The merged Gay Marriage thread

[Sparhawk]

"The right to marry whoever one wishes is an elementary human right compared to which 'the right to attend an integrated school, the right to sit where one pleases on a bus, the right to go into any hotel or recreation area or place of amusement, regardless of one's skin or color or race' are minor indeed. Even political rights, like the right to vote, and nearly all other rights enumerated in the Constitution, are secondary to the inalienable human rights to 'life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness' proclaimed in the Declaration of Independence; and to this category the right to home and marriage unquestionably belongs." - Hannah Arendt, Dissent, Winter 1959.

There really isn't anything I can add to this, but I do hope it gets some people thinking.

[supersix2]

Based on the laws of the United States and the Constitution there is nothing that makes gay marriage wrong or illegal. The only basis anyone has for making it illegal is religous beliefs. There is nothing wrong with having religous beliefs but they should not influence law making. The constitution declares that we are all created equal and we all are entitled to equal rights. As a result, it would be unconstitutional, and therefore un-American to make illegal gay marriage.
Regardless of your relgious beliefs you must admit that a law banning gay marriage would be unconstitutional.

[skyscan]

Ok, let’s go through the steps to figure this one out.

Ask anyone who has a problem with same-sex marriage these questions.

A) Is marriage a religious matter?

Y) Go to question B
N) Then, same sex marriages are fine, not a religious matter thus, a legal one where everyone's rights should be the same.

B) Do you have a problem with non-religious people getting married, (leave it male and female)?

Y) Many non-religious people get married each year (Vegas anyone), and it's legal, why not same sex?
N) Then it isn't a religious event, thus Same-sex couples can marry and enjoy the same legal rights as everyone else.

Also, if they insist that it IS a religious matter, that’s ok. If it is a religious matter then how about no constitutional amendment because that would break separation of church and state.

(feel free to poke holes in or fix anything)

[hammer4all]

Tom Tomorrow's cartoon today:

[BenChuy]

Originally posted by Mojo_PeiPei
2/3's of one of the most liberal states in the country voted for this. Now you have a rogue mayor committing a felonious act by knowingly and willingly breaking state law. This shit is ridiculous, not to mention it sets a horrible precident. Perhaps whats most upsetting is that no one is really doing anything about it.

Now, WHAT city is he mayor of? If you looked at their poll of what they voted for, you would probably see a radical difference.

And i must say, the homophobia (a psychological disease) in this country is rampant!
If a couple of guys getting married, or two womyn getting married makes your dick feel small, buy a bigger SUV.

I for one am married to my wife and when i find people who share the passion and commitment to their significant other that i and my wife feel for each other it brings me hope. this includes the wonderful long-term gay and lesbian couples i know.

This country is not going to pot because of liberals. it is because of self-centered people in general! Looking beyond one's self, thinking of other people (wow! it's a Damned CHRISTIAN value: USE IT ASSHOLES!) will turn this country around. Why do other countries hate us? Because our wants are paramount. Do you see the pattern? Quit this selfish cycle and things can change. ok... wow. that was a rant...

[Mojo_PeiPei]

We christians don't hate the homo's, we dissapprove of the homosexuality.

[BenChuy]

Originally posted by Mojo_PeiPei
We christians don't hate the homo's, we dissapprove of the homosexuality.

Speak for your self. I know many christians who are like you. I feel that they are my friends. i _hear_ more christians, more often. who sew hate pointed towards homosexuals. These are the assholes that i am talking about. I doubt that you would enjoy them either.

[brianna]

Originally posted by Mojo_PeiPei
We christians don't hate the homo's, we dissapprove of the homosexuality.

If you had any respect for homosexual you'd refrain from referring to them in such a derogatory manner.

Since sexuality is one of the main things that defines a person hating someone's sexuality is akin to hating the person.

[Lebell]

Originally posted by Mojo_PeiPei
We christians don't hate the homo's, we dissapprove of the homosexuality.

Please speak for yourself.

I am a Christian who doesn't believe there is anything sinful about homosexuality.

[FoolThemAll]

Yep, a distinction must be made between homosexuality and homosexual behavior; the former cannot possibly be sinful. And then there are Christians like me who don't believe that the latter is sinful either. (Did you mean the former, or both, Lebell?)

[Sparhawk]

Originally posted by FoolThemAll
Yep, a distinction must be made between homosexuality and homosexual behavior; the former cannot possibly be sinful. And then there are Christians like me who don't believe that the latter is sinful either. (Did you mean the former, or both, Lebell?)

I'm a Christian as well, and I don't see the distinction, just like I don't see the distinction between heterosexuality and heterosexual behavior.

[FoolThemAll]

Inclination to behave in a particular way versus behaving in that particular way. Generally, heterosexuals don't have the inclination, although it's certainly possible for them to engage in the behavior.

[BenChuy]

Denying the urge to love someone? is that considered healthy? How can love (yes, i know what real love is and have seen it in gay couples) be bad for you when it it mutual?

[Lebell]

Originally posted by FoolThemAll
Yep, a distinction must be made between homosexuality and homosexual behavior; the former cannot possibly be sinful. And then there are Christians like me who don't believe that the latter is sinful either. (Did you mean the former, or both, Lebell?)

In a nutshell, my thought process goes like this:

There is pretty good evidence that homosexuality is genetic.
God doesn't make things sinful by nature.
Therefore homosexuality isn't sinful.

That's why I support homosexual marriage.

[BenChuy]

from what i have read homosexuality can be plotted like this:
A subset of the culture is predisposed to possibly be gay (bi), but factors effect the final move into homosexuality.
1. Molestation/rape
2. Poor relations (abuse) with father (gay) or mother (lesbian)
3. communication about subtle feelings for same sex frowned upon and quieted (festering guilt)

Not all of these need to be present, but often are. The personalities were based on a modified Myers-Briggs test.

in talking with all of my gay friends (mind you, they had to all be drunk at one of my cast parties) almost all of them had poor relations with their same sex parents and at least 4/5ths were admitting to being molested or raped at the time.

just for thought.
btw, i consider myself emotionally bi, i have the personality and one other trait.

[Mojo_PeiPei]

To give you guys an idea where I'm coming from:

Life is God's most sacred gift. Life is a foundation of marriage. Marriage is between a man and a woman.

[brianna]

Originally posted by Mojo_PeiPei
To give you guys an idea where I'm coming from:

Life is God's most sacred gift. Life is a foundation of marriage. Marriage is between a man and a woman.

Great, go ahead and believe that -- but it's not an argument against the legality gay marriage if it's based on religion.

[Mojo_PeiPei]

Like I've stated before I could care less if somes gays want to get married, I agree with everyone when they say that they are entitled the same rights and protections under the law as everyone else.

[jazzwyld]

I'll have to quote Jon Stewart...are they going to make us marry gay now. Just poppy cock this whole thing, let two people love each other with the same protection and rights as any other heterosexual couple

[Conclamo Ludus]

Originally posted by jazzwyld
I'll have to quote Jon Stewart...are they going to make us marry gay now. Just poppy cock this whole thing, let two people love each other with the same protection and rights as any other heterosexual couple

But that might make us all gay.

[supersix2]

I don't even understand why this is such an issue. To me there are far more important problems facing this country than what two people do in the privacy of thier own house. This is a constitutional issue for me not a religous one. Although my religious beliefs play a tiny moral factor into my position on this issue.
From a religious standpoint I am Roman Catholic by religion but I never go to church. I do believe in God and the teaching of Jesus so I am a Christian. God may or may not have a problem with homosexuality but shouldn't the final judgement be left up to Him. Who are we to dictate God's will anyway.
From a constiutional and political standpoint a law opposing gay marriage should enrage and frighten any logical thinking American. That would be another law by the government to infringe on our personal lives. The government of the United States was NOT designed to interfere with our personal lives. I believe that it is un-American to support this law. I TOTALLY disagree with Bush and any politician who supports a law banning gay marriage. Plus as I said earlier this should be a non-issue. There are far more pressing issues facing this country such as terrorism and the economy. Lets focus on whats important and what is good for the whole country not just the fundamentalist christians.

[filtherton]

Its not really an issue. It is an election year effort by karl rove to pander to the religious right. The amendment will never go through and rove knows this. Its just an issue that they hope to use to divide the dems and erode their support.