crfpilot

NEW ORLEANS, La. (Reuters) - A military jury found an anti-war U.S. Marine reservist guilty of unauthorized absence and sentenced him to six months in jail for refusing to report to his unit during the Iraq (news - web sites) war, his lawyer said on Sunday.



The verdict was less than the desertion charge the U.S. military had sought, which could have put Lance Cpl. Stephen Funk behind bars for a year, but defense attorney Stephen Collier said he would still appeal for a lighter sentence.


Funk, 21, has said he was the target of unfair prosecution because he was a conscientious objector who spoke at anti-war rallies. He was the only one of 28 Marine conscientious objectors to the Iraq war to face prosecution, but the military said that was because he was the only who did not report for duty.


A jury of four Marines reached the verdict late on Saturday after two days of testimony in a court martial at the 4th Service Support Group command, headquarters for the Marine Reserve, in New Orleans, which is where the Marine Corps processes conscientious objector cases.


Collier argued that Funk did not respond to his unit's call up on Feb. 9 because he claimed conscientious objector status and believed he would not be deployed. His unit, based in San Jose, California, loads cargo for transport.


But prosecutors said his refusal to report was a simple case of desertion.


Funk also informed the military he was gay, but military Judge John Maksym forbade that from being an issue in the court-martial.


Collier said Funk, who was immediately sent to jail, took the jury's decision well.


"Stephen was ready to serve some time. He knew this was likely to happen," he told Reuters.


Funk also will receive a bad conduct discharge from the military, Collier said.

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I think he should have received a longer sentence. The good thing is that he will receive a bad conduct discharge, which pretty much will ruin his life. He will not be able to get anything more than a minimum wage job, I hope he enjoys the rest of his miserable life.

The thing I don't get is why do these conscientious objectors join the military? Is it because they want all the education benifits and veteran's benifits, but when it comes time to do their job they renig on there oath.

BTW I did 8 years in the USMC and would have proudly gone to Iraq if I was called upon.

What do ya think? Are there any conscientious objectors here on TFP? Did you serve your country?

CrazySaturn

I'm willing to serve my country for anything it needs...


....except for this one thing. Yeah, right.

__________________
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Silvy

While I'm strongly against the Iraq war (and all wars in general), I do think it is your duty as a soldier to serve your country (I know I would if need arose).

All in all I think he was tried and judged for the right reasons.

__________________
"Do not kill. Do not rape. Do not steal. These are principles which every man of every faith can embrace. "
- Murphy MacManus (Boondock Saints)

filtherton

I bet a lot of people who joined the mililtary for college benefits regret their decision now. That being said, this guy should've just claimed homosexuality from the get-go if he wanted out so bad.

phredgreen

i'm not quite sure about this fellow. on one hand, you have the army out there advertising like hell about learning job skills and improving oneself and travelling the world, but i garuntee you there's not one recruiter that'll tell you just how ugly war can be. most people will join in for the benefits, server their minimum term, and move on, having learned something to further their lives, but i think alot of people do get cold feet when faced with the reality of war. i think that not showing up wasn't the way to deal with this. there is a process that conciencious objectors must go through to have their case heard fairly. this guy just plain not showing up was a mistake, his throwing in an "oh yeah, i'm also gay" seems more like a last-minute play for leniency, but again, it's too little too late. he made his mistakes, now he's paying for them. leave it at that. there are too many other injustices in the world to focus our attention on this guy who got what he had coming to him.

__________________
My country is the world, and my religion is to do good.
- Thomas Paine

krwlz

Its pretty simple, in the military, you are NOT pad to think, or have an opinion. Your paid to follow orders to the best of your ability. He failed to do so. He deserves whatever they can nail him with.

Shauk

just because someone doesnt agree with you on one area of conduct doesn't mean they arent a good person at heart. Im optimisitic that people are inherently good people to start.

dont sit there and play condemnation of someone you've never met.

thats just dumb.

Stud

Technically I think he could be sentenced to death for this.

As an ex-soldier I can tell you soldiers can do some stupid things.

uncle phil

in my mind, anyone who enlists in the military knows the risks, as does anyone else who enrolls in a potentially dangerous occupation. this guy got off easy...

__________________
"We were wrong, terribly wrong. (We) should not have tried to fight a guerrilla war with conventional military tactics against a foe willing to absorb enormous casualties...in a country lacking the fundamental political stability necessary to conduct effective military and pacification operations. It could not be done and it was not done."
- Robert S. McNamara
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"We will take our napalm and flame throwers out of the land that scarcely knows the use of matches...
We will leave you your small joys and smaller troubles."
- Eugene McCarthy in "Vietnam Message"
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never wrestle with a pig.
you both get dirty;
the pig likes it.

Macheath

If you want to establish conscientious objector status and you're in the military, read this journal of one conscientious objector's experiences:

http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/6181/applic.htm

Note that serving conscientious objectors can be honorably discharged.

If you're a civilian who wants to establish conscientious objector status should the draft be reinstated; read this article:

http://www.natcath.org/NCR_Online/ar...03/032103i.htm

Note that a conscientious objector can and should still apply for selective service. The key is extensive documentation of beliefs. Conscientious objectors, by definition, oppose ALL war.

Oh yeah, it sounds like this guy was an idiot and accepts his punishment.

Jonsgirl

I can say that I was heartily against the Iraqi war, until Pres. Bush announced that it was offical. At that point whether or not I agreed with it was moot. My president said go to war, and I would have went.
I see nothing wrong with having conscientious objectors in the military. There are hundreds of roles they can fill and still serve thier country. Is it such a bad thing to not 'want' to kill people?
I believe that he was justly punished for the only actual crime he commited.
I wonder what exactly makes you feel that he should've been more harshly judged. Ok, granted that the guy acted very foolishly, but why is it a good thing that the man's life is probably ruined?

Ugh. Jarheads. I'll never understand you guys. (j/k nothing but respect for the corps.)

__________________
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But it won't be today, and it won't be you.

crfpilot

From article 85 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice:

(c) Any person found guilty of desertion or attempt to desert shall be punished, if the offense is committed in time of war, by death or such other punishment as a court-martial may direct, but if the desertion or attempt to desert occurs at any other time, by such punishment, other than death, as a court-martial may direct.

I just think 6 months is a little lite considering the maximum sentence is death. Edit:I think 2-4 years incarceration would have been a reasonable punishment, but that's just my opinion. I respect the guy for taking his punishment like a man though.

As a cargo loader he would have a very slim chance of ever having to kill anyone.

shalafi

I dont think theres anyone who can credibly claim that they joined the Marines without knowing they could be called upon to go to war. And as an ex-marine friend used to say U.S.M.C. stands for U Signed the Mother-fucking Contract.

Leviathan[NCV]

I've gotta agree, he had this coming.

WhoaitsZ

don't hurt me.

i am not sure what kinds of protesting he did. if he was doing general protesting, no problem. in other words, no rioting or flag burning.

but, as stated, he was inprisoned because he went AWOL. 27 (?) other protestors in the Marines were not court marshelled. they didn't go AWOL.

unlike many people, holding opposing thoughts is not too difficult for me. i could understand him protesting and he has that right. every man has (or should have) the right to speak; especially a soldier.

however, going AWOL is nothing short of juvenile and he fucked up. tough shit.

if you can't pay, do NOT play.

what pissed me off was the 'i'm gay' statement.

i thought he would want equal treatment?

what a fucking loser.

smooth

My Grandfather was a Republican and a conscientious objector. He was drafted into WW2 but worked as some kind of medical staff on the front lines and decided to not carry arms. I think that was very admirable and heroic to face risks like that due to his beliefs.

After his time he went to college on the GI bill and learned to farm--he was Native American with an 8th grade education. His tractor rolled off a mountain and crushed him when my mother was about 14.

I put the party affiliation in there because my Grandma's second husband was a feisty Democrat. And I do mean feisty--a card carrying Wobbly.

He signed up for every damn war there was (I, II, and Korean, IIRC). He spent time as a parajumper (I think they had wooden propellor panes back then, lol) and his 'civilian' time as a merchant marine.

Some socialist, huh?

__________________
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"You measure democracy by the freedom it gives its dissidents, not the freedom it gives its assimilated conformists." -- Abbie Hoffman

krd913

He signed up to get money for school but when the time came to pay it back by doing your job he didn't want to he knew this wasn't the girlscouts when he raised his hand and said I will

BigGov

It doesn't matter, it's disobeying an order, which should carry a heavy sentence. Especially for a marine. No matter what a soldier thinks of an order, he's supposed to obey it.

Zeld2.0

Well I agree it was a bit light for something that he did was very stupid - and he got off easy. I mean theres many who can object to killing and still serve their country fine.

But Jimmy4 - thats not entirely true. Its true that when you're in the military they don't necessarily want you to think. But at the same time, they promot the soldier to think. Thats what always set the U.S. soldier apart from other nations

Instead of sitting there waiting for speicfics, they can improvise and make it happen. They dont need to ask their superiors what to do.

They're obviosly not gonna follow an order to "go kill yourself" - obviously its following rational orders. But i think saying that you're supposed to follow any order is a bit off. And I hate to say it, but i hate it when people label soldiers as being robots. Its true theres tons of idiots but thats what separates the great ones from the bad ones.

BigGov

Obviously our soldiers go out an improvise in the field, but it's a little hard to do so when they ignore a direct order to just report for duty. The two are a little different

__________________
One day an Englishman, a Scotsman, and an Irishman walked into a pub together. They each bought a pint of Guinness. Just as they were about to enjoy their creamy beverage, three flies landed in each of their pints. The Englishman pushed his beer away in disgust. The Scotsman fished the fly out of his beer and continued drinking it, as if nothing had happened. The Irishman, too, picked the fly out of his drink but then held it out over the beer and yelled "SPIT IT OUT, SPIT IT OUT, YOU BASTARD!"

onetime2

Got off easy (at least as far as the sentencing). He screwed over not just the Corps but his fellow Marines who were counting on HIM to do his job. Instead some other grunt was sent in his place. All the training, food, housing, etc that the taxpayers paid for was wasted on him.

__________________
Strive to be more curious than ignorant.

archer2371

Yeah, this guy deserves his sentence, and plus military law is completely different from civilian law (tho I'm sure you guys know this). Personally I don't think this guy should appeal, because if you appeal, there's a higher chance for conviction of the lesser sentence and/or a tougher sentence. Hopefully he has some green horn Lieutenant for a prosecutor and not an R. Lee Ermey type Sarn't.

__________________
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"Hey Grif, Chupathingy...how bout that? I like it...got a ring to it."

"I have no earthly idea what it is I just saw, or what this place is, or where in the hell O'Malley is! My only choice is to blame Grif for coming up with such a flawed plan. Stupid, stupid Grif."

Sun Tzu

Taking nothing away from what he did (I agree with Uncle Phil-his sentence was light) I would rather the few who would do this action (or lack thereof) not show up than to have multiple lives count on their performance. When I was enlisted (Navy corpsman) we called these kind of people "shitbags" and there presence actually puts peoples lives in danger. Usually their performance will be their undoing, but some manage to slither through and continue with borderline satisfactory evals never promoted to higher ranks. I'd rather these people not show up.

Just so it doesnt sound like Im blasting any political parties I wont state a name. But its hypocracy like this that pisses me off and shows some major problems in the core values of certain areas of our government. A certain US president (not Clinton- although he did some F*&#@# up shit of his own) who was a commisioned officer has dishonorable history of being a deserter, but because of who he was it was looked over and he got away with it. In my eyes this man commited an offense every bit as bad as this person, but was let off and allowed to become President. IMO this mocks the system, as do allot things I suppose. Right or wrong there have been too many Americans that have given their lives (whether the agreed or not) for someone to skate by like this.

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To confine our attention to terrestrial matters would be to limit the human spirit.- Stephen Hawking

Slims

If he wasn't willing to fight or serve in any capacity that the military told him to, then he shouldn't have signed up for the reserves, taken the oath, or recieved a paycheck from the marines.

He should have been found guilty of desertion.

__________________
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." - Winston Churchill

"All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act out their dream with open eyes, to make it possible." Seven Pillars of Wisdom, T.E. Lawrence