US troops turn botched Saddam raid into a massacre - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

smooth · 08-01-2003, 01:00 AM

US troops turn botched Saddam raid into a massacre

by Robert Fisk • Monday July 28, 2003 at 08:55 PM

Obsessed with capturing Saddam Hussein, American soldiers turned a botched raid on a house in the Mansur district of Baghdad yesterday into a bloodbath.

US troops turn botched Saddam raid into a massacre

By Robert Fisk in Baghdad

28 July 2003: (The Independent) Obsessed with capturing Saddam Hussein, American soldiers turned a botched raid on a house in the Mansur district of Baghdad yesterday into a bloodbath, opening fire on scores of Iraqi civilians in a crowded street and killing up to 11, including two children, their mother and crippled father. At least one civilian car caught fire, cremating its occupants.

The vehicle carrying the two children and their mother and father was riddled by bullets as it approached a razor-wired checkpoint outside the house.

Amid the fury generated among the largely middle-class residents of Mansur - by ghastly coincidence, the killings were scarcely 40 metres from the houses in which 16 civilians died when the Americans tried to kill Saddam towards the end of the war in April - whatever political advantages were gained by the killing of Saddam's sons have been squandered. A doctor at the Yarmouk hospital, which received four of the dead, turned on me angrily last night, shouting: "If an American came to my emergency room, maybe I would kill him."

Two civilians, both believed to have been driving with their families, were brought to the Yarmouk, one with abdominal wounds and the other with "his brain outside of his head", according to another doctor.

At the scene of the killings, there was pandemonium. While US troops were loading the bullet-shattered cars on trucks - and trying to stop cameramen filming the carnage - crowds screamed abuse at them. One American soldier a few feet from me climbed into the seat of his
Humvee, threw his helmet on the floor of the vehicle and shouted: "Shit! Shit!"

There was no doubt about the target: the home of Sheikh Rabia Mohamed Habib, a prominent tribal leader who had met Saddam but who was not even in his house when the Americans stormed it. One report says they killed a guard as they entered.

"The Americans searched the house completely, very roughly," Sheikh Habib said. "It seems they thought Saddam Hussein was inside." It appears the killings started as the troops were searching the
building and as motorists approached the barbed wire which the soldiers had placed without warning across the road. Witnesses said the first car contained at least two men. "The second contained two children about 10, their mother and their father who had been wounded in the Iran-Iraq war - he was a cripple," a local shopkeeper told me. "They all died. The man's legs were cut in half by the bullets," he added. A third car then approached the Americans, who opened fire again. One of the occupants
fled, but the other two remained in the vehicle and were killed.

When another car arrived US troops riddled it with more bullets and it burst into flames. It is believed that two people were inside and both were burnt to death. "The Americans didn't try to help the civilians they had shot, not once," a witness said. "They let the car burn and left the bodies where they lay, even the children. It was we who had to take them to the hospitals."

Yet again, false informers, ill-trained American soldiers who appeared to exercise no fire control and a lack of military planning has created a tragedy among the people the Americans claimed to be 'liberating' from Saddam Hussein only 15 weeks ago. Last night, there were reports from the southern city of Karbala that three men had been shot dead by American troops during a demonstration.

Copyright: The Independent. UK

sixate · 08-01-2003, 02:05 AM

We still didn't kill enough of them as far as I'm concerned.

Thanks for the article. It made me smile.

Kadath · 08-01-2003, 04:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by sixate
We still didn't kill enough of them as far as I'm concerned.

Thanks for the article. It made me smile.

All I can think of is Peter from Family Guy: "Oh come on, that one's not even real!"

Darkblack · 08-01-2003, 05:10 AM

Heh, bad thing about karma, what goes around comes around. You can take that however you want.

reconmike · 08-01-2003, 05:37 AM

It wont be long now before the monday morning quaterbacking begins.......

They should have warned this, they should have used powder puff bullets,

In a combat zone where US personel are being killed daily, do you really expect things like this not to happen.
The civilians were approaching US troops, why was that?

Unless you have ever been in a simular situation, I would think your opinion does not mean much.

kurty[B] · 08-01-2003, 05:50 AM

Yeah, I'm not going to say much here, since I have no experience, just stories been told from my co-workers who faught in the Gulf War years ago. One such time "civilians" were found running across a field carrying boxes (obviously guns and ammo stolen from the soldiers' camp), but because the proper authority wouldn't give the command to take them down finally one of the soldiers made that decision himself, and well other chimed in, and the end result was a civilian truck on fire, and a bunch of mangled bodies. That guy had his rank stripped from him, but was later granted it back after a superior to that superior analyzed the situation and felt he did the right thing.

There's so many things the media can leave out to make a story sound patriotic or unpatriotic. I'll stick with human nature, these guys are fearing for their life, there's going to be communication problems, and well if someone encroaches on their borders they've set-up to protect themselves, they're going to take pre-cautionary measures, and possibly find out in the end that they did or did not need to, but that will be after the fact. I'm just glad I'm not in their shoes.

08-01-2003, 01:00 AM	#1 (permalink)
smooth Junkie Location: Right here	US troops turn botched Saddam raid into a massacre US troops turn botched Saddam raid into a massacre by Robert Fisk • Monday July 28, 2003 at 08:55 PM Obsessed with capturing Saddam Hussein, American soldiers turned a botched raid on a house in the Mansur district of Baghdad yesterday into a bloodbath. US troops turn botched Saddam raid into a massacre By Robert Fisk in Baghdad 28 July 2003: (The Independent) Obsessed with capturing Saddam Hussein, American soldiers turned a botched raid on a house in the Mansur district of Baghdad yesterday into a bloodbath, opening fire on scores of Iraqi civilians in a crowded street and killing up to 11, including two children, their mother and crippled father. At least one civilian car caught fire, cremating its occupants. The vehicle carrying the two children and their mother and father was riddled by bullets as it approached a razor-wired checkpoint outside the house. Amid the fury generated among the largely middle-class residents of Mansur - by ghastly coincidence, the killings were scarcely 40 metres from the houses in which 16 civilians died when the Americans tried to kill Saddam towards the end of the war in April - whatever political advantages were gained by the killing of Saddam's sons have been squandered. A doctor at the Yarmouk hospital, which received four of the dead, turned on me angrily last night, shouting: "If an American came to my emergency room, maybe I would kill him." Two civilians, both believed to have been driving with their families, were brought to the Yarmouk, one with abdominal wounds and the other with "his brain outside of his head", according to another doctor. At the scene of the killings, there was pandemonium. While US troops were loading the bullet-shattered cars on trucks - and trying to stop cameramen filming the carnage - crowds screamed abuse at them. One American soldier a few feet from me climbed into the seat of his Humvee, threw his helmet on the floor of the vehicle and shouted: "Shit! Shit!" There was no doubt about the target: the home of Sheikh Rabia Mohamed Habib, a prominent tribal leader who had met Saddam but who was not even in his house when the Americans stormed it. One report says they killed a guard as they entered. "The Americans searched the house completely, very roughly," Sheikh Habib said. "It seems they thought Saddam Hussein was inside." It appears the killings started as the troops were searching the building and as motorists approached the barbed wire which the soldiers had placed without warning across the road. Witnesses said the first car contained at least two men. "The second contained two children about 10, their mother and their father who had been wounded in the Iran-Iraq war - he was a cripple," a local shopkeeper told me. "They all died. The man's legs were cut in half by the bullets," he added. A third car then approached the Americans, who opened fire again. One of the occupants fled, but the other two remained in the vehicle and were killed. When another car arrived US troops riddled it with more bullets and it burst into flames. It is believed that two people were inside and both were burnt to death. "The Americans didn't try to help the civilians they had shot, not once," a witness said. "They let the car burn and left the bodies where they lay, even the children. It was we who had to take them to the hospitals." Yet again, false informers, ill-trained American soldiers who appeared to exercise no fire control and a lack of military planning has created a tragedy among the people the Americans claimed to be 'liberating' from Saddam Hussein only 15 weeks ago. Last night, there were reports from the southern city of Karbala that three men had been shot dead by American troops during a demonstration. Copyright: The Independent. UK

08-01-2003, 05:37 AM	#5 (permalink)
reconmike Thank You Jesus Location: Twilight Zone	It wont be long now before the monday morning quaterbacking begins....... They should have warned this, they should have used powder puff bullets, In a combat zone where US personel are being killed daily, do you really expect things like this not to happen. The civilians were approaching US troops, why was that? Unless you have ever been in a simular situation, I would think your opinion does not mean much. __________________ Where is Darwin when ya need him?

08-01-2003, 02:05 AM	#2 (permalink)
sixate Registered User Location: Somewhere in Ohio	We still didn't kill enough of them as far as I'm concerned. Thanks for the article. It made me smile.

08-01-2003, 05:10 AM	#4 (permalink)
Darkblack Banned Location: Pennsytuckia	Heh, bad thing about karma, what goes around comes around. You can take that however you want.

08-01-2003, 05:50 AM	#6 (permalink)
kurty[B] Sauce Puppet	Yeah, I'm not going to say much here, since I have no experience, just stories been told from my co-workers who faught in the Gulf War years ago. One such time "civilians" were found running across a field carrying boxes (obviously guns and ammo stolen from the soldiers' camp), but because the proper authority wouldn't give the command to take them down finally one of the soldiers made that decision himself, and well other chimed in, and the end result was a civilian truck on fire, and a bunch of mangled bodies. That guy had his rank stripped from him, but was later granted it back after a superior to that superior analyzed the situation and felt he did the right thing. There's so many things the media can leave out to make a story sound patriotic or unpatriotic. I'll stick with human nature, these guys are fearing for their life, there's going to be communication problems, and well if someone encroaches on their borders they've set-up to protect themselves, they're going to take pre-cautionary measures, and possibly find out in the end that they did or did not need to, but that will be after the fact. I'm just glad I'm not in their shoes.