Dear Cynthetiq

[Cyborg Ninja]

Original Warning message from Cynthetiq:
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"http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?p=2361632#post2361632 Please change your sig to conform to this rule:

Originally Posted by Halx

Hello, I'd like to inform you all about an important policy change with the site. Previously, we did not allow links to external websites in your signatures unless they were unaffiliated with you and didn't ask for money. We are changing that policy slightly! Henceforth, you are allowed to post a link to your personal website, blog, gallery or whatever in your signature, under the following guidelines: 1) You must provide a link back to the TFP. 2) Your site is not an advertisement.

Thank you, Cynthetiq"
----

Maybe you didn't think about it, but it would have been much more polite to send a MESSAGE about a non-profit informative website about organ donation rather than instating a penalty for it. MUCH more polite.

[jorgelito]

What happened? I am very interested in organ donation. Where can I get info? What thread is it?

[Dtamr]

I dont really get it. You cannot advertise for a non-profit website in your signature? It makes sense but as long as nobody has a problem with it, I cant see the reason why it can't be there.

[Frosstbyte]

I am so confused by why you chose to post this to the general forums instead of PM'ing the admins, but being that you did, I have NO idea what your post is trying to say. It's not a personal attack, you haven't been banned or suspended or warned (at least not that the message shows). It's a change in policy. Links in sigs can only be to sites you own and/or operate, they cannot be advertisements and the site must link back to the TFP. What's the problem?

[Cyborg Ninja]

Perhaps you can't read my warning level. It was increased because my signature linked to a not-for-profit website on organ donation. I think this was the website, but it was erased by someone so I'm not sure: http://www.organdonor.org/

Overall this is not a big deal. But I think it would have been a much better idea to notify people through PMs, either as a mass-PM to every member or create an Announcements board and post a topic there. I was not aware of this topic, and since someone had manually edited my signature through the Control Panel, I question their reasoning in also issuing me a warning. Perhaps they consider a Warning to be "just a warning" and not a penalty, but I think it was rude to do so.

BTW, I am a strong advocate of organ donation and patient's rights, partly due to my mother's death from cirrhosis and she was never able to receive a liver transplant.

[abaya]

Originally Posted by Cyborg Ninja

rather than instating a penalty for it

What was the penalty? I'm confused... did you get an official warning (e.g. the little meter under your name) for this? Why not just send a PM to Cynthetique, instead of starting a whole thread for this??

[mixedmedia]

You have a 10% warning increase which will expire in about 3 weeks.

The forum's rules about links in your sig (before the policy change) was fully explained in the forum rules which you should have familiarized yourself with - having now been here since June. So saying you didn't know isn't exactly an excuse.

But regardless, it's a very light penalty and one hardly worth this thread.

........

After a cursory search of the forum, it doesn't appear that a thread has ever been started to discuss organ donation. Perhaps an option for you would be to start one to discuss its importance, to encourage it and then provide some places where one can sign up.

I signed up at my local DMV.

[ShaniFaye]

also.....regular members cannot see your warning level so we have no idea what it is. And yes as MM said...its clearly outlined in the board rules..also Halx started a recent thread about the rule change for siggy's

[Cyborg Ninja]

Mixedmedia, as expected, there are those who are willing to make excuses no matter what. It's funny how that thread was not made until December 9th. You're telling me this policy has been in place since June, even though both that topic creator and the person who gave me the warning say it is only recent? Did you bother to familiarize yourself first before your defensive posturing?

Moving on... I had no been on the forum for about a week or posted on it at least for perhaps longer than that. It seems I received the warning prior to the last 24 hours. And ShaniFaye, I already know that other members cannot see my warning level. I stated that in a previous post in this thread.

[amonkie]

There seems to be a little misunderstanding on some fronts. I'm going to provide some suggestions for Cyborg and others reading this thread who may have questions about TFP policy, and how to best handle these inquiries.

1. TFP staff is here to help keep this ship running smooth, and part of that means being as fair as possible to all parties. We don't have six sets of eyes apiece, but we catch what we can when we see things that have been put as a "not a good idea" in our rule structure.

2. The best way to communicate about things that involve you personally, is to contact a member of the staff you feel comfortable with via PM or through one of the IM contacts in their profile, or request a mod in #tfp. This allows 2 things to happen - It allows us to possibly provide some clarification about our actions which may not have been clear enough for you, and also this allows us the chance to hear your side of the story, if neccessary.

Like Mixedmedia said... this warning falls off after a few weeks. Our goal here is to foster intelligent discussion, and we try not to take away from that in sideline politics such as this thread.

If there are other questions about this .. please see myself or another admin.

Thanks!

[mixedmedia]

Originally Posted by Cyborg Ninja

Mixedmedia, as expected, there are those who are willing to make excuses no matter what. It's funny how that thread was not made until December 9th. You're telling me this policy has been in place since June, even though both that topic creator and the person who gave me the warning say it is only recent? Did you bother to familiarize yourself first before your defensive posturing?

Moving on... I had no been on the forum for about a week or posted on it at least for perhaps longer than that. It seems I received the warning prior to the last 24 hours. And ShaniFaye, I already know that other members cannot see my warning level. I stated that in a previous post in this thread.

Just to be clear, the thread was modified on Dec. 9th to reflect the new policy. Before that it read that NO links in signatures were permitted. If you had familiarized yourself with the policies when you came here you would not have put a link in your sig whether or not you were familiar with the change.

But thanks for the advice.

[The_Jazz]

Cyborg Ninja, you've misread what's been said. The old rule wasn't in place since June - it was in place since before I became a member. You somehow fell through the cracks and we missed enforcing it. I recently cleared my sent PM box of about 50 notices to people who's signatures I either requested to be changed or notice that I changed it myself (for new people). The old rule did not allow links to outside sites to be in signatures without prior approval - I can think of 4 or 5 instances of that approval off the top of my head. Sorry that we didn't enforce the rule 100% consistently before, but we are now as of December 9th. Your signature wasn't in compliance before the rule change and it wasn't before Cynthetiq PM'd you.

In other words, you were in the wrong before the rule change and after the rule change. Cynthetiq was absolutely right to send that PM, and he just beat me to it. Amonkie and MixedMedia are being nice, but I'll be the blunt/bad guy and tell you that you only had your signature as it was because no one noticed it.

[analog]

Monkie, I love that blue-green text!

Also, to OP (and anyone else): This is a good example of the worst possible way to handle a personal (or board) issue with a member of staff. If you think it's rude for getting a teeny tiny warning, sent privately, for something you shouldn't have done, I can't imagine how you thought this wouldn't be rude.

[ratbastid]

Seriously, dude.

If a PM, editing your sig, and an invisible 10% warn that will die off in a couple weeks is "rude", then posting this thread in General is like "nuclear rude". Plus, the rules are clear and you were in the wrong, no matter how worthy a cause the link in your sig was.

My advice is: deal.

EDIT: Or don't! I can't tell you how many six-monthers I've seen get pissed off about rules and their enforcement and go screaming out of TFP in a blaze of righteous fury. Feel free to do that, if that's what you're going to do. But be clear it's YOU doing that.

[tecoyah]

I for one....want another warning issued to Cyborg for general stupidity....lets see if he can get to 50% by Xmas.

[Hain]

Where is the TFP forum rules located? Terms of service? Something?

Originally Posted by http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?t=45061

# SIGNATURES
1. No site plugs are allowed in signatures unless you have PAID for them.
2. Maximum signature length should be 5 or 6 lines. You will be asked to edit if a lengthy signature frequently eclipses the length of your posts.

What is a site plug? I am just going to point out the obvious; look at my sig!

Coming back from the sig:
"Previously, we did not allow links to external websites in your signatures unless they were unaffiliated with you and didn't ask for money."
"... we did not allow links ... unless they were unaffiliated with you..." I'm leaving mine until I get one, as I am not affiliated with BOINC-just recommend people to participate.

@ Cyborg Ninja:
The site was not literally asking people to donate their organs right away, was it???

[Halx]

Please keep this in private messages. This is a matter concerning a rule that is as old as dirt.

[Ustwo]

Only sissies have less than a 50% warning, you go girl!

[abaya]

Originally Posted by tecoyah

lets see if he can get to 50% by Xmas.

Not that this matters, but Cyborg is a she.

Ustwo...

[DaveOrion]

Oh the drama......like sands through the hourglass, so are the days of our lives.......

BTW, do all warnings expire??? Not that I really care, just all I could think of to add...........and only trolls have over 50% warn....

[telekinetic]

Aww, I had consoled myself with the thought that since there were only 5 blocks, maybe EVERYONE got warnings in chunks of 20% :-/

I wish the forum I moderate on let me give out arbitrary warn percentages!

"Warning level increased 93.5% for trying to gain entry to a BYOB party with a sixer of Beast"

"Warning level increased 1% for reminding me that I need to rotate my tires"



PS: Monkie (heh), good job on the bluegreen text. It is marginally more legible than the usual yellow on the white background my skin of choice provides. However, due to the default being the darker background, I have resigned myself to having all moderator/admin text be "spoilers"

[Ustwo]

Originally Posted by DaveMatrix

Oh the drama......like sands through the hourglass, so are the days of our lives.......

BTW, do all warnings expire??? Not that I really care, just all I could think of to add...........and only trolls have over 50% warn....

So when did you get over 50%?

[mixedmedia]

Originally Posted by Ustwo

So when did you get over 50%?

[DaveOrion]

Originally Posted by Ustwo

So when did you get over 50%?

I hit 10%, when you were at 80%......still doing public service to get that reduced???

[jorgelito]

Thanks for the link Cyber, I am looking into it.

Since when do warnings fall off after a few weeks?

Originally Posted by tecoyah

I for one....want another warning issued to Cyborg for general stupidity....lets see if he can get to 50% by Xmas.

This is completely unnecessary and a personal attack.

[Shauk]

Originally Posted by jorgelito

This is completely unnecessary and a personal attack.

yeah I kinda got that vibe too.


as far as the links in signatures. I don't get what the fuss it about. Is there a good REASON for this? I mean as long as it isn't just a stupid pyramid scheme or something I don't see what the cause for concern over that little tiny space of personal identifiable expression pointing to your own personal larger space of personal identifiable expression and/or a space that isn't personal, but means a lot to you and you'd like to let people know you're aligned with that cause.

I r confused.

[telekinetic]

Originally Posted by jorgelito

This is completely unnecessary and a personal attack.

I'm sure he didn't mean in general, he meant due to the creation of this thread. And I tend to agree. This is holding a press conference demanding police reform, all because a cop had the nerve to pull you over when you were doing 70 in a 55, and let you off with a warning.

[blahblah454]

I fail to see what the cry-baby fest is for.

Grow a pair and suck it up (yes I know you are a female)

[World's King]

Are you serious?


You thought this 'problem' warranted a thread? A thread for you to bitch?



As my other Mods have said... This was a private matter that should have stayed private. You understand the rules now. Or at least I hope you do. So please get past this.

I know I come off as an asshole. I always have. But trust me. I mean well.

[Infinite_Loser]

*Posts in order to see his warning level*

[analog]

Originally Posted by Infinite_Loser

*Posts in order to see his warning level*

You can also see your own warning level by going to your profile.

[Cyborg Ninja]

I have been busy, and have since received a couple, um, self-contradictory PMs since then. This issue is still in need of being cleared up. I'm surprised that so many did not understand the original rules on signatures compared to the relatively-recent change. I'm mostly amazed by some of the moderators here... Anyway...

In the first post in this topic, there is a link to a topic that states the new signature rules. Here is the content of that post:

Hello, I'd like to inform you all about an important policy change with the site. Previously, we did not allow links to external websites in your signatures unless they were unaffiliated with you and didn't ask for money. We are changing that policy slightly!

Henceforth, you are allowed to post a link to your personal website, blog, gallery or whatever in your signature, under the following guidelines:

1) You must provide a link back to the TFP.
2) Your site is not an advertisement.

The date? December 9th, 2007. I only posted once before I got a Warning from Cynthetiq, and this was some days, I think it was two days, after that topic was made. Cynthetiq seems to believe that this topic was viewed by all and common knowledge. Absurd. It would have been much brighter to have created that topic or copy it to an Announcements board. The topic was also not stickied when I visited, if ever. I couldn't have summed it up better than the above post. A "super moderator" here claims that signatures containing links required approval prior to being used. Considering no one prior had raised concern, I have no reason to believe it wasn't approved. And frankly, I have a feeling this approval process was not correctly stated by this person. If you just think of the number of links in signatures prior and the recent acceptance of links to personal sites, it just doesn't stand to reason.

It also seems that some, including Cynthetiq, originally (and possibly still do) believe the site I linked to was commercial and affiliated with me. That is not true. And honestly, it's pretty ridiculous that anyone would jump to that conclusion. Maybe if the site said "Donate your organs... TO ME!" then maybe you'd have something there... but nope. It is a not-for-profit site that gives information about organ donation in the US. My mother died from cirrhosis, so it is also a personal issue to me.

I did receive two PMs from Cynthetiq, and I'm afraid I have to keep them private, which is a shame because they seem so faulty to me and I brought up some great rebuttals. But an important thing to point out here is that this topic isn't about one moderator or whatever. It's about an overall policy that doesn't even seem to be fully understood by some moderators here. So I have some recommendations.

1. Create an Announcements board or use the "Get Tilted" board more often (the stickied policy threads do not appear to have been updated for the relatively recent policy change)
2. Make sure policy changes are posted on the Announcements board
3. Do not give Warnings in advance because you think PMs are generally ignored

Those are just a few. The others are on a more personal level dealing Cynthetiq's judgement on the signature and Warning issues. I'm sure some people here think it's all a bunch of wasted breath over nothing, and I suppose it is, but I can't help but feel the need to correct the issue. Somebody has to. Maybe I'll add to this later. Anyway, I hope this post will brighten a few minds and inspire ideas to make this forum a better place.

[telekinetic]

Seriously...why are you getting so bent out of shape over a warning? Warnings are just fancy official PM's anyways, it's not as if they dock your pay or don't allow you to post as much or anything.

I usually don't respond to people in a personal antagonistic manner (not since I got a 20% warning for doing so ) but this whole thread seems to be about you not liking how you were treated by board staff, so what else is there to discuss?

You're lucky you're not on one of the boards I moderate, or I'd warn you again for making a topic about how bad the staff was. All of my warnings are accompanied by multi-day suspensions...I was pleasantly surprised that this board does not do the same.

It sounds like the staff is responding appropriately to you being a squeaky wheel, and trying to resolve your question and complaint, why do you feel the need to pander for sympathy for the 'abuse' you've suffered?

[Cynthetiq]

You seem to forget that the date Dec 9, 2007 only reflects that there is a CHANGE in policy. Prior policy was that there are NO URLS allowed in signatures.

You seemed to forget that at all points on this discussion.

I don't care what your personal agenda is with your signature. That's not for me to discern nor care about. I don't care if you run the site, or don't run the site, the rules were laid out and clarified. I made the request to you, you took umbrage to it.

Stickys and announcements get their place. Even still, that doesn't mean you would have or any community member reads them. Many times the staff does exactly the same thing, sends a message or warning to the individual and points them to the appropriate thread.

You also seemed to forget that any further discussion of this would require you to discuss this with Halx directly. It was the final point of my PM.

Instead, you'd like to continue these "suggestions" and "discussion" outside of discussion directly with the staff.