Canada: Bringing Down Dion - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Ace_O_Spades · 03-14-2008, 11:18 PM

Shamelessly pulled from my blog, here's something that's going on in Vancouver right now:

http://canadianspades.blogspot.com/2...down-dion.html

Quote:

The Green Party is down 5.7% with 26.2% undecided voters... This is a chance for history. This is a chance for the Green party to really get in gear. Dan Grice has lead the debates, and has made the environment the key election issue. He is running the election on his terms and I think there is a real chance for an upset here.

I'll be out distributing leaflets for one reason... The loss of the most stable Liberal riding in Canada would send a powerful message: Boot Dion or we're not voting for you. Grow some balls or we're not voting for you. The Greens can really demonstrate themselves as a viable opposition vote. That seems to be the way Canadian politics is played, so why not play ball?

Plus, Grice has said publicly he wants to legalize marijuana. That has mobilized the activist community into not only donating funds, but donating manpower to the leafleting crew. Well played Grice, well played.

Here's Grice:

I personally think this policy would create a dramatic reduction in personal and property crime, because it would instantaneously cut out about 30-40% of the internal profits of organized crime in this country. It would also remove the gateway effect where the same people selling pot are often the same people pushing meth and cocaine.

As a candidate, I want to be vocal about this but I am afraid this will stereotype us as the "marijuana party?" I love the conservatives attacking us on Peace, Pot, Protectionism, and Parking tickets because it puts it in context of other issues.

I love the messaging: "Tax Cannabis," as it doesn't sound soft on drugs, not draconian. What do other people think, is there much votes to be gained by taking a lead on this or will it marginalize us.

Submitted by Dan Grice on 23 October 2007 - 1:35am.

Let's send a message, make history, and really make governments take environmental issues seriously. Vote Grice in Vancouver Quadra.

Do you think the Greens have a realistic chance? That's an awful lot of undecided voters. We're hitting the leafleting pretty hard tomorrow... Trying to mobilize the weed smokers to come out and vote. We've got 1000 pamphlets for tomorrow alone. That ramps up on Sunday.

highthief · 03-15-2008, 05:33 AM

I think actively courting pot smokers is a bit risky in that, by association, you may alienate voters who might be inclined to vote Green.

By that I mean I think it is OK to endorse legalizing/decriminalizing pot - many politicians have said as much - but I think that a very visible link between real potheads and a party hoping to gain political cred is slightly risky.

Then again, it is Vancouver ...

Ace_O_Spades · 03-15-2008, 08:19 AM

I think they're officially trying to downplay the link, but yes, it IS vancouver, and potheads are a big demographic here. and really, 5.7% is nothing with that large of an undecided vote. It just becomes mobilization now...

CandleInTheDark · 03-15-2008, 08:45 AM

No, the Green party does not have a serious chance. The Green had lost its viability and credibility when Elizabeth May aligned her party with the Liberals. I will not vote for the Greens given this relationship.

Ace_O_Spades · 03-15-2008, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CandleInTheDark

No, the Green party does not have a serious chance. The Green had lost its viability and credibility when Elizabeth May aligned her party with the Liberals. I will not vote for the Greens given this relationship.

I disagree really, if the issue is hit on enough at UBC there is a huge environmental activist community that is just waiting for a moment where they can actually make a difference, now is that time.

Heading out to deliver flyers in ~an hour and a half

Ace_O_Spades · 03-18-2008, 07:46 AM

wow, so I got involved with the green party down the stretch and they had no direction whatsoever.

They honestly didn't deserve to win. Obviously they weren't even close. Such a haphazard campaign.

I spent two days on the campaign and I saw enough to not want to vote for a Green Party candidate any time in the forseeable future. I wish it were just a money issue, but they are just incompetent.

highthief · 03-18-2008, 02:32 PM

I think they did well in a couple of ridings? I don't have the figures, just what I heard on the radio this morning.

Ace_O_Spades · 03-18-2008, 02:35 PM

yeah they did well, but there's a difference between getting inflated numbers as a protest vote and actually having the support of the population

They got triple the votes in Quadra that they got in the last general. Pretty good, but not good enough to win.

Martian · 03-18-2008, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ace_O_Spades

yeah they did well, but there's a difference between getting inflated numbers as a protest vote and actually having the support of the population.

That's what it is. The Green Party is replacing the NDP as the snub vote, which leads to more votes out of spite to other candidates.

Still, I guess it's better to be a snub vote than to be ignored completely.

Charlatan · 03-18-2008, 04:12 PM

Snub votes have kept the NDP in the house of commons for many years.

debaser · 03-18-2008, 05:11 PM

Dude, potheads aren't going to get out of bed during voting hours...

Bad strategy.

highthief · 03-18-2008, 05:30 PM

The Green Party needs some black dude squaring off against Mila Mulroney for the leadership - then they'll get somewhere.

Charlatan · 03-19-2008, 12:00 AM

I just read that in the riding where Bob Rae won, the Greens came in third, only 36 votes behind the second place NDP and way ahead of the Conservative candidate...

highthief · 03-19-2008, 02:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charlatan

I just read that in the riding where Bob Rae won, the Greens came in third, only 36 votes behind the second place NDP and way ahead of the Conservative candidate...

Yeah, Toronto Centre - if they ever vote Tory it will be a sign of the coming armegeddon.

silent_jay · 03-19-2008, 06:13 AM

Greens did well that's for sure, almost took a Liberal Stronghold in BC, took second place losing by 151 votes I think it was.

CandleInTheDark · 03-19-2008, 07:10 AM

Can someone explain why anyone voted for Bob Rae? I am much to young to remember him as a premier, but from what I am told he was completely imcompetant as a member of the NDP. So if he was so bad for Ontario, how did he muster the support?

highthief · 03-19-2008, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CandleInTheDark

Can someone explain why anyone voted for Bob Rae? I am much to young to remember him as a premier, but from what I am told he was completely imcompetant as a member of the NDP. So if he was so bad for Ontario, how did he muster the support?

While I agree he was a poor premier, the guy is a very, very charismatic guy to speak with face to face and is hugely intelligent, so it is understandable.

Personally, I would have a hard time voting for him if he was the Prime Miniterial candidate, but I could see voting for him to represent my riding.

Leto · 03-19-2008, 09:04 AM

I second the comment by highthief. I went to a candidates lunch at the Royal York, when Rae, Harris & Peterson were campaigning and Rae was by far the most intelligent and eloquent of the three of them that afternoon.

If he was a liberal, I would have voted for him in that 1990 election too.

Ace_O_Spades · 03-19-2008, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by silent_jay

Greens did well that's for sure, almost took a Liberal Stronghold in BC, took second place losing by 151 votes I think it was.

Your figures are wrong... The Tories were 2nd place by 151 votes.

silent_jay · 03-19-2008, 11:55 AM

Opps my bad, I was kind of high last night watching CBC, must have heard wrong.

Ace_O_Spades · 03-19-2008, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by silent_jay

Opps my bad, I was kind of high last night watching CBC, must have heard wrong.

Yeah, I can just see the Tory propaganda machine whirring this one into high gear... "We just about took your most secure riding... Na Nana Naaaa Naaahhhh"

percy · 03-19-2008, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leto

I second the comment by highthief. I went to a candidates lunch at the Royal York, when Rae, Harris & Peterson were campaigning and Rae was by far the most intelligent and eloquent of the three of them that afternoon.

If he was a liberal, I would have voted for him in that 1990 election too.

He's a smart guy alright. To bad he's a socialist. Now that he's a liberal, he's a bleeding heart socialist.

I don't mind him though. I'm glad most people don't pay attention to him.

Wonder who will be viewed more incompetent as premier. Rae or Mcgrunty.

Leto · 03-20-2008, 09:51 AM

meh. I have no problem with socialism per se. I just don't want to pay for it. I guess I appreciate Rae's intellect, but feel that running a provincial government should be akin to managing a company, spend versus benefits. the Federals should be the altruistic and humanistic source of funds.

vox_rox · 03-31-2008, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leto

meh. I have no problem with socialism per se. I just don't want to pay for it.

Um, and rampant neo-liberal capitalism doesn't cost anything?

Peace,

Pierre

filtherton · 03-31-2008, 11:06 PM

I hoped that this thread was going to be about taking out Celine Dion. I was going to suggest that you do Alan Thicke next, but I see now that there would be no point.

Charlatan · 03-31-2008, 11:09 PM

We've already exported them to the US. We don't really need to worry about Dion and Thicke.

Leto · 04-01-2008, 03:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vox_rox

Um, and rampant neo-liberal capitalism doesn't cost anything?

Peace,

Pierre

it does.... but how much do you want to pay?

m0rpheus · 04-01-2008, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by percy

Wonder who will be viewed more incompetent as premier. Rae or Mcgrunty.

Or Harris.

loquitur · 04-01-2008, 02:48 PM

If you're going to bring down Dion, what will happen to the rest of the Belmonts?

Baraka_Guru · 04-01-2008, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m0rpheus

Or Harris.

I just assumed it was "the worst besides Harris."

m0rpheus · 04-03-2008, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baraka_Guru

I just assumed it was "the worst besides Harris."

Ah okay that makes sense.

03-15-2008, 05:33 AM	#2 (permalink)
highthief Junkie Location: Ontario, Canada	I think actively courting pot smokers is a bit risky in that, by association, you may alienate voters who might be inclined to vote Green. By that I mean I think it is OK to endorse legalizing/decriminalizing pot - many politicians have said as much - but I think that a very visible link between real potheads and a party hoping to gain political cred is slightly risky. Then again, it is Vancouver ... __________________ Si vis pacem parabellum.

03-15-2008, 08:19 AM	#3 (permalink)
Ace_O_Spades The Death Card Location: EH!?!?	I think they're officially trying to downplay the link, but yes, it IS vancouver, and potheads are a big demographic here. and really, 5.7% is nothing with that large of an undecided vote. It just becomes mobilization now... __________________ Feh.

03-15-2008, 08:45 AM	#4 (permalink)
CandleInTheDark Addict Location: Where the music's loudest	No, the Green party does not have a serious chance. The Green had lost its viability and credibility when Elizabeth May aligned her party with the Liberals. I will not vote for the Greens given this relationship. __________________ Where there is doubt there is freedom.

03-18-2008, 07:46 AM	#6 (permalink)
Ace_O_Spades The Death Card Location: EH!?!?	wow, so I got involved with the green party down the stretch and they had no direction whatsoever. They honestly didn't deserve to win. Obviously they weren't even close. Such a haphazard campaign. I spent two days on the campaign and I saw enough to not want to vote for a Green Party candidate any time in the forseeable future. I wish it were just a money issue, but they are just incompetent. __________________ Feh.

03-18-2008, 02:32 PM	#7 (permalink)
highthief Junkie Location: Ontario, Canada	I think they did well in a couple of ridings? I don't have the figures, just what I heard on the radio this morning. __________________ Si vis pacem parabellum.

03-18-2008, 02:35 PM	#8 (permalink)
Ace_O_Spades The Death Card Location: EH!?!?	yeah they did well, but there's a difference between getting inflated numbers as a protest vote and actually having the support of the population They got triple the votes in Quadra that they got in the last general. Pretty good, but not good enough to win. __________________ Feh. Last edited by Ace_O_Spades; 03-18-2008 at 02:47 PM..

03-18-2008, 04:12 PM	#10 (permalink)
Charlatan Getting it. Super Moderator Location: Lion City	Snub votes have kept the NDP in the house of commons for many years. __________________ "My hands are on fire. Hands are on fire. Ain't got no more time for all you charlatans and liars." - Old Man Luedecke

03-18-2008, 05:11 PM	#11 (permalink)
debaser Sir, I have a plan... Location: 38S NC20943324	Dude, potheads aren't going to get out of bed during voting hours... Bad strategy. __________________ Fortunato became immured to the sound of the trowel after a while.

03-18-2008, 05:30 PM	#12 (permalink)
highthief Junkie Location: Ontario, Canada	The Green Party needs some black dude squaring off against Mila Mulroney for the leadership - then they'll get somewhere. __________________ Si vis pacem parabellum.

03-19-2008, 12:00 AM	#13 (permalink)
Charlatan Getting it. Super Moderator Location: Lion City	I just read that in the riding where Bob Rae won, the Greens came in third, only 36 votes behind the second place NDP and way ahead of the Conservative candidate... __________________ "My hands are on fire. Hands are on fire. Ain't got no more time for all you charlatans and liars." - Old Man Luedecke

03-19-2008, 06:13 AM	#15 (permalink)
silent_jay Her Jay Location: Ontario for now....	Greens did well that's for sure, almost took a Liberal Stronghold in BC, took second place losing by 151 votes I think it was. __________________ Absence makes the heart grow fonder

03-19-2008, 07:10 AM	#16 (permalink)
CandleInTheDark Addict Location: Where the music's loudest	Can someone explain why anyone voted for Bob Rae? I am much to young to remember him as a premier, but from what I am told he was completely imcompetant as a member of the NDP. So if he was so bad for Ontario, how did he muster the support? __________________ Where there is doubt there is freedom.

03-19-2008, 09:04 AM	#18 (permalink)
Leto Junkie Location: The Danforth	I second the comment by highthief. I went to a candidates lunch at the Royal York, when Rae, Harris & Peterson were campaigning and Rae was by far the most intelligent and eloquent of the three of them that afternoon. If he was a liberal, I would have voted for him in that 1990 election too.

03-19-2008, 11:55 AM	#20 (permalink)
silent_jay Her Jay Location: Ontario for now....	Opps my bad, I was kind of high last night watching CBC, must have heard wrong. __________________ Absence makes the heart grow fonder

03-20-2008, 09:51 AM	#23 (permalink)
Leto Junkie Location: The Danforth	meh. I have no problem with socialism per se. I just don't want to pay for it. I guess I appreciate Rae's intellect, but feel that running a provincial government should be akin to managing a company, spend versus benefits. the Federals should be the altruistic and humanistic source of funds.

03-31-2008, 11:06 PM	#25 (permalink)
filtherton Junkie Location: In the land of ice and snow.	I hoped that this thread was going to be about taking out Celine Dion. I was going to suggest that you do Alan Thicke next, but I see now that there would be no point.

03-31-2008, 11:09 PM	#26 (permalink)
Charlatan Getting it. Super Moderator Location: Lion City	We've already exported them to the US. We don't really need to worry about Dion and Thicke. __________________ "My hands are on fire. Hands are on fire. Ain't got no more time for all you charlatans and liars." - Old Man Luedecke

04-01-2008, 02:48 PM	#29 (permalink)
loquitur Junkie Location: NYC	If you're going to bring down Dion, what will happen to the rest of the Belmonts?