Politics What did Romney and the GOP do wrong?

A buck? You wusses. I got a 5k bet going right now with a guy who seems to think there were no precincts in the US that went 100% Romney. He's stuck on the 100% votes for Obama in urban areas and swears there's simply no where where Romney would have gotten 100%.

I haven't decided yet what to do with his 5k yet. But he's going to be really sorry when he opens his e-mail after work tonight with my link to county clerks in Utah, Oklahoma and Wyoming.

 

Under the Obama economy I am virtually bankrupt. $1 is a big percent of my net worth, I should have been smart like a few people I know who basically cashed out, hedge on the short side, or bet on economic malaise when President Obama got elected in 2008. It is funny how the liberals don't vote with their money the same way they vote politically - you would think liberals would be spending, buying houses, cars, hiring people and investing if they really believed in President Obama! Or, as in the Chicago way - dead people may vote but they don't spend money.

 

I'm doing way better under Obama then I did under the last six months of Bush. Under Bush in six months I lost nearly half my net worth. Since Obama's been in office my 401K has come back, the value of the properties are coming back One had dropped to about (+/-) 55% of it's value prior to Bush and the other was around 62%. Both are back above the 80% level now.

I'm always surprised when these really poor people in really red states (or areas) vote for GOP. Many are on food stamps, are getting federal subsidies for farming or fishing or just plain welfare. yet you talk to them and they'll often tell you they vote GOP because that what Jesus would do, or because the Dems want to abort all babies everywhere or my favorite because the Dems want to destroy marriage by letting gays get married.

 

I think the difference is that as a conservative, I readily acknowledge that I am a greedy capitalist pig. I look to my own self-interest before party. I think liberals pretend to live by some higher standard - but that they really act in their own interests. For example, Oprah Winfrey. If she really believed what she says about the human condition, how do you amass more wealth than she could legitimately spend in multiple life spans - at the highest standards? best believe with her and many others like her - it was/is money first.
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What date do you really use, the November 2008 date of his election or the January date of his inauguration, or some other later date? My house value is down almost 50% that did not happen while Bush was in office and I suspect that if we let the mess work itself out based on market principles we would have felt the pain but would be doing much better today.

In some cases these folks simply don't like Yankees or government telling them what they can and can't do - one issue in particular involves guns. Only a fool would turn down free money - so if they qualify for food stamps, you bet they will sign up - but they will be pissed if you try to tell them they can't buy a Big Gulp.

Think about the Civil War only a very small percent of the population had an interest in the slavery question, but almost all were willing to fight for States Rights.

 

I use June '08. That's when things in northwest Oregon, my area, really started the free fall. My personal 401k peaked on my June '08 statement but that was due to a month delay as the Dow peaked in the upper 13K's in May. By the time Obama was sworn in mid Jan. '09 the Dow was down around 8K and by my Feb. Statement I'd lost 44% of it's value. My house was appraised for a VA loan rework in Dec. of 2006 it came back within 5% of what the county had it valued at. In the fall of 2009 I got my real estate tax bill from the county and it hadn't change. I spoke with a friend via Skype and he asked if I'd seen my tax bill. "Yes." "Is it lower?" "No, why?" "Because housing values since the mill shut down the 2nd paper mill (turns out 2 of 3 mills within the same mill complex had been shut down as of March 2009) have fallen through the floor. You should contact the county assessor and appeal, there's no way your house is worth what it was." The mill produced TP and paper towels for Costco was without a doubt the largest employer in the area, a very rural area with few other options for employment. I called the county and they first said I'd have to apply for a hearing date and either show up in person or have my representative, assume attorney, appear in person if I wanted to appeal the amount. I requested the hearing and made plans to return, figured I might as well see my family while I was at it. Two months before the hearing a received a letter stating they'd reworked almost all residential property values and reduce the value of my home 37%. I decide not to appeal further. I talked to other people who did appeal and some claim they got up to 55% reductions. As of last July the mill was back to all three mills are up and running. Though last I heard the 3rd shift (graveyard) at mill 2 and 3 are still not working. I haven't checked the value of my house, I have no reason to the Coast Guard has a five years lease. But I've checked home prices in the hometown newspaper on-line and they've certainly jumped back to near pre-Bush levels.

My only other property is a five acre plot with no improvements and is zoned farm so it's always stayed the same value which amounts to a couple hundred a year in taxes. I doubt it value has changed much.

 

McCain is just embarrassing himself at this point. He's just become an angry old man with a huge clip on his shoulder. He claims Susan Rice is not qualified to be Sec. of State? Why because she gave a briefing on Benghazi and told people exactly what she was told the intel revealed regrading the events? Now he and Senator Graham say she's "in it up to her neck." She's the UN ambassador. What does she have to do with this other then she was around when they we're demanding to speak someone? She gave a presentation based on the intel she was given. This not not make her unqualified for anything. And who is McCain to judge who's qualified of anything? He should never have a say in that matter ever again after picking Sarah Palin to be a heart beat away from the Oval office. The world is getting crazier by the day. Hell yesterday (?) I turn on the tube and they were talking about the Petraeus marital affair scandal who'd they bring on to speak about the morals of it? Newt Gingrich. Seriously Newt Gingrich is the guy you ask about the morals of marital fidelity? Tomorrow I think they're going to have a piece business morals... they'll probably have Bernie Madoff on the phone.

 

It's funny how the uber-conservatives, yes, that would be you Aceventura, call out liberals who have money but they aren't calling out people like Trump, Limbaugh, Romney et al. who spew nothing more than a skewed (there's that word again) version of wealth and conservatism and then claim they are "greedy, capitalist pigs". I also find it funny how anyone can claim to be a fan of Bush2 while spouting anything related to economics while keeping a straight face.

Math - It's only used for liberal bias!

McCain has sidestepped some of the fallout from the Romney campaign but his Benghazi stunts are becoming more Palinesque by the day. His Viagra must be distorting his critical thinking ability.

 

it's all part of the conservative-as-victim game, which is linked to the far-right identity politics that has contributed significantly to breaking down rational political discourse in the us of a, city on a hill, god's favorite.

meanwhile, obama-the-socialist follows the heroic line of the bush people and endorses yet another israeli post-presidential election massacre in gaza. because what's a few more palestinian lives when netanyahu's re-election is in doubt?

 

To me, the way that the Democrats could paint the Republicans as religious extremists and anti-woman was the most striking thing.

Clearly the vast majority of Republicans dont think if you get raped and get pregnant you should think of that as "a gift" or anything like it... but there was enough of these nutters in senior enough positions that it really damaged them.

It just made it so easy for the govt. They dont have to say anything... just point at the guy claiming that women somehow magically dont get pregnant when raped, or the other one, or the other one... and just say "here's what they think about you... this guy is running for high office under their flag..."

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Also, religion shouldnt matter... and I personally am not saying this is my view, but being a Mormon is borderline having a pretty extreme and alternative view of the world spiritually in many people's view. That didnt help the guy much (nor does being a millionaire who has all the allegations of tax avoidance and outsourcing American jobs buzzing around him)

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And also, you have to look at the degree Obama won it rather than Romney lost it.

Same as 2008, when there was a crisis, while Romney looked like a politician struggling for the right spin, Obama looked like a leader who's first response was a human one. It might just be he's better at spinning.... or it might be he is just a more genuine guy, dont follow US politics well enough to know. But when you see Romney reading off a script and Obama out there talking to people who's houses just blew down and even Chris Christie saying he's a good guy, I think a lot of the people who are not really political just think: this is a guy who is actually trying.

 

She is an exceptional person who holds liberal views that appear to be in conflict. If that wasn't clear or still is not let me know.

The question often comes up regarding why not donate the money to government for the government to distribute? The answer is because, even liberal billionaires know, direct giving and oversight of the gifts are more efficient.

No, I just point out a potential conflict and I would like someone to reconcile the conflict. I acknowledge my conflicts and I am more than happy to discuss them, it is the best way for me to work through them. For example I have always been conflicted on the question of abortion - on one side I understand privacy issues and the right to control one's person - on the other there is the issue of the life of the unborn. I don't understand people who are not conflicted. Just like the financial conflicts of making money and being a responsible member of a society - or what is a fair profit? these conflicts are worthy of discussion without some pretending to be morally superior and thinking they have it all figured out.

Very true. But that is why I interact with liberals - I try.
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My problem is with the dynamics of my situation. I thought I had diversity but everything dived at once - business, real-estate, investments, met with increasing costs. I moved in 2006 - in California the real-estate market started its dive in 2006. In NC the real-estate market started its big dive in about 2008. Business started its dive in 2007. The cost of credit for my business went up materially in 2008. Credit availability froze/closed in 2009. I had to go into investments and savings to pay bills and stay in business, so I have not been able to take advantage of the rebound. Etc, Etc. I am basically starting again from scratch. I am not in a panic, but being in my fifty's I will need to make big incomes to make up for time lost - the thought of being taxed at 50% or more is not appealing. Being told I am not doing, have not done my fair share is an insult. As I rebuild, I am going to do it with less reliance on employees - it is not worth it.
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I know there are many factors for an individual's success or failure. when I blame President Obama I am usually specific. For example, when negotiating the bailout for the financial sector, the government allowed banks to shut down their normal lending activities. this put the brakes on loans, lines of credit and other options to finance business growth. Overnight I had lines of credit go from about 6% to over 20%, in other cases the lines closed with 30 days notice, etc. and the President doesn't understand why business is not hiring??? Other than companies like Apple, GE, Amazon, Google, etc., who are sitting on mountains of cash that they don't know what to do with, the rest of us need functioning credit markets.
--- merged: Nov 19, 2012 at 3:34 PM ---

Get real. I am a capitalist. I was born with nothing and I can live in the back seat of my car if I had to, I have made money, lost money and made money again. All I want is a level playing field, and given that I will be fine. In the US today, big business has an advantage, the working poor/middle class have advocates in government and the super rich do what they want. And then there are those who work for government in some capacity, including education, who basically have no real exposure to the problems in the real economy. Just tax the rich, tax the rich some more, and tax them again - who is actually paying these taxes?

 

How is this math. Business owner with 10% profit margin. That mean for every $1 of revenue, $.90 goes to others (trickle down). Oh, and government wants 50% of the 10% profit margin. Don't start a business, don't invest in business growth with your own money - i.e. don't have $.90 of every $1 going to others. If you bought gold in 2008, you would have doubled your money - with no headaches of owning and running a business. Is this what we want? Is business really the enemy?
--- merged: Nov 19, 2012 at 3:47 PM ---

I think that in order for an individual to make billions they have to have very high profit margins. Some would argue excessively high profit margins are exploitative. I normally hear this argument coming form liberals. Do you think there is an inherent conflict when a liberal takes advantage of excessively high profit margins? They could always lower their price or pay their people more or hire more people or give others opportunity in the market, etc, etc.

Or, just say it is me. Tell me it is my imagination regarding this conflict. Tell me I am making it up - and I will drop this line of thinking/quetioning on this forum. I don't want to have to try to persuade anyone on something I think is obvious.

 

If I earn $1 million in profit, based on $2 in revenue and $1 million in employee costs - if I care about my employees educating their children why not increase my employee costs to $1.5 million - meaning my employees get more and my profit is less.

Or,

Why would I net the $1 million in profit and then turn-around and give $500,000 to start a school?

Or,

Why would I net $1 million in profit and advocate for government policy to help people make more money?

I could continue, but if you don't follow it is pointless. Even if I am not articulating the point in the best way, if you can not step back and see the big picture in my point we are going to go around and around in circles.