It's pointless IC3. All he's saying is, "I don't like rap, I don't like rap, I don't like rap." over and over again. It's something he and many others will never get and maybe it's better off that way.

I just want downwardspiral to realize that what he's hearing is not what true HipHop is.

What you are hearing is not what true hiphop is, These so called MC's are not helping the scene, I mean can somebody tell me of another type of music out there that sings about how fucking rich they are? I can't seem to think of one:rolleyes:

That's what is being played on the radio, That's what is giving HipHop a bad Rep...I agree with you that I don't want to hear somebody rap about how rich they are.

But don't let that shit blind you from something that was once a Passion for the music...There is still alot of MC's that have the passion the Fake MC's don't have.

I actually seen an interview of....Either de la soul or The Roots...But anyways, One of the MC's were asked who they are liking in the hiphop world, He said that he was dissapointed in rap...That's when you know there is a problem in the scene, When MC's are saying they are dissapointed in rap, And they are talking about the guys that are on the radio...Well the majority of it anyways.

saying all hip hop sounds the same is silly and ignorant. especially when some of you say all the rap you hear is on the radio/mtv. well any genre of music through those outlets all sounds the same so why are you even posting your opinions when you only hear the crappiest form of hip hop out there? like i said if you would make an effort to check out underground artists your thoughts would change but since you dont why are you making ignorant claims (i.e. all they talk about is violence, its all the same, etc.) it really angers me and it doesnt make sense to me. basing your opinions on what your fed through the radio and tv ... unbelieveable

Same could be said about all the fuckin rock music thats on the air right now. Every single one a these fuckin punk bands sounds the same and so do all of these new alternative bands. I mean they actually really do sound the same from every aspect, the singing is the same, they are all playing the same riffs over and over again, the subject matter is pratically the same. At least in hip-hop the only thing that sounds the same is the fact that it's all speaking. But the beats, delivery, rhymes, are mainly different in one way shape or form. Just listen to

Wu-Tang Clan
De La Soul
Aesop Rock
Cannibal Ox
The Roots
Mars Ill
Canibus
Kardinal Official
Heiroglyphics

The list could go on but NONE of those groups/artists sound the same as the group/artist above them. Maybe to you they may sound the same but if they still do it's just cause you have a fuckin subconcious bias towards them and you want them all to sound the same but the fact of the matter is none of them do. And if you still would rather say you hate rap it all sux, none of it is good writing then fine leave it the fuck alone they didn't make it for you anyway.

Asta!!

I'll start off with you numberfive in saying that you are right, I don't get this mainstream rap people listen to today. I don't get why people can listen to people talk about how rich they are, how many ho's they've banged, how much bling bling they have and so on. Gangsta rap is a pointless genre of music, but that's my opinion. Maybe I should have specified that in the title of the thread. And you IC3, I'm not denying that what I hear isn't the so called 'true hiphop' or whatever, because I myself know it isn't hiphop, it's garbage. The 'true hiphop' you speak of probably dosent have anything to do with bling blng and shit, and that's a good thing. And costello, i'll tell you the same thing I told numberfive, gangsta rap is pointless and I should have put that I meant gangsta rap in the thread title. No need to get angry, but you said that we base our opinions upon what we hear on TV and Radio, right? And that makes you angry? But isn't that what we Americans do? Most American opinions are based off of what we hear and see as it is. As for you K-Wise, I'll agree that all the new pop-punk bands sound the same, and I hate them as much as I hate gangsta rap. But saying that I have a subconcious bias towards rap because I don't like it and that I want it all to sound the same but it really dosent, let me ask you, have you heard the rap I have been telling you I hate lately? The pop/gangsta rap on the radio and on TV? It does all sound the same, and thats the rap I hate! As I told IC3 the underground rap as you call it probably dosen't go on and on about bling bling and that's good! None of the gangsta rap is good written lyrics, it's all stupid, and I agree w/ you again they didn't write their shitty bling bling lyrics for me, or you or anyone. They wrote it because they know that teenie bopper kids who think listening to Parental Advisory CD's is cool, and that those kids can and will con parents in to buying it for them. It's either those kids who con parents, or the people who think they have to be cool, so they'll get mainstream rap music to have something in comon with their peers. Now if you have anything else to say go for it.

Rap exists to piss me off. That is the only reason why.

You didn't read me right. I said if you listened to all of those groups I mentioned and you still think that all rap sounds the same then you have a subconcious bias towards it. Not that you currently do....you haven't heard all of it for me to know that. Stop going back to that crap heh. I completely agree with you that all of that crap you see on T.V. sounds exactly the same and it sux but look at it this way....I don't consider that to be rap. No one should. I'm saying forget about all of that crap and don't ever listen to it again. Give the underground hip-hop a chance and if you still don't like it then it's just not your thing....I won't hate you for it. I think any idiot can recognize the many different sounds in a lot of rap groups and at least acknowledge that fact....and I think any mature person can admitt that a particular rap song may have some very awe inspiring writing...they don't necessarily have to like it though just give it the respect that it deserves. I haven't heard too many other artists in the many genre's of music who can write half as good as some of the best rappers out there. The sooner people see that....the happier I'll be. Good writing is good writing no matter who does it. If ya really wanna check out some of the good stuff I'll suggest some stuff. I doubt I'd be able to sway your opinion of it though. Jesus you guys big Bill O Reily fans or sumfin? Theres another bastard I'd like to prove wrong (not directed at anyone just a guy I can't stand) Well...

Asta!!

Bill O' Reilly. . . the guy who debated with Jenna Jameson about porn? Haha

Guess not haha.

Asta!!

I couldv'e swore it was O'reilly who dabated w/ Jenna on the subject of porn. . . lol

Oh yeah, it was Bill all right. I remember seeing that interview actually, man it was funny as hell watching him debate with her too.

I knew it was Bill! I thought thats who they said on E True Hollywood Story for Jenna.

I was saying guess not to the question of whether you like him or not haha. Double standards are everywhere though. Just as I hate the crappy ass rap music I love havin a bitch rub her ass on muh crotch to it and just as I think women should get real jobs..I'll watch some porn in a heart beat. Confusion is rampant

Asta!!

I've turned my rap thread into a Jenna Jameson/Bill O'Reilly debate flashback, oh well lol

Dont worry worse things have happened.....Milly Vanillly.....Missy Elliot....Carson.

Asta!!

Haha, this is true K-Wise, so very true.

Now Now...We can't leave Vanilla Ice of that list of yours:D

Rap exists to balance out country;).

I'm vaguely amused by this entire discussion (and no, I don't listen to rap except for Eminem, who I only listen to in the car), because it makes me think of the history of music. Since Bach's day, discussions like this have been going on. All music exists for one reason or another, and yes, sometimes it just pisses people off. As an example, there was a riot at the first performance of Stravinsky's "Rite of Spring" (the dinosaur sequence in Disney's "Fantasia," for those who may be unfamiliar with it). People questioned the existence of that piece. People have questioned why everyone from Hector Berlioz to John Cage had to exist, but, like rappers, they had something to say in their own way, and they said it. As with most musical forms, some rap and hip-hop is amazingly good, and some is amazingly bad. It's the way music goes. If you don't like it, there's not much I can do about it. You are not alone in your dislike of the genre, but it seems silly to question "Why does it even exist?"

IMO rap/hip-hop sucks and I can't see how anybody could consdier it musical talent. Sure some of the lyrics might be good but they aren't even creating the music. I have never heard such a horrible attempt at creating music.

Someone finally sees it the way I have been. . . wow.

I hate most rap... but I love some of Eminems work... he is a VERY good storyteller.

to piss me off. Thats why.

That right there is just being ignorant.

I have to agreee that that is ignorant.. =)

For me.. there is a lot of Rap I dont like, but there is a lot I do. So its obviously not all sounding the same.

Just because you dont like it, doesn't mean others don't and that it shouldn't be classified as what YOU think music should be.

Eminem's version of "Sing for the Moment" is one of my favorite songs of any genre.

It is ironic to see someone named after a NIN album complain about rap. Isn't NIN just some sad guy screamsinging bad rap? ;)

More importantly, if you don't understand why a form of music exists, than you probably don't understand why any music exists. If you don't take the time to understand something, then of course it is all gonna be the same to you- you don't know shit about it. All metal sounds the same if you don't care enough to figure out the difference. So does country, or gospel, or folk for that matter. The only difference between NIN and staind is that trent hates life all by himself, while Staind hates life as a team, right.

Please and you think most a these other dudes are "creating the music" ?? What the hell do you think a beat is? Look at real producers not Puffy...look at Pete Rock, Alchemist, Rza, 4th Disciple, Hi-Tek, Dj Premier all these cats make original beats using various samples n sounds they can find. Beat machine is the exact same shit as an instrument cept prolly harder to do than one. Especially since you got all these cats who play the same 3 riffs 90 other bands before them played. You have a bias whether you'd like to admitt it or not. Edger Allen Poe...if you read The Raven it's just like a rap song. You could even spit it over a beat. And stop giving Eminem all the credit. I hate how people are like "Yeah I hate rap but I love Eminem" like he's the only good rapper out. You know how many people rap like him? He stole his steez from cats like Masta Ace, Kool Keith, Cage, Necro....etc. And if you wanna hear a battle emcee listen to somebody like Juice, Supernatural, Canibus, Chino XL. I mean I know for a fact if you like him you'll like most underground hip-hop. Shit give it a chance.

Asta!!

I don't know what the hell your talking about (do you even know).

Have you even heard Trent Reznor sing Hurt, he kicked some serious ass singing that song.

No Sir, I don't like it. I think rap went from being a real on-the-street thing to being what the RIAA believes is a cash cow. Well, rap turned into more of a culture, and gets a lot of airplay and bad press. Old-school rap like Sir Mix-a-lot is when it was good (to me) and now it seems every rapper wants to bust a cap in my ass now. What fun is that? Hell, even heavy metal bands run an occasional ballad.....

"I am a big man, yes i am
and i've got a big gun
got me a big old dick and i
i like to have fun
held against yer forehead
i'll make you suck it
maybe i'll put a hole in yer head you know just for the fuck of it."
-NIN, big man w/ a gun

Screamsinging bad rap.
I'm just saying that it is ironic (unexpected) that someone would choose question the value of hip hop, and then express their enjoyment of something that sometimes resembles very bad quality hip hop. Keep in mind, i'm not saying that NIN is hip hop, i'm just saying that sometimes Mr. Reznor "sings" in a way that is very rap-like
I know what i'm talking about, i'm sorry if i was unclear.

Oooh ooh! It only seems like every rapper wants to pop a cap in yer ass because you probably only listen to gansta rap. Watching MTV you probably believe that evey white male between the ages of 18-30 (besides eminim and justin "justified" timberlake) is on the verge of suicide. Quick, somebody get chevelle on a suicide watch, before they do something horrible!!!!

This is a pointless discussion. I enjoy such discussions, so I'll chime in now.

Rap, or more correctly Hip Hop, isn't going away, nor should it. To assume that MTV is Hip Hop or to categorize Hip Hop as Gangsta rap is ridiculous. You need to ask yourself whether you should be trashing something of which you knowingly know next to nothing about. And if you don't realize that Hip Hop is not solely or even primarily focused on Drugs/Hos/Guns, you are simply ignorant of your own ignorance.

Anyone that would even consider stating that The Roots (as a prime example) do not create music must certainly have absolutely no concept of what music really is.

Personally, I could never listen to Country music. I know next to nothing about the genre. However, I'm not foolish enough to believe that it is not music. I didn't grow up on a farm, but other people have - and in so doing, they have learned to enjoy Country music. More power to 'em.

For the record Downwardspiral's name does not refer to the NIN album of the, almost, same name.

Hey everyone!...... I am one of the biggest rap haters in the world! I let my kids and my wife know it (because they like it), but I also let my kids know that this is what this country is all about! We all have this thing called opinion, which we are all entitled to. This country is the greatest country in the world because of that. I love almost all music except rap, and when I'm in the car with my kids, I let them listen to their rap (as long as it's clean- they're 10 and 12), but then I tell them it's dad's turn and slip in some good old classic rock or r&b, or even country. They've even come to like some of it! I think everyone should just lighten up and get along!

Whoa whoa whoa one second there filtherton, who said I got my ame rom the Nine Inch Nails album hmm? If you want to get technical the album name is 'The Downward Spiral', you could at least ask first before you make assumptions as to where my name came from. And you bling, did I ever say that I categorized MTV gangsta rap as hip hop? No, I didn't. I never brought up the damn subject of hip hop in the first place. I said gangsta rap, not hip hop. You my friend need to read the other posts made in the thread before you start running your mouth about ignorance, bling. I also never said that hip hop focused on guns, drugs and ho's, I said gangsta rap did. Again i'll say you need to get the full story before you start running your mouth. Anything else you wanna add to your senseless babble?

Feh. All the teens of this world are led by MTV. Hell, Nickelodeon is owned by MTV, and when you get older you just start watching MTV.

Quite scary that a few channels can make such an impression on teens.

Such weak minds! ;)

I apologize for jumping to conclusions about your name. I'd be pissed too if somebody mistakenly thought is was named after a NIN album. Mil perdones!

Do you guys think it's valid to say that in a lot of ways mainstream rap annoys people to the point where they figure that all rap is bad, and brings them to the point where they even tend to discriminate and hate the people that listen to mainstream rap?

I guess what I'm trying to get at is, do you think this butchering of rap is in part causing discrimination against black people or people who say they listen to rap?

Yes it is. And most who say they hate rap are really saying they hate black people and the black culture (not necessarily those who posted). Discrimination is everywhere though you can't escape it you just gotta learn to live with it like myself and other minorities have to. And bad music is bad music but if it's making kids wanna drop the books and pick up a gun or go to a club rather than get a job, n everything imbetween then it's more than just bad music....it's practically a plague. And for that reason I can understand why people would hate it. It doesn't give them the right to stereotype or generalize or discriminate against an entire race and generation though. It's a sad subject and I'd love to stop it but fact of the matter is one finger can't pick up the trash as good as 2 hands. Eventually it might but it would take a long long time.

Asta!!

And just what are you implying there, rainheart? That I don't like black people? I wonder now what does discrimination have to do with my hatred for mainstream gangsta rap hmm? I don't have a problem with people who listen to rap or black people, let them listen to mainstream rap all they want, I just don't get how people can listen to gangsta rap. It sounds to me like you're saying that anyone who comes out and says they don't like rap is discriminating against black people, too. And if that is indeed what you're saying then you my friend are way off. I'll continue to say I don't like mainstream rap, but i'm not about to go out and get violent or discriminate towards people that do, I'm just simply voicing my opinion.

So exactly how many books are there on Lestat? Interview With A Vampire, Queen Of The Damned was one too right? What were all of them? I thought the movie for Queen Of The Damned kinda sucked but my friend said he liked it a lot but thats because he read the books and recognized all the characters that were in it. Shine some light my way

Asta!!