Help me understand Jena 6 protesting - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

intecel · 09-20-2007, 01:47 PM

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=3628976

I just don't get it. At all... Why the protests? If 6 people jump and beat the crap out of another person, why shouldn't charges be filed?

Should they just be let go? Umm... in my eyes, not without a trial.

The_Jazz · 09-20-2007, 01:51 PM

I don't think many of the protesters are saying that they should be let go - at least I haven't heard that. They do have a valid point that these kids are getting charged with greater crimes on what seems to be the sole basis of their race.

If you read more of the back story about what's happened in Jena, they've had typical small-town racial problems that have flaired into something much nastier in the past 4 or 5 years.

You can try this link since the Chicago Tribune was the first national media outlet to really pick up on the story. For the record, they aren't really a friend of Jesse Jackson et al. There are some links to their earlier stories on the issues.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...i_tab01_layout

intecel · 09-20-2007, 02:02 PM

Bethune-Cookman college here in orlando is holding a protest to "FREE" the "Jena 6" on the main page of the orlandosentinel.com... also, about every website i've been to show people wearing shirts saying "Free the Jena 6"...

That's where I got lost... why "free" them...

Rekna · 09-20-2007, 02:12 PM

There are so many reasons why they are protesting (justly in my opinion) here.

Read the backstory. Read about the noose's placed in the tree and the white boys getting expelled by the principal but then the school board reverses that and only suspends them for 3 days. Or about the black boy that was beat up by some of the white boys and having nothing happen. Or about the white boy who pulled a gun on a black boy in a gas station, to which the black boys wrestled the bun away from the boy and called the police. The police charged the black boys with theft for taking the gun....... They charged these minors as adults on crimes way higher than they did with the other boys. Charge these boys with crimes yes but don't charge them with greater crimes because they are black while ignoring others because the perps were white. Type "jena 6" into wiki and read up on what happened.

Willravel · 09-20-2007, 02:27 PM

Uneual treatment. The white kids get suspended, the black kid goes to jail. And that's leaving the horrible behavior like "white tree" and hanging nooses.

Democracy Now! has a lot of excellent information on this.
www.democracynow.com

roachboy · 09-20-2007, 02:49 PM

as for the slogan itself, never underestimate the email abilities of the rcp.

Slims · 09-20-2007, 02:54 PM

I can see being pissed about the racism, but not the criminal charges.

The victim was knocked unconscious with one of the first blows and was kicked repeatedly while laying unconcious, on the ground, by six guys. Racist or not, that's overboard, and they deserve to be charged.

If there is a problem with white kids getting off easy then fine, protest that. But why would you want these kids to be released from prison? What business do they have stomping on an unconscious kid unless they were trying to kill him? How does that not warrant an attempted murder charge?

I have heard about the white kid who supposedly hit a black kid with a beer bottle and was 'only' given assault and battery charges. However, that doesn't seem nearly as severe. I have seen a lot of guys get hit by beer bottles during brawls, and I am absolutely positive they all lived, and that their attackers were simply trying to win a fight...not kill anyone.

Perhaps there is an underlying racist sentiment that has some influence on how charges are filed, but at the same time I dont think the two incidents mentioned are in any way comprable.

Mojo_PeiPei · 09-20-2007, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg700

I can see being pissed about the racism, but not the criminal charges.

The victim was knocked unconscious with one of the first blows and was kicked repeatedly while laying unconcious, on the ground, by six guys. Racist or not, that's overboard, and they deserve to be charged.

If there is a problem with white kids getting off easy then fine, protest that. But why would you want these kids to be released from prison? What business do they have stomping on an unconscious kid unless they were trying to kill him? How does that not warrant an attempted murder charge?

I have heard about the white kid who supposedly hit a black kid with a beer bottle and was 'only' given assault and battery charges. However, that doesn't seem nearly as severe. I have seen a lot of guys get hit by beer bottles during brawls, and I am absolutely positive they all lived, and that their attackers were simply trying to win a fight...not kill anyone.

Perhaps there is an underlying racist sentiment that has some influence on how charges are filed, but at the same time I dont think the two incidents mentioned are in any way comprable.

Well put, it is baffling to me how somewhere in the midst of all of this, these kids are somehow victims.

Rekna · 09-20-2007, 03:05 PM

How about a charge for brandishing a gun? I know that is a crime here in SLC. The big problem is these kids were charged as adults.

Mojo_PeiPei · 09-20-2007, 03:17 PM

You don't necessarily have to be legally adult to be charged as one in all cases. It often happens for murder, its a matter of comprehension and cognizance of a suspect. If not minors could have free reign. I could murder somebody at the age of 17, and be released in a relatively short amount of time, plus it would be expunged from my record.

JustJess · 09-20-2007, 03:25 PM

Wow. I have read several articles on this, and I don't see how you can think that racism isn't playing a major, nasty, holy-shit-I-can't-believe-this-is-a-story-from-2007 role.

Were they wrong to beat that kid to a pulp? Yes.

Reading this situation without context of racism is a mistake, and one has to think you're forcefully keeping your blinders on.

Mojo_PeiPei · 09-20-2007, 03:39 PM

I think racism is fairly obvious, especially in the case of the DA who didn't prosecute for the nooses and any other ridiculous incident.

But in the case of the six little thuglets who tee'd off on the white kid, you won't get any sympathy from me. Its not the first time in this country that teenagers have been tried as adults. Attempted murder isn't unreasonable to me. Had the kid been so unlucky that he had died, the kids would be charged with second degree murder re: Louisiana Murder Charges, 2nd degree murder

Quote:

§30.1. Second degree murder

A. Second degree murder is the killing of a human being:

(1) When the offender has a specific intent to kill or to inflict great bodily harm; or

(2)(a) When the offender is engaged in the perpetration or attempted perpetration of aggravated rape, forcible rape, aggravated arson, aggravated burglary, aggravated kidnapping, second degree kidnapping, aggravated escape, assault by drive-by shooting, armed robbery, first degree robbery, second degree robbery, simple robbery, cruelty to juveniles, second degree cruelty to juveniles, or terrorism, even though he has no intent to kill or to inflict great bodily harm.

Aggravated assault is a gift for those kids, the fact that it got overturned as a result of age is laughable.

JustJess · 09-20-2007, 03:46 PM

I think the protesting is more about "tit for tat"... that if the white kids got off with a hand slap for their crimes, so should the black kids. But let's be honest here, if the white kids had been treated equally in the first place, it wouldn't have escalated the way that it did. The only way to redeem any part of this ridiculous situation is to go back and charge the white kids with the appropriate crimes, but that will never happen. Ever.

Now, several kids' lives are ruined. I hope their fucking stupid dumb motherfucker parents are proud of themselves. I hope those asshole idiots rot in hell for raising kids equally as fucking dumb.

/sorry for the cursing, they make me angry. Very very angry.

Mojo_PeiPei · 09-20-2007, 03:50 PM

Don't get me wrong the DA saying there were no charges under LA state law in which to charge those kids is a joke.

But it in no way justifies what the kids did, nor should have any bearing on their sentencing.

And yes their parents are fucking idiots, but at the same time these kids aren't babies they are teenagers, of the age where they were initially allowed to be charged as adults, I think it is their cross to bear, not their parents.

mixedmedia · 09-20-2007, 04:45 PM

Well, I think we can all rest assured that these guys won't be set free, so all you alarmists can sleep easy tonight knowing that they will be tried and convicted of something. Hopefully, thanks to people giving a shit about justice, it will be comensurate with what they actually did - beat on a kid who got up and went to a school function later that night.

I'm not at all surprised that this is happening in 2007. I've lived in a small town in Louisiana and I've seen the slow boiling racial hatred first hand. Lots and lots of white folks in Louisiana and other southern states have not greatly changed their attitude towards black people. What they have done is suppress it in public as much as possible, but it boils over again and again because the children are also being taught to carry a bias that can't be spoken of in public. What the fuck else can we expect to happen? It's going to boil over eventually, just like it has in Jena.

What I saw was more insidious than the open racism of the pre-civil rights era, but nevertheless harmful to race relations. The antagonism coming from both sides was palpable. This was my observation as a person moving into it from an entirely different, more tolerant, social framework.

Racnad · 09-21-2007, 06:58 AM

I'm all for equal treatment, but that's for equal crimes.

Hanging a noose in a tree is certainly rude, insensitive, obnoxious and innapropriate, but it is no way equvilent to knocking someone uncouncious and continuing to kick him. If you don't agree then please cite which law was violated by the noose in the tree. Attempted murder sounds like too severe a charge in this case, but remember it was reduced to aggravated assult.

If you're going to use innocent victims of racism to illustration racism in this country, they should be actual innocent victims, not kids who beat the shit out of other kids, or dancers who make up stories about being raped by LaCrosse teams.

mixedmedia · 09-21-2007, 07:11 AM

You need to keep in mind that this was an environment in which the black kids felt they needed to approach the principal of the school in order to find out if they could sit under the tree. So they sit under the tree and some assholes decide it will be funny to hang nooses from it - because they are so insensitive to their own insensitivity that they think humor can be found in the subject of lynchings. This is not rude, insensitive, obnoxious and inappropriate - it is repulsive. Which sets off a chain of events in which the white kids keep getting absolved from their transgressions and finally some black kids are arrested and treated harshly for their crime.

There is racism apparent in this story from the beginning to the end. Anyone who doesn't see that is fooling themselves. And it is apparent from the very beginning when the black kids don't know if they have the right to sit under the tree. I agree that sometimes race is played erroneously in media events like this, but this is not one of them.

Mojo_PeiPei · 09-21-2007, 07:42 AM

No one is disputing that racism is a problem, no one is saying it is acceptable. Yes it is sad it is still around and so strong as it is in Jena. Obviously there needs to be change, but by saying that...

Quote:

the white kids keep getting absolved from their transgressions and finally some black kids are arrested and treated harshly for their crime.

What the hell is with this? I am not an alarmist, but you certainly look like an "apologist" for those poor "victims" the Jena 6. They committed a brutal crime, on their own. It has zero to do with any thing that transpired before that incident.

The_Jazz · 09-21-2007, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mojo_PeiPei

It has zero to do with any thing that transpired before that incident.

It happened in a vacuum?

Of course it had everything to do with what happened before. That's why when you look at the whole picture, you see that it's an escalation of racial tensions resulting in these 6 kids beating another kid. It culiminated with these 6 being charged with attempted murder, which seems to me to way over the line, especially given the speedy recovery of the victim.

Mojo, look at the whole picture, not just the one incident. When you do, I think you'll see something much different.

Mojo_PeiPei · 09-21-2007, 07:52 AM

I realize it happened for sure as a result of boiled over tensions. Fine.

It still doesn't justify the actions or make the kids martyrs.

And the charges were latered lessened, and only one has yet to even be tried.

The_Jazz · 09-21-2007, 07:58 AM

You're then making the assumption that the protests are over just the 6 kids and not the overall problems. I don't see anyone justifying the beating.

The higher charges are a result of the pressure by the protesters.

Mojo_PeiPei · 09-21-2007, 08:01 AM

Every shirt or banner I saw said "Free the Jena 6".

Am I missing something?

mixedmedia · 09-21-2007, 08:02 AM

Did you read the story about black kids being assaulted and having a gun pulled on them without arrests being made before this incident?

Sure they beat the crap out of this kid, but he walked away and went to a school event that evening. Then the black kids get arrested and charged with attempted murder? Sure the charges were reduced (after public outcry) but that doesn't excuse the imbalance of justice, the first unjust response that this town had to the crime.

And I am not an apologist for them. That's a total falsehood. I fully support their being punished in a just way. It's just unfortunate that it couldn't work both ways in Jena.

Mojo_PeiPei · 09-21-2007, 08:08 AM

Yes, the incident at the gas station is completely laughable as the black kids were ultimately the ones charged.

To me it is a completely moot point the white kid who got beaten was able to make it out later that night. He was fortunate. What don't you grasp about beating someone to the point they are unconcious, six on one no less, then continuing to stomp him when he is passed out from physical assault and unable to defend himself, again six on one.

If you get in a fight you shouldn't be charged with attempted murder, but a "fight" denotes mutual combat, or in the very least a scenario where one person is able to defend themselves, again a key word DEFEND THEMSELVES.

Tell me how six on one equates to mutual combat, or a situation where a reasonable person would be able to defend themslves? If the kid had carried a side arm and shot one of those gabronis he would have almost certainly been absolved as it was SIX ON ONE, I don't know about you but I percieve a great threat to my life at that point. To get further beaten after the point by six little shit heads after you are unconcious, come on...

Racnad · 09-21-2007, 08:17 AM

Ok, add repulsive to my list of adjetives. Add racist too. Of course there's racism here. But I don't understand why bad thoughts in some people's heads, that sometimes manifest themselves in repulives displayes such as putting a noose in a tree makes it OK to beat the shit out of someone, especially since the kid who was beaten was not one of the kids who hung the noose (I'm sure if he was the media would have said so).

I like what I once heard Colin Powell say about racism. He said in an interview that when someone someone called him a nigger, he took the attitude that the person using that word was the one with the problem, and it was no relflection on his own worth. He did not allow ignorant people to make him feel bad about himself. If these racist displays were seen for what they really are - reflection of the ignorance and lack of sensitivety of the person dsplaying them.

By promoting the message that African Amercians are so fragile that they must be protected from harm caused be merely seeing or hearing symbols or words dating from past oppression, we are making ignorant racist white people feel more powerful.

mixedmedia · 09-21-2007, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mojo_PeiPei

Yes, the incident at the gas station is completely laughable as the black kids were ultimately the ones charged.

To me it is a completely moot point the white kid who got beaten was able to make it out later that night. He was fortunate. What don't you grasp about beating someone to the point they are unconcious, six on one no less, then continuing to stomp him when he is passed out from physical assault and unable to defend himself, again six on one.

If you get in a fight you shouldn't be charged with attempted murder, but a "fight" denotes mutual combat, or in the very least a scenario where one person is able to defend themselves, again a key word DEFEND THEMSELVES.

Tell me how six on one equates to mutual combat, or a situation where a reasonable person would be able to defend themslves? If the kid had carried a side arm and shot one of those gabronis he would have almost certainly been absolved as it was SIX ON ONE, I don't know about you but I percieve a great threat to my life at that point. To get further beaten after the point by six little shit heads after you are unconcious, come on...

I do not 'not get this.' My concern is that punishment, like everyone else who is horrified by this situation, is meted out fairly. The protests, regardless of signs and t-shirts that say 'free the jena 6', are meant to highlight the inequality of the justice system in this town. What exactly is the problem with that?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racnad

Ok, add repulsive to my list of adjetives. Add racist too. Of course there's racism here. But I don't understand why bad thoughts in some people's heads, that sometimes manifest themselves in repulives displayes such as putting a noose in a tree makes it OK to beat the shit out of someone, especially since the kid who was beaten was not one of the kids who hung the noose (I'm sure if he was the media would have said so).

I like what I once heard Colin Powell say about racism. He said in an interview that when someone someone called him a nigger, he took the attitude that the person using that word was the one with the problem, and it was no relflection on his own worth. He did not allow ignorant people to make him feel bad about himself. If these racist displays were seen for what they really are - reflection of the ignorance and lack of sensitivety of the person dsplaying them.

By promoting the message that African Amercians are so fragile that they must be protected from harm caused be merely seeing or hearing symbols or words dating from past oppression, we are making ignorant racist white people feel more powerful.

No one has said that it makes it okay. Once again, my views are being unfairly represented. Why is that? I could just as easily say that you and MoJo PeiPei are apologists for racism. I don't believe that, though, because I can make my argument without pinning someone who disagrees with me into an extreme corner. The issue is the imbalance of justice. Do you not agree that this should be exposed and changed?

Mojo_PeiPei · 09-21-2007, 08:31 AM

I fail to see how the Jena 6 are not the point, I think all the signs, shirts, media reports,and interviews attesting to the fact that they are their to "support" the six kids agrees with me.

Also how was Justice not "metted" out fairly? Six idiots committed a violent crime, they were arrested, charged as such.

And I'm rather upset that hate crime charges weren't pressed against the Jena 6. If it were six white kids who beat the shit out of a black kid, you know damn well everyone and their mother would be shrieking and hollering.

I'm not trying to unfairly paint you in an apologetic light, you called me an alarmist first.

And I am not denying that Jena is a hotbed of racial problems, especially how it relates to justice. But the Jena six are in no way shape or form fitting in that discussion for me.

mixedmedia · 09-21-2007, 08:33 AM

Yes, they are there to support the six kids and their right to fair justice.

Racnad · 09-21-2007, 08:40 AM

You didn't say it was OK, but T-Shirts reading "Free the Jena 6" are saying it was OK. If other incidents were not prosecuted properly, then they should be. But one thing's for sure, calling someone racist names or displaying nooses, swastikas or whatever is less severe and deserves less punishment than a gang beating that causes a concussion and loss of vision in one eye for three weeks (the description of the kid's injuries from Wikipedia).

mixedmedia · 09-21-2007, 08:46 AM

So some people and their t-shirts are more important than illuminating racial disparity in the justice system? You can't brush off the significance of the real issue here. It's a lot bigger than the beating of this kid.

kutulu · 09-21-2007, 09:18 AM

You can't change what happened in the past. They only way to make things right is to apply the law fairly now and in the future.

mixedmedia · 09-21-2007, 09:24 AM

And you apply the law fairly now by owning up to the mistakes of the past, especially when it's the very recent past.

***************************************

Sorry, I missed this part earlier.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mojo_PeiPei

Also how was Justice not "metted" out fairly? Six idiots committed a violent crime, they were arrested, charged as such.

They were charged with attempted murder for a beating in which the victim was in the hospital for 2 hours and there was no evidence that their intent was to kill him and only after public outrage did they reduce the charges. Their initial reaction was unjust and is indicative of the real issue here. I don't see how you can admit there is racism in Jena and then deny it as an issue in this situation.

Quote:

And I'm rather upset that hate crime charges weren't pressed against the Jena 6. If it were six white kids who beat the shit out of a black kid, you know damn well everyone and their mother would be shrieking and hollering.

The assault was provoked by a comment that the victim made. I don't believe at that point it can be considered a hate crime. They didn't attack him because he was white, they attacked him because he was a white guy making comments about one of the attackers. If the guy had been walking down the street minding his own business when he was attacked then I would agree with you.

Quote:

I'm not trying to unfairly paint you in an apologetic light, you called me an alarmist first.

Well, I am sorry about that. I was being a little sarcastic. It's a weakness of mine. But I do think that concentrating on the few who have shirts or signs calling for their release as if it were the overwhelming opinion of everyone who feels this situation is wrong is a little extreme...perhaps even convenient. And I will go out on a limb and speculate that those statements are not being made because they believe the Jena 6 are innocent, but because they believe their has been a miscarriage of justice in Jena.

Quote:

And I am not denying that Jena is a hotbed of racial problems, especially how it relates to justice. But the Jena six are in no way shape or form fitting in that discussion for me.

The situation in this town cannot be dissected and its parts parceled out in an easily digested order. Everything that has happened there is the direct result of an established social order that is wrong. And when I say that, I don't excuse these young men from being punished for what they did. But I think the entire situation was handled by the town's officials in an insensitive and downright ignorant way that, in essence, paved the pathway for this to happen.

JohnBua · 09-28-2007, 03:55 PM

Didn't the first kid charged have five prior violent charges? If so, I DON'T want that guy freed, black or white.

ottopilot · 10-01-2007, 12:45 PM

09-20-2007, 01:47 PM	#1 (permalink)
intecel Psycho	Help me understand Jena 6 protesting http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=3628976 I just don't get it. At all... Why the protests? If 6 people jump and beat the crap out of another person, why shouldn't charges be filed? Should they just be let go? Umm... in my eyes, not without a trial.

09-20-2007, 01:51 PM	#2 (permalink)
The_Jazz Asshole Administrator Location: Chicago	I don't think many of the protesters are saying that they should be let go - at least I haven't heard that. They do have a valid point that these kids are getting charged with greater crimes on what seems to be the sole basis of their race. If you read more of the back story about what's happened in Jena, they've had typical small-town racial problems that have flaired into something much nastier in the past 4 or 5 years. You can try this link since the Chicago Tribune was the first national media outlet to really pick up on the story. For the record, they aren't really a friend of Jesse Jackson et al. There are some links to their earlier stories on the issues. http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...i_tab01_layout __________________ "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - B. Franklin "There ought to be limits to freedom." - George W. Bush "We have met the enemy and he is us." - Pogo

09-20-2007, 02:49 PM	#6 (permalink)
roachboy Super Moderator Location: essex ma	as for the slogan itself, never underestimate the email abilities of the rcp. __________________ a gramophone its corrugated trumpet silver handle spinning dog. such faithfulness it hear it make you sick. -kamau brathwaite

09-20-2007, 02:54 PM	#7 (permalink)
Slims Eccentric insomniac Location: North Carolina	I can see being pissed about the racism, but not the criminal charges. The victim was knocked unconscious with one of the first blows and was kicked repeatedly while laying unconcious, on the ground, by six guys. Racist or not, that's overboard, and they deserve to be charged. If there is a problem with white kids getting off easy then fine, protest that. But why would you want these kids to be released from prison? What business do they have stomping on an unconscious kid unless they were trying to kill him? How does that not warrant an attempted murder charge? I have heard about the white kid who supposedly hit a black kid with a beer bottle and was 'only' given assault and battery charges. However, that doesn't seem nearly as severe. I have seen a lot of guys get hit by beer bottles during brawls, and I am absolutely positive they all lived, and that their attackers were simply trying to win a fight...not kill anyone. Perhaps there is an underlying racist sentiment that has some influence on how charges are filed, but at the same time I dont think the two incidents mentioned are in any way comprable. __________________ "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." - Winston Churchill "All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act out their dream with open eyes, to make it possible." Seven Pillars of Wisdom, T.E. Lawrence

09-20-2007, 03:17 PM	#10 (permalink)
Mojo_PeiPei Kiss of Death Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow	You don't necessarily have to be legally adult to be charged as one in all cases. It often happens for murder, its a matter of comprehension and cognizance of a suspect. If not minors could have free reign. I could murder somebody at the age of 17, and be released in a relatively short amount of time, plus it would be expunged from my record. __________________ To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition.

09-20-2007, 02:02 PM	#3 (permalink)
intecel Psycho	Bethune-Cookman college here in orlando is holding a protest to "FREE" the "Jena 6" on the main page of the orlandosentinel.com... also, about every website i've been to show people wearing shirts saying "Free the Jena 6"... That's where I got lost... why "free" them...

09-20-2007, 02:12 PM	#4 (permalink)
Rekna Junkie	There are so many reasons why they are protesting (justly in my opinion) here. Read the backstory. Read about the noose's placed in the tree and the white boys getting expelled by the principal but then the school board reverses that and only suspends them for 3 days. Or about the black boy that was beat up by some of the white boys and having nothing happen. Or about the white boy who pulled a gun on a black boy in a gas station, to which the black boys wrestled the bun away from the boy and called the police. The police charged the black boys with theft for taking the gun....... They charged these minors as adults on crimes way higher than they did with the other boys. Charge these boys with crimes yes but don't charge them with greater crimes because they are black while ignoring others because the perps were white. Type "jena 6" into wiki and read up on what happened.

09-20-2007, 02:27 PM	#5 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Uneual treatment. The white kids get suspended, the black kid goes to jail. And that's leaving the horrible behavior like "white tree" and hanging nooses. Democracy Now! has a lot of excellent information on this. www.democracynow.com

09-20-2007, 03:05 PM	#9 (permalink)
Rekna Junkie	How about a charge for brandishing a gun? I know that is a crime here in SLC. The big problem is these kids were charged as adults.

09-20-2007, 03:25 PM	#11 (permalink)
JustJess Unencapsulated Location: Kittyville	Wow. I have read several articles on this, and I don't see how you can think that racism isn't playing a major, nasty, holy-shit-I-can't-believe-this-is-a-story-from-2007 role. Were they wrong to beat that kid to a pulp? Yes. Reading this situation without context of racism is a mistake, and one has to think you're forcefully keeping your blinders on. __________________ My heart knows me better than I know myself, so I'm gonna let it do all the talkin'.

09-20-2007, 03:46 PM	#13 (permalink)
JustJess Unencapsulated Location: Kittyville	I think the protesting is more about "tit for tat"... that if the white kids got off with a hand slap for their crimes, so should the black kids. But let's be honest here, if the white kids had been treated equally in the first place, it wouldn't have escalated the way that it did. The only way to redeem any part of this ridiculous situation is to go back and charge the white kids with the appropriate crimes, but that will never happen. Ever. Now, several kids' lives are ruined. I hope their fucking stupid dumb motherfucker parents are proud of themselves. I hope those asshole idiots rot in hell for raising kids equally as fucking dumb. /sorry for the cursing, they make me angry. Very very angry. __________________ My heart knows me better than I know myself, so I'm gonna let it do all the talkin'.

09-20-2007, 03:50 PM	#14 (permalink)
Mojo_PeiPei Kiss of Death Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow	Don't get me wrong the DA saying there were no charges under LA state law in which to charge those kids is a joke. But it in no way justifies what the kids did, nor should have any bearing on their sentencing. And yes their parents are fucking idiots, but at the same time these kids aren't babies they are teenagers, of the age where they were initially allowed to be charged as adults, I think it is their cross to bear, not their parents. __________________ To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition.

09-20-2007, 04:45 PM	#15 (permalink)
mixedmedia has all her shots. Location: Florida	Well, I think we can all rest assured that these guys won't be set free, so all you alarmists can sleep easy tonight knowing that they will be tried and convicted of something. Hopefully, thanks to people giving a shit about justice, it will be comensurate with what they actually did - beat on a kid who got up and went to a school function later that night. I'm not at all surprised that this is happening in 2007. I've lived in a small town in Louisiana and I've seen the slow boiling racial hatred first hand. Lots and lots of white folks in Louisiana and other southern states have not greatly changed their attitude towards black people. What they have done is suppress it in public as much as possible, but it boils over again and again because the children are also being taught to carry a bias that can't be spoken of in public. What the fuck else can we expect to happen? It's going to boil over eventually, just like it has in Jena. What I saw was more insidious than the open racism of the pre-civil rights era, but nevertheless harmful to race relations. The antagonism coming from both sides was palpable. This was my observation as a person moving into it from an entirely different, more tolerant, social framework. __________________ Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

09-21-2007, 06:58 AM	#16 (permalink)
Racnad Crazy Location: Washington State	I'm all for equal treatment, but that's for equal crimes. Hanging a noose in a tree is certainly rude, insensitive, obnoxious and innapropriate, but it is no way equvilent to knocking someone uncouncious and continuing to kick him. If you don't agree then please cite which law was violated by the noose in the tree. Attempted murder sounds like too severe a charge in this case, but remember it was reduced to aggravated assult. If you're going to use innocent victims of racism to illustration racism in this country, they should be actual innocent victims, not kids who beat the shit out of other kids, or dancers who make up stories about being raped by LaCrosse teams.

09-21-2007, 07:11 AM	#17 (permalink)
mixedmedia has all her shots. Location: Florida	You need to keep in mind that this was an environment in which the black kids felt they needed to approach the principal of the school in order to find out if they could sit under the tree. So they sit under the tree and some assholes decide it will be funny to hang nooses from it - because they are so insensitive to their own insensitivity that they think humor can be found in the subject of lynchings. This is not rude, insensitive, obnoxious and inappropriate - it is repulsive. Which sets off a chain of events in which the white kids keep getting absolved from their transgressions and finally some black kids are arrested and treated harshly for their crime. There is racism apparent in this story from the beginning to the end. Anyone who doesn't see that is fooling themselves. And it is apparent from the very beginning when the black kids don't know if they have the right to sit under the tree. I agree that sometimes race is played erroneously in media events like this, but this is not one of them. __________________ Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

09-21-2007, 07:52 AM	#20 (permalink)
Mojo_PeiPei Kiss of Death Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow	I realize it happened for sure as a result of boiled over tensions. Fine. It still doesn't justify the actions or make the kids martyrs. And the charges were latered lessened, and only one has yet to even be tried. __________________ To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition. Last edited by Mojo_PeiPei; 09-21-2007 at 07:57 AM..

09-21-2007, 07:58 AM	#21 (permalink)
The_Jazz Asshole Administrator Location: Chicago	You're then making the assumption that the protests are over just the 6 kids and not the overall problems. I don't see anyone justifying the beating. The higher charges are a result of the pressure by the protesters. __________________ "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - B. Franklin "There ought to be limits to freedom." - George W. Bush "We have met the enemy and he is us." - Pogo

09-21-2007, 08:01 AM	#22 (permalink)
Mojo_PeiPei Kiss of Death Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow	Every shirt or banner I saw said "Free the Jena 6". Am I missing something? __________________ To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition.

09-21-2007, 08:02 AM	#23 (permalink)
mixedmedia has all her shots. Location: Florida	Did you read the story about black kids being assaulted and having a gun pulled on them without arrests being made before this incident? Sure they beat the crap out of this kid, but he walked away and went to a school event that evening. Then the black kids get arrested and charged with attempted murder? Sure the charges were reduced (after public outcry) but that doesn't excuse the imbalance of justice, the first unjust response that this town had to the crime. And I am not an apologist for them. That's a total falsehood. I fully support their being punished in a just way. It's just unfortunate that it couldn't work both ways in Jena. __________________ Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

09-21-2007, 08:08 AM	#24 (permalink)
Mojo_PeiPei Kiss of Death Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow	Yes, the incident at the gas station is completely laughable as the black kids were ultimately the ones charged. To me it is a completely moot point the white kid who got beaten was able to make it out later that night. He was fortunate. What don't you grasp about beating someone to the point they are unconcious, six on one no less, then continuing to stomp him when he is passed out from physical assault and unable to defend himself, again six on one. If you get in a fight you shouldn't be charged with attempted murder, but a "fight" denotes mutual combat, or in the very least a scenario where one person is able to defend themselves, again a key word DEFEND THEMSELVES. Tell me how six on one equates to mutual combat, or a situation where a reasonable person would be able to defend themslves? If the kid had carried a side arm and shot one of those gabronis he would have almost certainly been absolved as it was SIX ON ONE, I don't know about you but I percieve a great threat to my life at that point. To get further beaten after the point by six little shit heads after you are unconcious, come on... __________________ To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition.

09-21-2007, 08:17 AM	#25 (permalink)
Racnad Crazy Location: Washington State	Ok, add repulsive to my list of adjetives. Add racist too. Of course there's racism here. But I don't understand why bad thoughts in some people's heads, that sometimes manifest themselves in repulives displayes such as putting a noose in a tree makes it OK to beat the shit out of someone, especially since the kid who was beaten was not one of the kids who hung the noose (I'm sure if he was the media would have said so). I like what I once heard Colin Powell say about racism. He said in an interview that when someone someone called him a nigger, he took the attitude that the person using that word was the one with the problem, and it was no relflection on his own worth. He did not allow ignorant people to make him feel bad about himself. If these racist displays were seen for what they really are - reflection of the ignorance and lack of sensitivety of the person dsplaying them. By promoting the message that African Amercians are so fragile that they must be protected from harm caused be merely seeing or hearing symbols or words dating from past oppression, we are making ignorant racist white people feel more powerful.

09-21-2007, 08:31 AM	#27 (permalink)
Mojo_PeiPei Kiss of Death Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow	I fail to see how the Jena 6 are not the point, I think all the signs, shirts, media reports,and interviews attesting to the fact that they are their to "support" the six kids agrees with me. Also how was Justice not "metted" out fairly? Six idiots committed a violent crime, they were arrested, charged as such. And I'm rather upset that hate crime charges weren't pressed against the Jena 6. If it were six white kids who beat the shit out of a black kid, you know damn well everyone and their mother would be shrieking and hollering. I'm not trying to unfairly paint you in an apologetic light, you called me an alarmist first. And I am not denying that Jena is a hotbed of racial problems, especially how it relates to justice. But the Jena six are in no way shape or form fitting in that discussion for me. __________________ To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition. Last edited by Mojo_PeiPei; 09-21-2007 at 08:35 AM..

09-21-2007, 08:33 AM	#28 (permalink)
mixedmedia has all her shots. Location: Florida	Yes, they are there to support the six kids and their right to fair justice. __________________ Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

09-21-2007, 08:40 AM	#29 (permalink)
Racnad Crazy Location: Washington State	You didn't say it was OK, but T-Shirts reading "Free the Jena 6" are saying it was OK. If other incidents were not prosecuted properly, then they should be. But one thing's for sure, calling someone racist names or displaying nooses, swastikas or whatever is less severe and deserves less punishment than a gang beating that causes a concussion and loss of vision in one eye for three weeks (the description of the kid's injuries from Wikipedia).

09-21-2007, 08:46 AM	#30 (permalink)
mixedmedia has all her shots. Location: Florida	So some people and their t-shirts are more important than illuminating racial disparity in the justice system? You can't brush off the significance of the real issue here. It's a lot bigger than the beating of this kid. __________________ Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

09-21-2007, 09:18 AM	#31 (permalink)
kutulu Junkie	You can't change what happened in the past. They only way to make things right is to apply the law fairly now and in the future.

09-28-2007, 03:55 PM	#33 (permalink)
JohnBua Banned	Didn't the first kid charged have five prior violent charges? If so, I DON'T want that guy freed, black or white.

10-01-2007, 12:45 PM	#34 (permalink)
ottopilot let me be clear Location: Waddy Peytona	edit Last edited by ottopilot; 12-27-2007 at 08:33 AM..