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Old 08-21-2003, 04:10 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Fear or laziness?

Quote:
There are two kinds of sufferers in this world: those who suffer from a lack of life, and those who suffer from an over-abundance of life. I have always found myself in the second category. When you come to think of it, almost all human behavior and activity is not, essentially, any different from animal behavior. The most advanced technologies and craftsmanship bring us, at best, up to the super-chimpanzee level. Actually, the gap between, say, Plato or Nietzsche, and the average human is greater than the gap between that chimpanzee and the average human. The realm of the real spirit, the true artist, the saint, the philosopher, is rarely achieved. Why so few? Why is world history and evolution not stories of progress, rather this endless and futile addition of zeros? No greater values have developed. Hell, the Greeks 3,000 years ago were just as advanced as we are. So what are these barriers that keep people from reaching anywhere near their real potential. The answer to that can be found in another question, and that's this: which is the most universal human characteristic: fear or laziness?
Dissected, I feel that the Plato, Nietzshe, average human, chimp thought is spot on.....believe as you may, I agree with it. I don't necessarily agree that Greeks were advanced as we are, except maybe socially. As for fear and laziness....I believe fear is the most universal human trait. For obvious reasons.

This is a quote from the movie Waking Life. It doesn't really matter if you have seen or havent. What is your response to it?
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Old 08-21-2003, 09:00 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Laziness....Absolutly. Im a smart guy, and had I chose, I could have been doing advanced physics/math by now (well, i like to think so anyway). but I never had the desire to excersise my abilities past what i needed to get through school (talking bout high school, im 18).

Im lazy. I think most people are, which is why we dont advance very fast.
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Old 08-22-2003, 06:16 AM   #3 (permalink)
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I would write a long and indepth reply....but I can't be arsed.
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Old 08-22-2003, 09:44 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Why so few artists and geniuses? Well, not only do they have to be brilliant, but we regular folk have to recognize that brilliance and that recognition has to survive through the ages.

How many Plato's and Nietzsche's have been forgotten; their legacy lost? Even worse, how many have been repressed and actively tortured for their 'heresy'?

Laziness is definitely a symptom of fear; fear of unrewarded effort, fear of failure, fear of what's outside, fear of rejection. All things that keep people in front of the TV where life is safe and empty and you can hide from the world and hope nobody notices.
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Old 08-22-2003, 03:40 PM   #5 (permalink)
not your typical god-fearing junkie
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by Macheath

How many Plato's and Nietzsche's have been forgotten; their legacy lost? Even worse, how many have been repressed and actively tortured for their 'heresy'?
Macheath, thats probably the most insightful answer I could have possibly seen. Not to say anyone else has a response up to that or beyond, but damn. Insightful stuff right there.

Very good point
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Old 08-29-2003, 09:36 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Laziness is caused by the fear that doing something will be more painful than not doing it. Ultimately we are driven by our fear of pain and desire for pleasure. I'm no philosopher I just stole that from Anthony Robbins---the guy is a genius.
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Old 08-30-2003, 01:21 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Battlefield
Laziness is caused by the fear that doing something will be more painful than not doing it. Ultimately we are driven by our fear of pain and desire for pleasure. I'm no philosopher I just stole that from Anthony Robbins---the guy is a genius.
i think this is definately true and i was going to say something along the lines of: fear is the underlying reason to every human response. be it laziness or what have you. the quote pretty much sums up my thoughts completely. it's so much easier to be lazy than try to go out and do something for yourself. it's so much easier to be a failure than to TRY to succeed. at least you are failing by choice, not because you tried and failed. and with that.. here's another quote:

the greatest hazard in life is to risk nothing. the person who risks nothing, does nothing, has nothing and is nothing. he may avoid suffering and sorrow, but he simply cannot learn, feel, change, grow, love, live. chained by his certitudes, he is a slave, he has forfeited freedom. only a person who risks is free.
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Old 08-30-2003, 09:05 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I think that fear is definitely the universal trait of man.

It reminds me of the emotional scale in Donnie Darko, with Fear on one side and Love on the other I believe it was.
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Old 08-31-2003, 12:48 AM   #9 (permalink)
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I have no fear, or if I do...I surpass it.

It's the laziness that gets me.
If I didn't procrastinate, it would be amazing what I could do.

But I am mostly taking my time, or recovering from the conflicts of life.
This is the kid in me that I fight daily.
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Old 08-31-2003, 07:29 AM   #10 (permalink)
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The biggest reason that we fail to do things is fear. We're afraid to step outside our comfort zone and face all the possibilities there. Instead of facing reality we retreat to our own little worlds. I find myself doing that here on the computer even. If I face the things I have to do then if I don't do them right in my mind I risk feeling like a failure or worse. Those who succeed are those who are willing to take those risks and step out in spite of criticism from others or even themselves. FEAR is what holds us back. my Uncle calls it backwards Pride - afraid of having our Ego's hurt. We will do what is necessary to survive and feed our Id. Ego is what makes us do more or afraid to do more.
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Old 08-31-2003, 11:21 AM   #11 (permalink)
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I also would write a long and indepth reply, but im too lazy
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Old 09-05-2003, 07:32 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I wish I could think of something to write here, but it looks like almost every angle is covered.

I am also too lazy to think, or am I fearful of appearing stupid?

It is probably too late for the stupid.
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Old 09-06-2003, 04:30 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Just think what we could all achieve if we stopped spending so much time in the internet trying to impress each other with our on intelligence and actually went and read som Plato or Neitzsche. Or even tried to advance our culture or society by adding to it? I think that ultimately computers will be our downfall. The only driven people will eventually come to develp such powerful comuters that society will become totallly dependant on them, and we can all relax into what we all want to do most: sit on our asses for good.
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Old 09-06-2003, 07:59 AM   #14 (permalink)
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That is so true Ubermensch - about sitting here at the computer instead of actually reading for enrichment. The classics and good literature are so forgotten. I find I have a constant battle with myself to watch how much time I spend on the computer and what I spend doing on it. On that note I will get off here and get on with real life.
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Old 03-12-2008, 04:10 AM   #15 (permalink)
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One drives the other

I have a great respect for Louis Mackey but to say, “pick one, fear or laziness—” I believe one drives the other, man, as do all elements of the universe, takes the path of least resistance driven by fear and guided by an avoidance of industry until this avoidance becomes the nuance. It is easier not to do your taxes than to do them, but on April 14th it is easier to do your taxes than to go to jail, etc. It was not easy for the American Revolutionaries to move from a state of bondage to a meta-physical awakening that brought forth the American Independence yet it was easier to wake-up than stay in a state of bondage that was impeding the collective lathergicity. My concern is what will be the wake-up call as the great American conversation slowly marches form apathy— to dependence.

Last edited by Mick.Lexington; 03-12-2008 at 04:49 AM.. Reason: Spelling
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Old 08-05-2008, 03:38 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Location: Paris
Well fear and laziness must be universal traits if this thread started in 2003 and it's now 2008! I'm 36 and I've been wandering around the last few days (or few years) convinced that my two great defects are some strange mix of fear and laziness which to my slow brain is a great revelation. So I decided I'd plug the two words into google and see where they'd take me and they took me straight to this thread. Some very interesting ideas have been expressed here and I've jotted a couple of them down for future perusal. What did someone once say... "do something every day that scares you"? I'm trying to program the words 'fear and laziness' into my conscious brain so that they pop up every time they're behind my way of doing things or not doing things. Only by being conscious of their insidious nature can we arm ourselves to combat them and widen that gap between humans and super-chimpanzees (not that I've anything against monkeys).

'nuff said, I'm off to bed!
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Old 08-15-2008, 11:05 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Wow, this is old.

My take on it is to agree that fear is universal, and quite likely the most fundmental evolutionary trait of sentient animals besides the urge to reproduce. Consider how it's tied into involuntary nervous system responses, especially the adrenaline rush and the collection of reflexes characterized as "fight or flight." Without it so deeply ingrained in the primitive brain, I can't imagine a species surviving for long.

Then again, once a species hits a certain point (I'm not sure if I'd say a certain point in evolution or a certain point in societal development,) its importance diminishes. Most people will not be exposed to life-or-death situations before they are able to intelligently analyze the situation, if at all. It's something I'll have to think about more.
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Old 09-04-2008, 12:00 PM   #18 (permalink)
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fear, because laziness is just fear in disguise...

Waking Life is an awesome movie by the way.
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