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Originally Posted by dksuddeth
I agree with you, if a private business or property owner does not want any weapons in his shop or property, that is completely his right just like it would be my right to choose not to enter or do business there because I refuse to go without it. I am simply pointing out that advertising or declaring a no gun zone is essentially telling the criminals that this is a no fear opportunity for them.
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But if you do not "advertise" with signs, you have gun people coming in saying "well you have no signage up." So it's a catch 22.
As for people shooting where guns are not allowed. IT doesn't matter if the sign is there or not, and I seriously have issues with the argument, "if I were allowed to carry a gun in there, that wouldn't happen."
Most of the school shootings are kids, where exactly do kids go?
People want to make statements when they do those mass shotings, I seriously doubt they care if there are other people there armed. They probably know they are on a suicide mission and in most cases it seems they have their "mission" well planned, plus they are usually massively armed. That plan usually is taking everyone by surprise. Most people, even if they do have guns when surprised, shocked and scared do not know how to react.
If you have people carrying guns in courthouses for fear of some psycho coming in, you have a lot of people with itchy trigger fingers and the second something happens that they aren't ready for, you may get innocent people getting shot because people over-reacted. Or, if it is an attack you may get more people killed because of crossfire.
There's a reason most major cities have SWAT teams and people who specialize in these areas. It is no, not, never a good place for the average Joe to take out his Glock and play Rambo. You're asking for more trouble than it is worth. Do you honestly believe the average Joe (trained in a classroom setting, who basically shot at a paper and took some written exam) and his Glock 9, are going to take down some nut case, who probably doesn't feel pain at the moment, who has more fire power than a Marine, and is ready for anything?
My feeling is the average Joe is shitting himself, IF he is brave enough to pull out his gun his hand is shaking so bad he can't get good aim and misses, perhaps maiming or killing innocents. Meanwhile, the Psycho hears the guns and really lets loose.
So you tell me, is it worth it? I don't think so, and I think the argument that people who carry guns are trained at handling this and the above scenario would never happen is a pipe dream and not based on anything.
If I am to be taken out by a shooter, I'd rather it be the psycho, than an innocent man playing Rambo. The psycho will get his, the innocent man who made a mistake will live with that guilt for the rest of his life.
Even in your above example, it was OUTSIDE the school where the Vice Principal had the gun. INSIDE may have been disasterous. You can argue it wouldn't have been, I can argue it would have.... no one knows, and IMHO I am thankful for that.
Also, as far as respect, how about cities where the people living there VOTE for gun bans and people outside the community challenge the voice of those people by suing and demanding "their (the outsiders)" gun rights. Case in point San Francisco. Where's the respect of others' rights?
One of the worst issues we have is where people believe their rights supercede everyone else's even if the community decided how they want their communities to live. This is the major reason we have a Federal government so strong and constantly in our lives. This is why there are people that feel we have too many rights and believe we can't handle them.
No one's rights supercede anyone else's. It's about respect and the knowledge that my rights end where your rights begin. In other words, if I choose to carry a gun and you are an owner of a "no gun zone" then my rights are lost when I step foot on your property. As you stated above, you may agree with that, but many NRA members and gun afficiandoes seem not to. As a few have argued they have the right to carry anywhere they desire on here.
The only way to get government out of our lives and the laws cut down..... have people respect others rights...... but a lot of people refuse to see that or live by that simple premise.