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Old 12-29-2003, 02:43 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Bowling for Columbine

I just saw this movie and it brought up some interesting points.

In case you have not seen the movie, it is a film by Michael Moore that attempts to probe why the U.S. has over 11,000 murders every year and why other countries with similar amounts of guns and gun laws (Canada, Germany, France, Britain) have fewer than 200 gun-related murders each year. Moore's theory was the media; the media displays every single night more and more crimes.

When you turn on the 5 o'clock or 6 o'clock news, what is the news story that it usually displayed? Someone being shot, a robbery, or someone donating to a local charity?

Or how about George W. Bush's #1 priority being the war, and not domestic problems.

Comments?
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Old 12-29-2003, 02:47 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I think this movie has been discussed to death before. I'll just say it was entertaining.
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Old 12-29-2003, 02:48 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: Bowling for Columbine

Quote:
Originally posted by soccerchamp76
Comments?
We beat this 'documentary' to shreds a few weeks back, and I don't think we need to do it every time someone new watches it. (not a flame of you, just that it gets old)

You can check here

http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html

and here

http://www.mooreexposed.com/

and any number of other places. They cover Mr. Moore nicely.
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Old 12-29-2003, 02:55 PM   #4 (permalink)
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With the search feature being disabled I wasn't able to search for it. I did have a feeling that this was discussed before but I had to give it a try.
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Old 12-29-2003, 03:15 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I think its a good film. I wouldnt say he offers any great insight into the tragedy of America's gun problems, but I enjoyed parts of it, thought parts of it were cheap.

I guess, at the end of the day, the fact that thousands of Americans are being shot every day makes him angry, and that is something I find a lot more admirable than people who cling on to a long outdated piece of a constitution that they interpret to say they have the right to own weapons of destruction.

I suppose, the question is, which maybe the film really poses after everything else (and whatever misrepresentations of evidence Moore is accused of) - we know a great many people are being killed in America by guns... is it worth it?

Of course, if you are determined to kill someone, you dont need a gun, but there can be no doubt that the widespread ownership of a weapon that can kill very easily creates more death and violence and fear...

So to people who love their guns, they must all ask, how many deaths, per year, is my right to own this weapon worth? Where do you put the number? 100, 10, 1,000. 10,000? How many lives do we need to know will be saved by controlling the ownership of guns before as a people you decide to give them up?
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Old 12-29-2003, 03:23 PM   #6 (permalink)
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criminals will always have guns reguardless of gun control. Gun control only takes guns out of the law abiding citizens hands (primarly those who aren't shooting other people).
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Old 12-29-2003, 03:25 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Strange Famous

How many lives do we need to know will be saved by controlling the ownership of guns before as a people you decide to give them up?
Show me gun control working and you would have a point. Only it doesn't and in fact it does quite the opposite. Results are what matters NOT intent!
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Old 12-29-2003, 03:32 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rekna
criminals will always have guns reguardless of gun control. Gun control only takes guns out of the law abiding citizens hands (primarly those who aren't shooting other people).
I struggle to think of any purpose a gun can serve other than to shoot someone with?
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Old 12-29-2003, 03:33 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Hunting and Defending your house from criminals
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Old 12-29-2003, 03:34 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Have you ever noticed that isreal doesn't have a lot of armed robberies? They don't have gun control, in fact they encurage people to carry guns with them.

Is a criminal going to rob a place when there is a strong chance that people inside have guns?
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Old 12-29-2003, 03:38 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Strange Famous
I struggle to think of any purpose a gun can serve other than to shoot someone with?
I have shot many firearms, and thousands of rounds of ammo. Want to take a wild guess as to how many people that I have shot? Zero.
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Old 12-29-2003, 03:41 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by seretogis
I have shot many firearms, and thousands of rounds of ammo. Want to take a wild guess as to how many people that I have shot? Zero.
For what purpose?
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Old 12-29-2003, 03:44 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rekna
Hunting and Defending your house from criminals
1 - Killing, torturing, and destroying wild animals is not a justified reason to possess a gun in my opinion

2 - Defending your house by.... shooting anyone who tries to break in?

Which is my point - if a robber didnt think you would have a gun, he wouldnt have a gun - and if he robbed you no one dies at least.

If a robber breaks into your house now, one of you is probably gonna get shot.
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Old 12-29-2003, 03:47 PM   #14 (permalink)
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If a robber didn't think you had a gun he would be able to waltz into any house with a gun and do what he wants. Maybe he will just shoot you then rape your daughter then shooter her. The prospect of victems having guns is definatly a deturent for criminals.

Hunting is justified if done for food and not sport in my oppinion. I don't mind people going dear hunting and such as long as they eat the dear in the end. At least this way the dear has a chance of survival unlike the cows at the slaughter house. But i'll agree with you that hunting for sport is horrible and i'd love to put those hunters who do it for sport on the other end of "their" game.
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Old 12-29-2003, 03:51 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rekna
If a robber didn't think you had a gun he would be able to waltz into any house with a gun and do what he wants. Maybe he will just shoot you then rape your daughter then shooter her. The prospect of victems having guns is definatly a deturent for criminals.

Gun ownership in the UK is still very low (although growing), and no one I know of has ever been attacking by a burgular with a gun, or a rapist with a gun. In the UK, you are probably most likely to be shot (if you are an innocent person and not a drug dealer) by the police.

I would also supsect (although I dont have evidence) that the UK does not have a much greater level of robberies or burgulary compared to the US.
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Old 12-29-2003, 03:57 PM   #16 (permalink)
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The UK also is a very different nation then the US. The UK doesn't have the innercity problem that the US has. The innercity problem the US has does not come from gun ownership however. Much of it comes from oppresion that blacks faced throughout the years and how it led to a violent culter. It only takes a few seeds of violence to create a large problem if the violence isn't solved early. When you have hateful ignorent people treaching young impressionable minds you end up with even more hateful and ignorent people. This is why organizations like the KKK simply appaul me. It is also why much of the Arab world is full of hatered twoard the US.

If kids can be made to believe that the easter bunny is real they can certainly be made to believe that the US is satan.
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Old 12-29-2003, 04:08 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Strange Famous
For what purpose?
Because I thankfully live in a country where law abiding citizens who are of sound mind have the right to own and operate firearms for recreation or self-defense.

It doesn't take much effort to find articles about the UK's rising crime rate in spite of its strict gun control laws, compared to the US's relaxed gun control laws and lowering crime rate.

However, I guess you would have to be interested in the truth to bother searching.

http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/cri...p?story=314832

http://www.dailytelegraph.co.uk/opin...questid=318893

http://search.ft.com/search/article....rch&state=Form

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...2Fncrim123.xml

http://www.tsra.com/UKViolent.htm

http://www.newsmax.com/articles/?a=2000/1/20/115342
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Last edited by seretogis; 12-29-2003 at 04:11 PM..
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Old 12-29-2003, 04:16 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Posting about Michael Moore or mentioning gun control never fails to get some sparks flying, does it?
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Old 12-29-2003, 04:19 PM   #19 (permalink)
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posting anything by extreamists has that response. I'd love to see people start posting Rush Limbagh comments. Only thing different between Rush and Moore (other than the pole they fall on) is Moore hasn't completely lost all his credibility yet since he is still fairly new to the political scene.
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Old 12-29-2003, 04:37 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Strange Famous
1 - Killing, torturing, and destroying wild animals is not a justified reason to possess a gun in my opinion

2 - Defending your house by.... shooting anyone who tries to break in?

Which is my point - if a robber didnt think you would have a gun, he wouldnt have a gun - and if he robbed you no one dies at least.

If a robber breaks into your house now, one of you is probably gonna get shot.
I understand this was directed towards someone else, but I'd like to address the points as well.

1 - It's that or buying venison from a slaughter house. I'd take a shotgun blast to the face over having my throat slit any day, hunting is kinder to the animal then buying your meat through a middle-man.

Furthermore, there is no torture involved with hunting, you kill a deer for food and sport, you kill rodents because they're pests and you kill aggressive animals (rabid dogs, mean dogs, bears, etc.) to protect yourself. If you have any moral objections to eating meat, then that's for a different thread. Although noone really cares anyways it turns out.

2 - Yes.

You're damn right he's going to get shot. You don't break into peoples homes, especially if they have the means to defend themselves.
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Old 12-29-2003, 04:39 PM   #21 (permalink)
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I think getting into a debate on gun control misses the point of Bowling for Columbine. He doesn't pretend to have the answer, that is what he is searching for.

I've found that most Moore bashers spend all their time trying to unveil relatively minor inconsistencies in his work as opposed to tackling the real issue at hand.

So, I have a question for everyone. Why do you think Americans kill each other so much more than any other Western country?


SLM3
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Old 12-29-2003, 04:40 PM   #22 (permalink)
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I'm sorry this thread is my fault. I just couldn't let it go.....

I started out well and should have left it at that.
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Old 12-29-2003, 04:44 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Quote:
But i'll agree with you that hunting for sport is horrible and i'd love to put those hunters who do it for sport on the other end of "their" game.
Sport hunters do far more to preserve and protect wildlife than all other groups combined.
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Old 12-29-2003, 04:45 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by SLM3
I think getting into a debate on gun control misses the point of Bowling for Columbine. He doesn't pretend to have the answer, that is what he is searching for.

I've found that most Moore bashers spend all their time trying to unveil relatively minor inconsistencies in his work as opposed to tackling the real issue at hand.

So, I have a question for everyone. Why do you think Americans kill each other so much more than any other Western country?


SLM3

I don't think you will find a simple answer to that question. There are far to many factors at fault. Family values, heritage, media, culture, disparity between the rich and the poor. Many of the same reasons that there is much animosity for the US amoung Arab nations.
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Old 12-29-2003, 04:47 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by SLM3
I think getting into a debate on gun control misses the point of Bowling for Columbine. He doesn't pretend to have the answer, that is what he is searching for.

I've found that most Moore bashers spend all their time trying to unveil relatively minor inconsistencies in his work as opposed to tackling the real issue at hand.

So, I have a question for everyone. Why do you think Americans kill each other so much more than any other Western country?


SLM3
Americans have always been prone to a sort of "frontier justice" mentality, those were our roots. Also the frictions between classes/races/etc. in this country are magnified through the lens of our culture, which likes everything to be bigger...
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Old 12-29-2003, 05:40 PM   #26 (permalink)
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To quote Chris Rock: "Don't go to parties with metal detectors, sure, it may feel safe on the inside, but the motherfuckers on the outside know you ain't got one." If you take away guns, and criminals will have access to them (black market, etc.), they will know that you do not have one and will have free shots at your house.

I might agree with Moore on his stance of media-induced fear if i visit a foreign country (Canada, England, France, Britain) and watch their news and see what they report on. The reports that I have heard have said that Moore pieced together film clips and others so he might be a little biased.
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Old 12-29-2003, 05:49 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rekna
I don't think you will find a simple answer to that question. There are far to many factors at fault. Family values, heritage, media, culture, disparity between the rich and the poor. Many of the same reasons that there is much animosity for the US amoung Arab nations.
You think the US is unique enough in these ways to account for the massive difference? What about the history of England, or Germany? They have much more blood on their hands, historically, as well as a big gap between rich and poor. They watch the same movies, and are subject to the same world events. I don't see the major difference that would account for the massively different body counts.

SLM3

P.S. I truly hope you don't think Arab nations (a vague enough generalization as is) resent the US because of its culture. If anything, many Arabs spend much of their time trying to emulate it.
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Old 12-29-2003, 05:54 PM   #28 (permalink)
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By the media I do not believe he was referring to movies as movies are distrubuted around the world.

The other countries also do not have a President whose focus right now is on the well-being of another nation (Iraq) then on its own country. Why go in to Iraq, destroy it, pay to rebuild it, when our own country has its own needs?
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Old 12-29-2003, 06:24 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by SLM3
You think the US is unique enough in these ways to account for the massive difference? What about the history of England, or Germany? They have much more blood on their hands, historically, as well as a big gap between rich and poor. They watch the same movies, and are subject to the same world events. I don't see the major difference that would account for the massively different body counts.

SLM3

P.S. I truly hope you don't think Arab nations (a vague enough generalization as is) resent the US because of its culture. If anything, many Arabs spend much of their time trying to emulate it.
America is unique in that it is the ME ME ME ME society. Sure we want guns, money, big ass houses, heck i live in one. Do you think many people that you walk to talk to today in this society know that 20000 people dies in Iraq this past weekend or do you think they know that micheal jackson got beat up the LAPD, or that the packers made into the play-offs. C'mon people this is all we care about me me me.....
I was leaving work tonite and i was getting into my car...a very small compact car, and the woman next to me got into her huge ass SUV and she said to me that she wouldn't want to be in that little car and get hit by an SUV as big as hers. But i said if we all had little cars like mine, we wouldn't have to worry about.
Kinda like if all of us didn't have guns, we wouldn't have to worry about people killing other people. I live in a state that want to allow concealed weapons......WHY??? I don't want those bastards hiding them......I don't like guns at all....but if they have to be there i want them out in the front, where i can see them.
For all the sportsmen out there.....People can hunt with them, but why do you need to hunt with an automatic machine gun, or hand guns....you don't.... so get rid of them.

Woooo i'm ramblin....
got a little off topic.
sorry
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Old 12-29-2003, 06:35 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nad Adam
I'll just say it was entertaining.
It was entertaining to me too.
I'm also entertained at how angry people get when discussing it. From that perspective, it's quite a success also.
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Old 12-29-2003, 08:47 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Strange Famous
1

Which is my point - if a robber didnt think you would have a gun, he wouldnt have a gun - and if he robbed you no one dies at least.

So robbers never break in and kill unarmed people? Man you are better than a Jim Carrey movie.
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Old 12-29-2003, 08:52 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by mrbuck12000
America is unique in that it is the ME ME ME ME society. Sure we want guns, money, big ass houses, heck i live in one. Do you think many people that you walk to talk to today in this society know that 20000 people dies in Iraq this past weekend or do you think they know that micheal jackson got beat up the LAPD, or that the packers made into the play-offs. C'mon people this is all we care about me me me.....
I was leaving work tonite and i was getting into my car...a very small compact car, and the woman next to me got into her huge ass SUV and she said to me that she wouldn't want to be in that little car and get hit by an SUV as big as hers. But i said if we all had little cars like mine, we wouldn't have to worry about.
Kinda like if all of us didn't have guns, we wouldn't have to worry about people killing other people. I live in a state that want to allow concealed weapons......WHY??? I don't want those bastards hiding them......I don't like guns at all....but if they have to be there i want them out in the front, where i can see them.
For all the sportsmen out there.....People can hunt with them, but why do you need to hunt with an automatic machine gun, or hand guns....you don't.... so get rid of them.

Woooo i'm ramblin....
got a little off topic.
sorry
Mr b
First off 20,000 people were not killed in Iraq this weekend. 40,000 died in IRAN. Second, thank those lawful people that are carring concealed guns sine you will also reap the rewards. When you walk down a street, a potential mugger will wonder if you are packing a rod, since it will now be legal, and decide not to mess with you, Even though you are not carring a gun, the mugger will not know for sure and err on the side of caution.

Food for thought, why does crime go down everywhere conceal carry laws are passed?
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Old 12-29-2003, 08:54 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by floydthebarber
It was entertaining to me too.
I'm also entertained at how angry people get when discussing it. From that perspective, it's quite a success also.
People should get angry when a fictious movie wins best oscar.

Did the thread starter read Ustwo's links? Iam curious as to what he has to say about the information he read.
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Old 12-29-2003, 09:01 PM   #34 (permalink)
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My biggest problem with BFC is the lies. My second biggest problem is how Moore is taken seriously when he does such shoody research.
Instead of talking to counselors, psychologists and such as to why the Columbine shooters killed, he suggests (erroneously) that they must have did it because the littleton plant makes WMD, when that is absurd, and it doesnt even make WMD.
In Roger and Me, Moore talks to everyone about Flint Michigan's problems EXCEPT the then govennor and Mayor of the place.
He blames DIck Clark for the murder of that child whoes name escapes me, not the crack head parents.
He makes a cartoon that shows the NRA and KKK holding hands and lighting a cross when the NRA was ESSENTIAL to forcing congress to enacting Anti KKK legistation and even trained blacks in gun handeling in order to protect them selves against the KKK. Something that is OPPOSITE of what Moore shows in his little fiction of a film.
He lied to the people in his film so they would be in it. Their reactions to this, and all the evidence to back up what I a saying are in Ustwo's links.
And worst of all, he edited two of HEston's speeches into a fictional speech that was OPPOSITE of what Heston was actually saying.


Why does someone who has the the "truth" on his side have to resort to such chicanary?

So why do people get mad when Moore is brought up? Because he is a dangerous minister of lies and propaganda. I am amazed that the learned seekers of truth on these threads are not all outraged by Moore's lies.
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Old 12-29-2003, 09:06 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Endymon32
First off 20,000 people were not killed in Iraq this weekend. 40,000 died in IRAN. Second, thank those lawful people that are carring concealed guns sine you will also reap the rewards. When you walk down a street, a potential mugger will wonder if you are packing a rod, since it will now be legal, and decide not to mess with you, Even though you are not carring a gun, the mugger will not know for sure and err on the side of caution.

Food for thought, why does crime go down everywhere conceal carry laws are passed?

Or perhaps that mugger will just shoot first and not give you the chance to go for the gun you might or might not have under your jacket.

The point is, who are you to tell me exactly what any mugger/criminal is thinking at any point in time? You'll excuse me if I don't take comfort in your mind reading abilities.


SLM3
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Old 12-29-2003, 09:22 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Just to be fair:


Michael Moore's response to the "wacko attackos"


SLM3
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Old 12-29-2003, 09:38 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by SLM3
Just to be fair:


Michael Moore's response to the "wacko attackos"


SLM3
Hehe that was cute, Moore attempted to explain about 1/20th of the 'lies' away. He ignored most of them (like the NRA/KKK linkage of his).
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Old 12-29-2003, 09:46 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by SLM3
Or perhaps that mugger will just shoot first and not give you the chance to go for the gun you might or might not have under your jacket.

The point is, who are you to tell me exactly what any mugger/criminal is thinking at any point in time? You'll excuse me if I don't take comfort in your mind reading abilities.


SLM3
Right just start blasting away in a crowd full of armed people..

So I ask again, why did crime go down in every place with a concealed carry law? You never answerd.
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Old 12-29-2003, 09:49 PM   #39 (permalink)
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http://www.fraserinstitute.ca/shared...sNav=pb&id=604
Quote:
The Failed Experiment: Gun Control and Public Safety in Canada, Australia, England and Wales
Publication Date: November 2003

Author(s):
Gary Mauser, Professor
Email: Gary_Mauser@sfu.ca

Executive Summary: Widely televised firearm murders in many countries during the 20th Century have spurred politicians to introduce restrictive gun laws. The politicians then promise that the new restrictions will reduce criminal violence and "create a safer society." It is time to pause and ask if gun laws actually do reduce criminal violence.

Gun laws must be demonstrated to cut violent crime or gun control is no more than a hollow promise. What makes gun control so compelling for many is the belief that violent crime is driven by the availability of guns and, more importantly, that criminal violence in general may be reduced by limiting access to firearms.

In this study, the author examines crime trends in Commonwealth countries that have recently introduced firearm regulations: i.e., Great Britain, Australia, and Canada. The widely ignored key to evaluating firearm regulations is to examine trends in total violent crime, not just firearms crime. Since firearms are only a small fraction of criminal violence, the public would not be safer if the new law could reduce firearm violence but had no effect on total criminal violence.

The United States provides a valuable point of comparison for assessing crime rates because the criminal justice system there differs so drastically from those in Europe and the Commonwealth. Not only are criminal penalties typically more severe in the United States, often much more severe, but also conviction and incarceration rates are usually much higer. Perhaps the most striking difference is that qualified citizens in the United States can carry concealed handguns for self-defence. During the past few decades, more than 25 states in the United States passed laws allowing responsible citizens to carry concealed handguns. In 2003, there are 35 states where citizens can get such a permit.

The upshot is that violent crime rates, and homicide rates in particular, have been falling in the United States. The drop in the American crime rate is even more impressive when compared with the rest of the world.

See gun laws favor the criminal element.
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Old 12-29-2003, 09:52 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Vancouver, BC - Restrictive firearm legislation has failed to reduce gun violence in Australia, Canada, or Great Britain. The policy of confiscating guns has been an expensive failure, according to a new paper The Failed Experiment: Gun Control and Public Safety in Canada, Australia, England and Wales, released today by The Fraser Institute.

“What makes gun control so compelling for many is the belief that violent crime is driven by the availability of guns, and more importantly, that criminal violence in general may be reduced by limiting access to firearms,” says Gary Mauser, author of the paper and professor of business at Simon Fraser University.

This new study examines crime trends in Commonwealth countries that have recently introduced firearm regulations. Mauser notes that the widely ignored key to evaluating firearm regulations is to examine trends in total violent crime, not just firearm crime.

The United States provides a valuable point of comparison for assessing crime rates as that country has witnessed a dramatic drop in criminal violence over the past decade – for example, the homicide rate in the US has fallen 42 percent since 1991. This is particularly significant when compared with the rest of the world – in 18 of the 25 countries surveyed by the British Home Office, violent crime increased during the 1990s.

The justice system in the U.S. differs in many ways from those in the Commonwealth but perhaps the most striking difference is that qualified citizens in the United States can carry concealed handguns for self-defence. During the past few decades, more than 25 states in the U.S. have passed laws allowing responsible citizens to carry concealed handguns. In 2003, there are 35 states where citizens can get such a permit.

Disarming the public has not reduced criminal violence in any country examined in this study. In all these cases, disarming the public has been ineffective, expensive, and often counter productive. In all cases, the effort meant setting up expensive bureaucracies that produce no noticeable improvement to public safety or have made the situation worse. Mauser points to these trends in the countries he examined:

England and Wales

Both Conservative and Labour governments have introduced restrictive firearms laws over the past 20 years; all handguns were banned in 1997.

Yet in the 1990s alone, the homicide rate jumped 50 percent, going from 10 per million in 1990 to 15 per million in 2000. While not yet as high as the US, in 2002 gun crime in England and Wales increased by 35 percent. This is the fourth consecutive year that gun crime has increased.

Police statistics show that violent crime in general has increased since the late 1980s and since 1996 has been more serious than in the United States.

Australia

The Australian government made sweeping changes to the firearms legislation in 1997. However, the total homicide rate, after having remained basically flat from 1995 to 2001, has now begun climbing again. While violent crime is decreasing in the United States, it is increasing in Australia. Over the past six years, the overall rate of violent crime in Australia has been on the rise – for example, armed robberies have jumped 166 percent nationwide.

The confiscation and destruction of legally owned firearms has cost Australian taxpayers at least $500 million. The cost of the police services bureaucracy, including the costly infrastructure of the gun registration system, has increased by $200 million since 1997.

“And for what?” asks Mauser. “There has been no visible impact on violent crime. It is impossible to justify such a massive amount of the taxpayers’ money for no decrease in crime. For that kind of tax money, the police could have had more patrol cars, shorter shifts, or better equipment.”

Canada

The contrast between the criminal violence rates in the United States and in Canada is dramatic. Over the past decade, the rate of violent crime in Canada has increased while in the United States the violent crime rate has plummeted. The homicide rate is dropping faster in the US than in Canada.

The Canadian experiment with firearm registration is becoming a farce says Mauser. The effort to register all firearms, which was originally claimed to cost only $2 million, has now been estimated by the Auditor General to top $1 billion. The final costs are unknown but, if the costs of enforcement are included, the total could easily reach $3 billion.

“It is an illusion that gun bans protect the public. No law, no matter how restrictive, can protect us from people who decide to commit violent crimes. Maybe we should crack down on criminals rather than hunters and target shooters?” says Mauser.

- 30 -

Established in 1974, The Fraser Institute is an independent public policy organization based in Vancouver, with offices in Calgary and Toronto.
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