Libertarians! 08 candidates - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Willravel · 01-09-2008, 09:30 PM

The candidates:
John Finan
Barry Hess
Dave Hollist
Alden Link
Daniel Imperato
Christine Smith
George Phillies
Robert Milnes
Michael P Jingozian
Bob Jackson
Wayne A. Root
Steve Kubby

Who do you, the many, many self proclaimed Libertarians of TFP, support? Currently, Wayne Root is in the lead so far as fund raising, trailed by Michael P Jingozian in second and Imperato in third. Each has a virtually identical platform that's basically the same platform that Badnarik ran on in 2004.

I found out today when I got my sample ballot that my switch to the Green Party was lost in the mail or something, so I'm still officially registered Libertarian (which is strange for a socialist, but w/e). I'm having trouble deciding who to pick, so I hope that I get good info from our Tilted Libertarians.

SecretMethod70 · 01-09-2008, 09:59 PM

Eh, it doesn't matter. Once Ron Paul doesn't get the Republican nomination, they're going to try very hard to convince him to run as a Libertarian. I don't know how likely that is (though he was their candidate in 1988), but I certainly wouldn't be surprised if he decided to do that.

Willravel · 01-09-2008, 10:22 PM

Huh. So none of em, eh? I mean it's my duty to help choose one of these guys to represent the Libertarian party. If Paul was on the list, I'd probably vote for him but he's not.

ASU2003 · 01-09-2008, 10:30 PM

I'm surprised that the Libertarian party doesn't come right out and say to consider voting for Ron Paul.

http://www.christinesmith.us/

Oh, wait one of the candidates does. Just don't search for her name at work with Yahoo. A picture from when she (ok, not her, but another Christine Smth) was Miss December 2005 for Plaboy.
NSFW - http://www.playboyzone.net/2005/2005...ine_Smith.html - NSFW

Can't you write in his name, even on your pre-registered party ballot?

Willravel · 01-09-2008, 10:37 PM

Looks like someone liberated her from her clothes.

Plan9 · 01-09-2008, 10:46 PM

Yes, yes... that lame tribal tat means she's a flake and will flip-flop on the issues to prevent you from uncovering her loaf-of-white-bread IQ.

Ustwo · 01-09-2008, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SecretMethod70

Eh, it doesn't matter. Once Ron Paul doesn't get the Republican nomination, they're going to try very hard to convince him to run as a Libertarian. I don't know how likely that is (though he was their candidate in 1988), but I certainly wouldn't be surprised if he decided to do that.

I'd be shocked if he didn't.

dc_dux · 01-09-2008, 11:04 PM

If he does, the Republican National Committee will likely take away his credentials to run for reelection for Congress as a Republican at the same time.

If he runs for Congress as a Libertarian and keeps his Congressional seat, which would be likely, perhaps he could then caucus with the Democrats ..the party that opposes the current Iraq war policy, the Patriot Act and warrantless wiretaps

SecretMethod70 · 01-09-2008, 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dc_dux

If he does, the Republican National Committee will likely take away his credentials to run for reelection for Congress as a Republican at the same time.

If he runs for Congress as a Libertarian and keeps his Congressional seat, which would be likely, perhaps he could then caucus with the Democrats ..the party that opposes the current Iraq war policy, the Patriot Act and warrantless wiretaps

Which is exactly why I'm not convinced he'd do it, but also not convinced he won't.

Willravel · 01-09-2008, 11:22 PM

So none of our Libertarians are even considering any of these people? Is it all talk?

SecretMethod70 · 01-09-2008, 11:29 PM

None of the (2) Libertarians I know are paying any attention to the Libertarian primaries.

samcol · 01-10-2008, 05:18 AM

Ron Paul is already running on the Libertarian platform. I don't see the point of the Libertarians running anyone against him when he has showed he can get 7-10% in caucus/primary setting. He's almost obligated to run as a 3rd party or Libertarian should he not get the election. He's still got the money and the support.

joshbaumgartner · 01-10-2008, 08:12 AM

I have listened to Paul say in no uncertain terms in more than one interview that he is not going to run as an independent or Libertarian this season. Not that it is worth a hill of beans if he changes his mind, but he was reasonably emphatic about it. The fact he has a relatively safe Republican seat in the House that would be put in jeopardy if he left the party might be why.

MSD · 01-11-2008, 06:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willravel

So none of our Libertarians are even considering any of these people? Is it all talk?

The only candidate of theirs I can support is Imperato. I looked at everyone else a few weeks ago and their immigration policies range from xenophobic to outright racist. Interestingly enough, he also has a sort of universal health care plan.

I am a registered Libertarian, but I'm fairly centrist on economic issues and consider myself a "compassionate capitalist" if someone needs to label me.

loquitur · 01-11-2008, 06:40 AM

willravel, someone can be a libertarian and still think that Libertarians tend to be cranks. (Note: my capitalization was not random in that sentence.) "Someone" includes me.

MSD · 01-12-2008, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loquitur

willravel, someone can be a libertarian and still think that Libertarians tend to be cranks. (Note: my capitalization was not random in that sentence.) "Someone" includes me.

You're not the only one. I can be a moderate libertarian Libertarian and still think that most Libertarians are cranks.

Willravel · 01-12-2008, 09:33 PM

So you don't vote in the primaries?

Slims · 01-13-2008, 09:22 AM

I am a libertarian but I am still registered as a republican.

As such I try to vote in the republican primaries in order to influence who I think will actually win, and then vote libertarian in the election to support the libertarian party.

I hate to say it, but if enough votes walk away from the mainstream parties (even if it causes the greater of two evils to be elected) then Repubs. and Dems will have to adopt their platforms due to the exodus of libertarians away from their parties.

genuinegirly · 01-13-2008, 09:59 AM

Libertarians and Republicans are allies on some issues, but they are not interchangeable. Rubs me the wrong way to think that a fully-accepted Republican would turn around and run as a Libertarian, just because they didn't get the votes in the primary to make it as the Republican candidate. Seems hypocritical. Though upon further reflection, I realize it's just a very excellent and backhanded way to get republican money to publicize a libertarian, get his views out there...

It really depends on the perspective and intention of the person running.

In this case, I'd support Ron Paul.

loquitur · 01-13-2008, 07:01 PM

There are right-libertarians and left-libertarians. And there are Republicans of a a libertarian bent and Repubs of a hierarchical bent - just as there are civil libertarian Dems and authoritarian Dem types.

Ustwo · 01-13-2008, 07:05 PM

Interesting that current Libertarian candidates would be xenophobic, from my understanding a 'true' Libertarian policy would be open borders, only without state assistance.

Sun Tzu · 01-14-2008, 03:33 AM

I hadn’t really paid attention while I had my false hopes for Paul so high. It really is discouraging, its not like they will let this person debate in the finals. Which has had me wondering , was Perot allowed up there because he had money. The whole process would seem so much more credable to allow more than two podiums on stage. As a side not while is was extremely boring I watch the Iowa caucus in CSPN. It was refreshing watching people hand count the votes. Why cant that happen with the presidential vote? Sure it would take longer. . . so televise the count under guard 24/7 until the end. While I will speculate because it just sounds to unreal to be true is anyone certain how and who handles the vote count?

As far as teh candidates while I affiliate myself with the Party it has come down to the individual whoever they are or which party they represent- hopfully we will have strong independents.

I need to start listening to what they have to say, even if I like it it seems a wasted vote anyway. Just like my vote for Badnarik was last time.

I know what some view his reputation as, but for personal reasons I wish Colin Powell would run.

Willravel · 02-05-2008, 03:34 PM

Voted Imperato.

Seriously, this wasn't intended to be a "maybe Ron Paul will blah blah" thread. It wasn't meant to be a "what I think of the Libertarian party" thread, either. I was hoping people would have something to say about the names in the OP. I was honestly looking to find out who you guys thought stood out and why, so I could make an informed decision today. MSD in #14 seems the only person who even looked at them.

Jeez. Might as well close the thread.

dc_dux · 02-05-2008, 04:50 PM

Imperato tried to run as a Green and Reform party candidate in the past and worked to elect Republicans to Congress several years ago as honorary chairman of the National Republican Congressional Committee Business Council (the billionaires club).

Willravel · 02-05-2008, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dc_dux

Imperato tried to run as a Green and Reform party candidate in the past and worked to elect Republicans to Congress several years ago as honorary chairman of the National Republican Congressional Committee Business Council (the billionaires club).

I know.

dc_dux · 02-05-2008, 04:58 PM

I would characterize him as a Ross Perot without the mental instability.

MSD · 02-05-2008, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willravel

So you don't vote in the primaries?

I would if I could.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ustwo

Interesting that current Libertarian candidates would be xenophobic, from my understanding a 'true' Libertarian policy would be open borders, only without state assistance.

True Libertarians are as hard to find as anyone who believes in another pure ideology. The majority of LP members I've seen are either stoners who don't know anything beyond the drug policy stance, rich people who just want their taxes low, and mostly right-wingers who don't want to be associated with the religious right or are religious and believe strongly in separation of church and state.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dc_dux

Imperato tried to run as a Green and Reform party candidate in the past and worked to elect Republicans to Congress several years ago as honorary chairman of the National Republican Congressional Committee Business Council (the billionaires club).

I agree with much of his platform regardless of his past affiliations.

lagoonguy · 02-07-2008, 06:10 AM

i haven't followed any of the libertarian talk and no nothing of the candidates. but i've decided to not vote republican or democrat so by default i might have to vote for whoever it ends up being.

samcol · 02-07-2008, 07:01 AM

I really hope Badnarik runs again if not in 08 then 2012. A very strict constitutionalist like Ron Paul but a litter yonger and more presidential in my opinion.

01-09-2008, 09:30 PM	#1 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Libertarians! 08 candidates The candidates: John Finan Barry Hess Dave Hollist Alden Link Daniel Imperato Christine Smith George Phillies Robert Milnes Michael P Jingozian Bob Jackson Wayne A. Root Steve Kubby Who do you, the many, many self proclaimed Libertarians of TFP, support? Currently, Wayne Root is in the lead so far as fund raising, trailed by Michael P Jingozian in second and Imperato in third. Each has a virtually identical platform that's basically the same platform that Badnarik ran on in 2004. I found out today when I got my sample ballot that my switch to the Green Party was lost in the mail or something, so I'm still officially registered Libertarian (which is strange for a socialist, but w/e). I'm having trouble deciding who to pick, so I hope that I get good info from our Tilted Libertarians.

01-09-2008, 09:59 PM	#2 (permalink)
SecretMethod70 Human Administrator Location: Chicago	Eh, it doesn't matter. Once Ron Paul doesn't get the Republican nomination, they're going to try very hard to convince him to run as a Libertarian. I don't know how likely that is (though he was their candidate in 1988), but I certainly wouldn't be surprised if he decided to do that. __________________ Le temps détruit tout "Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling

01-09-2008, 10:46 PM	#6 (permalink)
Plan9 I Confess a Shiver	Yes, yes... that lame tribal tat means she's a flake and will flip-flop on the issues to prevent you from uncovering her loaf-of-white-bread IQ. __________________ *Whatever you can carry.* "You should not drink... and bake."

01-09-2008, 11:04 PM	#8 (permalink)
dc_dux Location: Washington DC	If he does, the Republican National Committee will likely take away his credentials to run for reelection for Congress as a Republican at the same time. If he runs for Congress as a Libertarian and keeps his Congressional seat, which would be likely, perhaps he could then caucus with the Democrats ..the party that opposes the current Iraq war policy, the Patriot Act and warrantless wiretaps __________________ "The perfect is the enemy of the good." ~ Voltaire Last edited by dc_dux; 01-09-2008 at 11:07 PM..

01-09-2008, 11:29 PM	#11 (permalink)
SecretMethod70 Human Administrator Location: Chicago	None of the (2) Libertarians I know are paying any attention to the Libertarian primaries. __________________ Le temps détruit tout "Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling

01-09-2008, 10:22 PM	#3 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Huh. So none of em, eh? I mean it's my duty to help choose one of these guys to represent the Libertarian party. If Paul was on the list, I'd probably vote for him but he's not.

01-09-2008, 10:30 PM	#4 (permalink)
ASU2003 immoral minority Location: Back in Ohio	I'm surprised that the Libertarian party doesn't come right out and say to consider voting for Ron Paul. http://www.christinesmith.us/ Oh, wait one of the candidates does. Just don't search for her name at work with Yahoo. A picture from when she (ok, not her, but another Christine Smth) was Miss December 2005 for Plaboy. NSFW - http://www.playboyzone.net/2005/2005...ine_Smith.html - NSFW Can't you write in his name, even on your pre-registered party ballot?

01-09-2008, 10:37 PM	#5 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Looks like someone liberated her from her clothes.

01-09-2008, 11:22 PM	#10 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	So none of our Libertarians are even considering any of these people? Is it all talk?

01-10-2008, 05:18 AM	#12 (permalink)
samcol Junkie Location: Indiana	Ron Paul is already running on the Libertarian platform. I don't see the point of the Libertarians running anyone against him when he has showed he can get 7-10% in caucus/primary setting. He's almost obligated to run as a 3rd party or Libertarian should he not get the election. He's still got the money and the support. __________________ It's time for the president to hand over his nobel peace prize. Last edited by samcol; 01-10-2008 at 05:43 AM..

01-10-2008, 08:12 AM	#13 (permalink)
joshbaumgartner Insane	I have listened to Paul say in no uncertain terms in more than one interview that he is not going to run as an independent or Libertarian this season. Not that it is worth a hill of beans if he changes his mind, but he was reasonably emphatic about it. The fact he has a relatively safe Republican seat in the House that would be put in jeopardy if he left the party might be why.

01-11-2008, 06:40 AM	#15 (permalink)
loquitur Junkie Location: NYC	willravel, someone can be a libertarian and still think that Libertarians tend to be cranks. (Note: my capitalization was not random in that sentence.) "Someone" includes me.

01-12-2008, 09:33 PM	#17 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	So you don't vote in the primaries?

01-13-2008, 09:22 AM	#18 (permalink)
Slims Eccentric insomniac Location: North Carolina	I am a libertarian but I am still registered as a republican. As such I try to vote in the republican primaries in order to influence who I think will actually win, and then vote libertarian in the election to support the libertarian party. I hate to say it, but if enough votes walk away from the mainstream parties (even if it causes the greater of two evils to be elected) then Repubs. and Dems will have to adopt their platforms due to the exodus of libertarians away from their parties. __________________ "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." - Winston Churchill "All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act out their dream with open eyes, to make it possible." Seven Pillars of Wisdom, T.E. Lawrence

01-13-2008, 09:59 AM	#19 (permalink)
genuinegirly Eat your vegetables Super Moderator Location: Arabidopsis-ville	Hey, I'm a Libertarian =) Libertarians and Republicans are allies on some issues, but they are not interchangeable. Rubs me the wrong way to think that a fully-accepted Republican would turn around and run as a Libertarian, just because they didn't get the votes in the primary to make it as the Republican candidate. Seems hypocritical. Though upon further reflection, I realize it's just a very excellent and backhanded way to get republican money to publicize a libertarian, get his views out there... It really depends on the perspective and intention of the person running. In this case, I'd support Ron Paul. __________________ "Sometimes I have to remember that things are brought to me for a reason, either for my own lessons or for the benefit of others." Cynthetiq "violence is no more or less real than non-violence." roachboy

01-13-2008, 07:01 PM	#20 (permalink)
loquitur Junkie Location: NYC	There are right-libertarians and left-libertarians. And there are Republicans of a a libertarian bent and Repubs of a hierarchical bent - just as there are civil libertarian Dems and authoritarian Dem types.

01-13-2008, 07:05 PM	#21 (permalink)
Ustwo Pissing in the cornflakes	Interesting that current Libertarian candidates would be xenophobic, from my understanding a 'true' Libertarian policy would be open borders, only without state assistance. __________________ Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.

01-14-2008, 03:33 AM	#22 (permalink)
Sun Tzu Conspiracy Realist Location: The Event Horizon	I hadn’t really paid attention while I had my false hopes for Paul so high. It really is discouraging, its not like they will let this person debate in the finals. Which has had me wondering , was Perot allowed up there because he had money. The whole process would seem so much more credable to allow more than two podiums on stage. As a side not while is was extremely boring I watch the Iowa caucus in CSPN. It was refreshing watching people hand count the votes. Why cant that happen with the presidential vote? Sure it would take longer. . . so televise the count under guard 24/7 until the end. While I will speculate because it just sounds to unreal to be true is anyone certain how and who handles the vote count? As far as teh candidates while I affiliate myself with the Party it has come down to the individual whoever they are or which party they represent- hopfully we will have strong independents. I need to start listening to what they have to say, even if I like it it seems a wasted vote anyway. Just like my vote for Badnarik was last time. I know what some view his reputation as, but for personal reasons I wish Colin Powell would run. __________________ *To confine our attention to terrestrial matters would be to limit the human spirit.- Stephen Hawking*

02-05-2008, 03:34 PM	#23 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Voted Imperato. Seriously, this wasn't intended to be a "maybe Ron Paul will blah blah" thread. It wasn't meant to be a "what I think of the Libertarian party" thread, either. I was hoping people would have something to say about the names in the OP. I was honestly looking to find out who you guys thought stood out and why, so I could make an informed decision today. MSD in #14 seems the only person who even looked at them. Jeez. Might as well close the thread.

02-05-2008, 04:50 PM	#24 (permalink)
dc_dux Location: Washington DC	Imperato tried to run as a Green and Reform party candidate in the past and worked to elect Republicans to Congress several years ago as honorary chairman of the National Republican Congressional Committee Business Council (the billionaires club). __________________ "The perfect is the enemy of the good." ~ Voltaire

02-05-2008, 04:58 PM	#26 (permalink)
dc_dux Location: Washington DC	I would characterize him as a Ross Perot without the mental instability. __________________ "The perfect is the enemy of the good." ~ Voltaire

02-07-2008, 06:10 AM	#28 (permalink)
lagoonguy Crazy Location: Atlanta	i haven't followed any of the libertarian talk and no nothing of the candidates. but i've decided to not vote republican or democrat so by default i might have to vote for whoever it ends up being.

02-07-2008, 07:01 AM	#29 (permalink)
samcol Junkie Location: Indiana	I really hope Badnarik runs again if not in 08 then 2012. A very strict constitutionalist like Ron Paul but a litter yonger and more presidential in my opinion. __________________ It's time for the president to hand over his nobel peace prize.