Carson Palmer - overrated + NFL draft - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

gov135 · 04-23-2003, 08:54 AM

NFL Draft day is a comin'. Looks like the Bengals will go with Carson Palmer for the first choice in the draft.

Looks like another crap shoot by the Bengals to me. Palmer is a guy who was highly touted out of high school, then wandered around the field for three years confused as all hell, puts together one good season to win the Heisman and then gets touted as the best in the draft class.

I don't get it. Here's a guy who faced some of the worse defenses in the NCAA (sorry Pac-10 fans, only USC and UCLA play any kind of D) and people are falling over him.

Byron Leftwich is clearly the number 1 pick. He did it his whole career, and his coach says hes better than Pennington.

Anyhow, let me know what you think. Also, who should your team draft?

JoeyB · 04-23-2003, 09:04 AM

While I agree that Carson Palmer has "bust" written all over him....(Heisman AND a Bengals QB--can't be good), I can't imagine someone has injury-prone as Leftwich going #1. He's been hurt several times at Marshall, although he's always fought through it, and that would be a giant red flag for me if I had the top pick.

duracellultra · 04-23-2003, 04:58 PM

Daryl Johnston brought up an interesting point in one of his commentaries:

Palmer played in nice weather his whole life, whereas Leftwich is used to playing under more abrasive conditions. While it surely can't mean a whole lot, I like Leftwich in Cinci more than Palmer in Cinci. Although, after the Akili Smith bust, I'm not sure how the Bengals feel about going after a QB with legs.

Mondak · 04-24-2003, 10:13 AM

Well - all I know is that the 'skins don't have any picks because they used them all drafing fairly marginal players.

Palmer will be a bust, but it will be a while before you truely know it. The main problem is that he is also perfect QB size on top of all the inflated Pac10 stats. It is tough to ignore that and the fact that he has a good attitude. It will be tough for anyone to pass up.

sixate · 04-24-2003, 01:54 PM

I have to agree. Palmer will most likely suck. I would never waste a #1 pic on a quarteback. Most times they just don't pan out. Plus the Bengals will kill a career even before it happens.

The_Dude · 04-24-2003, 02:07 PM

palmer has his act together.

he did lead the team to a very good season (except against kansas state, heheh!)

i mean the last games he played, he seemed like superman.

Grondar · 04-24-2003, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Palmer signs on for Bengals' reconstruction

CINCINNATI (AP) -- Carson Palmer has signed on for the Cincinnati Bengals' reconstruction.

The Heisman Trophy winner agreed to a contract Thursday with the NFL's worst team, which has the draft's top pick and a history of ruining young quarterbacks.

Intrigued by the way first-year head coach Marvin Lewis has changed the aura around the NFL's worst team, Palmer decided to sign on. "I'm proud to be part of a new era of Bengals football,'' he said at a news conference, shortly after he signed a seven-year deal.

"I've been following them for the past couple of months and seen the changes he's made. I'm excited to be part of this thing.''

The Bengals narrowed their candidates for the No. 1 pick to Palmer, quarterback Byron Leftwich and cornerback Terence Newman, then targeted the passer from Southern California this week.

Palmer's agent, David Dunn, agreed on contract parameters late Wednesday, and filled in the rest of the details Thursday on a contract that includes $14 million in bonuses.

Palmer got a $10.01 million signing bonus, and will get another $4.01 million roster bonus in 22 months. The contract will turn into a six-year deal if he's in for 35 percent of the plays in any season.

Palmer can make roughly $40 million in bonuses and base salary over six years, with escalators that could take it to $49 million. He'll get $18.25 million in the first three years through bonuses and salary.

Getting a pre-draft deal with Palmer was a priority for Lewis, who is trying to change the Bengals' reputation for bungling away chances to improve through the draft.

The Bengals have been the NFL's worst team over the past 12 years, in part because they've mishandled their quarterbacks. They moved up to take David Klingler with the sixth overall pick in 1992, and chose Akili Smith with the third overall pick in 1999.

Neither one had much of a chance on a team that hasn't had a winning record since 1990. Both missed training camp in contract disputes, then got thrown into the lineup as unprepared rookies.

If Lewis gets his way, the same thing won't happen with Palmer. The plan is for him to sit for at least one year and learn behind starter Jon Kitna. Palmer is convinced he'll be handled properly under Lewis.

"There are times in every organization's life when you hit a crossroads, you hit a key juncture,'' Dunn said. "This organization is clearly wandering down a different road than they've wandered down before. And it's nice to be at the beginning of the fork in that road.''

Klingler, who came from a run-and-shoot offense at Houston, and Smith, a mobile passer from Oregon, both were confined by the Bengals' passing philosophy. They tried to turn both of them into Ken Anderson clones -- stand in the pocket until the last second, then dump it off if necessary.

Klingler lasted only four years with a weak offensive line and an unimpressive receiving corps.

The Bengals did even worse with Smith, who got less than one full season as a starter before he was discarded. The Bengals teamed him with rookie receivers Peter Warrick and Ron Dugans in 2000, when head coach Bruce Coslet quit three games into the season.

Coslet was in charge of developing Smith, who got little guidance and wound up relegated to third string for the past two seasons. He's still on the roster.

Palmer has one thing in his favor: Lewis understands the importance of bringing a young quarterback along slowly. Plus, Lewis needs to win right away, so he'll let Kitna run the offense this season, with Smith currently in line as the backup.

The Bengals were willing to trade down with the first pick, but found no suitable partner. They brought in Palmer, Leftwich and Newman for interviews with the staff and front office this month before finally deciding to go with the more acclaimed quarterback.

Palmer is 6-foot-4 and more of a pocket passer than either Klingler or Smith. After going 16-16 in his first three seasons, he got the Trojans into the top 10 and led them to the Orange Bowl last season.

Palmer was the first of Southern Cal's five Heisman winners to play quarterback, and the first Heisman winner chosen No. 1 in the draft since Tampa Bay took Vinny Testaverde in 1987.

Cincinnati's hopes of a turnaround will rest on Palmer, a California native who is going to have to learn to adjust to the Midwest and its climate.

"I'm a pretty low-key guy,'' Palmer said. "I think I'll fit in well here as opposed to LA. I'm definitely ready for the change. I'm ready to get out of LA. it's too up-tempo for me.''

Article can be found HERE.

Halx · 04-24-2003, 03:11 PM

Don't bash Palmer..

He's got all of us SoCal peeps riding his back.

degrawj · 04-24-2003, 03:20 PM

Sorry halx, but it's true, he's overrated. it's virtually impossible to pick a good quarterback out of the draft. they just end up popping out of nowhere. picking palmer for #1 is a total waste.

RAMONES!!! · 04-24-2003, 03:23 PM

if i were the bengals i would have traded the pick to another team that has 2 first rounders

bish · 04-24-2003, 04:35 PM

You have to remember that Palmer played for 3 different coaches at USC. Once Carroll came in and let him play in a system for more than one season, he played very good.

I don't think he'll be a bust at all, only if Cincy can get him some receivers and keep Dillon in the backfield!!

cub4life78 · 04-24-2003, 06:44 PM

I think it's absolutely insane someone can make 40-something million over a couple years for playing a sport. And we wonder why our economy sucks. The pro athletes have all our money! Anywhoo, I guess I can't begrudge someone of their chance to do well.

maximusveritas · 04-24-2003, 08:02 PM

It seems like nobody wants the top pick. I think a team at 4 or 5 is in a much better position. They don't have to pay as much and they can get a player who is as good if not better than the #1 guy.

Dr.Who · 04-26-2003, 10:15 AM

How can you sign a QB to a six years, multimillion $$. I don't know Palmer so well since I don't follow NCAA Football but it's again the logic of football. Beside, QB is the most risky position of all.

BigGov · 04-26-2003, 12:53 PM

What I don't understand is how far Leftwich slipped. He is obviously the best pure quarterback in the draft, probably in the last decade. Most coaches say they want a guy who can run their offensive effectively. Leftwich called a majority of his plays, has an excellent arm, and when he isn't out there playing on a broken shin, he's smart enough to run competantly. If he has to that is, because he's big enough to shrug off alot of the rushing that would be coming his way.

If only the Rams would have traded up, imagine Leftwich with Faulk, Holt, Bruce, and one of the best offensive lines in the league around him.

04-23-2003, 08:54 AM	#1 (permalink)
gov135 Junkie Location: Midwest	Carson Palmer - overrated + NFL draft NFL Draft day is a comin'. Looks like the Bengals will go with Carson Palmer for the first choice in the draft. Looks like another crap shoot by the Bengals to me. Palmer is a guy who was highly touted out of high school, then wandered around the field for three years confused as all hell, puts together one good season to win the Heisman and then gets touted as the best in the draft class. I don't get it. Here's a guy who faced some of the worse defenses in the NCAA (sorry Pac-10 fans, only USC and UCLA play any kind of D) and people are falling over him. Byron Leftwich is clearly the number 1 pick. He did it his whole career, and his coach says hes better than Pennington. Anyhow, let me know what you think. Also, who should your team draft?

04-23-2003, 09:04 AM	#2 (permalink)
JoeyB feeling tingly	While I agree that Carson Palmer has "bust" written all over him....(Heisman AND a Bengals QB--can't be good), I can't imagine someone has injury-prone as Leftwich going #1. He's been hurt several times at Marshall, although he's always fought through it, and that would be a giant red flag for me if I had the top pick. __________________ My mom is a Diamondbacks fan. She really likes the Big Unit

04-24-2003, 10:13 AM	#4 (permalink)
Mondak Industrialist Location: Southern California	Well - all I know is that the 'skins don't have any picks because they used them all drafing fairly marginal players. Palmer will be a bust, but it will be a while before you truely know it. The main problem is that he is also perfect QB size on top of all the inflated Pac10 stats. It is tough to ignore that and the fact that he has a good attitude. It will be tough for anyone to pass up. __________________ All truth passes through three stages: First it is ridiculed Second, it is violently opposed and Third, it is accepted as self-evident. ARTHUR SCHOPENHAUER (1788-1860)

04-24-2003, 02:07 PM	#6 (permalink)
The_Dude The GrandDaddy of them all! Location: Austin, TX	palmer has his act together. he did lead the team to a very good season (except against kansas state, heheh!) i mean the last games he played, he seemed like superman. __________________ "Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity." - Darrel K Royal

04-24-2003, 03:11 PM	#8 (permalink)
Halx Please touch this. Owner/Admin Location: Manhattan	Don't bash Palmer.. He's got all of us SoCal peeps riding his back. __________________ You have found this post informative. -The Administrator [Don't Feed The Animals]

04-23-2003, 04:58 PM	#3 (permalink)
duracellultra Upright	Daryl Johnston brought up an interesting point in one of his commentaries: Palmer played in nice weather his whole life, whereas Leftwich is used to playing under more abrasive conditions. While it surely can't mean a whole lot, I like Leftwich in Cinci more than Palmer in Cinci. Although, after the Akili Smith bust, I'm not sure how the Bengals feel about going after a QB with legs.

04-24-2003, 01:54 PM	#5 (permalink)
sixate Registered User Location: Somewhere in Ohio	I have to agree. Palmer will most likely suck. I would never waste a #1 pic on a quarteback. Most times they just don't pan out. Plus the Bengals will kill a career even before it happens.

04-24-2003, 03:20 PM	#9 (permalink)
degrawj I'm still waiting... Location: West Linn, OR	Sorry halx, but it's true, he's overrated. it's virtually impossible to pick a good quarterback out of the draft. they just end up popping out of nowhere. picking palmer for #1 is a total waste.

04-24-2003, 03:23 PM	#10 (permalink)
RAMONES!!! _-_---_-_	if i were the bengals i would have traded the pick to another team that has 2 first rounders __________________ Come on

04-24-2003, 04:35 PM	#11 (permalink)
bish Crazy Location: Indy	You have to remember that Palmer played for 3 different coaches at USC. Once Carroll came in and let him play in a system for more than one season, he played very good. I don't think he'll be a bust at all, only if Cincy can get him some receivers and keep Dillon in the backfield!!

04-24-2003, 06:44 PM	#12 (permalink)
cub4life78 Insane Location: Kansas	I think it's absolutely insane someone can make 40-something million over a couple years for playing a sport. And we wonder why our economy sucks. The pro athletes have all our money! Anywhoo, I guess I can't begrudge someone of their chance to do well.

04-24-2003, 08:02 PM	#13 (permalink)
maximusveritas Winner	It seems like nobody wants the top pick. I think a team at 4 or 5 is in a much better position. They don't have to pay as much and they can get a player who is as good if not better than the #1 guy.

04-26-2003, 10:15 AM	#14 (permalink)
Dr.Who Insane Location: Part Unknow	How can you sign a QB to a six years, multimillion $$. I don't know Palmer so well since I don't follow NCAA Football but it's again the logic of football. Beside, QB is the most risky position of all.

04-26-2003, 12:53 PM	#15 (permalink)
BigGov WoW or Class... Location: UWW	What I don't understand is how far Leftwich slipped. He is obviously the best pure quarterback in the draft, probably in the last decade. Most coaches say they want a guy who can run their offensive effectively. Leftwich called a majority of his plays, has an excellent arm, and when he isn't out there playing on a broken shin, he's smart enough to run competantly. If he has to that is, because he's big enough to shrug off alot of the rushing that would be coming his way. If only the Rams would have traded up, imagine Leftwich with Faulk, Holt, Bruce, and one of the best offensive lines in the league around him. __________________ One day an Englishman, a Scotsman, and an Irishman walked into a pub together. They each bought a pint of Guinness. Just as they were about to enjoy their creamy beverage, three flies landed in each of their pints. The Englishman pushed his beer away in disgust. The Scotsman fished the fly out of his beer and continued drinking it, as if nothing had happened. The Irishman, too, picked the fly out of his drink but then held it out over the beer and yelled "SPIT IT OUT, SPIT IT OUT, YOU BASTARD!"