Peeping tom sodomized by victims mother, friends and family.
 

Is this right? Should we be taking justice into our own hands? Should those acting on behalf of the victim be subject to charges? This hits close to home. I grew up and have friends and family minutes away from where this happened. Worse yet, there are probably only 4 degrees of separation between the Peeping Tom and me (a friend of a friend of a cousin, etc knows the person).

http://www.cleveland.com/news/plaind...2650775790.xml

Smoking Gun

No it's not right. Vigilante justice is never right.

But it's damn funny.

What a charming woman she is -- She's not even related to the 5 year old.

Gee, ya think? how about making the punishment fit the crime?

It's not that funny really, what's funny is the band of misfit criminals that decided it would be a good idea to basically kill some perv. Hollywood couldn't have picked a better bunch, they sound like some high-class citizens.

Wow, that is fucked up.

Tough, real tough! But if he was even entertaining thoughts about harming that little girl.......

Vigilante justice should be reserved for when the legal system refuses to, or is unable to, take action, or when it utterly fails.

That is disgusting.

well as the father of a little girl I can see both sides of the fence, being angry enough to attack the perv (but not to that extend! that is what makes this wrong) that is what the police are for not your fists. pedophiles have no rights in my eyes, but maybe he was just thinking of doing a b&e not looking at the girl for example. but if he is one, then he should be treated like all other pervs...shot in the back of the head.

"Temporary Insanity" comes to mind.

Oh shit.

That's fuckin' funny.

a stripper shoved a foot long tree branch in his ass.. ouch, he musta gotten some splinters. good thing he was probably already unconcious when they pulled it out

I love how everybody hates pedophiles and we don't understand shit about them, I mean I wouldn't allow them to screw little kids but everytime one of them pops up some crazy angry mob surfaces from the general population wishing the worst possible things for him/her; Like never sympathizing, never trying to fix their problem at the source, whatever it is.

People need a healthier outlet for all their stresses. Screwing little kids, castrating pedophiles, and beating and sodomizing peeping toms just aren't very healthy things to do, you know?

Well, if the guy wasn't off wandering around looking for little 5 year olds to wack off to this never would have happened to him. Not saying it was right, but I do think it's better that this happened to him than for him to have gotten away with it completely. He just happened to pick the wrong house, lol.

It was not right for them to have attacked the guy, nor was it right for the guy to be there doing that in the first place. They should have just called the police and told them to come with their lights off as to catch him in the act.

Wow... just... wow...

And there was a 15 year old girl that partook in the beating/sodomizing of the guy? What the hell are they teaching her?

I completely agree. but note that those people were doing drugs in the first place.. they couln't call the police. it doesn't justify anything. they should never had beat up the guy...

I dont see how its funny at all.

The perv doing that is gross and he needed help or something (though now he might die )

The gang of people shouldnt have done that, its completely fucked up, especially the stick, and going back to see if he was alive and beating him more..


Now what are the parents of this 5 year old doing up at 4 am doing drugs and drinking?

I hope they get what they deserve (not death, but a long prison sentence)

I dont get how you people call these guys pervs and whack jobs and such. Some people have different sexual turnons than others. Whats the score here?
And dont tell me that hes going to hurt these little girls. I would bet that he would just take pics of her. ??? and also dont tell me that this will scar her for life. Do you remember anything that happened while you were 5 years old? No, you dont. Case closed...

BTW I am NOT a pedophile Im just creating another side of the story.

Redarrow, a great many pedophiles do move on to actual molestation, and most people feel rather protective of their children- Would you let that pedo take pics of your kid?- I would hope that you would react in some way, and at least show some outrage - as to the memory thing, yes, I do remember quite a bit from age 5, and a bit before- I am sure that I am not unique in this- most people would tend to lable pedophilia as a true, "evil" of the world, and as a result, most would not be to concerned with how the pedo might be suffering from a mental affliction- I for one, am sure that there is a screw loose with them, but do not think that it is worth the trouble to understand, such people are simply defective and must be prevented from harming society- Imho, a bullet is a proven form of "therapy"

as to the details and what I think of this situation
on the one hand, I find it somewhat just that this man will serve as a warning to the pedophiles of cleveland, on the other it seems a bit harsh as he had no direct contact with the child- obviously the people who did the beating are not bright bulbs on the tree- looks like a double warning, against drunken stupidity, and perverts- no one wins, and everyones life is ruined.... even, probably, the kids.......

agreed, having her mother put to jail is probably worse for the kid than having a guy look at while asleep. from an utilitarian stand point, the "pervert" didn't hurt anyone by looking at the girl; though his sexual preference may have driven him ultimately to cause harm the little girl and to many, including me, his action is sickening, at the time of his death, he has yet caused any harm but perhaps to himself mentally (if we define his sexual preference as a problem). Furthermore, if you DO believe that one has the right to harm another because of his/her "problems" or that justice should be served, than killing another man is never justified under that belief. To harm another for his/her problem should only be to help him/her. to condemn someone for a "harmless" problem, I believe, is not correct. (harmless in a liberalterian way). I am in no way promoting peeking on another person, especially a defendless/innocent girl, but either way put, you cannot kill him for it.

I think they went too far. A good, savage beating is what this crap pile deserved, but no one deserves to be raped. Certainly, if I caught someone looking in on my family and masturbating to them, I would seriously consider shooting them, but never sticking objects in their orafices. It's hard to take sides when both parties are so wrong. I'm in favor of just calling an airstrike in on the apartment complex to just make sure. But that's me.

I would have kicked his arse as well - but not to that extent. I would definitely not be shoving ANYTHINg up his arse.

Works for me.

Despite Dubya's desperate desires, the cops can neither be everywhere nor watch everything and everyone.

The should have simply buried the guy under a couple bags of lime and left it at that.

Vigilantes facing death by government. Interesting.

What were they doing up at that hour partying. WITH her daughter home sleeping?? I mean the guy was getting a CD, safe to assume that they were going to be playing music. They were giving the girl a safe environment in the first place.

Yeah that guy should never have been there. He "asked" for it in a way. With a "low rent" establishment he can't possibly expect a somewhat civilized reaction. Of course he wasn't thinking right anyway.

Sure maybe the police might not have come in time. Though - if he didn't get caught once I bet he would have shown up again. The police could have caught him them.

One other thing. That woman lives there and didn't know there were cameras around?? What kind of drugs was she taking that she never noticed that?? DUH!

God there's just so much wrong with this story.

That guy is going to go back and shoot the place up.

This group of six should be held up and treated as heros, not criminals. If I had the money, I'd buy them all the best lawyers.

If you listen verrry carefully...you can almost hear the banjo's playing in the background. I can't even begin to say how screwed up this all is. There are nothing but losers here. Especially, and probably most tragic of all, the little 5 year old girl. What a bunch a fine, upstanding roll models she has...oh, had. How do you mend these scars? I dunno...maybe it's the best thing in the world that could've happened to her. Maybe she can be placed with a family that knows how to behave when young children are in the picture.

Disagree -- Having the mother in jail will be the best thing for this child. This "mother" is clearly not a responsible person, who uses good sense and judgement, she has no business raising another human being.

6 bad people off the streets, 1 young girl gets a second chance at life through a foster family. Sounds like karma to me.

the system is in place for a reason. Sure the system has holes and some problems but let's face it; two wrongs don't make a right, no matter how cliche it is..it's true. The guy is sick in the head obviously but the people who beat him up aren't exactly stable either if they are raping someone with a damn stick while a child watches. The guy didn't touch the girl but they raped him. I'm not saying he was right or defending him I'm mearly saying that they could have handled themselves in a different way, sending the guy to prison for a while and they would still have their lives intact. Now they are facing charges and the guy who was raped will probably not even end up in prison..

not sure how i feel, No, i don't think that he got what he deserved, but if it was my house. . . . i think that i would have detained him , and let him get his ass raped in jail.

He definitely deserved his ass kicked a little, but only as a way to detain him for the police. The people who beat him are obviously retarded and should be held accountable for their failure to exercise restraint. Tree branch up the ass?! I mean holy shit?! I couldn't do that to my worst enemy! It takes a sadistic person to do shit like that, even to bad people. The whole situation is a cluster fuck, IMO.

Like Mal said- vigilante justice should only occur if the system fails you first. And only in extreme cases, like you got them on tape committing a heinous crime and then they get off on a technicality like no rights read or something.

Except that's not what we do with so-called "pervs". They're either put in jail for a finite amount of time, or they're treated for whatever psychological afflictions they have, or both.

That sort of thinking is what leads to cases like this.

Hopefully… My God this story is a tragedy.

All I can say is that is screwed up beyond belief, all of it. I mean, what the hell?

People like those nuts scare me.

Damn that's some pretty fucked up shit.

The appropriate repsonse would have been to beat him up enough to restrain him and notify the police. They crossed that line before they even sodomized him.

The report said they found pot. Sure, it's illegal, but I don't see it as any worse than a group of people drinking (as long as nobody drives home). I don't have an issue with it. Someone mentioned the cd and how that shows they were listening to music, however it doesn't say anything about how loud. You can have music on at a volume low enough to not disturb sleeping kids. I think you guys are assuming a lot there calling them lowlifes based on that.

What proves to me that they are lowlifes is the way they treated the peeping tom. First of all, they beat the shit out of him instead on restraining and calling the cops. Second, they were planning on dumping the body if he was dead. Third, they sodomized him.

This isnt vigilante justice... this is a bunch of thugs beating & raping a man until he almost dies. I hope they rot.

They all suck, but the group is worse than the peeper, and here's why. Most peepers, pedos or not, are peepers because they are emotionally unable to interact with those they desire and so will look at a safe distance. Given the fact this was 4am I think the peeper was expecting to be left to his devices safely, tho his intelligence is dubious as well. He most likely wasn't going to risk breaking in and molesting the girl. If he would then he wouldn't have bothered peeping and jerking off at the window.


I also disagree that he would have escalated just because he's a pedo. Obviously he wasn't too smart in his methods of releasing his desire, but just becuase he is reviled by society doesn't mean he has no restraint whatsoever. Rapists are rapists, no matter what their choice of victims. Many pedos have no desire to harm a child at all, just like I have no desire to hurt women tho they are my sexual choice. Desire doesn't equal rape. He's not too bright to be sure, but that doesn't make him a rapist, just a peeping perv. Most wouldn't get too upset if he was peeping on college age girls, tho it's just as heinous an invasion of privacy, and most wouldn't automatically brand him a potential rapist for being a peeper of said adults. The important thing is no harm was done to the child by the pervert-time will tell if the lynch mob's actions will hurt her.

There's a certain amount of "He got what he deserves" that I feel for this bastard. Who knows what his intent was peeping in a 5 y/o girl. In any event these fools who took justice a little too far with this creep need to pay the price for their uncivilized actions.

How can anyone attempt to claim the moral high ground after meting out punishment that is hugely dissproportionate to the crime?

I have no pity for either party. The perv may have got more then he deserved, especially since they returned one hour and nine minutes later to dish out more. The first beating I can't condemn because if I found someone outside my five year old daughter's room at 4 am masturbating they would be fortunate if they got away with their body intact. At that point I would probably lose all sanity for a brief period. I really don't know what I would happen but I would probably grab the first weapon I came upon and commence shooting or beating, depending on the weapon I first came across. But after the initial anger, and I guarantee that I would be one pissed off angry sonofabitch, I would probably cool off a bit and call the law immediately. But to return and do it again is a little excessive and for that they will probably pay a bigger price than the perv.

I don't know what the people who committed the attack were thinking..well, obviously they weren't, but if I saw someone staring in at my daughter, my first thought other than to call the POLICE would be that taking matters into my hands would be the worst idea imaginable. I mean, after all, isn't there a not all too uncommon link between pedophiles and murderers? Every single person involved in this except the little girl is a jackass, and I have no sympathy for any of them. The fact that drugs were involved doesn't surprise me at all either.

jesus....how could anyone condone this?

what these people did had nothing to do with any conception of justice. a gang of fuckwits beating someone nearly to death, and raping the guy with a tree branch--that is not justice--that is attempted murder--and if he dies, it will probably be premeditated to boot---because they tore down one of the surveillance cameras.

"vigilante justice" is a contradiction in terms.

The guys probably going to die... Id say he paid a fairly big price

Where on Earth do you get this link? I've never heard that. I think you may be getting that from all the media coverage when a child rapist murders a child, which I would bet everything is much much less often than molestation in general. Doesnt' make what molesters do okay at any rate, but to try to add another stigma to this hated group isnt' helping things. I've read extensively the stories of many of these ppl and many are far from violent ppl let alone murderous. Rapists and murderers and just that, no matter who their target.

agreed. plus if it's on the news, it only shows how rare it is. if it's common, it will never make it to the news. How many news coverages are there for women who are raped? almost none these days. point is, child molestation is rare enough for it to make it to the news thus i think we can safety infer: pervert or pediphile does not equal rapist. again, i'm not condoning their social behavior but it's not ok to kill them...

Just great, now I have the ‘dueling banjos’ tune from the movie Deliverance stuck in my head. Just to make things clear, North Royalton is in the middle of the Cleveland suburbs, and not a back woods town where you would expect to hear a banjo in the background.

IMO North Royalton, the town where all of this happened is a quiet upper class suburb much like the upper class Chicago suburbs portrayed in the movie Breakfast Club; the same type of suburbs that Jay and Silent Bob are seeking out in the movie Dogma.

Wow, look at all the movie references I made.

Minding their own business, shouldn't matter. What business of anyone's is that? The little girl was sound asleep, not passed out drunk or awake partying. Of what consequence is this to you?

A very quick snap-judgement based on little to no information. Some people LOVE demonizing partying and drinking and using drugs (which could have just been weed, for christsakes) as the worst thing in the universe, when in reality it's a perfectly normal thing to be up with other consenting adults, enjoying adult beverages, and having a good time. Who are any of you to dictate that these actions are those of a bad parent? That is a disgusting generalization.

Getting a music CD hardly means they're going to blast it, or disturb the little girl in any way. Again- I see no way in which this makes this woman a bad parent, and I fail to see your (and others') righteous indignations over such little information. It's very easy to wag your finger at people, isn't it?

These people went too far- plain and simple. If this was my little girl, i'd have beat the shit out of him while on hold with the police, but obviously not to the point of even coming CLOSE to killing him. You can all make your assumptions about the parenting skills of those in question, but you ignore the fact that this man may have been 20 seconds away from breaking her window to get in. You ignore the fact that he may be watching her and following her home from school. He may have planned on abducting her in the future. You don't know that- and yet it's REALLY easy to label these parents YOU KNOW NOTHING ABOUT as horrible people. The fact is, they were enjoying a good time, one of them went to get a CD for music and saw the man in the window of the little girl who was still sound asleep, despite the horrible din you people make their get-together out to be... and craziness ensued.

Really, we can all say what we "would" do, but none of us would really find out unless it happened to us. Some people have buttons that should never get pressed in their entire lives, lest horrible atrocities befall the button-presser. Example: If the woman I love is ever raped or killed, not even God himself will be able to hold me back.

My long-winded $0.02...

Yeah.. Right before I break into a house I like to polish my knob...

But seriously, since nothing was done (even though there was the chance he could have) the legal system would have probably slapped him on the wrist and later on he might have done something to another little girl.

Sorry BoCo, can't see your hand on this one. The guy is sick and wrong for what he did. That doesn't give man these freaks the right to beat him to death. The pedo deserves treatement. It seems so popular to wish only the most vile things on pedos, like they're the worst idea ever had, but instead no one thinks maybe they need to be treated for the disorder. Maybe that guy was beaten and raped and fucked up his whole life, and it's made him a "monster." Either way, a gang of drugged up strippers and pals does not have the right to decide life or death. Neither society or God give individual man that right.

They had the right to call the police, they had the right to hold him there even. But that's where the right to throw stones stops. There is no way this bunch is close to anything resembling a hero. To suggest they are heros is to regress to neadertal standards and rut in the mud of human aggression.



*edit*
What bothers me about every thread we have like this one is that no one here is considering another point of view. This is like every other thread with such disparate viewpoints. If you side with the opposite of the mob, you get your post picked apart point by point. 'Cuase that's usefull.
Basically there is no discussion here, it's a collection of speaches made by people yelling at stones. No one is listening, just proving how wrong another post is. Eventually someone will get too personal, and it'll get locked, or it'll die because the people that just need to have their say have thrown in thier two cents. The arguers will have beaten their heads into the wall long enough to quit, and then the thread dies. Alone, forgotten, and totally unoriginal.

Is it always about you, billege? :-P There's never one right answer in situations like these. That's why depending on the judge and/or jury, you'll get different outcomes. It just serves as a central point where we can read each other's thoughts, whether they are "right" or "wrong."

Analog... the parents of the 5 year old girl were partying at 4 am, drinking beer and doing drugs... with a 15 year old girl and a 19 year old and some people.. I really dont think that is a good parent no matter what you say

Agreed, Jam.

And back on topic I think the peeping tom guy deserved to deal with the police and to be registered as a sex offender, not to be in intensive care or possibly 6 feet under

I think there is a victim in this scenario, but it isn't the little girl.

Talk about snap judgements...I am not demonizing partying (though drugs with a child in the house, is wrong -- always -- you cannot ever justify that - but that's not why she's a bad parent)

I could care less what this mother was doing before she was part of a group that savagely beat and raped a man. She left the child alone in the house to go out and avenge a wrong?

She's a bad parent because she set a bad example. When do two wrongs ever make a right.

What a bunch of drug-ridden drunk idiots. If they called the police then the man would be in a world of shit. Now the guy has people sympathizing for him and the people who took matters into their own hands are now the bad guys. That was a really stupid move by the people. I hope they get what they deserve for their mistakes...and maybe they'll see how idiotic drugs and alcohol are if you can't use it responsibly.

-Lasereth

Assault and murder is unacceptable unless your life is threatened. In this case the man obviously wasn't an immediate threat, and the legal issues that result from physically assaulting someone aren't worth the immediate but temporary gratification of kicking his ass. The appropriate response would have been to call the police, and allow them to take care of it. Prisons aren't known for treating sex offenders (and child abusers in particular) very kindly, and I have no doubt that this man would have ended up as Bubba's personal meat condom.

Not right, but, well, bizarre, that's for sure.

throw everyone's ass in jail
the rapist
the mob
the drugusers

Moving backwards... she set a bad example by not responding in the correct manner. How many times in that girl's life do you think a man will peep in her window late at night and be beaten to within an inch of his life by her family? This was a specific circumstance. If anything, this is a lesson in self-control and measured response. We're all human. That being said, I side with neither party. The peeper should be punished and rehabilitated in accordance with the law, and the family should be charged and brought to justice for the disproportionate/extreme reponse to the scenario. By the way, does one bad example make a person a bad parent in general? We all have our buttons...

I don't feel that leaving the house was all that big a deal. A guy was peeping in on her sleeping 5-year-old. Shit went down. It's an extreme circumstance, stuff happens.

Finally, to your first point-

I passed no judgments whatsoever. The closest I came to offering opinion was when I said it was a disgusting generalization- that's my feeling, not a judgments on others.


Refresher...
How can I not justify that? Because you say so? Ludicrous. So you've never imbibed alcohol with a child around? You've never smoked a cigarette or other tobacco product with a child around? You've never taken advil, tylenol, Premsyn, Midol, Benadryl, or any other prescription or over-the-counter medicines? "Illegal" drugs are "illegal" because they're "illegal" here. They all have an effect on you. They are all considered "drugs". Passing judgment on another's ability to parent based on something as small as the use of a drug is a poor excuse for lack of information in the situation and a snap-judgment is the result of negligence in rational thought.

that is just sick, there's no excuse for such behavior, they should have tied him to a lamp post naked, not beaten him to death, humiliation is so much better...

I don't really agree with that, because then it becomes based on the person's opinion of the crime. What's the point of a legal system if you're just going to find a person guilty anyway?

I'm not against vigilante justice... but this seems to kind of went a bit overboard. Jerking off at a 5 year olds window? This guy got what he deserved.