Freedom vs Security in the age of Surveillance - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

lindalove · 07-28-2005, 10:09 PM

Cities and businesses are full of cameras … phone conversations and private internet communications are intercepted … credit card and ATM transactions can be tracked … every citizen has their own personal ID number so the government computers can keep track of us

As technology advances … the ability of big brother to track and profile citizens will only improve

How much is too much?

How much freedom do we trade in for security and law enforcement?

How do we control those who have the keys to the kingdom?

pattycakes · 07-29-2005, 04:12 AM

i would rather be less secure and more free. the united states is no more threatened now than it has been within the last id say 10 years. There is now and hasnt been any threat. just someone who hypes about a plane hyjacking, and then the media gets on. who cares, we were attacked before and we will be again so lets just live our lives and forget this whole patriot act bullshit

Cynthetiq · 07-30-2005, 08:53 PM

As a person doing a genealogical database and corroborating birth information, if you were born in the US between 1905 and today, chances are I can find you and your mother's maiden name and your birth location pretty quickly. I recently found a ship manifest of my great grandfather making port in San Francisco 1952 with his wife and the destination they were headed.

As far as cameras are concerned, here in NYC there are so many private cameras that there is a group who has mapped them and also given maps out how to avoid them, you may walk lots extra, but it can be done. IMO Britian has cameras all over London, it didn't stop the bombs on 7/7.

Gilda · 07-31-2005, 10:59 AM

One of the newest things is facial recognition software. I saw a profile on its proposed use in Miami, where they were proposing that cameras be installed at the airport and in certain other public places hooked into a central computer with the faces of known, wanted criminals in a database that the computers could use to scan faces in the crowds for.

There were, of course, civil rights objections. I see no problem with a system like this being used for this particular purpose in public places, but somehow I doubt how effective it would be. It would be too easy to hide one's face from cameras using a baseball cap; criminals do this already to disguise themselves from security cameras when committing crimes.

The objection is the slilppery slope argument, which is that once it's ok to scan for this, it'll become ok to track movements of suspects, or track movements of people not suspected of crimes.

The defense was that it's just observing people in public, where it's entirely legal for police to watch anyone, just doing it in a more efficient manner.

I don't know where to draw the line between freedom and security, but I do feel that we're headed in the wrong direction right now.

07-28-2005, 10:09 PM	#1 (permalink)
lindalove Registered User	Freedom vs Security in the age of Surveillance Cities and businesses are full of cameras … phone conversations and private internet communications are intercepted … credit card and ATM transactions can be tracked … every citizen has their own personal ID number so the government computers can keep track of us As technology advances … the ability of big brother to track and profile citizens will only improve How much is too much? How much freedom do we trade in for security and law enforcement? How do we control those who have the keys to the kingdom?

07-30-2005, 08:53 PM	#3 (permalink)
Cynthetiq Tilted Cat Head Administrator Location: Manhattan, NY	As a person doing a genealogical database and corroborating birth information, if you were born in the US between 1905 and today, chances are I can find you and your mother's maiden name and your birth location pretty quickly. I recently found a ship manifest of my great grandfather making port in San Francisco 1952 with his wife and the destination they were headed. As far as cameras are concerned, here in NYC there are so many private cameras that there is a group who has mapped them and also given maps out how to avoid them, you may walk lots extra, but it can be done. IMO Britian has cameras all over London, it didn't stop the bombs on 7/7. __________________ I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not. What's the best nation in the world? DO-NATION!

07-31-2005, 10:59 AM	#4 (permalink)
Gilda 32 flavors and then some Location: Out on a wire.	One of the newest things is facial recognition software. I saw a profile on its proposed use in Miami, where they were proposing that cameras be installed at the airport and in certain other public places hooked into a central computer with the faces of known, wanted criminals in a database that the computers could use to scan faces in the crowds for. There were, of course, civil rights objections. I see no problem with a system like this being used for this particular purpose in public places, but somehow I doubt how effective it would be. It would be too easy to hide one's face from cameras using a baseball cap; criminals do this already to disguise themselves from security cameras when committing crimes. The objection is the slilppery slope argument, which is that once it's ok to scan for this, it'll become ok to track movements of suspects, or track movements of people not suspected of crimes. The defense was that it's just observing people in public, where it's entirely legal for police to watch anyone, just doing it in a more efficient manner. I don't know where to draw the line between freedom and security, but I do feel that we're headed in the wrong direction right now. __________________ I'm against ending blackness. I believe that everyone has a right to be black, it's a choice, and I support that. ~Steven Colbert