just when you downloaded Fast Times.

Each time you took a chance and didn't get caught, that's one time you got away. Sometimes you aren't so lucky as exampled by your letter.

Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

Destrox · 10-03-2005, 08:59 PM

Seek advice from a lawyer asap.

Other then that I really have no idea what I would do. I would be scared shitless to be honest.

It is one reason that *if* I were to download somthing such as illegal content, I wouldnt do it by a medium that is so public and allready targeted in previous court battles.

X_789_X · 10-03-2005, 09:00 PM

I don't know why they come after me o.0

Why not just go after Bearshare or the company that has it for download because, as far as I'm concerned, it was there to download for whomever wanted to, and I did.

And, to be honest, if I knew downloading that movie would have gotten me sued, I wouldn't have done it.

BTW> I can't afford a lawyer. I'm a poor college student

...

Destrox · 10-03-2005, 09:02 PM

Because, cases such as this, you go out and tell the public and spread fear. Mission accomplished whether they get money or not.

As for the whole not knowing its illegal thing.. eh.. good luck with that. Did ya miss the whole Napster fiasco?

Cynthetiq · 10-03-2005, 09:04 PM

ignorance of the law is not a reason. if you think that "Why not just go after Bearshare or the company that has it for download because, as far as I'm concerned, it was there to download for whomever wanted to, and I did." well, then that's for a JUDGE to decide who is right or wrong.

also with all the high profile cases that have been about RIAA suing everyone, I have a hard time believing that you are claiming ignorance of the law.

and then you stating in your OP that you don't want to go to court because you know you'll lose implies to me that you know you did something illegal and wrong.

if you don't.. well then you spent waaaay too much time in the titty board since you're still a rookie after being here since Oct 2003

edit: cannot afford a lawyer... READ the FIRST line I posted where it says one will be appointed to you for FREE.

X_789_X · 10-03-2005, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Destrox

As for the whole not knowing its illegal thing.. eh.. good luck with that. Did ya miss the whole Napster fiasco?

No, I didn't miss the Napster thing but... Bearshare came waaay after Napster. I coulda' sworn that I read somewhere about how it was all right to download shared files as long as the company you were using it from wasn't charging any fees (Or something like that).

X_789_X · 10-03-2005, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cynthetiq

ignorance of the law is not a reason. if you think that "Why not just go after Bearshare or the company that has it for download because, as far as I'm concerned, it was there to download for whomever wanted to, and I did." well, then that's for a JUDGE to decide who is right or wrong. also with all the high profile cases that have been about RIAA suing everyone, I have a hard time believing that you are claiming ignorance of the law.

No, I'm not saying that. What I am saying is that I know I read somewhere about how companies were getting around that law because, as long as they weren't charging for the service, then it was all right to do. Bah... I need to go find that article because I know I read it.

Quote:

and then you stating in your OP that you don't want to go to court because you know you'll lose implies to me that you know you did something illegal and wrong.

No. I state that because I remember reading about the same thing happening to another college kid, and some major company came after him and tried to sue him for millions o.0

Quote:

if you don't.. well then you spent waaaay too much time in the titty board since you're still a rookie after being here since Oct 2003

You know, you're really no help-- At all o.0

And, for the record, I've never viewed that board. Why go look at pictures when I can see them in real life ^_^

Quote:

edit: cannot afford a lawyer... READ the FIRST line I posted where it says one will be appointed to you for FREE.

Jeez... Well sorry for missing it the first time :\

Elphaba · 10-03-2005, 09:17 PM

You downloaded just *one* old movie and they want to sue you for $50K? Perhaps you are not telling us about your history of downloads?

You could have rented that old flick for $3, or paid not much more for a used copy.

Not smart, dude.

Cynthetiq · 10-03-2005, 09:18 PM

thinking hard about the situation... the letter you got it was directly from Universal and not from the courthouse?

If it's from Universal, there should be a contact name and number. Call them and verify it. Or contact the courthouse for the exact date of your docket number.

X_789_X · 10-03-2005, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elphaba

You downloaded just *one* old movie and they want to sue you for $50K? Perhaps you are not telling us about your history of downloads?

You could have rented that old flick for $3, or paid not much more for a used copy.

Not smart, dude.

Ummm... I've always downloaded movies and music (I said that in my first post). I've been doing it since Napster and I never got into trouble. I do try to keep up with the laws concerning anti-piracy, and I know for a fact that I wouldn't have downloaded it if I would have been sued for it.

Bah... Oh well... That's life, I guess.

eotlemac · 10-03-2005, 09:23 PM

This is getting heated. Im afraid you are fucked.

My tiny brain would recommend you not try to plead ignorance because if i were the RIAA i would be even more persuant of a ignorant bastard.

Your best bet is to be apologetic to the fact that you were stealing. And maybe play the "what would be the punishment for stealing a hard copy of the movie?" angle.

If that doesnt work, you could start stocking up on "soap on a rope".

Best of luck to you and you have now scared me away from downloading for at least two days.

Cynthetiq · 10-03-2005, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X_789_X

Ummm... I've always downloaded movies and music (I said that in my first post). I've been doing it since Napster and I never got into trouble. I do try to keep up with the laws concerning anti-piracy, and I know for a fact that I wouldn't have downloaded it if I would have been sued for it.

Bah... Oh well... That's life, I guess.

i guess you missed this:

Quote:

http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,118628,00.asp

MPAA Sues First Movie Swappers

Industry group will offer a free program to help users find and eliminate illegal files.

Grant Gross, IDG News Service
Wednesday, November 17, 2004

The Motion Picture Association of America this week announced that it has begun filing lawsuits against people who use peer-to-peer software to trade movie files without permission over the Internet.

The MPAA filed an unspecified number of lawsuits in courts across the U.S., seeking damages and injunctions against the P-to-P users. Under the U.S. Copyright Act, people can be liable for as much as $30,000 for each movie traded over the Internet, and as much as $150,000 per movie if the infringement is proven to be willful.

The trade group announced earlier this month it would begin to sue file traders.

Find Illegal Files
The MPAA also announced it will soon offer to computer users a free program that identifies movie and music titles stored on a computer, along with any installed P-to-P software. The information collected by this program would be available only to the computer's user, according to the MPAA.

Users can ask the program to remove infringing movies or music files and any P-to-P software, the MPAA says in a press release.

"Our ultimate goal is to help consumers locate the resources and information they need to make appropriate decisions about using and trading illegal files," Dan Glickman, MPAA president and chief executive officer, says in a statement. "Many parents are concerned about what their children have downloaded and where they've downloaded it from."

The MPAA also announced a new P-to-P ad campaign, to be distributed to about 10,000 U.S. video stores. The Rated I: Inappropriate for All Ages video-store campaign is similar to an ad campaign that appeared in theaters, newspapers, magazines, and on the Internet.

"Litigation alone is not the solution, but it is part of a broader MPAA effort that includes education and new technological tools among other components," Glickman says.

X_789_X · 10-03-2005, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cynthetiq

thinking hard about the situation... the letter you got it was directly from Universal and not from the courthouse?

If it's from Universal, there should be a contact name and number. Call them and verify it. Or contact the courthouse for the exact date of your docket number.

It came directly from Universal. I tried to call that number (Was the first thing I did) but I got a message that the number I dialed was not a working number or some BS.

So yeah... I'm totally scared. I don't even think I'm gonna' sleep tonite. I feel REALLY sick o.0

Destrox · 10-03-2005, 09:28 PM

Well that makes a little more sense at least. By reading your first post it appeared as if you were saying you had only downloaded this one movie.

Also not to completly side track but...

Quote:

Find Illegal Files
The MPAA also announced it will soon offer to computer users a free program that identifies movie and music titles stored on a computer, along with any installed P-to-P software. The information collected by this program would be available only to the computer's user, according to the MPAA.

Users can ask the program to remove infringing movies or music files and any P-to-P software, the MPAA says in a press release.

How would that work if they are still going to sue you, as such this case we have here.

The person claims they did not know such files were infringing movie files, but will still be sued with no say in it.

X_789_X · 10-03-2005, 09:28 PM

Well Cynthetiq, that makes me feel even worse because I don't have that kind of money

I think Mexico's looking like a great option right about now. And, no offense, but you don't have to be so harsh about it :\

Destrox · 10-03-2005, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X_789_X

It came directly from Universal. I tried to call that number (Was the first thing I did) but I got a message that the number I dialed was not a working number or some BS.

So yeah... I'm totally scared. I don't even think I'm gonna' sleep tonite. I feel REALLY sick o.0

Out of curiousity do a search of where Universal is located, and then check where the phone number points to.

Also, I would sure think you should get somthing from a COURT office stating when you are to be at a court house, not from a business.

Gilda · 10-03-2005, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X_789_X

Ummm... I've always downloaded movies and music (I said that in my first post). I've been doing it since Napster and I never got into trouble. I do try to keep up with the laws concerning anti-piracy, and I know for a fact that I wouldn't have downloaded it if I would have been sued for it.

Bah... Oh well... That's life, I guess.

"I didn't think I would get caught because I've done this a lot and never been caught before" is unlikely to go over well as a defense. Why not just pay for the movie in the first place?

Gilda

Spartak · 10-03-2005, 09:33 PM

1984 man... 1984...

X_789_X · 10-03-2005, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gilda

Why not just pay for the movie in the first place?Gilda

Dunno'. I just thought I'd try to see if I could download it and I could. I never thought that it would have gotten me sued, especially since it's an old movie.

Cynthetiq · 10-03-2005, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X_789_X

Well Cynthetiq, that makes me feel even worse because I don't have that kind of money

I think Mexico's looking like a great option right about now. And, no offense, but you don't have to be so harsh about it :\

sorry i dont' sugar coat things... you should know that from reading any of my posts.

like i said you don't have to have that kind of money. they can just garnish your wages until it's paid off. Garnish wages is just like having another tax coming out of your paycheck...

Destrox · 10-03-2005, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spartak

1984 man... 1984...

Its actually from 1982.

X_789_X · 10-03-2005, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Destrox

Its actually from 1982.

That's even worse. The movie is even older than I am

.

Why do they care about such an old movie, anyway?

Cynthetiq · 10-03-2005, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X_789_X

\

That's even worse. The movie is even older than I am

.

Why do they care about such an old movie, anyway?

intellectual property rights... if you don't defend them vigorously all the time from the beginning, then you cannot later defend them at all.

cyrnel · 10-03-2005, 09:38 PM

These cases are generally settled for a few $thousand, on payment plans, with the stipulation that you keep the terms confidential. The vast majority I've heard of were the result of sharing files, not simply downloading. (Though by downloading you're usually automatically sharing.) While their legal tactics may be changing to downloaders I'd be surprised if that's all this was about.

I would contact attorneys in your area and mention the letter until you find someone familiar with the process. Lots of targets are poor students or further down the financial ladder than yourself.

X_789_X · 10-03-2005, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cynthetiq

intellectual property rights... if you don't defend them vigorously all the time from the beginning, then you cannot later defend them at all.

Yeah... My letter says that. It also says something about Section 106 of the US Copyright Act.

I guess I should go look that up.

Destrox · 10-03-2005, 09:42 PM

# Amazon.com Sales Rank:
Today: #4,971 in Video
Yesterday: #4,685 in Video

Amazon easily has over 80,000+ movies.

They are still making money on a movie and dont want to miss a dime.
But also from my original post, its also to spread fear to others rather them going after everyone they hit and miss.

http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap1.html#106

Quote:

§ 106. Exclusive rights in copyrighted works36

Subject to sections 107 through 122, the owner of copyright under this title has the exclusive rights to do and to authorize any of the following:

(1) to reproduce the copyrighted work in copies or phonorecords;

(2) to prepare derivative works based upon the copyrighted work;

(3) to distribute copies or phonorecords of the copyrighted work to the public by sale or other transfer of ownership, or by rental, lease, or lending;

(4) in the case of literary, musical, dramatic, and choreographic works, pantomimes, and motion pictures and other audiovisual works, to perform the copyrighted work publicly;

(5) in the case of literary, musical, dramatic, and choreographic works, pantomimes, and pictorial, graphic, or sculptural works, including the individual images of a motion picture or other audiovisual work, to display the copyrighted work publicly; and

(6) in the case of sound recordings, to perform the copyrighted work publicly by means of a digital audio transmission.

X_789_X · 10-03-2005, 09:51 PM

-Sigh-

Yeah... I read that earlier. Well, I guess there's not much use in worrying about it tonight. I'm just gonna' go to sleep (Or at least, try to go to sleep).

Thanks for all the input :\

SecretMethod70 · 10-03-2005, 10:23 PM

Like someone else mentioned, these cases are almost always settled for a few thousand. Then they'll probably work out a payment plan too.

Honestly though, it sounds to me like someone's messing with you. I would think you'd have actually gotten a summons.

genuinegirly · 10-03-2005, 10:32 PM

I like SecretMethod70's response there. If the number doesn't work, then I'd assume it's a fake. But just to be safe... find a lawyer friend and have them look it over.

spindles · 10-03-2005, 10:47 PM

What secretmethod said. In Australia, when you have to go to court, you will have someone turn up at your place of residence, ask for you by name, and hand you a court document. At worst it will be on letterhead from the other party's lawyer. This happens until you have a law firm contact the other party's lawyer to say they are acting on your behalf, at which point the pesky delivery guy will go directly to your lawyer. This is a good thing as it means you wife doesn't see just how much correspondence actually occurs...

clavus · 10-03-2005, 10:54 PM

My bullshit detector is going red-line. You got served by mail? The phone number is disconnected?

Does this letter have a return address from Nigeria?

cyrnel · 10-03-2005, 11:15 PM

A summons would follow later, after your refusal to settle. Still, it does sound like someone is messing with you.

Then again, the studios and trade associations use third party collection agencies which are often fly-by-night operations. I wouldn't write it off without trying from another phone and investigating the contact information thoroughly. You don't want to default to the penalty box.

Schwan · 10-04-2005, 12:27 AM

Something is not right. I'm not sure about your local law, but I think that it's standard procedure in most countries around the world for the court to deliver information about you being sued. In my country, and in most other places I've worked, this information has to be delivered personally, and signed by you. I see two options: that either the company is getting ready to sue you, and the date specified in the letter you got is a date when they'll go to court with all the data to begin the process (so, right nowe, the cour't hasn't actually started you case). If you got this letter, then maybe they want to settle first. However, if the phone number is dead... it sound like a hoax.

Check the name of the person that signed the letter. Google it. If that person really works at Universal or a law firm, than you might be onto something. Call them. If not, call the cops.

smooth · 10-04-2005, 12:54 AM

1. You are not entitled to an attorney in this situation. At worst, this is going to be litigated in a civil court. You do not have a right to legal representation in a civil trial. You may ask the court, but you will not likely recieve it. Requests may be granted for litigants claiming their civil rights have been violated, but they aren't entitled to them. You don't even have the sympathy of the law on your side in this issue.

2. You might be able to mount some defense that someone else did it. But once again, this is not criminal law. You are not entitled to the same protections or standard of guilt in a civil trial. It operates under the preponderance of the evidence, not beyond reasonable doubt. If the fact finder comes to the conclusion that you are 51% likely to have committed the grievance or somehow liable, the ruling will be in the plaintiff's favor.

3. Posting here was one of the worst things you could have done. A) remove all of your logged posts, B) beg Halx to purge the database of your statements, and C) contact a real attorney.

tecoyah · 10-04-2005, 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smooth

1. You are not entitled to an attorney in this situation. At worst, this is going to be litigated in a civil court. You do not have a right to legal representation in a civil trial. You may ask the court, but you will not likely recieve it. Requests may be granted for litigants claiming their civil rights have been violated, but they aren't entitled to them. You don't even have the sympathy of the law on your side in this issue.

2. You might be able to mount some defense that someone else did it. But once again, this is not criminal law. You are not entitled to the same protections or standard of guilt in a civil trial. It operates under the preponderance of the evidence, not beyond reasonable doubt. If the fact finder comes to the conclusion that you are 51% likely to have committed the grievance or somehow liable, the ruling will be in the plaintiff's favor.

3. Posting here was one of the worst things you could have done. A) remove all of your logged posts, B) beg Halx to purge the database of your statements, and C) contact a real attorney.

This is by far the best advice you could get in this situation. The simple reality is....You need to take this as the real deal, and act accordingly. Personally, I have never downloaded Music/movies because if the risks involved (illegal and Virus content) but, it seems you decided the risks were arbitatry compared to the entertainment value. The only thing left to say here.....Good Freakin' Luck.

Vincentt · 10-04-2005, 02:49 AM

Go buy the movie, then scrach it with a key, then tell them you downloaded it because you already own the movie, but can't watch it.

I don't think shit like that really works though.

flstf · 10-04-2005, 02:49 AM

I don't know about Universal and the movie industry but I thought the RIAA was only targeting those who uploaded (provided) music files for others to download.

I wouldn't admit to downloading the movie until you talk to a lawyer. Perhaps it will be up to them to prove that you and not someone using your computer without your permission is at fault. I really have no idea, but I would consult an attorney, at least buy an hour of time with one to start.

Also do some searches for Universal and piracy, there must be more people with your problem and you may be able to find out something about how these cases are being handled.

I thought most of the RIAA lawsuits were settled out of court like the following example:
Schoolgirl Settles With RIAA

Quote:

Brianna Lahara won't be sharing music files anymore. Less than a day after the recording industry announced its lawsuits, the 12-year-old Manhattan schoolgirl and her mother settled their case for $2,000.

"I am sorry for what I have done," Brianna said in a statement released by the Recording Industry Association of America on Tuesday. "I love music and I don't want to hurt the artists I love."

The RIAA accused Brianna of distributing more than 1,000 copyrighted songs on Kazaa.

The recording industry has sued another 260 individuals for similar offenses. The organization, which represents the five major recording companies -- Universal Music Group, Sony Music, EMI, BMG and Warner Music -- filed its complaints on Monday in federal courts around the country.

The defendants include a working mom, a college football player and a 71-year-old grandpa. In interviews and news reports Tuesday, some expressed frustration about being singled out by the recording industry.

Menoman · 10-04-2005, 03:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X_789_X

I don't know why they come after me o.0

Why not just go after Bearshare or the company that has it for download because, as far as I'm concerned, it was there to download for whomever wanted to, and I did.

And, to be honest, if I knew downloading that movie would have gotten me sued, I wouldn't have done it.

BTW> I can't afford a lawyer. I'm a poor college student

...

Just coz there is a bank down the street, doesnt mean ya should rob it.

X_789_X · 10-04-2005, 04:45 AM

First of all, I googled the name on the letter (Aaron Markham) and he is the director of internet anti-piracy, worldide anti-piracy operation (So I know at least that much is real).

Anyway, inside of the envelope was the letter stating what the infraction was and then there was another letter stating a court date at the local courthouse or something. So yeah, I guess the first thing I'm going to do this morning is try to re-dial that number and then I'm going to call the courthouse.

And -Sigh-, I think this is complete BS. I innocently downloaded a movie to watch and next thing you know, I have Universal breathing down my neck. And... I really don't want to have to pay anything, because I can't o.0

And, for the record, I kinda' don't need to hear anymore, "That was a really dumb thing to do". I think at least 9/10 people download music off the internet. So yeah... It could happen to you

.

10-03-2005, 08:45 PM	#1 (permalink)
X_789_X Upright Location: In The Deep, Deep South...	I'm Being Sued For Piracy... I downloaded "Fast Times at Ridgemont High" off of Bearshare about a week ago and today, when I get home from work, I see a letter from NBC Universal stating that I'm being sued for $50,000 and that a court date has been set up on the 20th on this month. I've always downloaded movies and music and have never had a problem until today. Well, I'm scared shitless because: 1.) I don't have $50,000. 2.) I don't want to go to court because I know I'll lose and 3.) I don't want to go to jail. So ummm... Does anyone have any advice? (I hope this is the right forum for this...) __________________ When a woman says she'll call you, she means when she gets home. When a man says he'll call you, he means sometime before he dies...

10-03-2005, 08:53 PM	#2 (permalink)
Cynthetiq Tilted Cat Head Administrator Location: Manhattan, NY	get a lawyer, if you can't afford one, then the courts will appoint one for you for no charge. you don't need to have $50,000. If they convict you they can just garnish your wages until you've paid off the $50,000. You can decide to not go to court, that will cause a default judgement against you and you lose automatically. You probably won't go to jail, but there's a possibility that you could, albeit small. As far as it only being a week, they probably targetted you a lot longer than just when you downloaded Fast Times. Each time you took a chance and didn't get caught, that's one time you got away. Sometimes you aren't so lucky as exampled by your letter. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time. __________________ I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not. What's the best nation in the world? DO-NATION!

10-03-2005, 08:59 PM	#3 (permalink)
Destrox Metal and Rock 4 Life Location: Phoenix	Seek advice from a lawyer asap. Other then that I really have no idea what I would do. I would be scared shitless to be honest. It is one reason that if I were to download somthing such as illegal content, I wouldnt do it by a medium that is so public and allready targeted in previous court battles. __________________ You bore me.... next.

10-03-2005, 09:00 PM	#4 (permalink)
X_789_X Upright Location: In The Deep, Deep South...	I don't know why they come after me o.0 Why not just go after Bearshare or the company that has it for download because, as far as I'm concerned, it was there to download for whomever wanted to, and I did. And, to be honest, if I knew downloading that movie would have gotten me sued, I wouldn't have done it. BTW> I can't afford a lawyer. I'm a poor college student ... __________________ When a woman says she'll call you, she means when she gets home. When a man says he'll call you, he means sometime before he dies... Last edited by X_789_X; 10-03-2005 at 09:03 PM..

10-03-2005, 09:02 PM	#5 (permalink)
Destrox Metal and Rock 4 Life Location: Phoenix	Because, cases such as this, you go out and tell the public and spread fear. Mission accomplished whether they get money or not. As for the whole not knowing its illegal thing.. eh.. good luck with that. Did ya miss the whole Napster fiasco? __________________ You bore me.... next.

10-03-2005, 09:04 PM	#6 (permalink)
Cynthetiq Tilted Cat Head Administrator Location: Manhattan, NY	ignorance of the law is not a reason. if you think that "Why not just go after Bearshare or the company that has it for download because, as far as I'm concerned, it was there to download for whomever wanted to, and I did." well, then that's for a JUDGE to decide who is right or wrong. also with all the high profile cases that have been about RIAA suing everyone, I have a hard time believing that you are claiming ignorance of the law. and then you stating in your OP that you don't want to go to court because you know you'll lose implies to me that you know you did something illegal and wrong. if you don't.. well then you spent waaaay too much time in the titty board since you're still a rookie after being here since Oct 2003 edit: cannot afford a lawyer... READ the FIRST line I posted where it says one will be appointed to you for FREE. __________________ I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not. What's the best nation in the world? DO-NATION!

10-03-2005, 09:17 PM	#9 (permalink)
Elphaba Deja Moo Location: Olympic Peninsula, WA	You downloaded just one old movie and they want to sue you for $50K? Perhaps you are not telling us about your history of downloads? You could have rented that old flick for $3, or paid not much more for a used copy. Not smart, dude.

10-03-2005, 09:18 PM	#10 (permalink)
Cynthetiq Tilted Cat Head Administrator Location: Manhattan, NY	thinking hard about the situation... the letter you got it was directly from Universal and not from the courthouse? If it's from Universal, there should be a contact name and number. Call them and verify it. Or contact the courthouse for the exact date of your docket number. __________________ I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not. What's the best nation in the world? DO-NATION!

10-03-2005, 09:23 PM	#12 (permalink)
eotlemac Banned	This is getting heated. Im afraid you are fucked. My tiny brain would recommend you not try to plead ignorance because if i were the RIAA i would be even more persuant of a ignorant bastard. Your best bet is to be apologetic to the fact that you were stealing. And maybe play the "what would be the punishment for stealing a hard copy of the movie?" angle. If that doesnt work, you could start stocking up on "soap on a rope". Best of luck to you and you have now scared me away from downloading for at least two days.

10-03-2005, 09:28 PM	#16 (permalink)
X_789_X Upright Location: In The Deep, Deep South...	Well Cynthetiq, that makes me feel even worse because I don't have that kind of money I think Mexico's looking like a great option right about now. And, no offense, but you don't have to be so harsh about it :\ __________________ When a woman says she'll call you, she means when she gets home. When a man says he'll call you, he means sometime before he dies...

10-03-2005, 09:33 PM	#19 (permalink)
Spartak Bang bang Location: New Zealand	1984 man... 1984... __________________ I can read your mind... looking at you... I can read your mind...

10-03-2005, 09:38 PM	#25 (permalink)
cyrnel Adequate Location: In my angry-dome.	These cases are generally settled for a few $thousand, on payment plans, with the stipulation that you keep the terms confidential. The vast majority I've heard of were the result of sharing files, not simply downloading. (Though by downloading you're usually automatically sharing.) While their legal tactics may be changing to downloaders I'd be surprised if that's all this was about. I would contact attorneys in your area and mention the letter until you find someone familiar with the process. Lots of targets are poor students or further down the financial ladder than yourself. __________________ There are a vast number of people who are uninformed and heavily propagandized, but fundamentally decent. The propaganda that inundates them is effective when unchallenged, but much of it goes only skin deep. If they can be brought to raise questions and apply their decent instincts and basic intelligence, many people quickly escape the confines of the doctrinal system and are willing to do something to help others who are really suffering and oppressed." -Manufacturing Consent: Noam Chomsky and the Media, p. 195

10-03-2005, 09:51 PM	#28 (permalink)
X_789_X Upright Location: In The Deep, Deep South...	-Sigh- Yeah... I read that earlier. Well, I guess there's not much use in worrying about it tonight. I'm just gonna' go to sleep (Or at least, try to go to sleep). Thanks for all the input :\ __________________ When a woman says she'll call you, she means when she gets home. When a man says he'll call you, he means sometime before he dies...

10-03-2005, 10:23 PM	#29 (permalink)
SecretMethod70 Human Administrator Location: Chicago	Like someone else mentioned, these cases are almost always settled for a few thousand. Then they'll probably work out a payment plan too. Honestly though, it sounds to me like someone's messing with you. I would think you'd have actually gotten a summons. __________________ Le temps détruit tout "Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling

10-03-2005, 10:32 PM	#30 (permalink)
genuinegirly Eat your vegetables Super Moderator Location: Arabidopsis-ville	I like SecretMethod70's response there. If the number doesn't work, then I'd assume it's a fake. But just to be safe... find a lawyer friend and have them look it over. __________________ "Sometimes I have to remember that things are brought to me for a reason, either for my own lessons or for the benefit of others." Cynthetiq "violence is no more or less real than non-violence." roachboy

10-03-2005, 10:47 PM	#31 (permalink)
spindles Mine is an evil laugh Location: Sydney, Australia	What secretmethod said. In Australia, when you have to go to court, you will have someone turn up at your place of residence, ask for you by name, and hand you a court document. At worst it will be on letterhead from the other party's lawyer. This happens until you have a law firm contact the other party's lawyer to say they are acting on your behalf, at which point the pesky delivery guy will go directly to your lawyer. This is a good thing as it means you wife doesn't see just how much correspondence actually occurs... __________________ who hid my keyboard's PANIC button?

10-03-2005, 10:54 PM	#32 (permalink)
clavus pow! Location: NorCal	My bullshit detector is going red-line. You got served by mail? The phone number is disconnected? Does this letter have a return address from Nigeria? __________________ Ass, gas or grass. Nobody rides for free.

10-03-2005, 11:15 PM	#33 (permalink)
cyrnel Adequate Location: In my angry-dome.	A summons would follow later, after your refusal to settle. Still, it does sound like someone is messing with you. Then again, the studios and trade associations use third party collection agencies which are often fly-by-night operations. I wouldn't write it off without trying from another phone and investigating the contact information thoroughly. You don't want to default to the penalty box. __________________ There are a vast number of people who are uninformed and heavily propagandized, but fundamentally decent. The propaganda that inundates them is effective when unchallenged, but much of it goes only skin deep. If they can be brought to raise questions and apply their decent instincts and basic intelligence, many people quickly escape the confines of the doctrinal system and are willing to do something to help others who are really suffering and oppressed." -Manufacturing Consent: Noam Chomsky and the Media, p. 195

10-04-2005, 12:27 AM	#34 (permalink)
Schwan A boy and his dog Location: EU!	Something is not right. I'm not sure about your local law, but I think that it's standard procedure in most countries around the world for the court to deliver information about you being sued. In my country, and in most other places I've worked, this information has to be delivered personally, and signed by you. I see two options: that either the company is getting ready to sue you, and the date specified in the letter you got is a date when they'll go to court with all the data to begin the process (so, right nowe, the cour't hasn't actually started you case). If you got this letter, then maybe they want to settle first. However, if the phone number is dead... it sound like a hoax. Check the name of the person that signed the letter. Google it. If that person really works at Universal or a law firm, than you might be onto something. Call them. If not, call the cops. Last edited by Schwan; 10-04-2005 at 12:29 AM..

10-04-2005, 12:54 AM	#35 (permalink)
smooth Junkie Location: Right here	1. You are not entitled to an attorney in this situation. At worst, this is going to be litigated in a civil court. You do not have a right to legal representation in a civil trial. You may ask the court, but you will not likely recieve it. Requests may be granted for litigants claiming their civil rights have been violated, but they aren't entitled to them. You don't even have the sympathy of the law on your side in this issue. 2. You might be able to mount some defense that someone else did it. But once again, this is not criminal law. You are not entitled to the same protections or standard of guilt in a civil trial. It operates under the preponderance of the evidence, not beyond reasonable doubt. If the fact finder comes to the conclusion that you are 51% likely to have committed the grievance or somehow liable, the ruling will be in the plaintiff's favor. 3. Posting here was one of the worst things you could have done. A) remove all of your logged posts, B) beg Halx to purge the database of your statements, and C) contact a real attorney. __________________ "The theory of a free press is that truth will emerge from free discussion, not that it will be presented perfectly and instantly in any one account." -- Walter Lippmann "You measure democracy by the freedom it gives its dissidents, not the freedom it gives its assimilated conformists." -- Abbie Hoffman

10-04-2005, 02:49 AM	#37 (permalink)
Vincentt Addict Location: Tokyo, Japan	Go buy the movie, then scrach it with a key, then tell them you downloaded it because you already own the movie, but can't watch it. I don't think shit like that really works though. __________________ .

10-04-2005, 04:45 AM	#40 (permalink)
X_789_X Upright Location: In The Deep, Deep South...	First of all, I googled the name on the letter (Aaron Markham) and he is the director of internet anti-piracy, worldide anti-piracy operation (So I know at least that much is real). Anyway, inside of the envelope was the letter stating what the infraction was and then there was another letter stating a court date at the local courthouse or something. So yeah, I guess the first thing I'm going to do this morning is try to re-dial that number and then I'm going to call the courthouse. And -Sigh-, I think this is complete BS. I innocently downloaded a movie to watch and next thing you know, I have Universal breathing down my neck. And... I really don't want to have to pay anything, because I can't o.0 And, for the record, I kinda' don't need to hear anymore, "That was a really dumb thing to do". I think at least 9/10 people download music off the internet. So yeah... It could happen to you . __________________ When a woman says she'll call you, she means when she gets home. When a man says he'll call you, he means sometime before he dies...