anyone watching CNN noticing how the men/women seem to be completely divided on who to support?

Women want Obama.

I had a curry last night, these pants, indeed, are glowing.
-----Added 15/10/2008 at 09 : 56 : 48-----
Chavez helping the FARC?

Err. No. The dodgy laptop, belatedly, has been called way dodgy by interpol.

*shakes head*
-----Added 15/10/2008 at 10 : 01 : 41-----
ZERO!

*McCain looks completely flabberghasted*

wow....
wow...
obama finally became the angry black man
ZERO!!!
haha
called out mccain...

Fuck you, Joe.

McCain is flatlining on the meter thingee.

FUCK JOE
period

FUCK him in the ass

now...mccain is faltering like crazy on this healthcare stuff...

and i thought, honestly, that mccain supported roe v wade.

Wait what? Did I miss something here? What did Obama say about Joe? He actually cursed on national TV? @_@.

And I did not know that about McCain. He just shot up in my opinion on how he dealt with the appointment of judges. Extremely mature viewpoint.

I wouldn't apply any litmus test, but if a judge has supported Roe Vs Wade, I think that would count against their qualifications.

Disingenuous.

Well Obama said the exact same thing, reversed :p.

wow, obama just had a ..reasoned response to abortion and late term abortion

and mccain needs to stop huffing and puffing into the mic...
-----Added 15/10/2008 at 10 : 26 : 36-----
ok, the freaking snide comments...whomever is handling mccain needs to show him the tapes and show him that it is not effective and just seems grouchy/crotchety....

Joe the plumber

-----Added 15/10/2008 at 10 : 49 : 59-----
That had to be something that was staged for McCain, but didn't really work.

heehee

I actually thought I heard him say... "A breast of freth air," which would have been even more hilarious. Yeah, I don't know who the hell Joe Plumber is, but my dad's a plumber and there's no way in hell he would EVER vote for McCain.

McCain just fucking annoys me, now. He is so unbelievably condescending, now more than ever. His laughter, chuckles, and general "you don't know whatchoo talkin' bout, boy" tone towards Obama makes me want to puke. I'm even more impressed that Obama CONTINUES maintaining his cool, except for that one brilliant moment of "ZERO!" about health care, when it was necessary. :thumbsup:

Going to bed, last time we stay up this late on a weeknight! (Except maybe election night.) I've marked my absentee ballot and am taking it to the US embassy in the morning.

I really would have prefer Obama handle this statement differently- "I'm not Bush, if you wanted to run against him you should have run four years ago." I think Obama should have countered- "No, certainly I know you're not. But if you wanted to run away from him you should have done that years ago. Instead you've continue to support him on almost every issue. You've consistently shown that support in every way, including most of your votes."

BTW- who the fuck is Joe the plumber?

Joe the plumber IS that guy in the video.

Literally. Joe WoznaPolishname.
-----Added 15/10/2008 at 11 : 04 : 10-----
Worzenbach?

McCain messed up his last name even.

I think McCain actually started quite strong, but it fell apart when he (unprompted) threw that Ayers/ACORN bit out there.

Ah, missed that. Thanks- makes more sense, still sounds lame.

Watched the debate at a friends house. All Canadian mainly. I'm certain if the world got a vote Obama would win by 90%.

i honestly thought mccain was winning until about 20 minutes in, then he started slipping a bit...then the healthcare stuff really cinched it for obama.

just my opinion, but mccain's plan seems very complicated and doesn't seem to be as helpful to people. that's just me.

the ayers thing really irked me. Mccain's campaign has been harping on it, then he just says "I don't care about an old terrist"...wtf is that.

and i personally LOVED obama's response to the bush thing. "sorry, your policies are not different"

Thanks for posting that vid, tisonlyi. That clarifies things a lot.

The flash polls have it wider than I would have expected:

CBS - Obama -53, McCain -22
CNN - Obama -58, McCain -31 and McCain's "unfavorables" went up from 45 to 49.

Bottom line, McCain is not convincing undecideds or soft Obama supporters to take another look.
-----Added 15/10/2008 at 11 : 31 : 27-----
The most outlandish comment - McCain: "ACORN is on the verge of perpetrating the greatest voter fraud in US history."

wasnt' mccain a keynote speaker at an acorn meeting?

And before anyone gets frothy....ACORN does not support or promote voting rights for non-citizen immigrants.

McCain looked incredibly angry at a couple points in the debate.

dcdux, what do you think will happen to republican midwest votes with that renunciation of the corn pledge by McCain?

The joe the plumber video was good. Obama had a very good discussion with that guy.

I think he knows he already lost Iowa (Bush won in 04) and wont pick up Wisconsin where he once thought he might have a shot.

And it played to the base that he absolutely has to hold (and have them show up to vote).

One state where it could make a difference is in Nebraska, the cornhuskers!....very red, but one of the few states that splits the electoral votes..... Obama Chases Nebraska Electoral Vote

What Midwest votes? He's losing in Illinois, Iowa, Wisconsin, Michigan, Minnesota, the latest poll from ND say he's losing there, too. He's still in the chase in Indiana and Missouri. He can count on 4/5 of Nebraska, Kansas, & maybe SD.

I have to say that this is about the only thing i agree with him on. Ethanol is a terrible idea. Not that i trust him to maintain the position into next week...

I think McCain's campaign realizes that their run for the president is all but lost and are now trying to shore up support with the base to salvage as many of the down ticket as possible. His dismissive remarks about women's health in regards to abortion policy will probably not go over very well with independents but the religious right will agree with him.

Yeah, I take that on board, but afaik he's only a few points up... I reckoned, rightly or wrongly, that a good few points would be lost in the booth to a touch of secret racism... Just wondered what someone who is, perhaps, a bit of an insider? would consider as the amount of points you lose in the midwest for sticking it to their economy...

I'm a Republican and McCain obviously won the debate. I'm a Democrat and Obama obviously won the debate.

Debate discussion in general is worthless because each side will say the other side got slaughtered just to try to get him in office. These debates are nothing more than proving if the candidates can publicly speak (which is good) and reinforcing the crappy fake commercials that air on every channel now saying the other side is a terrorist/idiot.

Just about all the Democrats around here (Wisconsin) are pro-ethanol. I guess they think it's win-win: look pro-farmer and alt fuel/green. I think the assumptions behind this are flawed. For one, even in these states the number of farmers is small and shrinking. Concentration of capital has given us large corporate farms with underpaid undocumented workers. And from the other side, ethanol is at best faux-green.

In any event, Obama has substantial leads in many of these states. The last poll from Wisconsin has Obama up by 17% and McCain has given up (no adverts after Tuesday). Michigan, Iowa, Illinois are similarly hopeless. I suppose being against ethanol might hurt McC in ND. It won't matter too much in Indiana. In sum, i don't think McCain had much to lose by coming out against it.

It's all theatre, like the rest of politics, but still... You can only browse porn for so long.

the "no fine" moment was the best. McCain looked a) flustered, then b) like he wanted to kill his fact checkers

I wasn't aware that the McCain campaign employed fact checkers.

i tried to watch this debate, i really did. but i found that after even a few second of it, i got really really interested in the phillies game again.

...........still chuckling over that one! :thumbsup:


McCain looked and sounded flustered and desperate. His 4 "sound bites" were repeated at least a dozen times.

http://images.dailykos.com/images/us...ain_buggin.gif

Seriously...he hears "Let me tell you the fine for joe the plumber..ZERO" and mccain acts surprised....

then mccain goes on to talk about how obama would fine joe the plumber..
-----Added 16/10/2008 at 10 : 26 : 21-----
my fave commentator: "2/3 of the people thought mccain was running a negative campaign..and mccain spent 90 minutes trying to convince the other 1/3"