Abercrombie and Fitch Sells Sex not Sweaters.
 

Taking a walk in the mall is now hard to do without seeing half-naked guys and girls pawing each other. “Wait now,” you say, “Isn’t that what security guards are for? Kick those hormone-overwhelmed kids out of the mall!” Well what if those teens were actually blown-up photos, advertising for Abercrombie & Fitch? Students are perhaps attracted to the offer of sex when they see an underwear-clad gorgeous guy with a glitzy gal, wrapped up in each other’s inferred ‘romance’ on advertisement posters. Or maybe the youth of our nation is being drawn to the appeal of washboard abs and tiny tummies. Whatever the reason—it isn’t because the clothes are of commendable condition and sensible sizes. <P>
The morals of this large chain outlet are at an all-time low, targeting 13-17 year olds with their attractive models. Sure they may claim that their aims are at an older ‘more mature’ audience, but with themes such as half-dressed football players, it is obvious that Abercrombie & Fitch’s fans are young adolescent girls too naïve to see they’re buying into the hype. It is thoroughly ironic that Abercrombie & Fitch's own published numbers show the company’s last year annual sales peaked at $827-million with sales up 18%. And their biggest market? 7 to 14 year olds (GASP!), and 18 to college age young adults.<P>
The silliest thing is that, as teenagers, we constantly insist on rebelling from our parents—however, when it comes to clothing or attitude we flip ourselves upside down to be one of the norm. Why not buy a nice blue tee shirt and a pair of pants from Old Navy or the Gap? Oh no, we have to be like everyone else; we have to buy the itty-bitty fifty dollar sweater that barely covers our mid-drift and practically screams ‘I’M AN ABERCROMBIE & FITCH CONSUMER!’ <P>
Yes, there <i>are</i> coalitions and alliances rallying against this store that sells sex over shirts. The American Decency Association (ADA) claims “Abercrombie & Fitch targets teens at the most vulnerable point in their lives utilising images of young bodies, mostly unclothed, some partially nude, some totally nude, many in sexualised poses.” In fact, in 1999, A&F was called into court to account for distributing pornography to adolescents. While understanding the dispersal of pornography to minors is illegal, A&F continued to top the prior catalogue with its Summer 2002 Quarterly Catalogue. This ‘clothing’ catalogue is so questionable it comes with an XXX rating. Nudity, shirtless women frolicking about, and a man seemingly in bondage are just some of the disturbing images in the summer issue of the Abercrombie and Fitch quarterly.<P>
Abercrombie & Fitch has even proceeded to offend certain Asian-American families, causing a whole school in Los Angeles to protest and demand that the racist slanty-eyed caricatures be immediately removed. Yet, the majority of our student body still models shirts, pants, belts, and underwear with pricey tags stating ‘A&F.’<P>
There is a huge and obvious difference between decency and immoral smut, and Abercrombie & Fitch balances precariously between the two. It’s high time our generation turns away from such filth and starts buying from stores that deserve profit. Next time you visit the Valley Plaza mall, try resisting the urge to buy from a store that promises sex in exchange for cash. If everyone pitches in, maybe then A&F will get the picture that <i>their</i> pictures are tasteless and uncalled for.

---

Written for my high school newspaper.

I like it la petite!

I've refused to buy from Gap, A&F, Ralph Lauren, and Old Navy and so on, because of their advertising campaigns. Although, occassionally I've suckered myself into Old Navy, because well... it's affordable, although walking into that store gives me nightmares.

Not just malls that have these questionable images now though either. Walking down the street/driving, I see these ads up at bus stops. It doesn't bother me, but I can see how people would get offended by it.

Of course, then I could find the link to the 70's Sears catalogue, with some questionable images in that too :)

I rebel by not going to the mall.

Yea, you're just jealous.


;)

Yes, it is widely known that sex sells. Don't like it, don't buy it.

it's common knowledge....that the age demograph pf 13 -17 (including college age folk)....is filled with trendy, follower type attitudes towards fashion. That's why stores like A&F target them....and are aiming to be seen as the 'in crowds' clothing. Would they sell as much if their ads had more reserved or even 'geeky' people sitting in the library reading books with their oversized glasses on? I hardly think so.These young consumers are so concerned with their appearance that regardless of price or quality, they will buy anything that is deemed popular. It's just the nature of the beast. We all grow up someday and realize that paying 60$ for a pair or underwear is a little ridiculous!

I use to love A&F. I was soooo into the flannel shirt with a t-shirt under it and jeans just out of high school... but man they are expensive so i just started buying the same look at kmart for a fraction of the cost...

now im married, have a kid and dress like my dad "sigh"

DB

j crew and BanRep for outter-wear
walmart and target for underwear

i neednt set foot in a mall for any of it. and thank god.

nice piece petite. good flow and to the point.

Good piece of writing and good point.
Thanks!

Good-looking, fashionable young people look more exactly the same today than they ever have. The biggest reason to avoid mass-marketed style is because the result of paying attention to what is sold is appearing to be a clone of everyone else.

You're right, ART, and that's exactly the major fear of adolescents. Not death or starvation, but the fear of being different. No kid wants the $120 Nikes because they might be comfortable or well-made. They want them because it would be certain ostracism to NOT have them.

Nike knows this. Abercrombie knows this. GAP knows this.

The cure, as I see it, is empowering kids with their own fiscal responsibility. Give your kid a clothing budget every three months and tell him/her to buy whatever clothes they want with that money. However, they cannot have one cent more no matter what. They can certainly buy the $120 Nikes if they really want them, but they'll soon learn the value of the $20 blue jeans and the Clearance rack at Old Navy.

that's what my parents did for me, I had an allowance to buy clothes, books, and school outings. I had to make hard choices of something cool vs. something practical.

I never dressed cool in school, until I got a girlfriend and she started picking out clothes for me. The clothes that I got from shopping with her were bought with my earned money and not the allowance. We also used to fight alot about the clothes I wore because I was a well dressed teen and I had lots of business meetings after class so I dressed pretty conservatively usually.

Yep, since like the age of 12 My father had given me a $40 a week allowance. Seems like a lot, but I needed to pay for all clothes, field trips, hot lunch, and spending money out of that it really taught me the value of saving vs blowing it all on something "cool."

At the age of 13 I got my first job and have been working ever since - with the exception of two weeks off when I was in between jobs when I was like 16.

I can't say I haven't ever worn their clothes..but I didn't really pay attention to the marketing. I wear something because I like it and it fits well. I do agree that some of the marketing ploys are suspect but in a capitalistic society you're going to have that no matter what you do. I haven't worn anything from Gap (ever) I haven't purchased from A&F in about 6 years and truly hate their clothes now. Bananna Republic is ok but still pricey. I prefer to wear my worn in jeans and a concert t-shirt heh.

Seriously, I saw the A&F catalog and half the pics were of naked kids! I thought "Hey, I already have that outfit!". After a week of walking around naked, I realized that it wasn't the new style. Thanks to the Fremont Police Department for being so understanding :thumbsup:

I buy most of my clothes from costco.

I've always been partial to the 'preppy' look, simply because i think it looks nice, and for me, it's comfortable. However, I've draw the line at buying clothes from from A&F. Not intentionally, of course, I mean, I might buy something there, except that every shirt I encounter that I sort of like has their logo plastered across the front, and apart from what LPM's article points to as 'wanting to be one of the norm', that it's trendy to wear A&F clothes...I really just don't see the point of wearing clothes with logos. And it makes me feel tacky.

This article got a huge rouse out of those jerky girls that can waste mommy and daddy's money on trips to the mall every Friday. Everytime they would walk by me, they would shout: "OH LOOK I'M WEARING AN A&F SHIRT!!!!" Another group of girls "boycotted" me by wearing Abercrombie and Fitch for a week straight.

oh.. i'm sure that showed you... lemmings and sheep.

I see more of a dress "code" from pop stars. I work retail, where little (i.e. 6yr) girls want the g-strings they see in videos. They don't know that Brittney, et al. are selling sex in their videos, they just want to be like her. It's whats hot - like a tattoo over the ass, or a crop-top and low-rider jeans (no matter what your size).
Of course A&F sells sex - it works. Look at beer commercials or ads. Drinking whatever won't get you laid, but they play the game.
Bottom line - it takes involvement from the parents. And if you think you know enough not to listen to your parents - you don't know jack.

PS: I'd like to make it clear to everyone that I was targeting the most mainstream thing I saw at school. Yes, I know beer commericials and other stores do this, and that sex sells...but I chose to write my commentary on A&F.

I want to be different... just like everybody else.

I hope to make this constructive criticism, and I hope you take it as such. However, it IS criticism. In a thread (so far) full of people agreeing with you, it may stand out as more negative than it is. Please read what I write from the constructive criticism, and slightly devil’s advocate point of view. Thank you.

I quoted you in parts to highlight where I have issues.

Let me start by saying I commend you for taking a public stand for something you believe in. That takes a brave person. Even though I seriously doubt this article had any impact, other than increased negativity towards you, the effort was worthwhile.
The impact you had, was I think, on people who already agree with you. The rest of the impact would be to make those that disagree with you do so more fervently, and take those that didn’t much care and put them against your point also.

Two little problems editorially: There is no such word as “mid-drift.” The word is “midriff,” or “The middle outer portion of the front of the human body, extending roughly from just below the breast to the waistline.”

If you’re going to buck heads with people in a publication, you’ve got to hold a high grammatical standard. The first thing people will do when they disagree with you is look for holes in your argument. Right or wrong, they will see mistakes in the text first. Then they’ll attack your intelligence and credibility with your own mistakes. They may not be right, but those tactics are very effective. Today’s media proves that. DO NOT GIVE them that easy out. You have to work harder to oppose the norm. No social crusader ever had it easy.

Second, the A&F catalogue did not have a XXX rating. This is a bad kind of mistake for you to make, because it’s blatantly false. If anyone wants to, they can call you a liar now. That is not going to help your point. The A&F catalogue you refer to DID have XXX printed on its wrapper, as much as an advertising push, as a warning. The thing is though, A&F put that there, NOT some government (or other) ratings agency. I can put XXX on my birthday card, but it doesn’t make it so.
The quarterly did have nudity, and it did have very sexually suggestive poses. But, it did not show intercourse, oral sex, or other actual sexual activates that would give such a rating.
While you make your point, you’d have to be prepared to discuss the definition of pornography (which is a whole other huge topic to tackle) since you’ve used that label. It’s not an accurate statement, and can/will lead some people to miss your main point.




Very early in your article you called your own audience, the people whose behavior you aim to change, “young adolescent girls too naïve to see they’re buying into the hype.”

Well, you just alienated your target. Whoops. As I’m sure you know, teens do not like to be called adolescent, and no one likes to be naïve.

You go on to remind everyone that people practice herd behavior, and generally try to be accepted by meeting whatever norm is there to meet. Okay, truth. But, few people actually think they go to extra effort to meet that norm. They also won’t likely admit during high school that they are doing it. And what age group, over just about all others, likes to think it’s being independent for the first time? The one you just said is completely absorbed in being sheep.

I’ve been to Old Navy and the Gap. Not a whole lot more conservative than A&F. Splitting hairs really. The clothes are very similar, even if the ads have a different focus.

You remind your audience again you feel they are sheep. Whoops. Then you insult their intelligence. Whoops.
I guarantee you that no girl who bought the $50 sweater did so with the actual intention of being just like everyone else. She thought it was cute. Now you’re telling her what her “real” motivation was, and you’re doing so sarcastically. She’s going to listen to you why, exactly? It’s not going to be because you made her feel stupid and defensive, that’s for sure.


“It’s high time our generation turns away from such filth and starts buying from stores that deserve profit.” Okay, good. Not many people will agree with you that suggestive poses are filth, but it’s a start. Why does a store deserve profit? You’re assuming we all agree on what makes a store deserving. This is what you should have started your article with, and spent the rest explaining why oversexuallizing young girls is “filth” and showing the audience who you feel deserves your $$.

The trick when explaining why you feel A&F doing that oversexuallizing is bad is the hard part. Most people your age are not going to agree that an A&F shirt showing some tummy is filth. Not going to happen. The ones that do see that, already agree with you, so they aren’t your target audience. A&F deliberately poses young people who don’t yet fully understand their sexuality, or the inherent responsibilities with it, in overly carefree extremely sexual pictures. They know that it turns hormonal kids on. They know it turns a lot of people on, and they know a lot of people will go into a rage and provide free publicity.

You need to explain in a rational, and yet emotionally touching way, why you feel our bodies deserve more dignity than cheap use as a marketing tool.

That’ll get people to see where you’re coming from.

Explain why you feel sex, especially in younger adults, is a serious and personal thing that is being exploited for profit, and you think that’s wrong. Tell them why you feel their approach to the market is wrong. Concentrate on the companies practices as wrong, don’t tell the ones buying the clothes they are sheepish fools for falling for it.

Don’t talk exclusively to girls either. The whole thing fails to give males any reason to not shop there. They know there are hot girls in A&F stores, and they know hot girls advertise A&F. Giving a teenage boy a strong enough moral reason to not want to support a source of hot girls isn’t going to be easy.

Changing human behavior is perhaps the hardest thing to attempt. You have to get in their heads, look at your words from their side, think hard about what you’re saying to someone wearing an A&F shirt. Make them feel that shirt is dirty, but not that THEY are dirty for buying/wearing it. Make them feel like NOW they know the dirty secret A&F had. Make them feel smarter than the sex for $$ ploy. Then you’ll make some change.

I don't shop at A&F, ever.... but I do own a pair of diesel jeans I bought at nordstrom rack... I'm such a

http://www.cbldf.org/graphics/logos/dwyerlogo.gif

whoa....it's a highschool article.....not a publication to top execs.

that reminds me of... adbusters

http://adbusters.org/metas/politico/...flag_r2_c2.jpg

I don't know why people get so worked up about stuff like this.... A&F is just doing what works. Is there anything wrong with buying A&F clothing? Will they turn into sluts when they buy a shirt?

You may think that their clothes are "filth," but I don't not. I have never worn an A&F article of clothing in my life, but that is simply because I don't like the style.

Also, what's wrong with "washboard abs" or "tiny tummies"? Having a toned body is much better for you than being fat.

Carn, when their advertising is so rude that it has an XXX warning, it makes a person wonder. Also, the washboard abs and tiny tummies advertise that everyone should starve themselves to become skinny. Abercrombie and Fitch also promoted racist clothing design as something cute and funny.

Personally, I don't really care either, but it's a little upsetting when 7 year olds are wanting to show themselves off to the boys.

Bingo!!

A&F Uses Sex to Sell Sweaters is what the title of this thread should be. If people are complete dumbasses and fall for their stupid shit, then I tip my hat to A&F for being a successful company, and laugh at the people who buy their garbage. This is a total non issue.

I think branding on clothes is 1000x more pervasive today then it was 5-10-15 years ago.

Where are you supposed to shop today for clothes or shoes these days that aren't covered with logos, or brand names or whatnot? every article of clothing from head to toe seems to have something on it identifying it to a company. i saw an iraqi fighter half way around the world on tv yesterday wearing a nike tshirt for christ sake. I wonder if its even possible to get just plain, generic stylish clothing??? I haven't found anyplace yet... :crazy:

on the train in NYC I saw my first triple branding shirt... Manchester Football Team with a Vodaphone logo in the middle with a Nike swoosh on the shoulder.

and it's not just clothing.. it's all brands.. branding branding branding... it's a corporate mantra.

Hi PowerClown, I had a coca-cola rugby shirt in 8th grade, just like everyone else. Those were really cool.

Well for sports teams, their clothing usually has several logos on them because they are sponsored by that company.

I don't starve myself, and I am in pretty good shape. I work out several times a week in addition to surfing several times a week. I eat like a starved pig, yet I take the time to work out and keep myself in shape. It is unfortunate that some people don't realize that not everyone can be a supermodel and that everyone has different bodies, but that's not A&F's fault. I agree with billege. Don't slam A&F and people for buying A&F, educate them instead. Teach parents to raise their kids right, and to not allow their 7 year olds to dress like sluts.

Btw, what stores deserve profit? Stores that my mom shops at? Stores that feature overweight people in their magazines?

I have an Abercrombie and Fitch anecdote. When my shorts get frayed and worn, and in one case spotted with chlorine beach spots, what I do is, I take them to Abercrombie and Fitch and just leave them in a pile of their new 'worn' shorts. I laugh at the thought that someone will try to buy them.

I don't agree with you and I also thought it was a poor article.

You essentially told an entire school population why they buy their clothes, and then you proceeded to critisize, even belittle them, for it.

I also think you did this not because you actually wanted to get any kind of humanitarian point across, but instead to create some kind of shock value for your newspaper.

Sorry for being harsh, but those are my feelings.

Hmm Valley Plaza Mall, isnt that in Bakersfield?

Yea I guess I know where you are coming from. I stop going to that mall all together because I couldn't stand the crowd there. I do all my shopping at Gap Outlet factories now.

I agree with the points billege made, but they won't do much good if cowman is correct.

I also think it's a bit of a stretch to promote Gap and Old Navy over A&F--all of them smack of preppy/trendy shit. If your argument is about cultural images, that line right there really undercuts your point. Better to have said to go shop second hand--that's the only place you wouldn't be contributing to branding and consumerism.

one can go to boutiques and thrift shops, powerclown.

on a differnt note, I can't get over the fact that my shoulder sling has a huge fucking brand name on the front of it! my shoulder sling. Even in my pain I have been transformed into a walking billboard.


haha, oh yeah, it's an UltraSling II by DonJoy

Whatever happened to UltraSling I? ;)

thank you ER. Ever since ER became a smash hit all the medical devices realized just how important tailgate bumper branding is...

no offense but i didn't waste 16+ years of my life in an educational system to have to shop at thrift shops as an adult. there's no getting around it, im a walking corporate billboard.

I don't understand....Are you saying that you don't shop in thrift stores because you're educated? Or is it you're entitled to shop in better places because you managed to get through high school? Or are you saying you've got a good job thanks in large part to suffering through a decade and a half of school and therefore can afford to buy the more expensive stuff and that justifies the end?

I'm just not making the connection....

Why is everyone up in arms about A&F?

I mean, it has nothing to do with clothes; it's image. They sell an image. Nothing more, nothing less. Their models are fantastically good looking types that seem to ooze sexuality out of every single attractive pore on their air-brushed little bodies and if they can convince you that that image and their clothes are related then more power to them.

Should they be ashamed? To an extent. There preying on the insecurities of a demographic that, as much as they cry out for individuality, are, in reality, just looking to fit in. Are they ashamed? Absolutely not. In fact, to add insult to injury they don't just cultivate this image and let it be done. They slap their label somewhere prominent so, presumably sometime in the future they can take inventory of who's wearing their clothes and judge the effectiveness of their advertising and adjust the "shame level" of their marketing focus. To be fair, they're just doing what any good business would do, make money. It's just their methods that seem a little out of whack.

As for shopping in thrift stores....well, I seem to remember it wasn't so long ago that retro was "in" and thrift stores were hot. However, that didn't make any money for the GapStageClosetAbercrombie & Fitch folks. Now that all the stores are selling their version of "past fashion."

It's the new retro, baby. :cool:

The question to ask is do you want in?

A great book pertaining to the "branding" of america is called "No Logo." I forget the author but I think her name was Naomi something.

Naomi Klein

And sex sells...

Heres a question for you:

Why does it matter if they're selling an image?

The whole point of clothing, at least in the summer time, IS image. Otherwise, we would all be walking around naked.

People like to look good, this is a fact of life. Why arn't we all up in arms about Fitness centers advertising pictures of beautiful women? Shouldn't the point of a fitness center be getting healthy?

For many people, it's not. I go to a gym 5 times a week because I want to look good. I buy Abercrombie because I want to look good. I eat a can of tuna for lunch instead of a bigmac because I want to look good.

Image is a MAJOR part of many people's lives, and belitteling(sp again) other people because they want to fit into a certain image is, in my opinion, a terrible thing to do.

Now as far as the article goes..well..as I said earlier, you decided why an entire school population was buying X clothing and then critisized them for it. Sure, many of the people are buying it for the sex image(what's wrong with that, again?), but im sure there are those who buy it because they like the clothing, or they have a relative who works there so they can get it cheap, or the other endless possibilitys that there are.

I got a kick out of this statement. :lol: I always thought buck heads are what hunters have on their walls, and disagreeing with someone was butting heads.


We now return to your previously scheduled thread, already in progress.

I'm saying having spent so much goddamn time and $$$ in getting an education (i use the term loosely) now that i finally have a few bucks in my pocket (I'm hardly rich) im gonna use some of that dough to buy nice clothes, which I happen to prefer. Logically speaking, if i was smart, i probably should save my money and shop at thrift stores and the like, but 1) im too materialistic, 2) im not smart.

8.5 for a fantastic dismount.

So anyway, if I had read this article when I was 16, full of angst, and shopping at Hot Topic (in the same realm as A&F as far as I'm concerned) for my Pennywise shirts, I most definitely would have been in full agreement with all the points brought up - including insulting those who shop at A&F.

However, now at 19 and more mature, I look at the big picture and can determine that it's all just clothing. External costumes for our internalized selves. While as a practice I shop at Goodwill and the sale rack at Kohl's (I do own some AE jeans and Gap shirts), I do not view myself as a more individualistic member of society - that comes from my personality, not my choice of clothing. Judging each other based on the label of our jeans - whether it be A&F or Lee - is not acceptable, regardless of how awesome it is to take a stand against the herding of America's youth, which has been done for decades.

We are all people, regardless of what we wear. [edit: I've met some pretty awesome people in my two years of college, and let's just say that my previous self would have not allowed these people to get within 5 feet of me] There is definitely not enough love for our fellow human out there, and hating someone just because of where they shop is not my idea of being open-minded.

Well, I say it's their money, their marketing campaign, and if people want to spend money to fit into a stereotype, go for it :-)

See it's ok to say whatever anyone wants to wear should be fine. But the problem is, as i see it, it's the younger crowd that's always tricked into this kind of thing. I'm worried about the 11-15 demographic. They are too young to be wearing sexually advancing clothing because they still have no idea about life and sex. I'm only on the topic of young girls dressing like whores at a young age. Wish they had better parents.

Prejudging people on the basis of just their clothing isn't cool.

Personally, I hate image. I hate our focus on physical appearance and obsession with looking perfect but not treating each other perfectly. Then again to each their own, if that's your goal go for it, but it sure as hell isn't mine.

Well, there's no reason to go calling yourself stupid. Don't get me wrong, I certainly wasn't trying to rag on you. I just didn't understand the way you were connecting the dots.

And believe me, I certainly understand the desire to buy good quality clothing and I'm certainly not slamming the folks who shop at these places. I just don't believe that good quality clothing comes exclusively from GapClosetStageAbercrombie & FitchNike's domain.

If you want to buy the image, I'm not going to knock you for doing it. Just realize that you are buying it for the image.

Does that make sense?

Oh yeah I understand I'm buying an image.
There's something I realized a while back: People are Judgemental. Even when they insist they aren't, they are. They'll judge you based on your haircut; they'll judge you based on the type of car you drive; they'll judge you by the types of friends you have; they'll judge you by what clothes you wear; they'll judge you by the music you listen to; they'll judge you by the way you speak. They'll judge you by your body type. They'll judge you by your posture. They'll judge you by what cigarettes you smoke and beverages you drink.

So...once I figured this out, I just tried to go along as best I could to minimize pain in my life. I realize that some people are different from this, and are more confrontational, confident or whatnot, I'm just describing myself. It never ceases to amaze me how a change in your outward appearance affects other's perceptions of you, and therefore, their actions toward you.

la petite

Great article, something i've felt for years...then again, i do shop at BR and gap and old navy and jcrew...but only when there are sales. :)

as for what you're saying....I can totally agree. the last A&F catalog i saw was R rated and had half advertising clothing and half with just naked people..no clothing necessary..normally...I'd be all for it, but when it's an ad for clothing marketed towards 15 yr olds and 15 yr olds can't legally have the advertisement...well, it just makes ya think.

Now, do i blame them? nooo, obviously it sells and the bottom line is everything...right?.................

I just think it's sad that parents spend so much money on their children for this stuff and then they bitch about everything else...

Naomi Klein

I gotta say this:
Where is anyone under 16 getting money for A&F clothes? My wife and I are both wage earners, and doing well for 20-somethings. We choose not to even try and pay what A&F sells clothes for. So, where the heck do kids get that kind of money?

I can see a working 16-18 year old dumping all their cash into clothes. That age group has the earnings potential, I suppose, to buy their own clothes.

But, if any kid too young to legally work is sporting some A&F, I'd think it's safe to assume they got the bankroll from mommy and daddy. I'd be willing to think many kids over 16 (and therefore possibly working) also get the many dollars to buy A&F from mommy and daddy.

This situation is not a new, or undisputed, one. Parents who let their children buy this stuff may or may not have discussed with their children the implications of sex. If our hypothetical parents have taught our A&F shopper about sex, it's not impossible they're making an informed purchase.

If parents are still funding the trip, it's still their decision to say what the kid can buy with that money.


Good, I'm glad you did. It's common for me and some of my peer group to say, when sarcastically issuing a challenge, "oh you wanna buck huh?"

It may not be grammatically correct, and I was just waiting for someone to point out grammatical errors in my post ,and call me out, or even call me a hypocrite.
However, I'm not writing a published article like the kind I'm dispensing "advice" on. My post is just that, a spell checked stream of consciousness, on a message board. If I was publishing an editorial I'd have followed my own advice.

I just buy clothes, I don't really think about. A company can advertise however they want, I don't really care. If I see something I like, I may buy it. If not, I'll head to the next store.

a few more comments:

there are other stores besides thrift stores that one can buy unbranded merchandise: sweatX is the first one that comes to mind. another store like that should come up in google.

in uptown areas, thrift stores carry better (more expensive) merchandise than A&F. I live in OC. If you go anywhere around the posh regions of OC or LA, you're going to find unbelievable things. That was just a suggestion as an antidote to consumerism--I wasn't trying to convince you, powerclown of anything, just answering your Q about where one could possibly go these days.

Now I don't usually buy _really_ expensive stuff, but when i have bought designer dresses and things, they are never branded. Neither are the most expensive suits and even my tux. So if one were really concerned about labels and things, expensive clothes are on the other end of the spectrum. My understanding is that slogans on clothes was a middle class phenom. The ball cap was the most blatant form of this. lower classes don't care, I suppose, and upper crust doens't want someone else's name on their ass. The only people who seem to care are people desperately trying to announce their class position and their desire to be upwardly mobile.

11-15 year olds know a hell of a lot more about sex than many of you are giving them credit for. They prolly get more sex than most of us, actually. and it isn't a new thing, although people try and link it to the decadence of our modern culture.

The notion that A&F is marketed toward these (pre)teens was not caused by A&F. It was caused by articles that started this thread. A&F claims they market their clothes to college students, their catalog was age restricted, and the models don't look like prepubescents or even high schoolers. The fact that parents buy their children these clothes doesn't make A&F culpable. It also doesn't say anything about the parenting styles, either. It's just clothes.

I think it's tragic for people to be linking one's clothing choices to that person's sexuality. If someone buys clothes from a catalog that shows people engaging in orgies and etc., that does _not_ make the purchaser into a whore. Wearing short skirts, baring midruffs, and low cut tops do _not_ translate into being a whore or sexually loose. The only thing that makes someone sexually promiscuous is engaging in sexual behavior--and girls and boys who don't ever show an inch of flesh are just as capable as those who show it all at engaging in sexual behavior.

Sexual behavior doesn't impugn anyone's moral character, unless they purport to subscribe to a particular set of moral beliefs that would otherwise argue that they shouldn't be doing it. If a girl or boy is a member of a church that believes premarital sex is wrong, then I would support someone calling his or her morals into question because he or she wouldn't be adhering to a chosen belief system.

That's where I draw my lines.

Well guys, the thread starter is only a kid so he's not going to have a perfectly written argument. I commend what he is trying to state which is A&F are clearly marketed to an underage group. Their models look like they're 14-17 years old. And the provocative nature in which they are pictured are sexually suggestive. Their ad campaigns are aimed at kids too young to be exposed to such things.
For crying out loud, I was in the Mall two years ago and they had a 6' x 8' photo of a seemingly naked guy in bed with four girls! That's obvious, blatant, and clearly inappropriate.

Heehee, I'm a girl. And yes, I was 16 or 17 when I wrote this.

and you do have lots of sex.....not that that's a bad thing

AF fucking sucks! I hate their clothes, I hate their campaigns, I hate the entire attitude and lifestyle that is associated with that shit! 50 fucking dollars for a pair of jeans that look like you ran them through a fucking wood chipper! Where do I sign up? Look at me, mommy bought me $500 worth of shit from AF and I only got 10 items! Oh yeah, I went to Old Navy and got the exact same looking shit from Old Navy for $250! Popular clothing stores are shit, and this is the precise reason why I hate them. Do I own clothes from stores like Old Navy and American Eagle? Yes. But I FUCKING HATE AF. They're shit. Pure, unadulterated shit. Too expensive, not worth the money, not now, not ever.

This sounds familiar, I think the author was in a documentary I saw recently:The Corperation, which is quite good by the way.

A&F makes me sick to my stomach. They are selling sex to minors, plain and simple. I am the last person to normally care, but after all of the stories I hear about young people these days, it makes me think twice.

A couple years back, when I was in good shape & worked in the mall, A&F asked me if I wanted to model in their store(wearing only boxers) for $100 a day. I politely declined, but I don not understand how having a half naked guy standing in your store has anything to do with selling clothing.... What are you trying to say?-If you dont come in here and buy clothes you will be like that poor sucker standing at the door in his boxers...?

oh, and i just got the best pair of jeans i have had in a while for $20, I dont know the store. I am forgetfull

Not sure if anyone mentioned this because I didn't read all the comments, but there was a controversy a couple of years ago too, where Abercrombie and Fitch was marketing a thong to 7 to 14 year olds that said "Eye Candy" and "Wink Wink" on the front and pissed a lot of people off. Not sure if they decided to keep selling them or not

Article here: http://www.jsonline.com/news/gen/may02/43941.asp

Pic of thong here: http://graphics.jsonline.com/graphic...gbig051602.jpg

Their ad campaigns are aimed at kids too young etc? Says who? Who are you to draw the line for X number of kids across North America?

Havign worked at A & F for about a six monthe period, I have to say that I don't much care for the people that the company employs (with a few exceptions, of course). Let me explain this a bit. I worked in a very large mall Abercrombie on the west coast. The area I live in has a very large number of Latino, Asian, and Black communities. None of wich were hired, unless they were what most people consider white wash. The ration of white to any other ethnicity was about 30:1 in a store of about 60. You get the idea. Also, the average phisique of the worker was somewhere between 'best-looking person at your highschool' and 'Brat Pitt and Jessica Simpson'. Neither of these rules was exclusive to the floor workers. Poeple who worked in the stock room and who worked the night shift - people who were never seen by the customers - were also required to look this way. We were also required to wear Abercrombie cloths and specific shoes! I complained about that, because I did not make enough working there to buy cloths like that; even with the employee discount. They basically told me to shut up or be fired, so I explained to them that California law gies me the right to wear something other than their clothes.
After that, I was basically an outsider. I only took the job to make my car insurance payments and for gas money. Eventually I made my way back into their graces with really good, and hard, work and shutting my big mouth. I was invited to sit in on interviews for new employees. We would hire about 10 or 15 at a time, seeing as there was such a quick turn around for working there (I wonder why?). What I heard the person in charge of hiring say after the interview shocked the hell out of me. This is almost a direct quote, "I can't beleive those chinks still think they can work here!!!" I immediatally demanded that person (a manager) to fire me. She did.

Since then there was a lawsuit involving asians (a 'two wongs will make it white' shirt showing asians doing dry cleaning) and there was another involving the strict dress code.

I won't ever shop there again.

Feel free to show my story in your school news paper.

Sounds like a nightmare. Anyway, I wish I could, but I graduated last year.

hahaha, oops. Well at least you get a different perspective.

I went into A&F once. I walked over to the t-shirts, saw that I would have to spend $25 to get one and walked out of the store. I've never been back inside any A&F stores since.

I thought it was funny the other day when I went into Old Navy and saw that they would go a head and pre-wrinkle your shirts for you.

I personally do not care how a store chooses to advertise themselves. I am part of the group who buys, not from A&F, because they are too expensive, but Hollister, Gap, American Eagle, and Express. So am I a bad person now? No, I like the clothes, they are what I am willing to pay, and personally, the thought of wearing someone else's clothing kinda grosses me out. I am in no way an unintelligent person. I also shop for clothing at Target. And for those of you who railed against Gap, to go on to say Banana Republic was where it's at, I have a bit of information for you. BR and Gap, in addition to Old Navy are all the same company. By buying from BR, you are effectivly patronizing Gap. Just thought I'd let you know.

Ok, I would first like to say that the only trendy place I get my clothes at is hot topic. Usually I shop at wal-mart. My main question is not "Where do the kids get the money?" or "Why are stores allowed to behave this way?". My question is "What the fuck are parents doing letting their 7-14 year old kids wander around the mall alone for? Especially with large amounts of money on them?" And if the parents are with the kids and letting them buy the clothes than there is nothing we can do about it. As far as I'm concerned the store should be able to sell whatever clothes it wants to and be able to use what ever advertising methods they want so long as they do not break the law.(i.e. child pornography, any models showing so called private areas need to be 18 or over.) Should a company be able to discriminate in it's hiring practices? Sure, that doesn't mean you have to shop there or work there if it does. If a company wants to present a certain image to it's customers it should be able to, even if it's a rascist image, if you were a store manager you wouldn't hire someone covered in dirt and filth and that reeks like an unemptied garbage bin to work on the sales floor would you? Besides rascism against a majority is just as bad as rascism against a minority, it still impacts the individuals. If you don't like it don't shop there. If they sell clothes that display rascist symbols don't by the clothes, if the clothes don't sell they will stop making them. I am not a rascist, so don't try calling me one, I am simply a very strong supporter of the First Amendment. I also believe that the government should not be able to tell businesses who they have to hire, or colleges who they have to admit.
Do I believe that racism should be done away with totally? Hell yes. But saying you can't display rascist symbols and slurs only hides it, it does not change the thoughts behind it. We have to be able to see the target to get rid of it.

Just to repeat I am in no way a supporter of rascism, I just believe we are going the wrong way about getting rid of it.

Aphrodites kiss. There are a lot of people out there that say that they'd never buy a Ford. Of course Ford is also Lincoln, Mercury, Land Rover, Astin Martin, Saab, Volvo, and Mazda. Just because they are all from the same father company means that they are all of the same quality or the same type. The parent company is not directly involved with the marketing stratagies of each of the subsideary companys.
I like Banana Republic, too.

I realize that though the "main" parent company isn't soley in charge of marketing, etc. they still do oversee some of it, at least in the case of Gap, Old Navy, and BR. It just kind of irritated me to hear someone say they hate this brand of clothes, but still buy from its subsidiaries. If you are going to boycott a brand for certain buinsess practices, it would make sence to boycott all its other companies as well.

I walked in once because someone said they had nice jackets, saw the shit they had and left to never return.