What would you do?
 

O.K., here is the scenario:

I designed a system for a customer of mine and was about to be awarded the contract ($350,000.00). (Money doesn't go to me but I do get a commission)

I don't really know how it happened, but the manufacturer I was going to use for about half the project got wind of my deal (I would be considered a dealer in this scenario). Next thing I know my customer has knocked my impending contract in half and is negotiating directly with the manufacturer to get the equipment and to have it installed (the manf. is out of state-LA- and I am local). It gets worse. My customer decides that they want to do more work with the manf. but their overall budget was $350,000. So to get more of the other stuff, my side of the contract gets knocked down to $98,000.00

Long story short, I call the manf. and get in touch with the president of the company (they probably do about 30 million a year, we do over 200 million a year). After I finished unloading on this guy, he made me an offer. This particular customer is considered a "feather-in-the-cap" type customer (high profile/looks good on a company brochure kinda thing). The guy wants his deal to close directly with my client. He also doesn't want to piss me off because we do alot of business with this manf. Its a numbers game, he stabs me in the back and I no longer spec his product-plus-I tell all of my co-workers what they did, yada, yada. He stands to lose by alienating me.

So, to the cruxt of my question, he makes me an offer.

To make me "happy" he has offered me a finders fee of 10% of the overall project on his side; it comes out to about $28,000.00

He then tells me that he can make the check out directly to me or whoever I want (i.e. my company, etc).

So.....

Do I take the money or do I turn it in to my company?

Before you answer, you have to know and understand the following things:

1) I am working on this project as a representative of my company. Yes, it is my customer (in fact I brought them in), but they have done business with my company so they are considered an official client of my firm.

2) I work in a very close-knit industry. It is very inbred, everybody knows everybody else.

3) I have created a pretty good reputation for myself in this industry. I am fairly well-known.

However, the money has been offered to me, personally, no strings attached.



What would you do?

/and no, I am not making this up

If it were me? I would not have been given this opportunity had it not been for my company, unless I'm misreading something.

I'd explain to the company what the situation is, and what you've been offered, and leave it up to them to decide.

I don't buy no strings attached, and 28K is no where near enough to besmurch my reputation and compromise my ethics.

This is a good example of channel conflict. Most resellers and manufacturers have encountered it. The good ones figure out a way to co-exist.

Under no circumstances should you take the money directly. You will appear to have been bribed at your company's expense, and will severely damage your reputation. Your bosses should have some experience in dealing with channel conflict. I would sit down with my boss and review the deal with him and work on a strategy to move forward. A typical solution would be for the manufacturer to split some of the margin with your firm (which is what the $28K represents).

From the sounds of it, it would be suffeciently under the table sneaky to damage your credibility, other issues aside I wouldn't do it from the risk, that and you pay doesn't seem that bad.

O.K.

Lets say my commission rate is 3%

3% of $280,000.00 = $8,400
3% of $28,000 = $840.00

so, your company and your client were about to form a contract... when a company you were going to sub-contract for the deal decided to bypass you and cut their own deal, knowing full well you were going to form a contract with the client?

well, from the very little i know about business law... i'm pretty sure that your sub-contracting manufacturer is in breach of some UCC laws and could be sued by your company. obviously, you don't want to create any bad blood if you work with them a lot, but you could definately use this as leverage to win back some more of your contract. considering your company sounds pretty large, i assume they have their own team of lawyers? go talk to one of them and ask for some advice.

It's like that old joke about the man who askes the woman if she will sleep with him for 1 million dollars, and she says yes, and then he askes if she will sleep with him for 10 dollars, and she says, what do you take me for? He says, we've already determined that, we're now haggling over price.

Doesn't matter the dollar amount -- it's still the ethics involved...

wonerwench,

It does come across like a bribe doesn't it?

I am trying to understand why this guy is willing to offer this kind of money.

Oh yeah, I should add. He put it in writing, made out to me.

dirtyrascal7,

The thing that holds in my favor is that the original design (that included this particular manf.) was created by me.

I forgot to mention:

I created this design before I got hired with my current employer. When I left my old company, they backed out of the deal and the customer asked me personally to come back in and rework the bid.

/shoulda gone independent

He may just be inexperienced, have a screw loose - or testing your ethics. Who knows?

The best way for you to handle this is to assume the offer was made to your company and to review it with your boss.

well, i still say there are contract laws being broken (even if there is no official contract, if the parties act as if there is a contract, no one can interfere and strike their own deal, breaking up the original "contract"... which seems to be the case here). and that you should talk to a lawyer, although perhaps now you should hire your own lawyer rather than use one of your company's laywers. :)

All right, I didn't give you all of the details. I wonder if this changes your opinion.

This actually ocurred a month ago.

I am wondering if the events after this change your opinion at all.

First, I didn't accept the money. I thought about it (my wife wanted me to), but it just went against my grain.

Anyway, here is how the events played out:

1) It took me awhile to convice my boss (the V.P.) that I wasn't full of sh*t.. He really couldn't grasp what was going on.

2) He finally figured it out and thanked me for being honest, etc. He then told me to take my wife out to dinner, wherever we wanted and to just put it on my company Amex--we went to The Melting Pot, a favorite.

3) At the end of the month, they decided to close our office down. In my office there was me, five of my techs and my admin. (I had the $98,000.00 contract signed at this point)

4) The techs and I were "transferred" to a different company (the owners were friends). My contract went with me.

5) I don't get paid commission until the job is done.

Long story short, I got gipped the commission on the $28,000 and it doesn't look like I will be able to get the commission on the $98,000 (long story on that one)

And to make it worse, they accused me of stealing when we closed the office. Previously I was lauded as an honest and upright person, now they were calling me a thief. It turns out the admin "accidentally" had the missing equipment--no apology to me for the accusation. They went so far as to have the president of the company I was "transferred" to ask me what I did with the missing equipment. What a way to start a new position....

At the time, I felt good about what I did.

Now I look back and see how this company treated me and I wish had just taken the "finder's fee".

Does this change your opinion at all?

ha... you know, i was on my way back from the grocery (not knowing all those events had already happened), and i thought "i bet if he does the "right thing" and tells his company rather than just taking the money, he'll get screwed over by his company somehow within a month. he should just take the cash and look out for #1". i hate being right sometimes.

sorry all that happened to ya... hope you learned something from it all.

No. You acted as you did due to what your moral core told you was right. Other people's appalling behavior is in no way a reflection on the ethics of your original decision, nor is it a reason to regret it.

At the end of the day when one closes his eyes to sleep and is alone with his thoughts, it is good to have a clear conscience. This is worth more than $28,000, imo.

dirtyrascal7,

You know what I thought when I was doing it? Since it was straight profit, I tried to negotiate a split with my company. No beans on that one. Once I broached the subject with them, it became their money.

The worst part is that now my wife is harping about, "I told you to just take the money."

I know its cliche, but sometimes you just can't win for losing.


wonderwench,

I always felt like there was only one thing I could do. But there were those fleeting moments where I was spending the money in my head.

Oddly enough, if I were to go back, I would do the same thing.

Except....

I would've taken my accounts and gone independent!

And here is yet another twist that makes me want to bang my head up against the wall.

I was approached today by someone who wants me to partner up with them and open our own firm.

uuggghhh!

I'd turn the money over the rat this rat bastard out and eF the eFing eFer over like he's done to you. ;) But that's just the kind of ruthless business eFer that I am.

Hey, now. Watch whose nick you're throwing around there! :lol:

Seriously, their behavior doesn't alter what your ethics dictate. You did the right thing no matter how bad they screwed you over, and that karma will come back to you (and to them) eventually.

Well, I think you did the right thing. There are so many crooks out there, it is people like you that help balance things out.

i myself would have taken the money, quit & started looking for a new place to work. but then again... i am a bastard with no morals.

I would take the money...Like you said you brought this people in and the guy offered you personally the money. Its yours take it and put it all in a college fund for your kids(if you have any or planning on having kids)

Several years ago I was cashing my pay check (at the place I worked) and the guy accidently gave me $300 more than I was supposed to get. Once I realized it (less than a minute later), I returned and gave the $300 back. He thanked me and told me he would talk to the owner and that I would be rewarded for my honesty. Two days later I was called up into the owner's office and given...
*drum roll*
...a coupon for $3 off some food.

Sure, I was upset at the time, but I still think I made the right decision.

It doesn't help to dwell on the past. You made the right decision and should focus on your career and maybe become independant or partner up with that guy you mentioned.

Wow $3 or $300..I would take the $300. My first job over paid me by 10 hours my first pay check(morons) I didn't know how much I was supposed to be making at that time, so the pricks never got there money back;)

Consider the fact that the $300 was due to someone else's mistake and not earned. Any clerk is cashed out of his register at the end of a shift. The cashier would most likely have been fired upon the discovery of a $300 error. Would you want someone to not call such a mistake to your attention if your were the cashier?

If you fuck up its your ass on the line;)

That's one way to look at it. I would prefer to treat the cashier in the manner I would hope to be treated if I made such a mistake. The benefit of keeping the money is far outweighed by the harm it would cause to the "mistaker" - not a good thing to have on one's conscience.

You make a good point but think if any of your other work mates would do the same...My work mates are a bunch or assholes so thats why I would keep the cash but I work in a wearhouse.

Their behavior doesn't affect my obligation to myself to live according to my own ethics.

From experience I can say...take the high road. The money is not all THAT much. That is not to say that pocketing the money is not the high road. Instead what I am saying is that, deep down, you KNOW what to do. Not only are you closer to the situation than we are, but I bet there is something inside you telling you what the right thing to do is.

Do what you feel best about and then buy your self some ice cream as a treat. The Karma circle will come take care of you later personally, in business and otherwise.

Takes forever to build a good reputation, one slip and its gone.

Your reputation is at stake. You know what to do.

If anything else, your company is going to see this as a very responsible move on your part. Corporations can sometimes be seen as families, and good deeds won't go unnoticed

---just go back and read #3 above--there is your answer..

You can get a job enywhere, if your reputaion is ok...

damn right they will take the money and probably fire you down the road!

it's so easy to spot the farkers on this forum




Oh, and contribution. Turning the money in will look fucking awesome on your part, and the company will do anything for your loyalty. They will, of course, eventually catch wind of this transaction... so the question is, basically, 'double or nothing'?

Fenton-J-Cool,

Turned the money in, looked good for a few weeks, company closed, lost my commissions, etc.

Fun, eh?

Oh yeah, to your other comment. I have three homepages set on FireFox - Fark is the middle one.

I agree; reputation over money (and 28k, as I'm sure you know, isn't all that much). The company is really the one who got the client so you should talk with your superiors first. Also, I don't agree that it's "no strings attached" ... that alone sounds shady.

Good luck and please let us know what you choose to do, since some people (like me) plan to go into business and could use the info! Thanks!

The results are interspersed through the thread.

Short Story: I did the right thing, the company closed our office shortly thereafter and I lost all of my commissions.

They even tried to accuse me of stealing when a computer went missing (so much for being the honest guy, huh?). It turns out that the admin "accidentally" took it home with her. No apology from the company I was so honest with.

Needless to say, I don't have very nice things to say about them (they are still operational on the east coast).

I decided a long time ago that doing the "right" thing doesnt get you that far... I do what is right for me at the time. I dont expect anything from anyone. and id like people(other than friends and family) to not expect anything from me.