Politics Ferguson

Do you have a leader you report to? Is there someone teaching you how to be white? Or are you an individual who processes information from different sources, blends them in with your personal experiences, and then makes a decision?

 

/you're a public servant, you should know how dumb the average Joe of any skin color is

/goes for every group

 

no, i've been on this forum for i think 10 years or so and donated. your post is pure race baiting and has nothing to do with the topic.

 

In my 2.5 years on the job, I have not generated a single complaint. I think it's because my attitude is that most people aren't bad, but a lot of people make really bad decisions. I know I have in my life. So I treat people with respect. I treated my neighbor very courteously when taking him to jail on an outstanding warrant. He only lives a few hundred yards from me.

 

grats to you for being an amazing cop, this thread has nothing to do with that.

 

So your time on the forum means what, exactly? Still doesn't change what you said. I was trying to offer some advice on why what you said was a racist statement. But I guess black leaders need to teach their people how to be more civilized in mixed company. Since I voted for Obama twice, does that make me a race traitor?

 

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it means i'm not just trolling i've been here awhile. i dont care what race you are are if you voted obama twice you have issues.

 

Really not sure what that has to do with the thread but okay.

What people are trying to say to you is that you are making a racist assumption.
Now does that mean that you are a bad person?
Or that everything you say is trolling?
No.
Just that you made a statement that was on its face not of value and made you look bad.

As I said the people who are out marching now, in general, are not the ones causing the damage and many people are volunteering to clean up.
You don't see that on the news so much because it isn't as exciting.
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Along those same lines is the rumors that spread suggesting that Captain Ron Johnson was flashing gang signs.

Those aren't gang signs | MSNBC

I'm sorry but how can anyone be stupid enough to believe this?
Or are they racist?

Because from my point of view it has to be one or the other.

 

Remember the Mulford Act? The NRA is all for gun control when they're controlling the right people.

And yet simultaneously often carried out by agents provocateur in order to justify the ensuing violent crackdown. Really we don't even need the protestors at this point, the police can just skip straight to beating the shit out of people.

More people are punched to death than killed by rifles and shotguns combined. Bullshit, meet facts.

 

You're a police officer, correct? Do you think you read the article without confirmation bias? With all due respect, I doubt it.

My reading is that the officer is saying "Yeah, I try not to kill people, but I could totally justify killing you for disobeying me." And he's right. Police officers can get away with murder, and they do. The laws are written to make it harder to convict them, they often work with or for the very organization that's responsible for investigation and they work with the prosecutors responsible for bring the case to court, should the case even go to court, they have more credibility with jurors, etc. All this can add up to impunity.

All the cool departments get to use the same tear gas that Bahrain uses on their protestors.


Everyone who doubts that racism is a factor in how this situation is interpreted need only to look to samcol. Racist, proud of it. Would fight for the rights of Ferguson to protest, except they're not white, so state violence against them is automatically justified. Oh, but if you point out that he's racist, you're an asshole for playing the race card.

 

Relevant:

Dat mentality.

 

Missouri has a lovely state motto 'Salus populi suprema lex esto'
'
'The welfare of the people shall be the supreme law'. The irony.

 

He should have added, don't ask for my badge number or my name, don't try to take my picture, don't get on the phone to call for help, don't try to tell them you have epilepsy, diabetes, autism, or are deaf, and most of all don't try to act like an equal.

I know there are good police.
Hell, I know there are great police.
I watched a group of them talk a kid who had killed his mother and was waving a gun around in the middle of the street into putting the gun down and giving up.
By rights, they could have shot him full of holes but they didn't.
He had a psychotic break, had a history of them I guess and it finally caught up to the family.
I knew people who went to to school with him and said he was good kid till he got to be about 17 and then everything got bad.
But the APD, even though he was armed and had killed someone, they didn't kill him.
That's good policing.

 

From Criminal Procedure Guidelines and Officer Field Manual:

Conducting the Stop:

B: Use of Force
If the suspect refuses to obey your command or request to stop, or if the suspect indicates by his actions or words that he will not stay with you while you undertake your investigation, you may use the least forceful means necessary to detain him.

However, if you have articulable reason to fear for your safety, drawing your gun or using your handcuffs will not automatically turn the stop into an arrest. If you do use such measures, however, be prepared to show in court that you had articulable reasons to fear for your safety.

If you are attacked, you may of course use a reasonable amount of force to defend yourself.

This is for a stop, based on reasonable suspicion. Not probable cause, not an arrest.

Redravin, you are usually not that patronizing. I know there are good people. Hell, I know there are great people. I watched a group of them walking down the street without breaking any laws. That's good citizens. Oh, except I'm also a citizen. And I'm also subject to the same laws. And I have sworn to uphold the constitution. And I actually have more restrictions on my actions in many ways.

 

Relevant:

Excellent case study book on the types of police officers (good, bad, ugly) and the approaches they have to various law enforcement situations

 

Sorry @omega. didn't mean to come across as patronizing.
I was actually trying to say that Ferguson, and some of the other extreme militarization of the police, isn't a fair characterization.
But you're right it does come across that way.

The problem, at least to me, is that the worst of the bunch get all the press and when you do your job right it doesn't get any coverage because, after all, that's your job.

Our society has a love, hate, relationship with the police that makes these kinds of conversations very difficult.
The vastly different way that people of different races and classes see the police doesn't help that conversation much either.

 

Pretty sure an excerpt from am employee handbook doesn't constitute much of anything in the way of evidence for how police officers act in reality.

 

Thanks, I appreciate it. One reason for the militarization of the police is that it saves lives. In the 70's the felony death rate of police officers was around 120 per year. In the 90's, that number had dropped to 69 per year. The tradeoff is a shift in how police react. We are taught to be suspicious of everything, to never let our guard down. To be hypervigilant. Because, any individual encounter could turn ugly. You just don't know who you are contacting. Because of that, we tend to exercise as much control over a situation as possible. To both find out what's going on, and to ensure our safety.
Also, there is often a legal precedent for everything we do. I have to frisk everyone the same. I don't need a woman to accuse me of groping her, end then have an attorney find five previous women to testify that I did not search them. I need to be uniform in all my actions.
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You have an employee handbook. I have POLICY. And the law. Both of which are admissable in court. Is your employee handbook pored over by a judge? Can deviations from your employee handbook leave you hanging in court?

You might be taken more seriously if you acknowledged that it's some police officers that are violating constitutional rights, not the majority or all.

BTW, I posted that to show that the police do indeed have the right to stop you, based on reasonable suspicion that a crime has or is about to occur. And that the courts support our ability to enforce those decisions with physical force. So it's not just policy, it is case law.