raeanna74

What if someday you found that the set of beliefs that you hold were false? This is saying that whatever proved that particular set false did not affect other belief systems. It could be just that you lost faith in those beliefs. What other belief system would you choose? What would be your second choice??

I don't know a name to put with it but if I had to choose another set of beliefs other that what I hold currently (baptist - NONconservative) I would have to go with a philosophy that would involve a general creative spirit. Even perhaps as etherial as just an energy that pervades everything. I would have to go with a philosophy that involves a cyclical life - reincarnation or something similar. I don't know what I would call that but it's what my second choice would be. If anyone CAN put a name to it please post as well.

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"Always learn the rules so that you can break them properly." Dalai Lama
My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

cheeterbo

it has been only recently (the past year) that i believe the set of beliefs (RC) i had are false. i believe there is something, a force, a god, an alien race, something, that has caused us to be as we are.

until that "link" is found, i will continue to believe in this manner.

i think the name for my current "belief" is agnostic.

El Kaz

I don't especially label my "set of belief". I'm pretty much atheist, but I realize there's always a doubt as to the existance of a higher being that played a part in the creation, but not in our everyday life. (So that's agnostic)
So if my beliefs were disproved as in, it was "proved" that there's a god, my "secondary set of belief" (man that's hardcore labeling ) would be admitting the existance of one or more higher being(s) who played part in the creation, but probably not in the evolution of all things.

Bobaphat

I have no idea what would be next. Because of that, I guess my number 2 belief system would have to be agnosticism.

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--size matters not-- yoda

zen_tom

That's interesting - for me I only see two alternatives; Spiritual beliefs (i.e. where one's self or soul can exist outside of and separate to the body - sometimes called an afterlife) and non spiritual beliefs (where one's self is the body and there is no afterlife)

I don't really see much difference between the various flavours of spiritualism, whether they are Eastern, Western, Arabic, New Age, Science Fiction, whatever, they are all variations on the same theme.

I'm already on the non spiritualist path, so the only other option to my mind is to take the spiritualistic one - which one of those I choose doesn't really seem to make much difference to me.

The second aspect of my belief concerns authority. You can either believe that authority exists, or that it is an illusion. Since I believe that there is no such thing as a higher authority, or any authority of any kind - I'd have to choose a belief system that did.

It looks like I'd have to become a Catholic.

CSflim

I am always glad to see my 'beliefs' proved wrong. This is what keeps them envigorated and fresh. This is what allows them to evolve and to progress.

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frogza

The only way that I could loose faith in my current belief set is if it were somehow proven that Christ was not who he claimed to be, of course that would rule out all Christian faiths. That is the ony way I could see that my beliefs could be found baseless but other beliefs remain true, since most other religions profess a belief in a higher power.

I would probably lean toward a version of Zen Buddihsm. The mastery over self aspect has always appealed to me. I may have gravitated to the greek idea of stoicism but not to extreme that Spartans were known for. Whatever I did though, it would definitly be a faith that required more than just a once a week thing, passive discipleship just isn't my style.

asaris

I really don't know -- it would depend on what caused me to lose my faith. If it was something like Ahura Mazda appearing to me bodily, then I would convert to Zoroastrianism. If it was proof that a divine being was impossible, then it would be atheism. There are probably other scenarios where I would lose my faith, and these would tend to lead me in different ways.

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"Die Deutschen meinen, daß die Kraft sich in Härte und Grausamkeit offenbaren müsse, sie unterwerfen sich dann gerne und mit Bewunderung:[...]. Daß es Kraft giebt in der Milde und Stille, das glauben sie nicht leicht."

"The Germans believe that power must reveal itself in hardness and cruelty and then submit themselves gladly and with admiration[...]. They do not believe readily that there is power in meekness and calm."

-- Friedrich Nietzsche

the_marq

If I was to find out that my athiest beliefs were wrong (whatever that means), I would immediately convert to the Catholic faith.

Why? Catholics have the best deal, spirituality-wise.

IE:
*they can sin all they want and still be forgiven (at least that's how I understand it)
*Heaven is a great deal. Basically by being a nice guy and going to church once a week I get an eternity of milk and honey. Sweet.

I know I sound facetious, but I am serious. I wish I could be a good Christian, but I just can't muster up the faith, and I kinda envy those who can.

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The Truth:

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#3 in a series

zen_tom

I know exactly what you mean - Catholiscism is fantastic - there's so much detail - all the art, architecture, magic, intruige, mystiscism, ritual, history, there's an answer provided for every eventuality - it's the richest, sexiest, most satisfying religion I can think of.

If religions were sandwiches, Catholiscism would be the biggest, juicyest, tallest, most delicious sandwich in the shop, and a side order of fries.

raeanna74

I find it interesting that many of you would choose Catholiscism. One reason I wouldn't choose that one is that your eternity is based on your works. You can end up in pergatory if you sin too much. If you commit a venal sin (excuse my spelling - not sure of the terms) then you can end up in hell. The reason I've chosen my first choice is that the protestant beliefs (of which baptist is one) believe that once you profess faith in Christ as the act of sacrifice which he performed by giving up his life as payment for all sin - then you're headed to heaven. Even if you were to commit murder - it's forgiven. The only consequence there would be a loss of rewards and jewels once you reach heaven. I would choose Protestant Christianity over Catholiscism any day.

Second choice is still something with no MAIN spiritual authority. Just an energy of the universe or karma or some such direction for the spiritual universe.

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"Always learn the rules so that you can break them properly." Dalai Lama
My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

flstf

I am mostly agnostic. But as my old grandmother used to say "You'll be in hell for less than 5 minutes before you change your mind". So I guess I'd become god fearing. Not really, but proof of some sort of superior being would be helpful.

tecoyah

As I am currently Pagan........You would need to disprove one hell of alot of stuff. Still, I would likely become buddhist.

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Holding onto anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned. - Buddha

stonegrody

I'm agnostic on the verge of Atheism. The proof I would need to convert me to Atheism is that there is no hope. I'm pretty close to abandoning my beliefs.

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MacGuyver

Well, theres no second choice if I dont believe in jack shit right now.

In a more serious sense, buddhists seem like pretty chill dudes, I'd probably try that.

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We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence then, is not an act, but a habit.
---Aristotle

Deeds, not words, shall speak [for] me.
---John Fletcher

Grancey

Interesting. I was raised a Catholic and my religious education was thwarted by a nun in Catechism who chose to use me as a puppet for her lesson in sharing. You can imagine. Just make sure the shop you select has passed the health codes.

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Quiet, mild-mannered souls might just turn out to be roaring lions of two-fisted cool.

Rdr4evr

I'm agnostic, so my belief can't be proven wrong since I'm open to both sides, so my only options would be atheism or religion. The only way I would follow organized religion is if it is proven to be 100% accurate, if not, than I would become an atheist.

Willravel

I am currently non denominational christian/buddhist. I would probably become a Taoist as a second choice. I must have read Tao Te Ching a thousand times. It's similar enough to Buddhism for me to phase right in, too.

Zant

I would considered a Muslim, but I see Islam more as if I were on the outside, I am truly not religious at all, I have always seen religion not as something that seems to exceed a physical, I just see it as another political motive, a way to not only sway politics but history as well, such as the Catholics and the Pope during the Dark Age.

I see the belief that we "recycle" to put in a more simple terms, we don't go to heaven, and we don't go to hell, I see that we start anew, not as just a human, but as everything from animals to even plants, something else in the universe seems to just which us around to start anew and live a completely different life.

It almost seems Buddhist

I don't see religion as anything of use or purpose, it may save people or hurt people, such as finding themselves and such but I think society should have been based on a more humane ideal.

ARTelevision

I believe nothing. But it's very difficult to do that. I spend a lot of time fighting what seems to me to be a very natural human instinct to need to believe things. I suppose if I was not obsessed with this decision I've made to consciously work to continually eliminate belief from my mind, I would just give it up and believe a few things.

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create evolution

d*d

isn't the beleif in nothing, the idea that it is just instinct (therefore in someway designed to protect us) that causes beleifs to form in our minds a beleif in itself?

ARTelevision

Only on the level of words can different things be construed to be the same thing. The process of dispelling belief is just a procedure - not a belief.

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create evolution

d*d

To constantly evaluate any thought process that may be tending toward a beleif structure and consciencely stop yourself from placing any values on it must create a world without meaning, don't we place values on things through what we believe ( I beleive I am sitting here in front of my computer). Sorry if this is going off thread, I just find Arts interpretation intriguing

ARTelevision

Well, I just don't see a need for believing anything. I operate very well with only provisional hypotheses. But as I said, it's a difficult condition to acheive - believing nothing. In actual existential fact, it is more of an ongoing process - of negation.

As far as meaning goes, I don't see any necessary connection between belief and meaning. Many of my provisional hypotheses mean a great deal to me...

So as not to go too far off topic here, here's a thread where this is discussed further.

http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...ghlight=belief

Thanks for your interest, d*d.

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create evolution

Master_Shake

I guess I kind of reject the question, I don't choose a belief system because it makes me feel good, I only respond to those ideas that work. If for whatever reason science was proven to be utter nonsense the system I would choose would be whatever one is correct (or more accurately reflects reality or my perceptions of it, etc.).

Having said that, I think the question then simply becomes "which system offers me the best rewards."

I think the scientologists have a decent program (aren't you reincarnated in your choice of life style?).

Anybody know which system's got the best reward program?

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You know something, I don't think the sun even... exists... in this place. 'Cause I've been up for hours, and hours, and hours, and the night never ends here.

MSD

This already happened to me. I tried to come up with a way to explain what I believed, and couldn't think of anything. Rather than keep a hollow shell of a belief system, I decided that the best I could do is agnosticism. I slowly grew to hate organized religion (th ereligions themselves, not the followers) and I feel that I'm a better person than I was when I decieved myself into thinking I believed.

SecretMethod70

Eh, I think you're getting Catholics and Protestants a bit confused. In Catholicism, what you do in your life has a very large effect on who you are inside...meaning, you CAN'T sin all you want and then expect to "get to heaven." Now, what "sinning" is depends on what person you speak to in Catholicism. You can speak to a Catholic fundementalist who doesn't like Vatican II at all and learn all about venial and mortal sins, or you can speak to some of the more contemporary Catholic thinkers that I've had my experiences with, who believe Vatican II goes further than the current church is even taking it, and are very accepting of homosexuals and various other things that "stereotypical Catholicism" does not include.

With many protestants, you either have "Grace" or do not...and if you have it, you're saved, no matter what your sins are. Of course, they get around this logical conundrum ("so, Hitler could be in Heaven just by believing Jesus died for his sins?") by saying anyone who HAS Grace would naturally do many good deeds.

Thus, the stereotype of "Catholic guilt." It does matter what kind of person you are. Now, what kind of person you ought to be is entirely dependant on which of the varied lines of thought within Catholicism you identify with. There is only one "official" stance...but you'd be surprised at the variations in progressive thought among priests, theologians, and so forth - all within the Catholic Church.

My experience while learning about the facets of Catholic thought, especially in the more contemporary sense, is that the majority of people have a severe misunderstanding of how Catholicism works, including most Catholics themselves. Not that I'm some genius of course, but my active questioning and learning, I believe, has lead me further in understanding than most Catholics care to go in their lifetime.


Oh, as for me, my second choice would be non-theistic Buddhism.

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Le temps détruit tout

"Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling

onodrim

Yeah, Secret said it well - being raised in a very conservative fundamentalist protestant home, I know what is protestant and what isn't.

As for what my second choice would be, I would go with Buddhism, although it is more of a philospohy than a religion. As it is, many of the core teachings of Buddhism fit in very nicely with Christian thought.

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"The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there’s little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides"
-Carl Sagan

Xenomorph

Depends how far you go with this 'wrongness'. I'm Catholic...if the College of Cardinals all sprouted horns and began cleaving a bloody path through Rome with massive pitchforks and demonic strength, I would probably become a Lutheran or an Episcopalian, or join some other Protestant faith tradition that I share an enormous portion of my beliefs with.

If some super-advanced, near-omnipotent alien came down and proved that Jesus' ressurection was a joke he played on us in junior high, I'm not sure what I'd do. I'd probably join a humanistic tradition that didn't neccesarily base itself around a god, like Buddhism.

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The facehugger is short-lived outside the egg which normally protects it. Armed with a long grasping tail, a spray of highly-concentrated acid and the single-minded desire to impregnate a single selected prey using its extending probe, it will fearlessly pursue and attack a single selected target until it has succeeded in attachment or it or its target is dead

nickynicole

religion envy?

It seems that most of us are lining up eastern religion as our second choice, which makes me think that western religion is currently lacking in something... maybe sense of self, and sense of sacred.

nickynicole

Oh... and to answer the question... I think I would be mormon, because then I would get to be a god, or at least the wife of a god, complete with my own world and everything!

SecretMethod70

Actually, I'm lining up with Buddhism because it is extremely close to what I learn from contemporary Catholicism. It's impossible that the life lessons that Catholicism and Buddhism share would be "proven wrong" - it's a philosophy of life, beyond what "gets you to heaven." The way I look at it, the main difference is the belief in a higher power, so Buddhism is the logical choice for me to continue with my philosophy of life while no longer believing in God or Christ. So, at least for me, I chose an eastern religion specifically for the fact that the western one I have is *not* lacking in those areas.

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Le temps détruit tout

"Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling

Lebell

I've considered this several times and I would be Jewish.

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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." – C. S. Lewis

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C4 Diesel

Well... When I was too young to realize what the heck I was doing, I told people that I was aethiest, since I was not raised with any religion whatsoever. Then I switched to being agnostic, but since I found that both pointless and unfulfilling, I switch to a stance more similar to Art's. I believe nothing (although I don't find it so hard to do so). I guess if someone forced me into a belief system I'd fall back into agnosticism, but I wouldn't put buddhism past myself in that situation either.

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