Glory's Sun

So I'm in the market for a new television. I'll probably wait until a couple weeks after Black Friday as last years data showed the name brands went on sale around that time. So I have an LCD TV already.. it's a decent Vizio. However, I'm in the market for a larger one now. I'm torn between a plasma and the new LEDs.

Now before everyone says that plasmas are old hat blah blah blah.. I want to state that this thread isn't for fanboi posts, it's for people who want to talk about differences in tv's and which is best for them.

I know that Plasma seems to have better blacks than lcds.. but the lcds have a better viewing angle and crisper colors. I usually watch tv in a dimly lit room, so the plasma will look great in those lighting conditions. I just don't know which way to go at this point. Samsung has a great 55" LED lcd, but Panasonic makes some awesome..and I mean AWESOME plasma sets that are quite a bit cheaper than the LED price points.

So let's hear the pros and cons of both LCD and Plasma. You can help me decide which way to go, and you can show off your expert technical knowledge.

I know there are other threads around here on the subject, but I'm in a bit of a rush and don't have time to search.

Redlemon

I went LED (47") when I purchased last year. While they say that burn-in is no longer an issue, I'm not going to stretch the SD content to fit, so I didn't want to even think about burn-in.

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MexicanOnABike

I own a plasma 42 Panasonic. Awesome quality in everything. I wouldn't go with anything else for now. the only problem is like Redlemon said: "burn in can still happen in plasma so my basic cable does have to be stretched. I don't care. MY actual enjoyment is my PS3 or full widescreen movies.

For power consumptions, i wish i went with an LCD or led TV.

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Glory's Sun

I don't view much of anything in SD, so stretching isn't much of a concern for me. I mostly watch movies, and with a blueray player I don't have to worry with the stretching. If I do watch television it's almost always broadcast HD stuff.

I'm curious on the power consumption statement MexicanOnABike.. are the plasmas really that bad?

Baraka_Guru

I'm still stuck in sub-30"-CRT land.

Buying a TV is getting as involved as buying a computer nowadays.

However, if I had to choose between plasma and LCD, I'd go with the latter.

http://reviews.cnet.com/green-tech/tv-power-efficiency/

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Glory's Sun

I just like that the plasmas are better for movies.. the dark scenes are so much crisper on a plasma.. but.. I hate the viewing angles sometimes. The dimmer the light the better the plasma looks.. and I know I'm about sick of walking into stores and seeing people who don't know how to properly adjust the settings on nice tvs.

thanks baraka, I'm looking at that now.

Baraka_Guru

Just bear in mind that a plasma TV at 55" would be like running a second full-sized refrigerator/freezer (or worse?) in terms of power consumption. But at least you can shut it off.

__________________
Knowing that death is certain and that the time of death is uncertain, what's the most important thing?
—Bhikkhuni Pema Chödrön

Humankind cannot bear very much reality.
—From "Burnt Norton," Four Quartets (1936), T. S. Eliot

Glory's Sun

damn.

that's a lot of energy for a tv.

Leto

is it? does a fridge really consume a lot? I thought they were pretty good.

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Baraka_Guru

Yes, refrigerators are energy hogs, partly because they are drawing power 24/7. They turn electricity into cold. Think about that for a while. This why air conditioners are energy hogs too. Your fridge can take up to as much as 10% of your home energy consumption, which is pretty crazy for a single appliance. This includes comparisons to energy consumption required for heating/cooling, electronics, water heater, lighting, etc.

__________________
Knowing that death is certain and that the time of death is uncertain, what's the most important thing?
—Bhikkhuni Pema Chödrön

Humankind cannot bear very much reality.
—From "Burnt Norton," Four Quartets (1936), T. S. Eliot

Glory's Sun

well looking at the chart BG posted, some of the better plasmas can cost anywhere from $39-50+ yearly in energy..

the LCDs are MUCH lower. Some of the plasmas were in the hundreds of dollars..while it's not that big of a deal, I don't want to bleed money where I don't have to.

Baraka_Guru

Maybe you could set up solar panels and thermal capacitors in your living room around the TV to capture any energy bi-products to feed back into the grid.

__________________
Knowing that death is certain and that the time of death is uncertain, what's the most important thing?
—Bhikkhuni Pema Chödrön

Humankind cannot bear very much reality.
—From "Burnt Norton," Four Quartets (1936), T. S. Eliot

Glory's Sun

how about a flux capacitor?

ThinkGeek :: Flux Capacitor Replica

Willravel

This is the best deal in HDTVs right at this moment, but that's going to change on Black Friday.

If you don't want an energy hog, get an LED HDTV. The money you save in energy probably won't make up for the cost for decades, though.

Cynthetiq

I may not want to bleed money where I don't have to, but willing to pay the price to operate the better experience. In simplest terms you pay to have that better quality black, and viewing experience.

Now let's talk turkey here. Most of the people who watch TV today are happy with crap. They are so happy with shitty pictures, full of artifacts from compression, and color issues. They are willing to watch crappy youtube videos and upconverted 480 because it fills up the 1080 screen, never mind that there's artifacts all over the place, and the aspect ratio is totally fucked up.

From my cold dead hands... I'm not giving up my CRT. Okay, maybe one day, but it's going to be as long a time as I can wait because today's cable just fucks up your wonderful TV with shitty broadcasts from the head end.

I'd say buy something that's going to last 5-6 years, and then be ready to replace it with the best of the best.

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Glory's Sun

Will: the G10's are awesome plasmas. Probably the best that you can buy. I'm looking for at least 55" though, so a 42" is out of the question. As far as black friday goes, if you want name brand and a non-discontinued model, you'll have to wait a couple weeks after black friday if last years data holds up this year as well. I'm not interested in a discontinued model.

Cyn: Working in the field I'm in, you know that I absolutely HATE artifacts and shitty compression. Like I said though, most of what I watch is movies and blueray takes care of all the shitty upconversions. Why some stations still upconvert 480 is just mind boggling. It just doesn't work.

I'm still leaning towards plasma because I want true blacks. True blacks are going to increase the viewing pleasure 10 fold. Supposedly, with the new tunage of the lights to eliminate burn-in, the whites aren't absolute anymore, but I think that's because most people don't know how to correctly set their screens and settings.

Willravel

Oh, sorry, I missed that. How about the .

Glory's Sun

if it's a 54" G10, it's up for consideration

(your link 404'd)

Willravel

Gah, it was to Amazon marketplace, the best price for that set (according to CNET). Here's the full link:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00267PY6K/...net_mp-3449-20

$1,568 is almost stupid cheap for that kind of quality at that size. Just turn off the power strip when you're not using it to counterbalance the slightly high energy use and you're off to the races (or some other 18th century idiom).

boink

I don't mind some artifacts when I may be lucky to find any transfer at all of some oddball movies. some old movies only exist in a crappy VHS transferd to DVD so there's no choice but not to watch a great story. just a thought anyway...I mean, it seems like it'd be hard to cut out all non HD content.

but on topic I was under the impression plasma dosn't last as long as an LCD ?

also, Dell has a "no dead pixel" guarantee so you might want to check out what they have.

I miss some of what my Sony XBR crt did...and House of the Dead light gun games, but my LCD looks great.

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Glory's Sun

gah! I now found the V10 which I'm interested mainly because it will handle true 24p at 96hz. The G10's allow for 60Hz which doesn't have flicker but it may have flutter every now and then.


at this point, other than the energy, I don't know if there's any reason to go LCD over Plasma. Plasma just destroys LCD in picture quality.

oh..and when did Pioneer quit the plasma biz? They had the best sets out.

someone on amazon said the reason that the other competitors are getting out of the plasma business is because panasonic owns all the factories or something.. not sure how true it is, but it would make a little sense.

---------- Post added at 09:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:08 PM ----------

boink, almost all tv's are rated for 100,000 viewing hours on flame mode. That means you would have to watch your tv 7 hours a day, every day for 30 years to reach that limit. Considering you won't have the settings on flame mode (brightness) it will last even longer.

LCD probably does last longer, but, I'm pretty sure there will be something out in 30 years that I'll want and won't have to worry with it

burn in isn't a factor in plasmas anymore either..

boink

ok...Cin said my Sharp will die the day after the warranty runs out

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Glory's Sun

well sharp isn't known for their awesome track records, but as far as getting darker or burn ins you should be fine. the only thing you'll have to worry about (and this is for ANY tv) is hardware issues.

boink

hmm. well last year when I was on this quest I lurked alot of AV boards, read c-net and shopped in actual stores. never herd any poor reports on Sharp.
anyway...good luck.

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Glory's Sun

don't get me wrong..not saying sharp is crap at all.. just saying they aren't known for awesome track records.

what size did you end up with?

Willravel

It's funny, I was worried about that exact same thing when I went out shopping for tvs. The 42" G10 was hooked up to a 1080p source (I think it was some Pixar movie) and I couldn't see any skipping or fluttering. I'm not some TV specialist, but I do sit in front of a computer LCD with a better refresh. When I got home, I checked out a lot of blogs—Engaget, Gizmodo, Cnet, etc.—and a lot of them weren't exactly convinced that the super-high refresh rates could actually be seen by a human eye. Just food for thought.

If in 30 years if they're not beaming this crap into our heads, I'll eat my hat.

Cynthetiq

re: I see that Matushita is now called Panasonic, but they are Technics, Panasonic, National, and I think Sanyo if that deal went through.

while they may claim 100,000 viewing hours, there's a lot of other components within the LCD that may not have that longevity. I've seen way too many of these things die with precision and almost near betting predictability.

---------- Post added at 10:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:15 PM ----------

I've decided that my next setup has to be better than what I currently have which was boss back in the 90's a Sony 36" WEGA XBR. I really don't want it to die, but at the same time... it would be nice to be able to go 50+ in our small space.

If you got a high end TV joint near you. Go there, talk to sales people. It's free. In the end, see what kind of deal they can do for you, and see if you can get a better one online. See if they'll price match it just to get your business. Ultimately, you'll get to try the TV in a manner that you want to, which is, bring your own reference DVD/Blue Ray and have at it.

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Glory's Sun

you won't see the flutter unless you have the picture settings on the Cinema mode. Since 60Hz isn't a 24fps derivative, the flutter will happen on high action frame loads. 96Hz has no flutter at all. I've seen the 60Hz flutter before, but figured I could run the movies at 29fps and sacrifice the "true" frame rate for no flutter. the V10 eliminates that.

Cyn: I haven't even thought about the shop angle. That's a great idea because I can set the settings how I want and really get a feel for the set before I purchase.

Thanks for the idea!

boink

I got two of them, a 32" for the foot of the bed and a 42" for the main space. at the time Sharp was the only ones making a 1080p in 32". you can see the dots easy from 6-7 feet away on 1080i so I had to go for the Sharp. I'm still real happy with the screen, the amount of connections and all the on screen menus. starting to get curious about updating firmware on it I'd read reports of guys getting new features when they updated firmware on the AV forums I lurked. I like that the remotes work on either tv too. I feed my 42" with a PS3, comcast and my computer and I'm real happy with it.

now I had a Sony 36" WEGA XBR... 300lbs and 24" deep. very pritty. looked great with a Dreamcast and my Saturn too. I also miss all the pip. but it just died one day. I can't be lugging a 300lb TV to the repair shop.

with the new Sharp, the Saturn looks ok with an s-video cable. I'm thinking of getting a VGA box for the DC.

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Cynthetiq

LOL I can't tell you how many shops wouldn't let me plug in my PlayStation (back in the day) to let me see just how good it would look. Ultimately I got a shop that let me just sit and tinker with the TV, with the setup I was looking for Sony DVD changer and I just went to town for a few hours. The guy ended up matching prices I found online, and because they were so much cheaper, I ended up kicking up a little more for getting the extended warranty for 5 years since he let me play for a few hours. It was a win for everyone.

The guy at the high end store? He couldn't match it, nor was he willing to let me play my PlayStation. But he was the one that convinced me that the XBR was the better of the 36" WEGAs and worth that little bit more.

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Willravel

The trick is wearing a suit, Cynth. Best Buy employees love guys in suits.

Glory's Sun

FUCK Best Buy. I'm not walking through those doors for anything.

I'm gonna see what shops are around and see if they'll let me do anything. Maybe if I do some technical speak, they'll realize I'm not some schmo and will let me see what's up. I don't mind paying a little more for the shop people if I can really get a feel for the set.

The Samsung 55" LED LCD really looks good, but in the end I'm still drawn to the plasmas for the true black quality.

TV shopping wasn't this difficult back in the day

Cynthetiq

I only use best buy for their 30 day return policy and I treat the purchases there like I did Radio Shack. They are the, "I need it right now..." place. Real purchases are few and far between.

Last thing I did there was test out headphones for 30 days, and I ended up buying them online for 2/3 the price.

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Lasereth

I've been debating this for the past month. With my 10% coupon it would be $900.

Panasonic - VIERA / 50" Class / 1080p / 600Hz / Plasma HDTV - TC-P50S1

You can't beat that.

---------- Post added at 05:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:54 PM ----------

I may be blind, but how is this a better deal than the one I posted that's the same price, except 8" bigger?

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Willravel

I didn't have a 10% off coupon?

Lasereth

But yours would still be $90 cheaper, except you lose 8", which is worth $500 easily!!!

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Glory's Sun

the difference is the link you posted Lasereth is for an S1 model. While they certainly aren't shabby, they don't hold water compared to the G10 or V10 models. (IMO)

It's still a good price though

MexicanOnABike

I watched "Drag me to hell" on blue Ray last night. So awesome on my plasma!! I have the panasonic 42 previous model of what Will posted. I wouldn't change it!! and the power consumption was never a problem for me as I only use it for entertainment. Never for filler or background noise.

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Lasereth

The reason I asked is because I honestly wanted to know. I looked at the website and I couldn't find any tangible reason to not get the S1 since all of the picture quality stats are the same. If you believe the G10 is better, can you explain why? Even though it doesn't matter since the TV isn't on sale anymore.

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Glory's Sun

Well, the pictures on the S1s are awesome, and you wouldn't be disappointed with it by any means. As far as the difference, the G10s, G15s and V10s offer more custom color settings for the end user. Some people said they've noticed a bit of a yellowish-color coming off the S1s. The extra custom color settings allow you to set your color ranges for different applications rather than going with THX, warm, cool, etc. The price difference between the sets (S1-G10) are so minimal that it seems a better buy to have the options at your disposal. The G15s are supposedly a little better than the G10s but I haven't seen one in person so I can't really say for sure.. the G15s are about $200 more I think.