Slavery in America - is it really happening?

^^^ agreed. Most of the animal farmers I knew growing up treated their stock very well, up to the end. Some milk cows were treated as pets. Modern factory farms are horrible though.

 

Well, if we were actually built to be vegetarians... I know, another thread.

The truth is, as a species, we would not have developed our larger brains, if we had not been eating an animal diet. High protein, and fat. Now, due mainly to processing, etc. we can get the nutrients from a vegetarian lifestyle. Even then we have to supplement vitamins, I'm thinking the B's and D, if I'm not mis-remembering. Highly processed foods, aren't they being touted as no no's, for some reason?

Certain animals are very efficient, due to being natural vegetarians, at processing low quality foods, such as grains, soy, and corn, into more nutritionally dense foods, like meat, that we can easily digest, without lots, and lots of mechanical and chemical processing. Yes, an animal converts plant materials that we couldn't even eat, into tasty, nutritious meat, that we can. This is done throughout the animal kingdom, of which we are citizens. Let's not even get into what happens to the animals when we are directly competing for the food that they would have eaten. ( humans will win this battle, too. we're good at that. they will die, and probably die out altogether )

I commend your trying to reduce suffering, I really do, but you might not be reducing overall suffering, but moving it to other venues, such as more field animals and insects. But they don't have the publicists that pigs have... jk

 

Of course its hamming it up like panto on the side of Peta, but having seen and heard whales in the wild (Bay of Biscay), where they have freedom to be whales with family, its sad that these poor captive performing animals will never know that freedom. Keeping them in a confined space reminds me too much of dogs in crates - some spend their lives with wire under their paws. I do strongly believe in whale sanctuarys, and that every dead whale washed up on shore should be delivered to the lying bastards at the nearest Japanese embassy so they have the corpses for 'scientific research' - added bonus, not having to run massive whalers would greatly lower greenhouse emissions. Everyone a winner. I do go to the circus - but if they have animals its because they are pets, and they do not perform for the public. I find them very entertaining - esp Circus Oz which I saw many many years ago.

 

I think a point has been missed, or dismissed. We cannot directly eat a lot of the things that our food animals can. We cannot get the nutrients out of them that they can. The vegetation that we can easily assimilate, like nuts, fruit, and vegetables require a lot of land, and cultivation ( which by the way, however accidentally kills and mutilates native animals ). These foods are also very vulnerable to changes in climate, whereas grass is not. Modern processing can help us to eat stuff that we normally couldn't, that's nice, but can be problematic health wise. We will either have to eat the animals, or change the 'natural' plants to ones we can digest. This will displace food sources for the animals, whether we like it or not. This will cause those animals to become unnecessary, and a burden/competition to us, whether we like it or not. The world is covered in mostly grass. We can't eat grass, we would die of malnutrition if we tried. Yet, we can gain necessary nutrition from ruminants, which can eat grass. This is the circle of life. We should respect it. Evolution has given us this very efficient, yet fragile interconnected life.

One way or another we are going to cause animals distress and harm. Minimizing suffering is a much more complex problem than a vegan diet can solve. To me, the vegan answer is a simple answer to make people feel better about themselves, than an actual solution to the problem to be addressed.

By the way, some vegs in India use the cows as food processors by eating the fresh cow dung. Predigested grub, yum... Can't eat grass, but you can eat grass fed pooh.

 

I wonder if any of the flesh eating bacteria will form an organization to file a suit for better treatment of humans?

 

Legally, a person doesn't exist until registered (a birth certificate is issued, or a person could qualify for one). But there are laws regarding the murder of a woman and her unborn child. I am intrigued by the idea of Texas executing a corporate "person".
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I'm currently struggling with having the cat that has adopted us castrated. There are some valid reasons for, which I'm pretty sure he would argue against. I've had a vasectomy - would a cat vasectomy be a reasonable compromise?

 

You can have the cats bolloxc removed and implants put in if appearance is the worry. If he has a vasectomy he will still want sex and so will be more likely to fight and fuck and contract feline aids, he would probably also want to scent mark his territory. If he is staying entire, you must be prepared to check his tackle like you do your own for lumps. Hope thats a help.
Pigs are the most effective garbage disposal units. I do have a veggie chum who likes leather shoes. He buys 'death by natural causes' leather shoes.

 

I don't know about "checking his tackle" - he already likes me way to much.

 

I am still coming to grips with how I feel about all this and gathering data, so I'll let this derail go. I do respect your conviction. Maybe I'll join you someday.

 

Shhhh!
Next up PETA sues Raid for genicide of mosquitos

 

I got no argument with you or anyone who is vegan, vegitarian, or otherwise. How/why you chose to live is entirely up to you. I assume that while some would hope that more of us were convertable to their way of thinking, PETA is a stone hanging from their neck.
PETA first came to my attention way back when, when they would throw paint on people's fur coats. Even then it seemed a bit backwards to me. It occured to me then that if someone did that to me I would seek a means to be made whole, ie replacement cost. wouldn't that mean that the deaths of the 25 (arbitrary number cuz I don't know how many makes a coat) minks you wanted to prostest caused the death toll to double?
Seems PETA's aim is for attention to a (given)legitiamte problem, but their method is a turn off.

 

Taking the entire Tom out of the picture (if he has sprayed, use bio soap powder to wash walls down - anything amonia based and you are setting up a feline water sports session as he outmarks the invader), are you into like 'free Willy'. De they belong in Parks? Large fish in small bowl.
We were going to start up tapeworm rescue one april first, see how many supporters we got. Forest pigs in India live on people poop. Hole on veranda, pigs roaming underneath - Q. Would you want to eat pork fed on your poop?