Ustwo

Heh I just thought of how ironic this thread is on TFP.

This board basically got started due to the titty board. Its changed since then (alas poor titty board, we miss your glory days) but it is sort of amusing

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Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host

Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.

Sultana

I've been reading and watching this thread, and have been trying to get my thoughts ordered enough to contribute.

I can understand how the OP feels. I identify with the feeling of not being enough, insecurity, when I think of my man wanting to look at other women in a sexual way. Especially with I was new to the relationship, omg! It was hard to deal with.

These days I am completely comfortable if he wants to do that, but that's because I trust him 1000%. I know without a doubt that he desires me, and that if offered a choice, he'd vastly rather have me than a 2-dimentional photo of a stranger. But because of life, and things that get in the way, and the vagarities of men being visual and what not (undeniable), I don't fret over what photos he may occasionally look at.

I ask myself what is the difference, and what I've come up with is this: Besides the fact that I trust him, it's a matter of how much importance he puts on it. If he looked at it all the time, if every time I walked into the office he had a magazine open, or a site up, and/or was beating off, etc., that would be a negative. Basically, if he made me feel like it was more important than our relationship, that would be bad. But I am secure in the knowlege that *I* and *we* are much more important, so I couldn't care less.

It does seem though, that many of the guys posting here seem to feel that it's their inalienable right, and that even questioning it is practically unamerican, or at least un-TFP-ian. I don't see it that way, but since I'm not male, I'm certain my viewpoint in this matter will not be regarded with the same weight.

I do greatly appreciate Wilravels' input about having better things to do. While there's nothing wrong with being a sexual person, I do think that to persue a one-handed sexuality (so to speak) to the exclusion of other relationships (sexual or not), is detrimental. I don't think it's sad when one's life is so full that there's not room for superficial sexuality (if one would agree that porn is a superficial sexual persuit) to be a large percentage of one's life.

__________________
"Love is a snowmobile racing across the tundra and then suddenly it flips over, pinning you underneath.
At night, the ice weasels come." -

Matt Groening

My goal? To fulfill my potential.

abaya

Sultana, I agree with you here. I don't have any major problems with porn--while I do prefer porn that is ethically produced and is more realistic about sex, I don't condemn the whole industry or the guys who watch it.

But I sense the same attitude that you mention... that one should never question the fact that ALL MEN MUST WATCH PORN (or die?)... at least, that's what I hear in many of the posts, except for Willravel's. I think it's important to question why and when you watch porn, to make sure it stays in its proper context.

For example, in ktspktsp's and my first 6-8 months together, the subject of porn didn't often come up. I think that's mostly because we were together almost all the time, and he had no need for porn. (He actually deleted the majority of his porn from his computer when we got together.) I was also new to the world of sex in general, so porn was something I didn't even think about, until I started getting more curious.

Then TFP came along. At the same time ktspktsp had to move 3 hours away for his new job. These two things combined to make me more interested in porn, given the distance and curiosity. He and I talked a lot about it, discussing his own habits and preferences, and I checked out a lot of stuff on TFP. My ideas changed as I started to understand that there are different qualities of porn (especially female-produced), and also that I could really get off from it. I became less scared of it and more exploratory. We even made our own short videos, which was really fun.

I think ktspktsp and I have grown as a result of our discussions about porn, our feelings about it (including me being brutally honest back then, which included a lot of the attitudes that the OP expressed), and our willingness to hear each other out. I am no longer threatened by porn, and I love hearing that he's been masturbating when we're apart (whether to pictures of me/us or porn women)... and I like telling him what I'm looking at. Sometimes we'll just get horny together by looking at the same stuff on Exhibition and TB, which leads to more fun...

Porn is not always bad. It can be exploitative, but not always. Hiding it and/or being afraid of it, and judging it without understanding it, is bad for a relationship. It's also bad to say that men need it more than women, or that men have a divine "right" to watch it under any circumstance, etc.

Basically anything that cannot become an open, caring discussion with your significant other, is bad. If porn isn't something you can talk about easily, then I suggest you work on that in your communication with your SO.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

analog

Well, no, I think what most of us are saying is that such thoughts would require a woman who:

1. Has very little to no trust whatsoever in her partner, and/or
2. needs to be so controlling over her partner that they demand to exclusively dictate the very things that turn them on.

Both of these conditions would make me say "you're out of your fucking mind," and are also both very unhealthy for any relationship.

xnicx87x

[QUOTE=:::OshnSoul:::].....makes me feel like A) I'm not enough/I don't have good enough qualities being a female, B) like women really are just tools/pieces of meat

i understand what you mean,my boyfriend watches porn.sometimes i feel like im not good enough and that hed rather watch them.after sharing my concerns with him he reassured me that he love me and fancies me more then anything like porn.now i understand even if he does watch porn when im not around its me he comes home to at the end of the day and no one else!share youre concerns with him all you probably need is reassurance,i havent got a proble, with it at all any more and feel more secure about myself. x x

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xXpixieXx

Ustwo

My thoughts exactly but I'd also add that while normally this is a 'womans problem', based on a lot of guys I know if their women started looking at guys with better bodies and bigger dicks all day long they would have the same issues.

Its accepted that a guy can have a wandering eye and the woman is just being possessive, but I'd be willing to bet that MOST men would have a problem if their woman did the same thing checking out a waiters ass, or making comments about other men being very attractive.

__________________
Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host

Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.

xepherys

I feel this particular item, if it is indeed what the OP meant to say, is the most telling. I don't know whether to chalk it up to inexperience or some other issue. First of all, you can neither allow or disallow a man to get turned on. That man, himself, without serious programmatic changes cannot allow or disallow something to turn him on. Guys are turned on by what they are wired to like. Some guys like big boobs, some guys like flat chests, some guys dig redheads, some guys get a stack and a half over asians. They are going to like what they like. While most men in adulthood can control it enough to not be like the kid who can't go up to the chalkboard, it doesn't stop that inherent chemistry from working it's mojo.

Back on point, if you give your SO (male or female) the impression that you've given an okay or NOT given an okay to find something arousing, you're crusing for a world of unhappiness. That's just not how most people work. If my wife said to me, "Hun, you can't think Asian girls are cute anymore!" I'd probably nod and wonder wtf had gotten into her. If she said, "From now on, you can't look at another girls butt!" I'd think she'd lost it. I mean, I MARRIED her becuase I want to be with her. There are billions of other girls to choose from and I chose her. That alone, above everything else, should be enough to make her feel secure. In my case, I got such a woman. Feel good about yourself, and your relationship and some porn and masturbation on the side won't hurt things a bit. :-)

Sultana

I appreciate this point being brought up, Ustwo. It would be interesting to see what it would be like with the shoe on the other foot, if women were as active in visually admiring other men (as men are about looking at nekkid ladies), and actively pursued getting off on it...how would that make the guys feel?

I'd guess they'd be feeling a degree of insecurity.

Anyone?

__________________
"Love is a snowmobile racing across the tundra and then suddenly it flips over, pinning you underneath.
At night, the ice weasels come." -

Matt Groening

My goal? To fulfill my potential.

ASU2003

I wouldn't care if she looked at guys on the Internet to get aroused. Even though I'm not really into naked guys, I would be able to watch it wit her. If she was communicating with them or if they were guys she knew in real life (strippers, ex-bf or friends) it might be a problem. If she is looking at guys on the beach or mall, it would be fine. If she was closing the door and masturbating without me, if I'm there, it would be an issue. I'm not sure how I feel about dancing with other people, I wouldn't mind dancing with other girls, but I'm not sure I would be comfortable with her dancing with random guys.

I always say what's fair for one person to do is fair for the other person also.

uptown

what does it mean when a man repeatedly cannot orgasm with his partner but there's evidence of lots of porn viewing on the computer the morning after ?


Would a woman be weird for being worried about the situation ?

Connie

I agree w/ Rinndalir. Men are mostly visual creatures, whereas women are usually best satisfied when they can create the environment inside of their own minds. Either in words or visuals, it's all about fantasy and imagination. It's not that a person is considering cheating or finds his/her SO unattractive; it's a matter of fulfilling a desire of the mind that transcends into the flesh. Like Rinndalir said, it's only when this desire cannot be satiated and the porn becomes a consuming activity is it a real problem.

cadre

My boyfriend looks at porn, I don't mind that he does it and he doesn't mind that I also have a porn stash. I don't see it as threatening to me since I do the same thing. I can kinda understand the need. I think it's just one of those things that guys do. Personally it seems that women don't like their so's looking at porn just because of society.

Sultana

This is a great post, putting the shoe realistically on the other foot. I rarely hear or read of guys fretting, "Is she reading those books because she's unsatisfied with me?"

Although not because they shouldn't be wondering, I honestly think it's because many are competely unconcerned with the fantasy lives of women (unless it happens to involve another woman, LOL!). But also, if you look at women reading novels like that, it still seems rediculous to imagine she wants a muscle-bound pirate to sweep her away.

Hey though, if guys think it would be fun if your woman shared porn with you, and maybe let that spark things that might otherwise not occur, it couldn't hurt to turn the tables and see what gets her motor running from her "lady porn", and try to somehow inject aspects of that into your love life.

Yeah, dress up like a pirate and take me, baby!

Or maybe, just freakin' dress up.

__________________
"Love is a snowmobile racing across the tundra and then suddenly it flips over, pinning you underneath.
At night, the ice weasels come." -

Matt Groening

My goal? To fulfill my potential.

shoegirl

But, as a woman, I find it really, really disrespectful if a man isn't considerate. Say for example, if you're sitting right next to your SO while he looks at random porn on the internet. Not a big deal if you don't mind, but if you really do mind, then it's quite inconsiderate, rude, and disrespectful. Yeah, I got it, men will do what they want and look at porn... but men, at least make an effort to know what will upset or bother your SO.

duskytip

It isn't all about looking at naked woman. It is natural for people to grow and become curious about different aspects of their sexuality. I know I am curious and want to try things with my wife that she feels is not for her. Looking at porn can help to satisfy those urges.

Average_Joe

My wife is kind of like the original poster. She is not comfortable with me looking at porn, basically due to her insecurities, which she admits, and due to an ex-boyfriend who apparently made her feel insignificant due to his obsession with porn. It's tough for me because I, like many men out there, like to view porn on occassion. I have to hide my personal collection and view it when I'm alone. I do wish I could share this side of me, but I know my wife would be uncomfortable. I actually wouldn't be surprised if she suspected that I do look at porn because she knows how much of a pervert I am.

We did actually watch porn together a couple of times, and had a good time with it, but after the fact, my wife became paranoid that I would be less turned on by her because of it. She knows how sexy I think she is, and knows I will never cheat, but my viewing porn is something she just can't accept.

analog

Ok but... WHY do you mind? Open communication does not include arbitrarily assigning "this bothers me" to things without discussing why.

What if I said you can't watch TV, because there are other men on TV and i'm jealous and insecure. It's rude and inconsiderate of you to watch TV. I don't have to have a good reason, I just don't like it and I wish you'd care about me enough to stop doing it since it bothers me. (sounding familiar yet?)

Find out where those feelings are coming from. Is he already distant, or have you been altogether replaced by porn? That's a broader issue than just a naked chick on a monitor, but the porn is a convenient scapegoat so you don't have to face the reality of your real problems.

Are you just a control freak? Lots of people are.

Is it simply that you don't want to see naked people? While I wouldn't care, I wouldn't stick around the computer if my SO was scrolling through pic after pic of naked men. It's not insecurity, but I find no pleasure in seeing those images. Of course, just because _I_ don't want to see it, I wouldn't force my SO to stop looking at it, unless there was a broader issue to her looking at it (and then communication needs to kick in).

People seek arousal, even if only mentally (any mental stimulation). Arousal can be a good book, a movie, a nature hike, or imagining that you're bending your new secretary over your desk and filling her out like an application.

So, keep in mind that although you're offended by it- what is actually, at the root of everything, the problem? Are you just jealous/insecure/controlling? Stop blaming real problems on an easy scapegoat like porn. If you whittle down everything else through open communication with your partner, and you end up left with just porn, then that's the problem, and you fix that. For most of you, however, that's not the case, and you'll be having a talk about jealous/insecure/controlling behavior.