No matter who wins there are going to be cries of voter fraud - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

pan6467 · 10-05-2004, 09:39 PM

Before I get to the article there's a few things I have been wanting to address in the state of OHIO.

Voter fraud.... The GOP claim that the unions have fraudulently sent in voter registrations that now are costing our state millions of tax dollars to verify. While the GOP has sent me a registered Democrat) and a few of my friends and family 3-5 voter registration cards. The reason I got them (probably) is because I am a subscriber to Rush Limbaugh's website. I could understand 1 but I reacieved 5 FIVE registration cards.

I could have very easily sent them in and claimed to be 5 different people, as could all of my friends and family that got these same cards. (I am sure there were quite a few who did. 2 of my cards had my name and address computer printed on the reply card.... the other 3 were totally blank and I was to fill them out).

So pardon me for the pissy attitude but the GOP seems to be crying about the Dems and union but are doing the exact same thing. And both are costing us millions in tax dollars and that in turn takes money out of education.

Ok now the article:

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LANSING, Mich. - Republicans say filmmaker Michael Moore should be prosecuted for offering underwear, potato chips and Ramen noodles to college students in exchange for their promise to vote.

The Michigan Republican Party has asked four county prosecutors to file charges against Moore, charging that his get-out-the-vote stunt amounts to bribery.

"We want everyone to participate in this year's election, but not because they were bribed or coerced by the likes of Michael Moore," said Greg McNeilly, executive director of the state Republican Party.

Moore, a Michigan native, is touring the country and imploring "slackers" who usually don't vote to head to the polls this year, saying they could make the difference in the presidential race. Moore has made stops at three Michigan universities as part of a 60-city pre-election tour.

During each program, habitual nonvoters are invited on stage to pledge to vote. First-time student voters are offered gag prizes such as clean underwear.

The GOP said Moore also offered students a clean dorm room, a year's supply of Tostitos and a package of Ramen noodles.

The GOP said it asked the prosecutors to charge Moore, a John Kerry (news - web sites) supporter, with violating Michigan's election law, which prohibits a person from contracting with another for something of value in exchange for agreeing to vote.

Maria Miller, a spokeswoman for the Wayne County prosecutor's office, refused to comment on the matter. Calls to Moore and the other prosecutors weren't immediately returned Tuesday.
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Link: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp..._michael_moore

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There are people offering things on the Univ. of Akron to students to vote for Bush (but are they GOP or Dems trying to cause problems? Who knows?). Exact same thing as what Moore is doing.

Also it is easy to get people to say "yeah they bribed me to vote this way" which is impossible to tell though because it is by secret ballot. I can say I voted Bush and was bribed to do so. But the question is where's the proof? First where's the bribe(?) secondly, in a secret ballot noone knows how I truly voted. So to hear "bribery" is BS. Because Moore can hand out anything he wants and these people can say "sure I'll vote for him" then go in and vote for the other guy and who's going to know? Makes no sense, it'd be a massive waste of money, time and effort.

It just appears to me that this race is so "close" in the parties eyes that they are both doing illegal things and both yelling about the other side. It's BS because what both sides are doing is making it so that there will be doubt and excuses no matter who wins.

If Kerry wins.... the GOP points to issues like this article.

If Bush wins the Dems point to the CEO of Diebold promising him the election and voter fraud.

Both sides just need to shut up campaign on the issues nad show respect to the voters. If they can't show each other respect.... that says something about their character.... If they can't show the people (their boss) respect that shows they truly don't give a damn about "We the people" and care only about the power.

Caring only about the power makes me ask why?

TheKak · 10-06-2004, 05:51 AM

Moore isn't bribing them to vote for Kerry, he is just trying to get them to vote PERIOD. I am asking everyone I meet if they are registered to vote, and trying to get as many people as possible to go vote "reguardless of who you vote for". I don't see anything wrong with offering people underwear in exchange for a pledge to head for the polls, as long as he isn't bribing them to vote one way or another, which it does not indicate in the article.

As for voter fraud: I wish I was a lawyer

mo42 · 10-06-2004, 11:29 AM

I agree. I'm fairly certain that the current laws in Michigan are not written in such a manner that encouraging people to vote by giving away items to register is illegal. If they are, I would think that they would probably change them if Moore gets prosecuted on this one.

10-05-2004, 09:39 PM	#1 (permalink)
pan6467 Lennonite Priest Location: Mansfield, Ohio USA	No matter who wins there are going to be cries of voter fraud Before I get to the article there's a few things I have been wanting to address in the state of OHIO. Voter fraud.... The GOP claim that the unions have fraudulently sent in voter registrations that now are costing our state millions of tax dollars to verify. While the GOP has sent me a registered Democrat) and a few of my friends and family 3-5 voter registration cards. The reason I got them (probably) is because I am a subscriber to Rush Limbaugh's website. I could understand 1 but I reacieved 5 FIVE registration cards. I could have very easily sent them in and claimed to be 5 different people, as could all of my friends and family that got these same cards. (I am sure there were quite a few who did. 2 of my cards had my name and address computer printed on the reply card.... the other 3 were totally blank and I was to fill them out). So pardon me for the pissy attitude but the GOP seems to be crying about the Dems and union but are doing the exact same thing. And both are costing us millions in tax dollars and that in turn takes money out of education. Ok now the article: ======== LANSING, Mich. - Republicans say filmmaker Michael Moore should be prosecuted for offering underwear, potato chips and Ramen noodles to college students in exchange for their promise to vote. The Michigan Republican Party has asked four county prosecutors to file charges against Moore, charging that his get-out-the-vote stunt amounts to bribery. "We want everyone to participate in this year's election, but not because they were bribed or coerced by the likes of Michael Moore," said Greg McNeilly, executive director of the state Republican Party. Moore, a Michigan native, is touring the country and imploring "slackers" who usually don't vote to head to the polls this year, saying they could make the difference in the presidential race. Moore has made stops at three Michigan universities as part of a 60-city pre-election tour. During each program, habitual nonvoters are invited on stage to pledge to vote. First-time student voters are offered gag prizes such as clean underwear. The GOP said Moore also offered students a clean dorm room, a year's supply of Tostitos and a package of Ramen noodles. The GOP said it asked the prosecutors to charge Moore, a John Kerry (news - web sites) supporter, with violating Michigan's election law, which prohibits a person from contracting with another for something of value in exchange for agreeing to vote. Maria Miller, a spokeswoman for the Wayne County prosecutor's office, refused to comment on the matter. Calls to Moore and the other prosecutors weren't immediately returned Tuesday. ================== Link: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp..._michael_moore ======= There are people offering things on the Univ. of Akron to students to vote for Bush (but are they GOP or Dems trying to cause problems? Who knows?). Exact same thing as what Moore is doing. Also it is easy to get people to say "yeah they bribed me to vote this way" which is impossible to tell though because it is by secret ballot. I can say I voted Bush and was bribed to do so. But the question is where's the proof? First where's the bribe(?) secondly, in a secret ballot noone knows how I truly voted. So to hear "bribery" is BS. Because Moore can hand out anything he wants and these people can say "sure I'll vote for him" then go in and vote for the other guy and who's going to know? Makes no sense, it'd be a massive waste of money, time and effort. It just appears to me that this race is so "close" in the parties eyes that they are both doing illegal things and both yelling about the other side. It's BS because what both sides are doing is making it so that there will be doubt and excuses no matter who wins. If Kerry wins.... the GOP points to issues like this article. If Bush wins the Dems point to the CEO of Diebold promising him the election and voter fraud. Both sides just need to shut up campaign on the issues nad show respect to the voters. If they can't show each other respect.... that says something about their character.... If they can't show the people (their boss) respect that shows they truly don't give a damn about "We the people" and care only about the power. Caring only about the power makes me ask why? __________________ I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"

10-06-2004, 05:51 AM	#2 (permalink)
TheKak Insane Location: Virginia	Moore isn't bribing them to vote for Kerry, he is just trying to get them to vote PERIOD. I am asking everyone I meet if they are registered to vote, and trying to get as many people as possible to go vote "reguardless of who you vote for". I don't see anything wrong with offering people underwear in exchange for a pledge to head for the polls, as long as he isn't bribing them to vote one way or another, which it does not indicate in the article. As for voter fraud: I wish I was a lawyer __________________ Roses are red, violets are blue, I'm a schizophrenic and so am I.

10-06-2004, 11:29 AM	#3 (permalink)
mo42 Insane Location: California	I agree. I'm fairly certain that the current laws in Michigan are not written in such a manner that encouraging people to vote by giving away items to register is illegal. If they are, I would think that they would probably change them if Moore gets prosecuted on this one. __________________ It's not getting what you want, it's wanting what you've got.