Belt Fed M16/AR15 Upper - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Exodus · 08-24-2003, 10:37 AM

If I only had 3G's to drop on this bad mamah jammah!
http://www.guntech.com/shrike/

dimbulb · 08-24-2003, 11:10 AM

Whats the rate of fire on this gun? If its anything like the M16, not so hot. You don't want too high a rate of fire on a support weapon.

No bipod. Thats no good at all. For SAW's you definitely need a bipod, in order to give accurate and sustainable fire.

Barrel doesn't look changable. Another strike against it. Try firing off a few belts off a machine gun, and it'll glow in the dark, and the barrel will droop after a while. Perhaps not that big a deal on a SAW, but it would be nice. Hmm... it looks changable, but looks like you'll need asbestos gloves (ala the M60) again, not so good in the heat of combat. Handles on the barrels are a GOOD thing.

A. Rothschild · 08-24-2003, 11:34 PM

The compactness of this firearm looks attractive. But as dimbulb wrote, the heat can be a problem unless you only intend to use it in sibiria.

It would probably be a nice weapon to use in inner cities, due to it's small size and large magazine capacity. I mean: with this baby running, you could keep people away from a street for a while. I wonder what the accuracy is...?

Oblivion437 · 08-25-2003, 09:31 PM

Actually Dimbulb, the whole point of a high ROF is for engaging a moving target which, in the case of a Squad Automatic Weapon is not, at least not according to US Doctrine a necessity made applicable through a high ROF. You want to clip guys down effectively on the move? Use an MG-3 or MG-42. They spit the lead out at 1200 shots per minute! For GPMG purposes, that generally gives you an 8 shot trigger burst. There's a powerful psychological effect given off by such a rate. It terrified US GI's into submission in France and Germany, you'd be scared of just *Ziiiiiiiiiip* and then blood and parts flying every which way.

dimbulb · 08-27-2003, 08:55 AM

hmmm.. true, and cyclic doesn't equate to the actual sustained rate of fire, as long as you have a well trained gunner that fires in bursts. It looks like it might have a regulator as well.

So does this fire from a closed or open bolt position? Closed bolt, after sustained firing, will lead to cook-offs, where the rounds fire by themselves due to the excessively hot chamber. BAD.

Oblivion437 · 09-06-2003, 03:39 PM

Actually, it's open bolt (the difference confused me for a while) that's prone to cook-offs in an overheat. Closed (which requires the bolt move forward, and enclose the chamber completely) can also cook, but you'd be spitting lots of lead out of the barrel to be sure.

Closed bolt is a little bit complex.

___| bolt in forward position

_| bolt travelling back

|=== bolt all the way back, fresh cartridge is fed

_|== travelling back

Open bolt is far simpler:

|=== Cartridge ready
*EJECT*
|=== Cartridge ready

The bolt never actually moves. The mechanism is usually spurred elsewhere, but the rate of fire is more easily made higher due to the fact that the mechanisms are prepared in advance. It's rather dangerous and prone to safety hazards.

debaser · 09-06-2003, 04:20 PM

The bolt certainly does move on an open bolt system.

The open/closed bolt simply refers to the position the bolt is held in when the weapon is not being fired.

Closed bolts cook rounds because the round sits in the chamber while waiting to be fired.

Open bolt weapons do not cook rounds off, but have the different problem of running away if the sear is broken. Of course to stop them is a simple matter of removing the magazine or breaking the belt.

Oblivion437 · 09-06-2003, 04:32 PM

Ah, yes... I was wrong. Still, the Open bolt system is heavily accident prone. Anyone who's fired a TEC-9 or a Thompson M-1A1 will tell you. The fact is, aside from a secondary safety device of some kind, the weapon is already in the position to fire when you load a magazine.

debaser · 09-06-2003, 04:41 PM

That is true.

cluster · 09-30-2003, 11:00 PM

the point to the shirk was to give a low cost belt fed to people with transferable form 4 M16 machine guns...

yes there is the m249 saw.. but the cost for a civie transferanble is $70,000 and thats for a presample !!!
http://www.subguns.com/classifieds/i...uery=retrieval

so the shirke is indid a great idea...

nevermind thats about 1 yr past the release dates .. people are still happilyly waiting for when ever it actually comes out.

G5_Todd · 10-11-2003, 11:44 AM

that is so badass

08-24-2003, 10:37 AM	#1 (permalink)
Exodus Psycho	Belt Fed M16/AR15 Upper If I only had 3G's to drop on this bad mamah jammah! http://www.guntech.com/shrike/

08-24-2003, 11:34 PM	#3 (permalink)
A. Rothschild Upright Location: Denmark	The compactness of this firearm looks attractive. But as dimbulb wrote, the heat can be a problem unless you only intend to use it in sibiria. It would probably be a nice weapon to use in inner cities, due to it's small size and large magazine capacity. I mean: with this baby running, you could keep people away from a street for a while. I wonder what the accuracy is...? __________________ Go to Heaven for the climate, Hell for company.

09-06-2003, 04:20 PM	#7 (permalink)
debaser Sir, I have a plan... Location: 38S NC20943324	The bolt certainly does move on an open bolt system. The open/closed bolt simply refers to the position the bolt is held in when the weapon is not being fired. Closed bolts cook rounds because the round sits in the chamber while waiting to be fired. Open bolt weapons do not cook rounds off, but have the different problem of running away if the sear is broken. Of course to stop them is a simple matter of removing the magazine or breaking the belt. __________________ Fortunato became immured to the sound of the trowel after a while.

09-06-2003, 04:41 PM	#9 (permalink)
debaser Sir, I have a plan... Location: 38S NC20943324	That is true. __________________ Fortunato became immured to the sound of the trowel after a while.

09-30-2003, 11:00 PM	#10 (permalink)
cluster Upright	the point to the shirk was to give a low cost belt fed to people with transferable form 4 M16 machine guns... yes there is the m249 saw.. but the cost for a civie transferanble is $70,000 and thats for a presample !!! http://www.subguns.com/classifieds/i...uery=retrieval so the shirke is indid a great idea... nevermind thats about 1 yr past the release dates .. people are still happilyly waiting for when ever it actually comes out. Last edited by cluster; 09-30-2003 at 11:07 PM..

08-24-2003, 11:10 AM	#2 (permalink)
dimbulb Riiiiight........	Whats the rate of fire on this gun? If its anything like the M16, not so hot. You don't want too high a rate of fire on a support weapon. No bipod. Thats no good at all. For SAW's you definitely need a bipod, in order to give accurate and sustainable fire. Barrel doesn't look changable. Another strike against it. Try firing off a few belts off a machine gun, and it'll glow in the dark, and the barrel will droop after a while. Perhaps not that big a deal on a SAW, but it would be nice. Hmm... it looks changable, but looks like you'll need asbestos gloves (ala the M60) again, not so good in the heat of combat. Handles on the barrels are a GOOD thing.

08-25-2003, 09:31 PM	#4 (permalink)
Oblivion437 Upright	Actually Dimbulb, the whole point of a high ROF is for engaging a moving target which, in the case of a Squad Automatic Weapon is not, at least not according to US Doctrine a necessity made applicable through a high ROF. You want to clip guys down effectively on the move? Use an MG-3 or MG-42. They spit the lead out at 1200 shots per minute! For GPMG purposes, that generally gives you an 8 shot trigger burst. There's a powerful psychological effect given off by such a rate. It terrified US GI's into submission in France and Germany, you'd be scared of just Ziiiiiiiiiip and then blood and parts flying every which way.

08-27-2003, 08:55 AM	#5 (permalink)
dimbulb Riiiiight........	hmmm.. true, and cyclic doesn't equate to the actual sustained rate of fire, as long as you have a well trained gunner that fires in bursts. It looks like it might have a regulator as well. So does this fire from a closed or open bolt position? Closed bolt, after sustained firing, will lead to cook-offs, where the rounds fire by themselves due to the excessively hot chamber. BAD.

09-06-2003, 03:39 PM	#6 (permalink)
Oblivion437 Upright	Actually, it's open bolt (the difference confused me for a while) that's prone to cook-offs in an overheat. Closed (which requires the bolt move forward, and enclose the chamber completely) can also cook, but you'd be spitting lots of lead out of the barrel to be sure. Closed bolt is a little bit complex. ___\| bolt in forward position _\| bolt travelling back \|=== bolt all the way back, fresh cartridge is fed _\|== travelling back Open bolt is far simpler: \|=== Cartridge ready EJECT \|=== Cartridge ready The bolt never actually moves. The mechanism is usually spurred elsewhere, but the rate of fire is more easily made higher due to the fact that the mechanisms are prepared in advance. It's rather dangerous and prone to safety hazards.

09-06-2003, 04:32 PM	#8 (permalink)
Oblivion437 Upright	Ah, yes... I was wrong. Still, the Open bolt system is heavily accident prone. Anyone who's fired a TEC-9 or a Thompson M-1A1 will tell you. The fact is, aside from a secondary safety device of some kind, the weapon is already in the position to fire when you load a magazine.

10-11-2003, 11:44 AM	#11 (permalink)
G5_Todd Junkie Location: Reichstag	that is so badass __________________ "....and when you men get home and face an anti-war protester, look him in the eyes and shake his hand. Then, wink at his girlfriend, because she knows she's dating a pussy." -General Franks