Toaster126

http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/...38/detail.html

The link is a news story. My school paper had two soccer players on the front of an issue lifting up their tops a la Girls Gone Wild, revealing sports bras. There has been an outcry from some saying that this degrades women and was inappropriate for a paper cover.

Do you think this is degrading to women? Do you think it was inappropriate for the paper cover?

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maleficent

And the link for the clicking impaired

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Cynthetiq

IMO the photo by itself with the simple tag Goals Gone Wild is good parody.

the caption of 4 good reasons is plain lowest common denominator pandering.

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maleficent

When the headline reads - 4 good reasons -- picturing only two soccer players.. they are going for the tawdry headline... it's cheap. These women are athletes... and the paper is reducing them to just their breasts.

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Jinn

Do they have a problem with it? No.

Should I have a problem with it, if they don't have a problem with it? No.

Some people want to be objects, and it is not my place to pass judgement otherwise.

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Cynthetiq

oh there's even yet ONE more good pandering part...

the BIG JOHNSON SOCCER....

I assume it's like the Big Johnson t-shirts.

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maleficent

We're not seeing that image in context... was there an original story attached -- besides the outcry story... Why was the picture published to begin with?

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Jinn

Now see this is one of those things I really don't understand about the PC crowd. If something is said about someone, and that someone is "OK" with it.. why should we care? So two college (I'm presuming) girls decided that they wanted to show their bras, and they were okay with it being on the newspaper cover. They're okay with it -- what the hell is it my business to say "oh nooo that's not okay..." If my homosexual friend doesn't mind being called a "fag," its certainly not my business to Stand Up For All that is Right and tell that person to not use "fag" because it is offensive...

People are fully capable of defending themselves. If they'd objected to this being in the newspaper and it was still shown, sure, I could see a problem. But now? It seems like PC-nazi's are trying to make something out of nothing. (Not that any of you are)

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Sho Nuff

Aww cmon. Its just harmless fun. I like it

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Leto

We cant see the rest of the page clearly, but they probabaly got away with the double entendre because there are 4 pictures on the page...

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Cynthetiq

no but if another homosexual is offended by the fag comment?

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maleficent

/me puts on her really annoying feminazi cap...

Any time women are objectified, it takes away from other accomplishments that they have achieved, they are being known for their breasts, or butt, or other body part rather than what they have achieved. Maybe these two women are the high scorers on the team, or have scored more goals than anyone in the state, or have broken some long standing school record, but instead of celebrating their accomplishments.. all they get is a cheesey shot of their breasts in a very unflattering bra.

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Sho Nuff

Our entire entertainment industry is based on objectifying people. Brad Pitt is no less objectified buffed out and oiled up in Troy than those women posing for the newspaper. Its not just women, its a sign of the times.

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maleficent

I don't disagree..
but
brad pitt - -ewwwww

however....
But these are athletes... college athletes... not movie stars... they are not professional anything...

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Sho Nuff

In the context of the newspaper ads they are models. Its the same as Jordan wearing nothing but Hanes and a smile. Even college football players pose for local calendars and promotions.

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maleficent

That's why I asked about context of the original picture.. .Was there a story attached? If it's on the front page, it'd be safe to assume there was a story... If there's a story, they are not modelling... same as if you had a picture taken for a man on the street interview...

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Jinn

Good. They let themselves be represented this way by (a) lifting their shirts and (b) letting it be printed. If they ALLOW this "degradation" to occur, its their own damn fault! If they didn't want to be objectified, its simple to refuse to lift your shirt, or refuse to allow the pictures to be published. Their own damn fault.

Once again -- they CHOSE to be known for their breasts rather than their athletic skill. This is no fault of society, but of their own.

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rlynnm

It keeps the bases covered, just in case.

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xepherys

I agree with Jinn...


also note that I don't KNOW them any more based on their breasts than their athletic achievements. From the picture I know two things:

a) They have breasts
b) They play soccer

Why do I know more about one of those, or think more of one of those than the other? I don't. *shrug*

Also, Mal, I noticed you say "unflattering bra". Not that you would, with your feminazi cap on think it'd have been better had they been wearing the latest from Victoria's Secret... but you DID say it. That right there throws the feminism hat out the window. Just an observation...

Menoman

It's like this, if you ask me.

When you try to say what those 2 girls should be allowed to do with themselves, you're trying to tell them how to live their life.

The same applies, if you want to up the 'level' of this type of thing, to pornstars, strippers, anything. You can't tell them not to do what they are doing, otherwise, it is telling them how to live their life.

Nobody has a right to tell someone how to live their life.

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xepherys

Menoman-

I agree... and one of the issues with feministic views of such things is that, by saying one thing ir right and another is wrong, you are, as you said, telling them how to live their lives. That, to me, is degrading.

Feminism != Feminism

Cynthetiq

Please note that I did not tell anyone how to live their life. I don't want someone to do it to me and try my best to not do it to someone else.

I only stated that the comment of 4 reasons was pandering to the lowest common denominator.

I didn't even comment on if it was degrading... just that the comment was pandering

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rlynnm

I dont think anyone has a right to tell someone else how to live their life, but do know that any action you take will and unfortunately be used to judge character and this may either be correct or misconstrued with the message you are actually trying to put out.

The original question was whether the ad promoted demoralization of women, well, with the innuendos, and the blatant lack of clothing, it does appear, well degrading. Regardless of what great soccer players these girls may be, the initial thought, I'm sure drives away from that fact.

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flstf

I think it is funny as hell especially with the caption "Goals Gone Wild" and if I was from Johnson County I would probably read the story and maybe give more support to the soccer program.

rlynnm

Unfortunately, mal, just the very fact that we were born with well...certain assets (are they even really assets anymore?) immediately we are regarded differently than males are. Isn't this almost innate? Certain (physical) aspects of us women, override other potentially more pivotal aspects. It's one of those things that is unfortunate, but has been socially/culturally constructed for who knows how long. I think I just went off on another tangent, anyways...

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Martian

I disagree.

See, what you're essentially saying here is that they are objectified (by men) and this takes away from their accomplishments (in the eyes of men). I have to assume that is the general intent being conveyed because a) men are the predominant group interested in their breasts and butts and therefore the predominant group to fixate on that and b) you say 'any time women are objectified' without specifying and subgroups of women. Since you're classifying the entire gender and it's very difficult for the gender to objectify itself I have to assume that it's men who are partaking in this behaviour.

My problem with this is that it doesn't give me and my fellow man a whole hell of a lot of credit. You're essentially saying that I'm going to see her tits and fixate, without even bothering to read the article. Completely ignoring the fact that while thse two young women are very pretty the piture is hardly sexual at all and quite chaste in my opinion, I don't see my entire gender as the sort to see it, say 'hey, boobs!' and forget how to use our frontal lobes. There are very probably men who do this, sure, but it's not all men. And just as you don't want to be objectified due to the ations of these two women I don't want to be penalized due to the actions of those men among us who can't look past a little T&A.

This, IMO, is a major issue with the feminist movement in general. It seems that the feminist movement attempts to deny sexuality in favour of other merits. The reality is there's no reason why they can't be successfully integrated. Why can't I pick up that paper because of the two pretty girls in (what I consider to be) a humourous spoof and then read about how one of them scored the game winning goal when I open it?

As for the headline, four good reasons... well, yeah, it's a double-entendre and therefore indirectly refers to their breasts. That's how double-entendres work. That doesn't necessarily diminish from the accomplishments of the two girls involved. Such a statement can't accurately be made without reading the referenced article.

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Toaster126

The comment of "four reasons to support blah blah" was explained on the inside cover.

"Note: The four reasons to support Cav's sports are strong finishes to fall sports, encouraging starts for winter sports, star athletes, and [sports editor]'s superb coverage."

There are indeed four pictures on the front cover, but the other three are not sports related.

The article focuses on the soccer team itself, not the girls.

Thanks Mal for posting the article\pic. I forgot some were link-shy.

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"The question isn't who is going to let me, it's who is going to stop me." (Ayn Rand)
"The truth is that our finest moments are most likely to occur when we are feeling deeply uncomfortable, unhappy, or unfulfilled. For it is only in such moments, propelled by our discomfort, that we are likely to step out of our ruts and start searching for different ways or truer answers." (M. Scott Peck)

rofgilead

I don't know, in my small town where I grew up there is a newspaper called the Picture Post. It had pictures of various things happening around my town and special events and stuff. But, the cover page was always some women posing in a bikini top and bottom swimsuit.

I think it is just a dumb local thing...

ziadel

theres so little to do that we have time to get worked up over this?


this seems like something REALLY trivial to be going to the matresses over...

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spindles

I don't think it is a local thing. The sun newspaper has been quite successful over many years having a topless page 3 girl.

Further, there is an Oz sports magazine, which I used to subscribe to (Inside Sport), that is actually a good sports magazine (though I think it has headed south, which is why I don't subscribe anymore). Of course, the cover picture is a "sports model" and there is obviously a "fashion" pictorial inside. FWIW, the worst selling edition they ever had was the one where there was a sportsman on the cover (Kieran Perkins - swimmer - no shirt on - at the time he was the world record holder in the 1500m). Personally, I bought the magazine for the articles, though the scantilly clad chick in the middle was definitely an added bonus.

Everyone knows that sex sells. While this particular local paper hasn't taken that the nth degree, they probably realise that cute soccer chicks might raise their circulation - and frankly the "negative" press is probably also a bonus.

This, my friends, is a storm in a <strike>dee</strike> tea cup

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shakran

If the girls are upset about it, they're idiots. If you don't want people to see pictures of you in your bra, don't let people take pictures of you in your bra.

But the newspaper was also stupid. This is journalism, not playboy. If you want to post stupid headlines like that, and if your only goal is to titilate, then you should be working for Hefner, not for the paper.

Menoman

I wasn't speaking directly to you, of course. Just throwing out my opinion of the title post.

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ObieX

I think people need to start thnking about their own actions more than the actions of others. If you want to lift up your shirt.. go for it. if you don't, then don't. If i were those girls i would be lifting up my shirt all the time, cuz my body would be smokin'. Yummy.

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flamingdog

Why is this even on the front page? Lead story, at that. There was no better news to report?

With the 'Goals Gone Wild' headline, it deserved maybe a picture story on page seven or something, but it would still be a pretty tawdry approach to take with it. I suppose it might increase circulation though.

Slyboots

I agree but since the whole Janet Jackson thingy at the superbowl, thing like these have started to offend people .I personally, find this thing ridiculous. I mean, I would understand the outcry if they were nude but come on, they have bras on!

I personally would also like to see more of those girls, if you know what I mean.

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trickyy

it's on the front page because it's a college newspaper. but i guess it was also a slow news day nationally, because here we are talking about it.

analog

Those girls have balls to do that.

But seriously... they lifted their shirts for a photo-op, they didn't object, and they have the "big johnson soccer" sports bras. I mean hello, they are just having fun and enjoying their sport. How do you call "exploitation" on an adult who asks for it and encourages it?

Cynthetiq

If this isn't degrading and objectifying women then I don't know what is...

Juiced commercial

for some reason when I saw this I thought of this thread...

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Carno

Well, if that photo was degrading, those girls did it to themselves.

If yall are upset that things like that objectify women, you should probably tell other women to stop letting themselves be objectified.

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