Religious Stampede?!?!
 

Unbelievable

What can one rationally make of this?

Bizarre on so many levels...

Please post content and not just links.

Thanks ;)

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Hajj stampede: 244 pilgrims dead
Sunday, February 1, 2004 Posted: 9:38 AM EST (1438 GMT)


http://i.cnn.net/cnn/2004/WORLD/meas...ampede.cnn.jpg
The stampede happened Sunday during a stone-throwing ritual

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MECCA, Saudi Arabia (CNN) -- A stampede Sunday morning killed 244 Muslim pilgrims and injured another 244 at a stone-throwing ritual which has been the source of deadly tramplings in the past, according to Saudi's health minister.

The incident happened around 9 a.m. (0600 GMT) during the annual Hajj pilgrimage. The health minister said the stampede lasted for about 27 minutes before the crowd was brought under control. The stoning ritual has since resumed.

Seven of those hurt were seriously injured.

The pilgrims traveled from the Muslim holy city of Mecca to Mina to cast small pebbles at three columns of stone that symbolize the devil.

An estimated 2 million pilgrims are attending this year's Hajj.

Last year, 36 pilgrims were trampled to death, most of them en route to the devil stoning ritual.

In 2001, a stampede at the same ritual killed 35.

Muslims across the globe make the annual Hajj pilgrimage to Saudi Arabia, where they worship at Islam's holiest sites. The five-day journey -- which every adult Muslim must take at least once if possible -- began Jan. 31.

The gathering of millions is often the scene of deadly stampedes and other violence.

The most deadly Hajj-related incident was a 1990 stampede in which 1,426 pilgrims were killed.

Here is a breakdown of other violent incidents at the annual Muslim pilgrimage:

1998 - 180 people died in a stampede near Mecca at the end of the Hajj;

1997 - A fire in Mina tore through the sprawling, overcrowded tent city , trapping and killing more than 340 pilgrims and injuring 1,500;

1994 - a stampede kills 270 pilgrims;

1991 - a chartered airliner carrying pilgrims home to Nigeria crashed, killing 261;

1991 - a plane crash in northern Saudi Arabia killed 91 Senegalese soldiers returning from a trip to Mecca which had been a reward for their service in the U.S.-led coalition that drove Iraqi forces from Kuwait in the Gulf War a month earlier;

1989 - bombs exploded near the Grand Mosque in Mecca, killing one pilgrim and wounding 16 others;

1987 - some 400 people, mainly Iranian Shi'ite pilgrims, were killed in clashes with Saudi security forces during anti-Western protests in Mecca.

-- CNN Correspondent Rym Brahimi and Producer Ayman Mohyeldin contributed to this report

It's what happens when you get 2 million people in such a cramped space. I'd say that the religious nature of it is completely unrelated, just ask any fire marshall - one thing goes wrong in a crowd like that, and panic spreads like wildfire.

bleh, what a horrible way to die

Re-read it...its religious ritual/fervor.
This violence simply doesn't occur, for instance, at Disneyland, Superbowl, Olympics, Rose Bowl, Carnivale in Rio, Indy500, etc..

I heard today that if you die at Hajj you go straight to heaven

from http://www.bluemud.org/article/23345

its a tragedy...and it is fueled by religious fervor, but its not unique to the islamic world. i mean, people died for the Who...its a factor of the size of the crowd, bad planning, and some bad luck.

Man, it's a damn good thing the Who wasn't playing too.

Sorry, I just got back from a Catholic funeral, and, though I realize that many people get a lot out of them, this ritualistic, superstitious folderal either leaves me chuckling in a self satisfied kind of a way or fuming at the time and resources wasted. I really can't feel too bad for folks killed at a ritual in which it seems some folks get killed every other year or so at least.

I've been in crowds of over a million people and there were not deaths like this. Its the nature of the event in this case where everyone is pushing to get to one spot which causes the problem, not just the size of the crowd.

This from an AP version of the story:

Safety measures were in place at the site - one where fatal stampedes have been frequent - but "caution isn't stronger than fate," said Saudi Hajj Minister Iyad Madani. "All precautions were taken to prevent such an incident, but this is God's will."

.................

It's "God's will," I guess...

No one here has ever been the the kind of packing-in that happens on Haaj. There are hundreds of thousands going through the paces in one religious event, such as stoning the devil.

This is European football x50. People die every other week in the crouds of european football matches.

Just gotta get the mix of human density + excitement.

Source
The "Manual"

Powerclown, what statement were you trying to make?

Powerclown, disguised human sacrifice is the first thing that popped into my head when I heard how often this goes on. Of course, I kind of blew it off with a "nobody's that crazy any more", but that's just my much trampled optimism making a break for it. (Back in your cage, you sniveling, simpering bastard! *Shhhhwih Crack!*)

crazy religious whackos :P

Justification for the Iraq War.

Ever wonder if religion is the root of all evil?

No..girls and money is... :lol:

back to the stampede...god damn! have some control people!

Do they NOT watch where they're going or something?

I think a lot of it has to do with the level of religious fanaticism prevalent among some Muslims. I don't mean for this to be taken the wrong way, I know not all Muslims are crazy and that every religion has its zealots. It seems to me that Muslims living in the 3rd world are the very craziest, least predictable people on earth though. That's just my opinion and I sincerely hope that I haven't offended anyone.

Its not a matter of fanatacism, its a matter of a million people trying to do something all at once.. Its poor planning.

Don't you think that rationale people would realize that the current Hajj system isn't working and that it should be reviewed?

The Hajj minister in Saudi Arabia comments: "All precautions were taken to prevent such an incident, but this is God's will. Caution isn't stronger than fate."

I think there is a little more to the situation than a lot of people packed in a tight space. People continue to die every year there.

Clearly you've never been to Singapore.

<img src=http://images.chron.com/content/news/photos/03/07/09/rpirates.jpg>

Ok, first thing I thought was:

"Who farted?"

Actually, its hardly a 3rd world country. Much closer to Boston/Manhattan than to hmm...say New Delhi...

infinitely better education (at least for high school and below) than the US. Your top colleges remain world class, for now....
comparable (in quality) and infinitely cheaper health care system.

Pretty good religious and racial harmony, and a not a very strong social divide. But of course, you're right. Muslims in Singapore are just like everyone else. Not much in the way of fanaticism there.

The USA has its share of religious kooks, so I wouldn't be so quick to condemn Muslims. Off the top of my head:

- Waco (6 dead)
- Heaven's Gate cult (39 dead)
- Jim Jones (400 dead)

Take a good look in the mirror before you condemn a whole culture. I'd say that the USA is one of the more fanatical nations. Look at the highly placed officials like Ashcroft pushing a religious agenda, or that general in Iraq saying that the muslims are following Satan.

People die at the Hajj in mass numbers yearly. And going to the hajj is a part of Islam, its part of the foundation. Last time I checked cults waiting for spaceships and christians drinking kool-aid weren't the norm.

Last time I checked neither religion is innocent of its own forms of killing throught their pasts.

P.S. Unless you're Islamic and not another pro-everything Christian guy, you have little room to say anything on another religion from which your sources are the internet.

Wasn't expecting a serious response to my attempt at humor, but thanks for the info about Singapore. The last I heard about the place was when a diplomat's kid got caned.