Fifty Shades of Choad: 9er and Baraka do chick lit crit

snowy · Aug 22, 2012

100 pages later...my head hurts.

All I can think about is lip-biting, English Breakfast tea, the odd moments where E.L. James uses British terms like "keen" and "smart" in ways that we don't use, and the vague citrusy smell of the playroom.

I want a playroom.

shanifaye · Aug 30, 2012

MeltedMetalGlob said: ↑

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THIS is awesome.....sigh good god I love that man
--- merged: Aug 23, 2012 12:09 PM ---

snowy said: ↑

100 pages later...my head hurts.

All I can think about is lip-biting, English Breakfast tea, the odd moments where E.L. James uses British terms like "keen" and "smart" in ways that we don't use, and the vague citrusy smell of the playroom.

I want a playroom.
Click to expand...

We have one....I now call it the plaid room of pain (though it doesnt smell like citrus lol)

Speed_Gibson · Aug 30, 2012

shanifaye said: ↑

THIS is awesome.....sigh good god I love that man
--- merged: Aug 23, 2012 at 8:09 AM ---

We have one....I now call it the plaid room of pain (though it doesnt smell like citrus lol)
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So are you saying that Hans Gruber jumped out of that window rather than finish those books?
I could almost try this if I could get the books without paying for them.

shanifaye · Aug 23, 2012

No actually what I meant was that I'd listen to him read even this pile of crap!!

Random McRandom · Aug 23, 2012

Yup.

Speed_Gibson · Aug 23, 2012

Just made this for an upcoming PS contest, seems appropriate enough for this thread. Source picture was the wagon with an umbrella on the front of it.

cynthetiq · Aug 24, 2012

Japchae · Aug 25, 2012

Glory's Sun said: ↑

Yup.

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Seriously, I freaking laughed until I had another asthma attack. Hilarious!!

Freetofly · Aug 25, 2012

Glory's Sun said: ↑

Yup.

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Geez, I never got mother days presents that came to me. I can't stop laughing, reminds me of a time when...lol I can't write it. lol

snowy · Aug 27, 2012

So, 9er has done a great job of summarizing the plot up to this point. I'm going to leave that to him. He's much better at it than I could ever dream of being.

One thing I really have a problem with is how the author never develops a sense of space. We're told some basic facts about each place we're put in--it's luxurious, it's simple, it's clean. We're not really told anything that puts us in that place, that lets us develop our own sense of what the space is like. I find this problematic, and it put me in mind of a piece I read recently by the great authoress Diana Gabaldon on how to write a good sex scene.

HOW TO WRITE SEX SCENES

Posted on July 23, 2012 10:52 AM

HOW TO WRITE SEX SCENES

Copyright 2012 Diana Gabaldon

[This is a short piece that I wrote on request for a Canadian magazine called Chatelaine, earlier this year. I have the reprint rights back, though, and since a Twitter acquaintance recently expressed a desire to “write smut”—I thought I’d at least provide him with the basics.]
Where most beginning writers screw up (you should pardon the expression) is in thinking that sex scenes are about sex. A good sex scene is about the exchange of emotions, not bodily fluids. That being so, it can encompass any emotion whatever, from rage or desolation to exultation, tenderness, or surprise.
Lust is not an emotion; it’s a one-dimensional hormonal response. Ergo, while you can mention lust in a sex-scene, describing it at any great length is like going on about the pattern of the wall-paper in the bedroom. Worth a quick glance, maybe, but essentially boring.
So how do you show the exchange of emotions? Dialogue, expression, or action—that’s about the limit of your choices, and of those, dialogue is by far the most flexible and powerful tool a writer has. What people say reveals the essence of their character.
Example:

_“I know once is enough to make it legal, but…” He paused shyly.
“You want to do it again?”
“Would ye mind verra much?”
I didn’t laugh this time, either, but I felt my ribs creak under the strain.
“No,” I said gravely. “I wouldn’t mind.”_
Now, you do, of course, want to make the scene vivid and three-dimensional. You have an important advantage when dealing with sex, insofar as you can reasonably expect that most of your audience knows how it’s done. Ergo, you can rely on this commonality of experience, and don’t need more than brief references to create a mental picture.
You want to anchor the scene with physical details, but by and large, it’s better to use sensual details, rather than overtly sexual ones. (Just read any scene that involves a man licking a woman’s nipples and you’ll see what I mean. Either the writer goes into ghastly contortions to avoid using the word “nipples”—“tender pink crests” comes vividly to mind—or does it in blunt and hideous detail, so that you can all but hear the slurping. This is Distracting. Don’t Do That.)
So how _do_ you make a scene vivid, but not revoltingly so? There’s a little trick called the Rule of Three: if you use any three of the five senses, it will make the scene immediately three-dimensional. (Many people use only sight and sound. Include smell, taste, touch, and you’re in business.)
Example:
_The road was narrow, and they jostled against one another now and then, blinded between the dark wood and the brilliance of the rising moon. He could hear Jamie’s breath, or thought he could—it seemed part of the soft wind that touched his face. He could smell Jamie, smell the musk of his body, the dried sweat and dust in his clothes, and felt suddenly wolf-like and feral, longing changed to outright hunger.
He wanted._
In essence, a good sex scene is usually a dialogue scene with physical details.
Example:
_”I’ll give it to ye,” he murmured, and his hand moved lightly. A touch. Another. “But ye’ll take it from me tenderly, a nighean donn.”
“I don’t want tenderness, damn you!”
“I ken that well enough,” he said, with a hint of grimness. “But it’s what ye’ll have, like it or not.”
He laid me down on his kilt, and came back into me, strongly enough that I gave a small, high-pitched cry of relief.
“Ask me to your bed,” he said. “I shall come to ye. For that matter–I shall come, whether ye ask it or no. But I am your man; I serve ye as I will.”_
And finally, you can use metaphor and lyricism to address the emotional atmosphere of an encounter directly. This is kind of advanced stuff, though.
Example:
_He’d meant to be gentle. Very gentle. Had planned it with care, worrying each step of the long way home. She was broken; he must go canny, take his time. Be careful in gluing back her shattered bits.
And then he came to her and discovered that she wished no part of gentleness, of courting. She wished directness. Brevity and violence. If she was broken, she would slash him with her jagged edges, reckless as a drunkard with a shattered bottle.
She raked his back; he felt the scrape of broken nails, and thought dimly that was good–she’d fought. That was the last of his thought; his own fury took him then, rage and a lust that came on him like black thunder on a mountain, a cloud that hid all from him and him from all, so that kind familiarity was lost and he was alone, strange in darkness._
Like that.
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Further, James tends to avoid using explicit language to help us picture what's going on, and it's jarring to be reading through a scene and see italics about how he touched her down there. As 9er has said, the character of Ana is pretty unrealistic. She's absolutely untouched at 21 in 2011. Puhleeeeze. There is a laundry list of euphemisms to choose from to refer to female parts; down there does not need to be one of them. Reading about Ana's adventures makes me feel as if I've stepped in some kind of sexual timewarp in which sex is something to be ashamed of again, strictly because of the way James writes the exchange. Unlike a scene from Diana Gabaldon, James' interactions between her characters seems unrealistic and one-dimensional.

One thing that really, really, REALLY drives me crazy in this book is how obvious it is that she has never been to the Pacific Northwest. As a PacNWer, there are particular things in this novel that I find jerk me out of the story when she is discussing particulars. For example, apparently Mr. Grey has given a great deal of money to help develop the "farming" division at Washington State University-Vancouver. Um, it's not called farming in academics--it's called agriculture, and WSU-Vancouver doesn't do ag. The main campus in Pullman does. I realize this is nitpicky, but at the same time, less than 5 minutes of Internet research would have revealed the truth. WSU-Vancouver is also not a residential university--most people don't go there specifically--they go there because they live in Vancouver or Portland already and are willing to commute. They'd go to WSU or UW for the stereotypical 4-year collegiate experience, or one of the smaller state schools--Western, Central, Eastern, or Evergreen State. This really bugged me as someone familiar with Washington State's university system.

Her editor didn't even bother to edit out certain British turns of phrase. We'll get to more on that later.

I can quite frankly say that not a single bit of this has aroused me. Seriously. I'm disappointed. There is bad fanfiction out there more arousing, more sexually appealing than this. It's not erotic. It's shameful.

Plan9 · Aug 28, 2012

Thanks for coming aboard, Snowy. Your perspective is greatly appreciated.

Snowy said:

One thing I really have a problem with is how the author never develops a sense of space. We're told some basic facts about each place we're put in—it is luxurious, it's simple, it's clean. We're not really told anything that puts us in that place, which lets us develop our own sense of what the space is like. I find this problematic, and it put me in mind of a piece I read recently by the great authoress Diana Gabaldon on how to write a good sex scene.
Click to expand...

I concur. There is a disconnected feeling about the book as it applies to the various locations. They’re all separate pods of immaculate rooms, perhaps in different dimensions. The author doesn’t really talk about there being any other humans on the planet aside from when they’re used to show the wealth and power of Grey or they’re dispensing muffins and breakfast tea. Exception would be Ana’s friend, Kate, and Grey’s brother, Elliott, which the author has painted as far more interesting characters than the two leads. Unless you’ve got a hankering for a pretty boy with a damaged soul, you want Elliott. If you’re a guy, you want Kate. Kate’s fucked before. She knows what she’s doing. She’s loud, she’s fun.

Diana Gabaldon is probably 289% better at writing sex scenes than I am but I’ll nitpick a little: As a man with a needy penis, I can’t really relate to colorful romance novel language like “his roiling lust came over him like black thunder down a purple mountain.” First off, that flowery prose sounds like a Ronnie James Dio song. Second, thunder doesn’t have a color. And third, too much of this language makes me feel like I’m trying to jerk off while staring at a Lisa and Frank folder. Given the stereotypical differences between the type and manner in which men and women “consume” pornography, it seems that you’re often writing for one or the other but probably not both. Just my perspective.

Snowy said:

Further, James tends to avoid using explicit language to help us picture what's going on, and it's jarring to be reading through a scene and see italics about how he touched her down there. As 9er has said, the character of Ana is pretty unrealistic. She's absolutely untouched at 21 in 2011. Puhleeeeze. There is a laundry list of euphemisms to choose from to refer to female parts; down there does not need to be one of them. Reading about Ana's adventures makes me feel as if I've stepped in some kind of sexual timewarp in which sex is something to be ashamed of again, strictly because of the way James writes the exchange. Unlike a scene from Diana Gabaldon, James' interactions between her characters seems unrealistic and one-dimensional.
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Yeah, I don’t get the childish vocabulary in a Bondage Lite novel. If you can’t say tits, cock and pussy… at least from Grey’s mouth as the dominating male beast character… you’re not being as coarse as would make sense given the topic. And the fact that the author is referring to Ana’s ass as her bottom only reinforces our image of her being a child. Given the aforementioned mix-up about whether or not Grey gives a shit about Ana's level of sexual experience, I'm having a difficult time keeping it hard downstairs.

Snowy said:

One thing that really, really, REALLY drives me crazy in this book is how obvious it is that she has never been to the Pacific Northwest. As a PacNWer, there are particular things in this novel that I find jerk me out of the story when she is discussing particulars. For example, apparently Mr. Grey has given a great deal of money to help develop the "farming" division at Washington State University-Vancouver. Um, it's not called farming in academics--it's called agriculture, and WSU-Vancouver doesn't do ag. The main campus in Pullman does. I realize this is nitpicky, but at the same time, less than 5 minutes of Internet research would have revealed the truth. WSU-Vancouver is also not a residential university--most people don't go there specifically--they go there because they live in Vancouver or Portland already and are willing to commute. They'd go to WSU or UW for the stereotypical 4-year collegiate experience, or one of the smaller state schools--Western, Central, Eastern, or Evergreen State. This really bugged me as someone familiar with Washington State's university system.
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Yeah, why use real locations at all? If you’re trying to be legit, Wikipedia is all you need to clear up those little mentioned-once-never-again details that girls like Snowy are gonna write a paragraph about later. Whenever I’m bored enough to attempt mediocre fiction, I like to use made-up stuff… throw a New or St. in front of another word (“New Purcell” or “St. Danzig”) and create myself a blank city that I’m free to paint any way I please as I progress. I don’t have to worry about it being inaccurate because it’s mine.

Snowy said:

Her editor didn't even bother to edit out certain British turns of phrase. We'll get to more on that later.
Click to expand...

Honestly, I barely registered them. Didn’t throw me off. Given the cosmopolitan nature of today's trash readers, I’d imagine a lot of people just thought it was cutesy talk… like referring to her virgin vag as her inner goddess or whatever. "She sucked his nubbly wubbin until he splorted!"

Snowy said:

I can quite frankly say that not a single bit of this has aroused me. Seriously. I'm disappointed. There is bad fanfiction out there more arousing, more sexually appealing than this. It's not erotic. It's shameful.
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Says the girl that writes tentacle porn! I challenge you to a duel, white female ninja from town!

snowy · Aug 28, 2012

Plan9 said: ↑

Honestly, I barely registered them. Didn’t throw me off. Given the cosmopolitan nature of today's trash readers, I’d imagine a lot of people just thought it was cutesy talk… like referring to her virgin vag as her inner goddess or whatever. "She sucked his nubbly wubbin until he splorted!"
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If you want real British writing with all of the naughty bits, read some Kathy Lette. I suppose that is one of the reasons it bugs me--I've read a great deal of literature (of all varieties) that uses British English. Here, it's as if she is caught between two worlds. I wonder how many American readers wondered WTF a marquee was when she referred to it during the graduation scene, as our usage of the word doesn't particularly fit with the context.

Also, it bugs me that Ana is portrayed as someone who has never been drunk before when they go out to the bar to celebrate, yet she and Kate and she and Christian keep drinking all of the time. White wine, red wine, Cosmos...This sudden change in behavior is not consistent and not realistic.

Plan9 · Sep 4, 2012

Hey.

Sorry for the delay in 50 Shades posts.

I've been busy and haven't really been in the mood to hear myself talk on a forum full of strangers lately.

Fear not... I'll get back to our regularly scheduled smut soon.

Speed_Gibson · Sep 5, 2012

Plan9 said: ↑

Hey.

Sorry for the delay in 50 Shades posts.

I've been busy and haven't really been in the mood to hear myself talk on a forum full of strangers lately.

Fear not... I'll get back to our regularly scheduled smut soon.
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We might have to dock your hazard pay with all of these delays in posts. the_jazz has been mailing your checks* for this right?
*"checks" meaning pictures not safe for anyone breathing

Freetofly · Sep 5, 2012

Plan9 said: ↑

Hey.

Sorry for the delay in 50 Shades posts.

I've been busy and haven't really been in the mood to hear myself talk on a forum full of strangers lately.

Fear not... I'll get back to our regularly scheduled smut soon.
Click to expand...

Yay! It's worth the wait.

shanifaye · Sep 6, 2012

Plan9 said: ↑

Hey.

Sorry for the delay in 50 Shades posts.

I've been busy and haven't really been in the mood to hear myself talk on a forum full of strangers lately.

Fear not... I'll get back to our regularly scheduled smut soon.
Click to expand...

I gave you a pass because of Dragon Con (and I hope your ears were burning cause man oh man did LE and I talk about you !! ) but DC is over, and Im not as sick as I have been the last several days....Im ready for my smut!!

Plan9 · Sep 6, 2012

shanifaye said: ↑

(and I hope your ears were burning cause man oh man did LE and I talk about you !! )
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Ergh, what could you possibly talk about?

It's pretty obvious that my supermassive black hole-like TFP presence is a result of my total lack of a real life.

Lordeden probably just went on and on about how awesome my couch is... because it is.

shanifaye · Sep 6, 2012

lol Yes, your couch was mentioned

the_jazz · Sep 6, 2012

Plan9 said: ↑

Ergh, what could you possibly talk about?
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I think that you've completely underestimated the amount of time people can talk about what a tool you are.

ZombieSquirrel · Sep 6, 2012

the_jazz said: ↑

I think that you've completely underestimated the amount of time people can talk about what a tool you are.
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Oh my god Pot! Tell me more about that Kettle being black!

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Fifty Shades of Choad: 9er and Baraka do chick lit crit

snowy so kawaii Staff Member

shanifaye Dominissive

Speed_Gibson Hacking the Gibson

shanifaye Dominissive

Random McRandom Starry Eyed

Speed_Gibson Hacking the Gibson

cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

Japchae Very Tilted

Freetofly Diving deep into the abyss

snowy so kawaii Staff Member

Plan9 Rock 'n Roll

snowy so kawaii Staff Member

Plan9 Rock 'n Roll

Speed_Gibson Hacking the Gibson

Freetofly Diving deep into the abyss

shanifaye Dominissive

Plan9 Rock 'n Roll

shanifaye Dominissive

the_jazz Accused old lady puncher

ZombieSquirrel Brrrrrrrains

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Fifty Shades of Choad: 9er and Baraka do chick lit crit

snowy so kawaii Staff Member

shanifaye Dominissive

Speed_Gibson Hacking the Gibson

shanifaye Dominissive

Random McRandom Starry Eyed

Speed_Gibson Hacking the Gibson

cynthetiq Administrator Staff Member Donor

Japchae Very Tilted

Freetofly Diving deep into the abyss

snowy so kawaii Staff Member

Plan9 Rock 'n Roll

snowy so kawaii Staff Member

Plan9 Rock 'n Roll

Speed_Gibson Hacking the Gibson

Freetofly Diving deep into the abyss

shanifaye Dominissive

Plan9 Rock 'n Roll

shanifaye Dominissive

the_jazz Accused old lady puncher

ZombieSquirrel Brrrrrrrains

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