shortynickel

hey janie...will yall mention when the "deadline" is...like a week, a month, a year?

the only thing additional that i would have to add is that...say ur married and ur SO cheated on you, even if yall get thru the problem there will still be the insecurities like yall are havin...i dont blame either of you for having ur insecurities....i can understand Rich's side of things cause i was the smaller person but i havent been cheated on nor will be be the cheatee...if anything i would be the cheater....sadly thats the way the cookie crumbles...i still stand by what i said before tho...but i am glad that the two of you have tried/are working things out...anyway...GL and i would love to know how things turn out.

Dale Kemp

Why don't you take a holiday. Don't break up, but just decide to take a holiday from sex with one another. Start courting all over again. Ask her out on a "first" date. Work up to putting your arm around her. Then try to get to the moment of your "first" kiss. End your date with a kiss, nothing more.

Maybe on a third date, try body caresses. Fondling feels so great, when its a new expression of your interest in one another.

And so forth.

After awhile, you'll likely want one another badly. Talk about how you feel, what desires you feel.

This holiday and courting all over again will give her time to sort out her feelings about your loving her, and give you time to reconnect with her, knowing she wasn't a virgin queen until you met her, but she's still worthy of you and your love. Courting her will show her that. Maybe, after a month of courting her, she'll let your reconnect with her. By that time, you should know whether she's really the one you want.

Good luck.

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Trueheart

analog

If you aren't married, or don't have kids, then counseling is bullshit. You're adults- work out your issues or, since it looks like your issues have come to a head anyway, just break up. No counseling is going to put a magical patch over all your problems.

freecorndogs

This is slightly unrelated yet I see it a lot in this post thus far: The idea that whenever a guy has a particularly zealous like or dislike he is always labeled "insecure". Why is this? Are we, as adults not allowed to have our particular likes and dislikes? If during a conversation it comes up that a guy doesn't like, let's say, "broccoli" people basically think to themselves, "oh", and leave it at that. "So the guy doesn't like broccoli, big deal. He's entitled." On the other hand, if it comes up that he doesn't like women who have slept around, now he's somehow "insecure". What if he just disagrees with it? How is it any different than not liking tobacco chewers, people who sit on his car, rude drivers, or broccoli for that matter?

And another thing...since I'm off on tangents that I'm sure will spark some antagonisitc responses (not my intention, mind you. I am actually hoping for real, legitimate, well thought out responses but I'm guessing there may be some expressed intolerance) why is it that a woman will admit to having been promiscuous but then get upset when she is disparagingly labeled? Isn't that the very definition of all those disparaging labels? I mean it isn't like this is a new thing that was unwittingly sprung on them after the fact and they're being "grandfathered in". To me it is rather like someone who smokes an eighth of marijuana each week getting upset for being labeled a pothead. Or, an alcoholic who drinks a 6 pack a day and a 5th of vodka each weekend getting annoyed the she is labeled a "drunk". The words "slut" and "whore" have been around for a very long time and, in fact, the women who fit those definitions have been judged and looked upon negatively by society for much longer than being a "drunk" has been unpopular. Why is it then that when girls grow up, fully aware of the negative conotations that such actions will bring them in society, they instead choose to live up to those definitions but then get "annoyed" that anyone "dares to judge them" or freely question them? Who is insecure? The people passing judgement? Passing judgement may not be "nice" but I have a hard time accepting that these judgements are in any way inaccurate. Whore is Whore and Drunk is Drunk. That is the defnition. There is little ambiguity. Now where the "numbers" may fall is somewhat a matter of opinion but let's not play ignorant to the spirit of the definition. If a woman is or has "slept around" with a good number of guys in her day then, like it or not, by definition, she is a whore. And, saying so doesn't make the speaker "insecure". It makes them honest. Maybe not nice, but honest, which is more than can be said for the women out there who would support lying about their numbers so that they can get a "free pass" and not be held accountable in society to a long held, talked about, printed, and widely accepted definition.

thed00t

Plan a romantic night. The entire 9 yards. Dress up in your best black formal dress. Get him to dress up. Go out to a nice as hell resturant. Go see a concert. Make it a whole evening event. Do it in another city if you have to. Plan it in advance, and get excited about it. Get him excited about it, so he brings flowers and stuff. Let him know how excited you are about it.

Either sparks will fly, or they won't.

If they don't... you know what you need to do. If they do, take it from there and treat it like the begining of the relationship again.

bad jane

perhaps it is just me, but i don't think your problem has anything to do with sex. from what i've read, it seems to be about trust. jane doesn't trust rich because he hurt her. it's great that he's apologized (assuming it is sincere) and that they want to work through it--but this is a big hurdle in any relationship.

that's not to say jane thinks rich is gonna cheat on her or anything along those lines--it just seems she doesn't trust him because she feels he judged her and hurt her feelings when she was honest with him. that makes any more "sharing" difficult--not just in terms of a nice sit-down-and-share-convo, but any opening up of herself to him emotionally, including in the bedroom.

rich says things have improved to the point where everything is fine unless there is an argument and then it all comes bubbling back up. well, that tends to happen when you have issues that aren't resovled. but i don't recall jane mentioning that everything is great the majority of the time. and really, we aren't talking about rich's feelings anymore--we're talking about jane's.

jane says she loves him but isn't "in love" with him. having been there, done that myself i'm gonna go on what that means to me. if it doesn't ring true, perhaps you'll need to clarify what it means to you. you think rich is a good person and a worthy friend--as an individual, you love him. much like you love anyone else you feel close to in your life. but you aren't "in love" meaning, that bond you used to feel as his gf is no longer there. you don't feel connected to him in a way that makes your relationship meaninful to you. it isn't about that initial rush of mushy gushy love you get when you first hook-up with someone being gone, it's about the level of closeness you once felt not being there anymore. that sound about right?

imnsho, you can tackle this a couple of ways depending on your individual preference and circumstance. if things are good more than they are bad, you can take a chance and try to work it out. if not, you can cut your losses and move on. or, if you don't want to have to deal with these issues you can ride out your time limit and walk away--never getting the closure you might have gotten with your other options.

you guys are young, but you aren't that young. people your age get married all the time--hell, people your age are getting divorced all the time too! so really, what is this relationship worth to you? how much potential is there in it and how much effort are you willing to invest? a few months may seem like forever right now, but if this is someone you could see spending the rest of your life with--3 or 4 months is nothing. your relationship is still relatively new which is going to make your decision that much more difficult. there aren't a lot of good times to look back on and see you through the rough spots (compared to people who experience trust issues after spending years together).

i don't think anyone can tell you how to learn to trust someone again. but i do know that it starts with a choice and it takes a long time. how long is up to you. what you need from rich is also up to you. you want to understand the what and why of his emotions? best of luck girl, you can spend years with someone and never get past the tip of the iceberg. emotions are not always logical and for many people, expressing their emotions is difficult enough--explaining them to someone else is even worse. even rich may not be able to provide you with a clear reasoning. and even if he does, you have to be able to believe what he tells you.

counseling might help, but you're young and this isn't a long term relationship. counseling is a big investment (in terms of money, time, effort and emotions) so it may require more commitment than your relationship is worth to you. (and that is NOT a bad thing in these circumstances. you guys have only been together a few months, devoting just as much, if not more, time to counseling this early on is huge.)

sounds like you need to spend some serious time doing a bit of soul-searching. but whatever your decision about this relationship, what you learn from it will help you in every relationship that comes after (romantic or otherwise). it's good to know what you base trust on and what it takes to earn that back. it's good to learn what your personal boundaries for trusting are and recognize when they have been crossed. as much as i know you hate going through this right now, there is the potential to learn a lot about yourself from it.

utburd

numbers....ah numbers are great, my partners are often in awe of my numbers.... Ive had a couple who were very insecure about them... but if the previous numbers ment that much too me id still be with them... or stalking them (jk). Ive had a couple of partners who have cheated on me, but we either broke up there and then...or shifted to an open relationship, or it was a one night thing. but i always like the details, sometimes they even get me horny. but im not jealous just interested, guess im naturally liberal, and easy going about this stuff...

I usually figure that experience helps get everyone involved a good experience.

so thats too ways of dealing with paranoia relating to experience...
however no help at all on infidelity...
hmm maybe i was sort of influenced by my dads infidelity, in a sort of fatalistic way...

ill have to think about that... if i come back a fundamentalist someone slap me...

WillyPete

What strikes me about this issue is the difference in attitude to her admissions of previous relationships.

Rich seems to have a lot more of a conservative outlook in life regarding sex. He's stated that he 'cheated' yet it was only kissing. Most of us here would say "so what". You see what level he associates the physical aspect of the relationship?

When you've got that attitude regarding sex and intimacy, and you've been cheated on by firstly a romantic trust and also a friend then you are going to feel very insecure about future relationships.

Having come from a quite puritanical background myself, I can relate to this. When it is drilled into you that sex is only legal between man and wife and anything else is fornication or adultery, even holding hands is serious.
However, now I've come to see for myself that sex has many faces to it. You have the passionate sex of discovery, sex to bind a relationship, sex for comfort and sex to scratch-that-itch to name a few.

If you have the mentioned outlook, hearing of a partners one night stands may raise some doubts regarding how they feel about you. Think about it. When you hold off sex you build up high expectations regarding performance and response. You start to think that sex should include one or more orgasms for both parties.
Rich (I'm guessing) probably feels that Janie has a more relaxed attitude toward sex and might not value it as much as him. This will also let him wonder whether he is 'just another' blip on her activity. What will she say of him some day? These can add up and mess with his head a lot.
Add into it that Janie has admitted a lessening of her sexual drive, orgasms and obviously her infatuation with Rich and now you'll have all these insecurities building up making him think he IS just an ex.

He could be transferring his expectations and reservations regarding the relationship, when sometimes they need to be considered as separate entities.

If you two are serious about this though, and were willing to bring this up to a forum of unknown people I'd recommend that you are ready and willing to take this to a professional counsellor. Even if you decide to terminate the romantic element of your relationship, parts of this may carry over to future relationships as it has done already. You have some issues that need resolving, nothing that is wrong with you, but just something you need to come to terms with.

Shizukana

Exactly. Insecurity can be a bitter and very difficult enemy in a relationship, and you can't blame the problems that arise from it on any one person in the relationship. You just have to be open and communicate. She has to know his insecurities and take them into consideration, and he has to try to understand or believe that what she's saying isn't going to necessarily be a slight on him, but simply part of the communication in the relationship.

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"The power of accurate observation is frequently called cynicism by those who don't have it." - George Bernard Shaw