Depressed man hangs himself live in webcam chat room...
 

Sad dad hangs himself on web

One thing that really stuck out for me was the fact that the article seems to blame the asshats in the chat room. This is not to say they weren't goading him on, but her was in an "insult chatroom". Second, who would even believe something like that was ACTUALLY happening in front of them (especially since you couldn't see his feet) until you're presented with actual evidence (like his face turning blue)?

Do you really think that any blame could be placed on the people in the chat room, or do you think it was simply the wrong room for him to be in? I mean, he's an alcoholic and suffering from depression, and he went into a chatroom specifically for insulting people. He can't have expected sympathy, especially not on the internet in a random chat room.

Also, what do you think about the spectacle itself, a man who's so far gone that he wishes to kill himself in front of people who are impotent to do anything about it. Is it his last "fuck you" to the world, making 50 people watch him take his life?

I think he was in the wrong place for his state of mind, like going to a bar when you need to sober up. The people are asshats anyway, but really who is going to expect a person in everyday life to just go ahead and off themselves right there in front of you?

I'd like the people who egged him on should be charged with involuntary manslaughter. having lost a friend to suicide, i know that all threats should be taken seriously. if we'd all take a second to hug a stranger, i swear we'd see a drastic drop in suicides.

if anyone needs a hug in California, give me a buzz.

:sad:

This is one of the most disturbing stories I've heard lately. This guy wanting to share his suicide with a bunch of strangers strikes me as most pitiable, and probably even stranger than their watching it, given what passes for entertainment these days... I hope his kids never see it.

I probably would have egged him on as well, That's just how these things work when you run in those types of chats.

It's hardly the viewers fault for this, how are they to know he was serious? There's so much shit goin on here in the big WWW that its pretty safe to say, it ain't true unless you can prove it.

I'm sorry for your loss, but this is a gross oversimplification of a complex issue. The man was an alcoholic and severely depressed- at least partly so because of the car accident back in July '06 from which he still has not yet fully recovered- he didn't need a hug, he needed a strong support base, therapy, and detox.

It's nice to want to change the world, and it's nice to extend pleasantries to strangers, but there are many cases where a kind word is far from sufficient to bring a person back from the edge like this... and trying to put the blame on anyone other than the person who took their own life won't bring them back, nor will it circumvent the one truth in all suicides: they are a personal choice.

i understand my comment was an over simplification, however, if this guy felt more love over the years, maybe he would not have gotten to the edge in the first place.

I think, in much the same way that the majority of people who contemplate suicide usually are under the influence of alcohol when they do it, you know, to like get a little extra something to help go the final 10 and all (sorry it sounds so unsympathetic, I don't quite know how else to put it...), that he most likely went to the insult chat room for the sole reason that these people WOULD egg him on, allowing him to feel that much more miserable and kinda give him that final push. Its what I'd do.

(you know, if I were terribly depressed and seriously desired to end all this... which I'm not by the way. Just thought I should clear that up, because it sounded rather emo towards the end there.)

From what I can infer from the story, did this perchance happen in the U.K. (the actual location of the suicide, not the entire online debacle, where it was "present").

This really strikes a nerve with me that perhaps The Digital Age is a revert in terms of societal welfare.
I mean, I doubt most of us take the time to assess what happens beyond our residence, work, school, let alone outside our countries to realize that our world is a bitter and cold reality filled with unseen tragedies and unheard cries of anguish.

I for one, hate living in such a harsh and cruel associational society where the only place one can feel secure to speak up is on a faceless buzzing marvel of technology.

I would advocate going out and relating yourself to any and all those around you, but that would be hoping for something that is far and away a possibility.

Just take away from such a travesty of a story that we need to remember that we are not alone in this world, and that there are actual human beings that live among us with real emotions that can sometimes falter if not appreciated.

I just remembered what I forgot to post:
There is a song by OutKast from their album Aquemini that perfectly conveys the above-mentioned notions of how our society can morph into something so grotesque. Anyway, it's called Synthesizer and can really put some perspective on one's life!

It's a very sad story indeed. I wonder what would have happened if even one person had tried to talk him out of it. It is also sad that people have become so skeptical and jaded that they didn't want to believe him until his face went blue. It was almost as if they feared being "punked" by someone more than they feared that another person would kill themselves in front of them. Of all the people i would prefer not to see alive, a depressed divorcee with a family and a job who drinks Boddingtons each evening isn't one of them.

I agree with this, the people egging him on should be charged with Britain's version of involuntary manslaughter maybe just manslaughter period.

This person obviously had issues and needed someone. Perhaps this person just wanted someone to talk to and felt he had friends he could trust in the chatroom. Perhaps, he started talking to someone whom he considered "a friend" and the friend went about "insulting" him, thus pushing him over the edge. Perhaps, he started getting more depressed as the taunting continued and he started talking about how the world would be better off without him, people started goading him and teasing him worse and the scenario just continued until the man was dead.

One issue I have is the Moderator could have and should have "cut the feed" as soon as he showed a rope. The Moderator should have also called the police or someone nearby immediately and hoped to save a man.

Most people talk and attempt suicide for attention, BUT need to be listened to, not harassed and made to feel worse, because scenarios like this can and will play themselves out. The person seeks attention, people goad and dare the person to do it, and the person does to save face.

We have no idea what truly happened or what was said to push the man that far, but I feel sorry for his kids and ashamed people actually goaded him that far.

I was 12 years old had just had a date where we went and saw "Poltergeist". The girl and I made out (kissed a few times and held hands.... back then for a 12 year old that was big)... she said we were a couple. I get home ride over to a friend's house and he starts razzing me, saying she never said that and blah blah blah..... so we call her and of course she is telling him she never said that. I'm 12, I was hurt and so I pulled a knife out of the kitchen and thought I'd slit my wrist (I'd show them!).

But I didn't want to, I was just hurt and didn't know what to do. I felt betrayed. I ran out of the house and was just going to go home and return the knife later. Instead my friend followed me and when he caught up to me, he thought I was joking about slicing my wrist, so he started laughing and telling me to do it.

As I started, he lunged to grab the knife and I ended up slicing his hand, I saw blood and ran home.

I told my dad what happened, and he first calmed me down by saying my "friend" and "girlfriend" were probably teasing me and it went too far. Then my dad called over and my "friend" denied my slicing him. Turned out he wasn't supposed to have anyone over and so he was more scared to say anything than I had been.

The cut wasn't much at all, and he was just going to "kick my ass at school" when he saw me.

Needless to say we both got into serious trouble.

How my experience relates to this story is simple..... I can see how someone who is just hurt and looking for someone to talk to, and instead gets insulted by the friends he trusts can end up in the heat of the moment not thinking straight do something very stupid.

I just think in a scenario like that the chatters should have just either ignored him and allowed the moderator to try to talk to him or backed down and tried to rationalize with him while someone called for help.

I'd also hate to be 1 of those 50 that saw it happen...... their lives will forever be changed and some of them will feel massive guilt and depression themselves.

As I mentioned earlier, the man did not need "someone". He needed real, professional help. A kind word or shoulder to cry on will only take you so far when you're talking about a chronically depressed alcoholic who's still got physical deficits resulting from a bad car crash 8 months before.

Also: while the goading him on was terrible, the idea that it could be considered manslaughter is sheer lunacy.

Also as was mentioned by someone else before, people who are suicidal often put themselves in situations where someone else can help them do it, by either pushing them over the edge or not paying attention to them. It's well documented with "jumpers" that they will pace back and forth, looking for someone to pay attention to them, to notice they're sad. When no one gives them attention, it gives them that extra "no one gives a shit" boost that they needed to actually make it happen.

A man who is depressed and actually looking to kill himself would absolutely go into an "insult" chat room. Where better to get worked up into a "yeah, i'm gonna DO this!" frenzy? And how is anyone in that chat room supposed to know he's serious? This is the internet- nothing is real until it's REAL.

Once again, that doesn't mean those people aren't assholes for egging him on, but it's ridiculous to suggest they're culpable.

He wanted to die, and used the people in that room to get his nerve up so he could do it. It's the perfect example of the selfishness of suicide... 50 people are now potentially riddled with guilt because he used them to work up his nerve to go through with it.

1. He didn't reach out to someone "professional" he reached out to people for whatever reason, I assume he believed to be friends. As I stated, the moderator especially had a duty to put some form of an end to it, and again especially when the rope came out.

2. NO ONE wants to die. If you choose to believe he wanted to that's up to you and your opinion. Just as I choose to hold the opinion I do.

3. Yes, these people should be held accountable for their actions. There is a huge difference between the "jumpers" you want to use as an example and this man. Most jumpers don't carry on conversations with people watching them from below. This guy did, these people egged him on, thus they have blood on their hands.

We don't know all the facts, what led up to this, what was said, what kind of person he was in the room...... I am sure all those are factors to consider also.

really the guy did not "obviously" need some help. We don't even know the guy.

This kind of shit happens on emo faggot myspace accounts every single day, you gonna call the police coz those retards are constantly talking about suicide?

Nah this shit happens every day on this here thing we call the net. Too bad for his kids he was the one in a million who actually meant what he said.


The "Cry Wolf" scenario doesn't just apply to a single person, if collectively people "Cry Wolf" too many times, nobody will believe anybody.

I don't think that the people in the chat room are criminally liable for this one individual's actions given the tenor of that chat room. Perhaps the moderator is, if he was closely following the proceedings, but the individuals screaming encouragement were just playing along with what they thought was a game. The closest analogy I can come up with is a boxing match that results in the death of one of the boxers (the other one is superfluous in my arguement) - the referee might be liable for not stopping the fight soon enough but the audience, who was screaming for blood, isn't culpable.

Is it horrible? Yes. Is it a tragedy? Yes. Is it a crime? No, I don't think so.

No way. That would be a complete misuse of the law. Now first off I'm sorry for your loss. I've had a friend kill himself also. However, I can tell you that if I was in the room at the time, I would tell him to fucking do it or shutup. I can't stand people who whine all the time and talk about how they are going to kill themselves and end their pain. Do it already. I don't have time for your bitching. If they want to be that selfish then I really don't have a use for them.

I can tell you that if a stranger took a second to hug me, I'd take a second to punch him in the face. I don't think that people being nicer would show a drastic drop in suicides. I think parents should spend more time with their kids so the kids can have a better foundation for life. Now don't go blasting me telling me that parent's can't always be around. I know that. I'm a parent. What I'm saying is that I'm sick of seeing all these emo-whoring kids (now I sound old) bitching about daddy doesn't love me or mommy told me no or my hair isn't as cool as Timmy's! Then they put on a Dashboard cd and fucking slit their wrists. bah

Or how about the people who breakup with a wife or girlfriend or bf/husband and kill themselves? Why?? The problem here is that were already some underlying issues that came to a head when a major dramatic event took place. Perhaps instead of hugging more people, people should be educated better so they can see the warning signs and get people the help they need.

That being said, I find a strange beauty in suicide.. sort of like power of your own destiny. :shrug:

oh yeah.. I want to see this video.

I happen to agree with you gucci, but I think the "whining" and self-obsessed overtures we hear from people so much today (esp. on the internet) as well as the type of collapsed character that we might see inhabiting an "insult" chatroom are indicative of the same thing - a shallow, self-obsessed, spoiled culture that is losing, and in many cases, has completely lost touch with the virtues of character, humility and the moral fiber that comes from living a life outside of the cocoon of your own irreality. I think it's all pretty pathetic and disgusting.

really? no free hugs for you? Sometimes my day is just washed away by a hug from my wife when I get home, a vast difference from when I lived alone and just wait for it to dissapate on it's own.



http://freehugscampaign.org/

Yes but by that argument the girlfriend who breaks up with the suicidal boyfriend risks getting charged with murder. Sorry, but people have to take responsibility for their own actions at some point. Yes joking about suicide is an asshole thing to do, and I think the people in the chatroom who were joking about it are assholes (And I do think they were joking - I don't think anyone seriously believed he was going to do it). However, being an asshole does not automatically make you guilty of a crime. This guy made the decision to hang himself. The responsibility for that rests squarely on his shoulders.

And, yes, we have also lost touch with the importance of kindness and the impact it can have on the world as a whole...as is evidenced in cynthetiq's post.

There's a difference between getting a hug from my wife when I get home and a random stranger hugging me. So no I won't take any free hugs. If a person needs a hug from a stranger to get through the day, then perhaps it's time for that person to really evaluate their life.

I agree completely with shakran, people have to take responsibility for their actions. You committ suicide..then tough. It's not like you can take it back. When my friend decided to let me and a few others walk in on his blown to bits head.. I was pissed at his stupidity. I felt no sense of sorrow for him. I was sorry for his family.

Yes, it was the guy's responsibility for taking his own life. I don't think the assholes in the chatroom should take on any liablility for what happened other than their own guilt for egging on a guy who hung himself in front of them. That is, if they are familiar with the concept of guilt.

The downside, in my opinion though, is that this guy is dead and the assholes who egged him on and those like them are still here to improve the quality of my life with their assholeness. :p

I agree.

After spending a large portion of my childhood with a family member who constantly threatened suicide, yes, you do grow numb and even impatient with them. After years of threats, it does boil down to either do it or shut UP!

Re: the hugs from strangers bit, I understand and appreciate the motivation behind the thought, but first and foremost people need to provide their own validation. It is not my responsibility to emotionally bolster people who refuse to take care of themselves. If it was, I'd never get anything else done, and I'd likely get sucked into a black hole of emotional need without accomplishing anything.

not quite. if the girl friend takes a broken man and taunts him, and tells him to kill him self, and he does, she should be charged with involuntary manslaughter.

i say Charged with, not found guilty of, the jury will decide if and who was responsible. i doubt the girl friend would be found guilty unless she really tried to have him kill himself. further i doubt more then just a few in the chat room would be charged, and only the worst of them found guilty if anyone. having not been there i don't know the circumstances.

Well, I think there is a difference between growing weary of a familiar person's overtures about suicide over years and egging on a stranger in a chatroom who is threatening it. I had an aunt who threatened suicide for thirty years, made several half-hearted attempts at it (meaning she did it within situations that it was probable she would be caught and stopped before it was too late, which did turn out to be the case). And believe me, there was no shortage of eye-rolling and head-shaking among the members of my family when the conversation turned to her. Her life was also plagued by drugs, alcoholism and abusive relationships with men. She finally did it successfully a little over two years ago.

So again, I'll say that I don't believe that these folks in the chatroom should be held legally culpable for what happened, but I am under the opinion that someone ought to dropkick their asses 'til next Tuesday for being total fucking asshats. Metaphorically speaking, of course.

So basically, if I tell you to jump off the bridge tonight and you do it, I'm responsible?? NO. I didn't push you off the bridge. You acted that on your own accord. A person is the final judge and bearer of their own actions. You can tell me how to run my business, but in the end it's my decision on how to run it.

Actually, if you remember the rape case that The Accused starring Jodie Foster was based on, people were arrested and convicted for egging on the rapists. And being that suicide is, I believe, legally a crime (at least here in the US) that such an idea as holding people responsible for egging on a suicide might not be totally without precedent. I dunno.

There is a difference between witnessing an event and urging to continue and watching an event with no capability to stop it and egging it on. The rape case was basically that there were people present who could have stopped the occurance but didnt. They indulged in it.

This case, (which really isn't a case IMO) is just some dumb fuck who was probably drunk and wanted to try and be a badass. The people who egged him on are not at fault as there was no physical way to prevent the event. When someone is going to kill themselves, no amount of "don't do it" will really matter.

So if the event going on was a rape instead of a suicide, you don't suppose the people watching and egging it on would shoulder any culpability?

Given that no one was physically present, I doubt that anyone could have physically stopped him, which is obviously what needed to happen. Let's also remember the venue of this chat room - "insults". One does not go there expecting polite and caring conversation regardless of mental states. This is as much a tragedy as anything else, but there's no need to expand on it by jailing or attempting to jail those who witnessed it. If this had happened in the US, any DA that attempted to file charges against the witnesses/chatters would be laughed out of court.

That depends on if people knew it was a real rape or not. If they are witnessing something that they know or think is a real rape, yes they are culpable. The difference in this case is that no one knew it was a real suicide until it was too late.

I don't see how they really could as there was no way to stop the event from occuring.

The only way it would be criminal would be if the event were advertised and the viewers had a premeditation to watch the crime. With suicide, you can't tell when people are joking or not, so what are you supposed to do? Call the cops every time some emo kid cries wolf?

Okay then, what if the rape victim were a child, and I don't bring that up for the emotional impact, but as an example of a situation in which there would be little doubt of its reality and legality.

Involuntary manslaughter means YOU killed the guy. That would be a bullshit charge.


so you're advocating false and malicious prosecution? That's a really good way to get the state sued.

And yet you glibly advocate that we charge them with a felony and prosecute them? That's irresponsible at best. You're acting as though everyone automatically does anything they're told to do. If I tell you to kill yourself, then hey, you don't actually have to kill yourself. If you do, that's your decision.

Your argument would set a very, VERY bad precedent. Basically we're now making it a crime to give bad advice. So, for instance, if I thought a certain stock was a good idea and you took my advice, and then the stock crashed, I could be held responsible. If I tell you to buy a Yugo, you could prosecute me for giving you bad advice.

America has already gone far enough into the realm of no personal responsibility. Why should we now want to shed ALL shreds of responsibility?

Well see that brings in a totally different realm of legal issues. Just viewing kiddie porn is a criminal act. So even if it were a pre-recorded deal, then obviously that would pose criminal charges if there were people egging it on.

I feel as though this is getting too stretched out. The point here is that a man killed himself and that's it.

I say big fucking deal it's his life.. and his stupidity.

If I witness a man getting shot in the street.. am I responsible or guilty of some crime?? No.. unless I don't cooperate with the ensuing investigation. I didn't shoot the man or cause that event to unfold.. just as the people watching this dumbass didn't cause him to put the rope around his neck. He did it himself.

Well, I agree I am stretching it out, but that is the reality of the law and how determinations and conclusions are often drawn.

The most basic facts are, if this occurred in America, then there would have been individuals watching a live feed of a crime occurring and egging it on. That's the most basic fact. And I don't think stretching it out to accommodate shifting attitudes about different crimes is necessarily a bad thing. It makes you think.

You assume that he regarded 50 strangers in an insult chat room... to be friends?

I disagree, and I wonder why you'd think this could possibly apply universally.

Not to belabor the point, but many do. There's a whole documentary on the "jumpers" of the golden gate bridge, and in the footage are many examples of people chatting up passersby. When interviewed after the fact, the motivation of some of them was to talk to someone and see if they cared. Some said, flat-out, that if the person they talked to was nice to them, they would feel better and go home; most all of them, however, stated that if they were ignored or dismissed, that was it. It's a good documentary- very thorough.

My wish is not to debate your opinion- my point is that you assert your opinion as fact, and I am debating that assertion of fact. And yes- when you want to jail people over your opinion, you are asserting it as fact.

Bingo!

MM - there was no crime until he did it. Yes, people "egged" him on, but did they do so with malace? I would expect in an evironment as what I imagine this chat room would be like that the use of props and other site "gags" (for lack of a better term) would be, if not commonplace, not be atypical.

This guy went looking for an audience that would egg him on. Blaming that audience for existing and holding them criminally liable serves no purpose. As has already been said better than I'm capable of, you can't prosecute someone for being an asshole.

no it doesn't
it fits perfectly

not at all, there is suspicion that they did something wrong, if the DA feels there is enough suspicion, it will go to trial, and if the jury agrees there was a crime committed, they will be found guilty, thats how the legal system works.

I'm for personal responsibility, both the responsibility of the person who committed suicide, and for the people who built him up to it.

I'm not saying they are guilty, I'm saying an investigation should look into whether or not they are responsible.

Did they do so with malice? Neither of us know. But I can say that I've heard stories of people doing the same thing in person, in the case of people who are threatening to jump off of buildings, for example - that there will be people on the street telling them to jump. I think it perfectly reasonable that there were people watching who were egging him on maliciously. And frankly, I can't fathom how you would egg someone on to suicide without malice. It's malicious whether you think the person in question is serious or not.

And again, I want to state that I'm not calling for the arrest of these people - just trying to stretch the ropes a bit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Involuntary_manslaughter

I don't see how it would fit at all personally.

Umm perhaps you should bone up on your legal system. Suspicion doesn't lead to a trial. It leads to an investigation. Only when there is sufficient evidence that a crime was committed will it be passed to a grand jury for indictment and then possibly move to a jury trial.



See here is why there will never be any charges filed. No one knows what state of mind the man was in prior to his stupid act. He could have been planning to hang himself anyway. There's no way to tell, because the key witness is dead. Good riddance.

Who cares if they did it with malice? I sure don't. They didn't put the rope in the guys hands or place the circumstances that lead to the event. Should I be charged with manslaughter because I don't care that he did it? Is that malice to the criminal degree? Of course it isn't. The laws are quite clear on manslaughter charges and none of these egging on statements propose that kind of criminal comtempt especially in the virtual world.

Dilbert1234567:

You are incorrect, and you are drastically stretching the written word of the article you posted to make it fit your point.

Manslaughter DOES mean YOU killed the person, through negligent action or inaction. Manslaughter is doing or not doing something that results in the death of another human being. You cannot MAKE a person kill themselves. You also cannot be negligent for lack of psychological support.

Suicide, by definition, is a person killing themselves. There can be no negligence by another person in suicide, because it involves no other people. Even if a crowd is watching on the internet. There is no such thing as a layperson failing to give psychological counseling.

At best, there are some places that have "samaritan" laws that make it punishable to witness a crime and not report it. However, this would only apply after it was discovered he was definitely killing himself, and someone was already saying to call the police by that time. These are normally a fine or very low "maximum" jail time.

The bottom line is, it is their choice, and no one else's.

I'm sure that it was unintended, but I laughed at the pun at the end anyway. This guy stretched a rope all on his own...

Is it criminally malicious if you watch someone commit suicide on tape?
Is it criminally malicious if you watch someone commit suicide online?
Is it criminally malicious if you watch someone commit suicide in the same roome?
Is it criminally malicious if you yell "jump"?
Is it criminally malicious if you hand him the rope?
Is it criminally malicious if you kick the chair out from under him?
Is it criminally malicious if you tie the rope around his neck, lift him bodily and throw him out a window?

I chose examples that are a mix of "yes" and "no's" in my mind.

"Negligence consists of conduct by an individual which is not reasonable"

do you find it reasonable to tell an emotional fragile person to kill them self?


I'm not saying they are guilty, i am saying there should be an investigation, i don't have all the facts, in all likelihood he would have killed himself anyways. i find it morally appalling that people would egg someone on to kill them self, if a criminal act took place, it should be prosecuted.

In a similar vein, if I told you to go fuck yourself...would that be rape?

Morally appalling...yes, I agree. But, I don't buy into legislating morality. So, being an asswipe is not, in and amoungst itself, a criminal act. There's nothing to prosecute.

i don't believe in legislating morality either. I'm a big fan of freedom of speech, there are limits though, you can't yell 'FIRE' in a crowded area unless there really is a fire. you can't yell 'I've got a bomb' on a plane.

if someone yells 'fire' in a crowded theater and people die because of a panic, i think that person is responsible.

The negligence in this law pertains to the fact that your negligence caused the death. You can't twist this into a suicide case because there is no mens rea because it's not a homicide. End of fact/story.

There is no criminal act that took place other than the suicide and that cannot be punished criminally because the man is both victim and criminal.

I find it morally appalling that people would try to pass the responsibility off to others in a case as this.

They are a mix of yes's and no's in my mind, too, and again, I am not making a case for manslaughter or criminal negligence here.

I didn't intend to the word "malice" to be used in a "criminal" sense. Only that, I don't see how someone could be encourage someone to kill themselves without malice.

But my point is, that I don't think anyone here can draw a definite line on the culpability of people egging on the commission of a crime just because they are not in a position to physically prevent it. In this case we are talking about the crime of a person killing hisself. I think opinion on this issue would sway a lot more if the crime were of a nature that is not self-induced. And that is as it probably should be, or at least, as it should be expected. I just don't think that you can lay down any hard and fast culpability mandates because the people watching and encouraging couldn't have physically stopped it therefore they are free to behave unreasonably. I'm not willing to make that kind of blanket reprieve at this juncture. I mean, personal responsibility, right? It doesn't necessarily end because your "person" has been absorbed into the anonymity of the internet. Legally, perhaps it will remain that way, I fully comprehend the danger of toying with it. But, PERSONALLY, I do not absolve these people of responisbility for what happened. Hopefully some of that makes sense.

I've run out of time for writing. doh! gotta go...

MM - just to drive you insane, go back and change "criminally" to "morally" and tell me if your mixes of "yes's" and "no's" changes. Interestingly (or not), mine doesn't.

Um, well. I might not find them all to be morally malicious. But I would certainly find them all morally reprehensible. But you are speaking to a person that predicted these sorts of questions, much to my dismay, would one day become questions way back on the release of the first Faces of Death film. Remember those? It disgusted me then and it disgusts me now.

fixed spelling of nuisance
 

I'm not trying to pass all the blame off on to the viewers, he had a mind to kill him self, and most likely would have, however, some of the viewers are partly to blame for him committing suicide at that point in time. and its up to the law to decide if they should be punished, it is my view that the law does extend into this area. however knowing that the legal system in this country sucks and is bogged down with nuisance lawsuits and the like, this will never make it near a trial.

btw, how the hell do you spell 'new-sents' lawsuits I've racked my brain and i can't get it...

anyways, can we all agree that its a sad event?

I love Faces of Death.

nuisance

*hug*

Although I can see the voyeuristic appeal...I was just never able to distance myself far enough away from it. I found it very tasteless and extremely low class. It's another one of those areas that everyone has to decide for him/hersef where to draw the line.

I draw the line at watching the suffering, mutilation and death of humans and other animals for entertainment. I will never understand why people find that fun or interesting -furthermore I don't even think it's in my capacity to understand.

Gucci, I'll just pretend I didn't see you say that. ;)

For me, it's just a fact of life. I do not shy from death or find it scary. I like to watch and wonder what people would go through before something happened or what the onlookers were thinking. :shrug:

/end threadjack

I would think that if the viewers were going to be charged with anything, it would follow more along the lines of legislation that would govern supporting "snuff films" rather than the involuntary manslaughter that some have presented.

The popularity of searches for Saddam Hussein's hanging video as well as the Daniel Pearl video certainly demonstrates a popularity in morbid content, however there seems to be a significant difference between the "Faces of Death" type of video and the actual participatory nature of this event.

While I generally do not support legislating morality, and can certainly understand some people's frustration with a depressed/suicidal person's constant threats of suicide, I find the callousness that some people have demonstrated in this thread disturbing.

No it doesn't. Me telling you to kill yourself does not cause you to kill yourself. YOU cause you to kill yourself. You make the call. That's vastly different from real involuntary manslaughter, which involves cases such as me selling you drugs (i.e. knowingly giving you the actual tools to kill yourself with) and you overdosing on them, or me running you over with a car because I was rooting around in the back seat for a CD.

So...part of the people care about others and part of them don't.
What a surprize.
I can only think of one public hanging I'd like to see...

The usernames list of the suicide picture included aMasteratwork... That's his 2nd viewing of a suicide on cam in what? 3 years?

I feel really bad for the whole situation is just really sad. Whoa, that was an unintentional rhyme, sweet! Anyways, I don't believe the people in the chatroom are in anyway liable in the eyes of the law. On the other hand, I think it takes a sick kind of person to sit there in a chatroom and think it's fun to egg someone on to kill themselves. I hope that whomever was goading him feels the guilt of doing so for a long time and that should be punishment enough. It was his choice, he followed through and the consequences were deadly. I had some personal experiences with feeling suicidal a long time ago but never vocalized it to anyone. It's a pretty awful place to be. I can't imagine thinking it would be funny to go along with something like that, even if you outright knew it was a joke. I had done some pretty self destructive things to myself during that time, but I realize it's not up to me to decide when I die. I think this is just another illustration of what a bunch of dumb fucks this world is inhabited with and how meaningless their lives must be to find shit like that entertainment.

Okay, what is an "insult" chat room, and what is the benefit of being in one? People just talking shit to each other non-stop, to see how witty or smart-ass they can be? Some kind of junior high locker room? WTF... just sounds totally pointless to me, but someone please enlighten me.

And also... what kind of insensitive fuck jokes about suicide, or EGGS someone on, in any context (yes, even a complete stranger on the internet)? I mean, I can see it if you've known someone for a long time and they've been waffling about it for years, etc... but a total stranger? I don't really care about legal repercussions, but even in this "insult" context, I can't believe that not a single person in that room had the consciousness of mind to think that this person might be serious.

Sometimes I hate the fucking internet and what it encourages people to do. (I am not talking about the guy who committed suicide; I am talking about the fuckers who watched him do it, and how they could possibly think that was something "cool"...)

The internet is full of attention whores, the kind of folks who do anything to get people to look at them. . In their eyes, egging this man on to hang himself would be no different than having some chick flash her breasts in front of the webcam. It's the wonderful world of the internet.

If you think he was egged on simply because he was on the internet, you're mistaken. In any situation where a person publicizes their attempt at suicide, there will be spectators in the crowd egging them on to jump/blow their brains out/etc., just as there will be people trying to persuade them to stop. Blaming the internet is pointless, as that would assume that if he didn't have a webcam he wouldn't have done it, which I don't believe at all.

So, a chick flashing her boobs is on par with a guy threatening to commit suicide? I just don't think those two actions are comparable, in any form. One is nudity. The other is life or death.

I have never heard of this, except for maybe in the movies. Have you seen this happen in real life, firsthand? Can you give me a factual example of this happening? I just cannot imagine it.

And I am aware that the guy might have committed suicide anyway, regardless of the internet or webcam. That is why I said, in the last parentheses to my previous post, that I wasn't talking about the guy committing suicide... I was talking about the fucking assholes who watched him do it, and thought that this was okay, even cool or funny. That's just plain sick.

And it's all entertainment. Think of how popular the videos of Nicholas Berg's beheading and Saddam Hussein's execution were once they hit the internet? People have a morbid fascination with the act of dying.


Personally, no. All I can go on is the firsthand account of a platoon sergeant I had who tried to talk a marine out of jumping from the top of the barracks at Camp Pendleton. He was the OOD (Officer of the Day) and was called to the barracks, along with the MP's and chaplain after the jumper was spotted by a firewatch who called it in to the Sergeant of the Guard. There was a couple of marines who were watching and one did sarcastically egg him on to jump, which resulted in quite the verbal berating from the chaplain himself.

IMO - A suicide is the most selfish act and stupidest thing to do. only wimps do it. I sincerely hope the rope wasn't nicely there and he suffered a while before the passed away. :shakehead:

Sounds like you might have cheered him on. Maybe not, but that's what it sounds like to me.

I feel just terrible for the tenant who will live in that apartment after him, what with the hole in the ceiling and all.

I don't know why people hang themselves. So many things could go wrong. If you end up paralyzed, you will have to depend on the care of other people, and they certainly wouldn't help you end your life.

As well, there are figures that suggest that most people who commit suicide where also heavy drinkers, and that contributed- their "addiction" I mean... but I beg to differ.

The drinking associated with most wreckless lives was their final means or effort to soothe the pain. They weren't suicidal because their drinking, but drinking because they were suicidal. Obviously it didn't work, but it was an effort to choose life over death.

Of course, sometimes it is true that addiction is the culprit, but not all the time as people would like to believe. A study found that like 30% of people who ended their life also were alcoholics, but this is only because they tried it to see if it would make things less painful. It itself wasn't their bane of existence- not in every case.

Anyway I've heard of this fad of posting your own death, or threatening to, but always wondered how someone would do it. For youtube.com you have to click 'finish,' then upload it, but I suppose in a live chatroom (never visited one) it would be different, real-time.

It was pretty wimpy for the Virginia Tech guy to do it, before having to face the SWAT team or whatnot...

...but for others who end their life, such as Budd Dwyer, it takes courage and guts. I mean, I've loaded my gun, and unloaded it, then loaded it again during tough times, and I just couldn't do it, and so ended up having to deal with a worse pain the next day, that of the situation that made me think about death in the first place. I certainly don't feel like less of a coward for being unable to do it. People who commit suicide want to make a statement about a matter, a loud and clear statement, and it is their last attempt to communicate a message of pain to people who have so far refused to listen. (Of course, I'm not condoning or encouraging the concept.)

The chatroom was an insult chat room which means you simply insult people not ege them on to kill them self this is not an insult. That would be like watching a young person chug-a-lug beer or alcohol and you edged them on then they died from alcohol poison.