vonstalhein

Ok, i'm posting this here because it has been described as a philosophy. What i want to know is why? I have absolutely no problem with straightedge, i myself only drink socially. But, for some reason, it is often associated with skinheaded X wearing baseball bat wielding sociopaths. Also, i find it vaguely annoying when people become self righteous towards me, and openly declare it. sXe is apparently a way of life, yet the sanctimonious proclamations and elitism that go hand in hand...perturbs me slightly. Hardcore is hardocore, and does it really NEED a sXe scene? Attention seeking if you ask me. What are your thoughts?

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Sledge

I see sXe as a socially acceptable manifestation of what's, at heart, a decent philosophy - but a manifestation that plays to the motivations and biases that make an ingroup work.

In other words, I respect people who refuse to ingest mind-altering substances. But sXe is what happens when such people get together, divide the world up into "us" vs. "them," and start thinking as a group instead of for themselves.

anti fishstick

agreed with sledge. this us vs. them mentality is the reason i can't respect sXe. and what's with the SLC sXe scene beating people up who aren't sXe? things go awry when people are power hungry. no drugs, sex or booze? good for you man, but don't push your views onto everyone like neo-nazis. the same goes for hardcore vegans yelling at everyone on animal cruelty and how gross meat is.. or even femmenazi's radically trying to fight for change yet creating unequality the other way around it gets old. and people tend to start disrespecting perfectly good "philosophies" because of these militants. i think it distorts the true meaning of these labels.

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wilbjammin

sXe is the outline of a philosophy... but it isn't very encompassing. With sXe I don't see much unity besides this ideal of purity (if that is what you want to call it). Instead of calling it a philosophy, I'm more bound to call it a socio-political phenomenon. Somewhat familiar to political parties with loose philosophies and a couple general principles they all follow. A movement without a lot of force behind it... like the Anarchists here in Eugene.

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vonstalhein

I agree with everything said here. However, i really don't understand the need to declare it so openly. I am uncomfortable that people need the sense that they are part of a 'scene' to see their beliefs through. And...hmm...it'd be interesting to see what a sXe'er has to say about this. personally, although i'm aware that it is no doubt something that will be around as long as there are attention seeking individuals needing the vogue 'cool' of logo etc...i just don't like it. I'm not feeling particularly articulate this evening...but it seems to me to be something that has been grossly tainted.

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CSflim

sXe?

could someone elaborate?

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Sledge

Straightedge.

First time I saw it, I was like WHUH? SEX? You know that's intentional, too...

wilbjammin

Straight edge people are anti-drugs and usually anti-sex (or promiscuous sex). I generally associate it in my mind with Christians wanting to be punk in Salt Lake City, but they definitely aren't necessarily Christians. Bands like Earth Crisis are associated with sXe, if you want to see some of their leaders. A lot of sXers are vegan, and some are even anti-piercings and tattoos. A lot of sXers are going to look like typical punk rockers, though some with a hippie-ish twist (dirty, but with a love of nature... and still angry). A hallmark of sXe is the big black X you can find on their hand that says "I'm sXe, look". There's more to say, but that is the heart of it.

Here's a link put out by proclaimed sXers.

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Easytiger

And the things straight-edgers have to resort to in order keep themselves amused because they don't drink, smoke, do drugs or have promiscuous sex...let's just say I'd rather do any of the above rather than get up to what my straight-edge friends do.

Ustwo

I think its cute.

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Sledge

Out of curiosity, what's that?

vonstalhein

Haha yeah tell us. Seriously though, i think it would be better to preach things in moderation other than preach..no things at all. People are only human, and in the face or boredom, what else are they gonna do?

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anti fishstick

i just think denying yourself of human nature of any kind, be it sex, emotions, whatever will cause problems.

they're bottled up with energy and agression and governed by fear bcos they can't get laid

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phukraut

is this just puritanism dressed up in a modern way?

PeaceFrog

This reminded me of a article i just read on the sXe scene and their involvement with tattoos and piercings. A little off topic, but still a really interesting read. It also clarifies the idea of sXe a little more too.

http://www.bmezine.com/news/pubring/20031210.html

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matthew330

sXe a philosophy?....nah - nothing more than lost little children trying to find themselves and make themselves feel important. How many people over 25, that don't drink, are still calling themselves "sXe".

XenuHubbard

Haha, I knew a few straight edgers. It lasted for almost two weeks. The appeal of incense and cordial didn't last very long. Went to one of their parties and got hammered, though. That was fun.

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vonstalhein

That article is fucking scary. I'm glad other people agree with me.
I think sXe is a mental disorder.

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Easytiger

Well, as a PRIME example, there was the time that six of them got really bored, so they wrapped each other in clingfilm and took turns pooping on each other "because it felt weird". They taped it. I saw it. It was wrong.

CSflim

Wow! That's so much more constructive than going to a party and getting drunk!

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Easytiger

Yeah, they do things stone cold sober that I'd never do drunk. Go figure.

sailor

Thats the best explanation Ive heard yet.

I like the idea, and its a very respectable thing, but the image they have is not something admirable.

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Sho Nuff

sXe is great personal philosophy. Its not for everyone but to deny that its even a philosophy because you disagree with the chosen lifestyle is ignorant. The acts in an of themselves are not a philosophy, but anytime you deny your animal nature and seek purity in your body it is a philosophy. In fact, it is one of the oldest philosophies on earth dating to the earliest forms of spirituality and priesthood.

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Sledge

That is the coolest thing I've ever not seen. I changed my mind about straight-edgers.

MSD

I've known this kind of people. Because they won't touch anything "unclean" like drugs and sex, they think they're better than me. There's no need to form a movement to feel better about yourself if your friends decide that you're a wuss. If they won't accept your values, find new friends who will accept you, don't join a movement and wallow in self-pity while trying to convert the rest of us.

Finchie

In my experience, the majority of straightedgers are just self-righteous kids who think they're better than you. I wouldn't consider it a philosophy... maybe a ripoff of certain religious or other *real* philosophical beliefs. There are several philosophies which say "Don't drink, don't smoke, etc." But it's *cooler* to just say you're straightedge since it's *cooler* to belong to a smaller group. It makes kids feel like they belong. When they grow up, they will not say they are straightedge any longer, because that's just retarded.

vonstalhein

I think there is something inherent of the promise of being straightedge that attracts the kind of people who fulfill the stereotype. It's like saying not all sXe'ers are self-righteous, but i think you can't be sXe unless you are, so it's almost a prerequisite. I agree with Finchie a lot, the minority thing is a big incentive for some reason. I can see where Sho Nuff is coming from though, but still....

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torn lace

From 1997-2002 I vocally considered myself straightedge. It was easier to tell that to the obnoxious kids who prodded into the reasons behind my abstinence from drinking instead of delving into the secrets of my family's alcoholic past, which I felt was highly embarrassing.

Throughout late middle school and early high school, I wanted to fit in like most kids do. Because my parents had strict rules against allowing me to go to parties where alcohol was being served, I ended up going to a lot of punk rock and ska shows. Labeling myself straightedge helped me to meet kids who shared common interests. It's a little offensive that some consider sXe a mental disorder or retarded, when it is definately a conscious choice. We learned to have fun being creative instead of getting drunk or stoned.

Being straightedge to my friends and I meant abstaining from cigarettes, drugs, alcohol, and promiscious sex. Sex in a loving, committed relationship was considered natural and not a risky behavior. Straightedge philosophy never related to religious beliefs.

The straightedge people I've met and hung out with were never "hate edge" or violent. Although there may be circles that are, I think bme sensationalized that aspect. Straightedge to me is just a healthier way of growing up. Being straightedge allowed me to focus on getting a good education instead of experimenting with things that I would regret later.

xo

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opentocomments

Its for people who dont do all that crap and need a clique to hang out with because they arent stong enough to resist alone.


Whats so bad about sex, drugs, and alcohol?

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drown_with_me

Your quote could apply to ANY sort of organized or unorganized group of like-minded people. Subsitute, say, the college Greek System into your statement, and it holds true also.

I'm not here to flame, but state that LIKE ALL GROUPS AND IDEOLOGIES, there are extremeists. sXe is no different.

I myself spent part of my college years sXe (it wasn't for me though... I eventually gave in to peer pressure - i was weak! ) and sXe "runs" in my family. There is absolutely NOTHING WRONG AT ALL with sXe philosophy. I think of my older cousin who kept an edge thru his entire teens/20's. He had his first beer at the age of 30. ...then I think of all the "wasted" nights I had in college/post and try to find some "positive"spin for it all. There are none. Meanwhile, my cousin found time to hone his skills as an illustrator, start a band, become a fantastic skateboarder and land a job with EA games. I often think that if I compiled all the nights drinking and spent them productively who knows what I could have accomplished?

So, thats my .02

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images

Straight edge is, in essence, a philosophy, but a redundant one at that. My reasoning is that you do not need to "claim" edge or embellish your body with tattooes to solidify your allegiance to a clean lifestyle; it's a superfluous distinction with which I've seen too many people become pompous and condescending. There are, however, people I know that have grown exponentially and not had to suffer the opportunity costs of an excessively hedonistic lifestyle.

I'm not a smoker, nor a drinker, nor a swinger. I whole-heartedly condone a clean lifestyle, but do not adopt the title of being edge. As a community, straight edge can help one establish a sense of self-worth, but with that also comes pride. And with pride, some people (some of which I've had run-ins with), become surly assholes. For me to assume that true of all people would be a slipperly-slope argument, so I base my statements mostly on the people I've met. Like drown_with_me said, every philisophical faction has its extremists, just as religion has its fundamentalists. If you are straight edge but also respect the choices other people make, much power to you.

For the record, I have a couple friends, one of whom is a fundamentalism Muslim, the other a fundamentalist Christian. They adhere calmy to their religion, but also respect the choices other people have made to find religions other than their own. I think that is very cool.

drown_with_me

Well stated images.

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ApexgriN

Most of you are way off. I was sXe for 3 years, 16-19, and I'll never regret it. You have to understand that there are extremists in every group, and most of these shallow judgements could be applied to any one of those groups. You people are missing the point. sXe, at it's base, is not injesting any mind altering substance. That's it. Some say you're not suppose to have sex, piercings and whatever. It's just other people trying to make themselves important by making up new rules.

Here's the lyrics to "Straight-Edge" by Minor Threat, the song that gave it a name.

I'm a person just like you
But I've got better things to do
Than sit around and fuck my head
Hang out with the living dead
Snort white shit up my nose
Pass out at the shows
I don't even think about speed
That's something I just don't need
I've got the straight edge
I'm a person just like you
But I've got better things to do
Than sit around and smoke dope
'Cause I know I can cope
Laugh at the thought of eating ludes
Laugh at the thought of sniffing glue
Always gonna keep in touch
Never want to use a crutch
I've got the straight edge
(Lyrics by Ian MacKaye)

Say anything about sex? No drugs/alcohol/whatever, that's all. I consider straight edge to be more of a youth group than anything else. Most kids will eventually sellout, but while they are young, they aren't doing drugs and fucking up the growing brain in the noggin. This is a good thing.

There will always be people that join a group for the wrong reasons. Every argument against straight-edge in this forum is basically universal for every group.

Straight-edge is a good thing and it's actually a very small group, yet since it recieves mostly negative attention on the major media outlets that all you sheep follow it'll never get the positive attention it deserves.

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apexGrin

vonstalhein

I just want to summarize this argument:
It seems that sXe is a positive movement, but has a number of participants that let pride and haughty disdain for other views let it down. So then, i will in future approach each sXe armed with a greater understanding of their chosen lifestyle, and will be prepared equally for the prospect of having met a strong-willed human being, living by a different doctrine to me, but also of having met a deeply flawed advocate of what idealistically discourages the very behaviour that is supporting my previous prejudice.

Agreed?

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