Hunt the Boeing - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

OpieCunningham · 08-30-2004, 08:03 PM

http://www.elchulo.net/files/pentagon.swf

(3.5mb Flash video)

(edit: - apparently a repost ... my bad)

Church · 08-30-2004, 08:46 PM

Thanks for the link. I've heard that theory before (and firmly believe there is something to it). I found the link pretty interesting. Thanks!

Willravel · 08-30-2004, 09:25 PM

That's what I was afraid of. The whole HUGE plane into the pentagon thing never really sounded right to me. I watched on tv as we were shown clip after clip of ground zero in new york. I probably watched about 7 minutes of footage from the pentagon. Total. And I was looking for it. See, my uncle sometimes works in that area, and I wanted to make sure he was okay. BTW, he's fine. I've flown in a 75 before. One of those things hitting the side of a building the size of the pentagon at 2 feet off the ground at full throttle (basically) would have done a hell of a lot more damage than that. People gave their lives for the USA. Then the USA covered up what really happened to them and lied to the american people and, more importantly, the families of those hurt or killed in the 'attack'.

When all of this crap eventually does come out, and it probably will, things might start to get kinda ugly. I've watched as the country I love has done some pretty aweful things. When you start to put them all together, you start to wonder if the government really represents the people. The second Gulf War (or Operation Iraqi Freedom) was originally said to have begun because we had certianty that Saddam Hussen had (by had they meant has already built, bot just working on) weapons of MASS DESTRUCTION. Not some automatic weapons or gernades, but weapons of mass destruction. Then we killed a hell of a lot of Iraqui people, millitary and civilian. After the war, the government said that the war was to free the Iraqi people from tyrany.

Wait, this is starting to remind me of something that happened about ten years ago... in Waco Texas. Remember that one? Wow, quite some shit. The reason the ATF was originally there was because they had a warrent to check for automatic weapons. That's it. After a hell of a lot of people died, the government said the reason they went in there was to free children who were being heald hostage. Ouch. The resembelance is astounding, as far as I'm concerned. There are a lot of other comparisons I could do, but I felt that this one really stood up.

I'd like to ask Kerry if he'd be willing to tell the truth about things of this nature if he were elected. That'd actually get my ass off the couch to vote.

opackfan · 08-30-2004, 10:11 PM

do you guys understand that the only real dense part of an aircraft is the engines? the plane itself is nothing more than a aluminium tube, so travelling at top speed into the pentagon, there would be some damage where the main body hit (it would crumple up and burn) then the holes where the engines flew into. the Pentagon is not made up of the same material as the wtc, so it could stand up to the impact better than the wtc, so less damage. not putting anyone down in this post, just adding my two cents

Church · 08-30-2004, 10:35 PM

So are you saying that every single part of the plane would burn into unidentifiable dust?

sadistikdreams · 08-30-2004, 10:50 PM

Great film and all, but the music annoys the FUCK out of me.

opackfan · 08-30-2004, 10:52 PM

how much of the planes at the wtc were recovered? what about the one in pa?

braindamage351 · 08-30-2004, 11:31 PM

The planes at the WTC stayed in the building, as their fuel broke free and melted the infastructure of the building. This is all many stories up. The pieces were subjected to both melting, falling an extremely long distance, and being crushed by half of one of the tallest buildings in the world. It's okay not to recover all of that one...

But if you do look at the video, despite the annoying music, it's right. There is no way in hell that you could fly a 757 that close to the ground while traveling directly forward. It's ridiculous. Isn't it incredibly suspicious that all of the videos of the incident were confiscated and NEVER released, while the WTC crash is in multiple angles?

PulpMind · 08-30-2004, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by opackfan

how much of the planes at the wtc were recovered? what about the one in pa?

site of the PA crash:

which has a conspiracy theory surrounding it much like the Pentagon flight... still, I feel something is going on that the public is in the dark about.

OpieCunningham · 08-31-2004, 12:40 AM

I enjoyed the music.

It had just the right amount of ominousness.

Also, it's electronica - which everyone knows is the best form of music in the world

slimshaydee · 08-31-2004, 01:24 AM

what happened to the actual plane that was said to have been hijacked then. there were people on it, and those people died. how did that happen

ultra_agent9 · 08-31-2004, 02:17 AM

interesting, it bought up some very valid points. Typical FBI- confiscating all film from nearby security cameras. Doubt we'll ever see the footage. Not in this lifetime anyway...

Loved the last song, Marilyn Mansons This is The New Sh*t.

Willravel · 08-31-2004, 09:49 AM

One of the songs was from the legendary game Star Craft (not mentioned in the end credits).

SaltPork · 08-31-2004, 01:00 PM

A friend of mine was in the Gannett towers on the 22nd floor looking at the Pentagon as it was hit by the plane. It happened, sorry to ruin all of your fun, but it actually happened.

Church · 08-31-2004, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wrkime

A friend of mine was in the Gannett towers on the 22nd floor looking at the Pentagon as it was hit by the plane. It happened, sorry to ruin all of your fun, but it actually happened.

Nobody is disputing that something hit the Pentagon. It just wasn't a 747. Whether it was a missle or a military jet, that is what we are trying to figure out.

SaltPork · 08-31-2004, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Church

Nobody is disputing that something hit the Pentagon. It just wasn't a 747. Whether it was a missle or a military jet, that is what we are trying to figure out.

Of course it wasn't a 747. The plane was supposed to have been a 757, not a huge plane as compared to the 747, but still pretty good size.

edit-BTW, what he saw was a passenger jet, not a military jet or missile. He watched the thing hit the ground and burst into flames. Hard to mistake a passenger jet for a military plane or a missile.

SaltPork · 08-31-2004, 01:19 PM

Let me also add that I wasn't there so I can't say for certain. All I know is what my friend told me and I don't believe that he has any reason to lie to me.

Furthermore, I enjoy conspiracy theories as much as the next guy, but explain to me what happened to flight 77 then, because all of those people are gone-where did they go?

Church · 08-31-2004, 01:25 PM

Yes, I meant to say 757. Habit.

Also, where exactly did it hit the ground according to your friend? Because I can't see any marks whatsoever on the ground. One thing that makes me believe otherwise to what they're saying, is it looks like something blasted OUT. If an object that size hit a building, it wouldn't fling shards of debris hundreds of yards behind it.

I'm not saying you are a liar, and I'm not saying your friend is either. But since the FBI took all the tapes from the surrounding area, I'm betting that that is not where they stopped. Maybe your friend had a chat with someone?

Willravel · 08-31-2004, 01:31 PM

Okay. There were a lot of people who saw it. It's no big secret that something crashed into the building. There was a projectile, and a loud crash and an explosion. The shock wave of the hit broke a lot of windows at the pentagon. No one doubts that something hit the pentagon. What we are talking about is that there probbly wasn't a 757 that hit the pentagon. Any structural engineer can tell you that the stats released about the crash (i.e. the speed of the plane, the distance from the ground, the damage) doesn't make any sense. The boeing 757-200 (the plane said by the government to be responsible) carries about 290 people and is about 220,000 pounds takeoff. Standard info. The firefighters reached the site very quickly and found very very little wrekage. A 220,000 pound plane leaves wrekage. If you want to argue that it was destroyed in the explosion, then why wasn't the building destroyed with it? There's more.

What is important is to remember, or learn, that the nose of this plane has something called a crashdome. This is the area of the plane that is below and infront of the cockpit; the area that would first impact. This crashdone is where the plane stores electronic navigation equiptment. To enable the transmission of signals, the nose is not made of metal, but carbon. It's shape has been designed to be aerodynamic but it is not crash resistant. The inside casting, as well as its contents, are extremly fragile. The nose would crash on impact with an obstacle, not penatrate it. You NEVER find a nose in a crashsite that involves a head on colision (the type in this case). THEREFORE, it is impossible that this carbon nose punshed a perfect 2.5 yard diameter circular hole in the steel reinforced buildings. This is not improbable, it's impossible. Because of the colapsing nose, the 747-200 would have demolished the building. The momentary spread of pressure on the building would have been like hitting the hand with a hammer. It would have broken bones. In reality, the aircraft that really hit the building punctured, and later the outer uilding colapsed. The only way to puncture instead of demolish is to localize the pressure to a smaller area. Going back to the hand anaolgy, you'd need a nail on the hammer to puncture the hand and go through. What kind of aricraft has a nose that is narrow and strong enough for this?

A missle. Missiles have heads that are much stronger than aircraft noses. They are made from depleted uranium and are designed for penetration. Depleted uranium is an extremely dense metal that friction heats up, increasing its penetrative capacities. Such missiles are particularly used to enter bunkers. An aircraft crashes and breaks apart whereas a missile of this type will penetrate its target.Many missles used throughout the world, let alone by the US, have decorations and colors that very closly resemble the colors of commercial airliners.

Fire fighters attest to having seen part of a plane that they identify, albeit with difficulty, as an aircraft nose. The nose of an aircraft, however, would not survive such an accident. The three buildings could not have been penetrated by the nose of a Boeing. However, a missile head made of depleted uranium could well have been capable of such damage.

My conclusion, wrkime, to your post is this: either your friend saw something fly by very fast that looked like if could have been a commercial plane, or you're friend was lying, or you don't have any friends.

I choose to beleive the former.

SaltPork · 08-31-2004, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Church

Yes, I meant to say 757. Habit.

Also, where exactly did it hit the ground according to your friend? Because I can't see any marks whatsoever on the ground. One thing that makes me believe otherwise to what they're saying, is it looks like something blasted OUT. If an object that size hit a building, it wouldn't fling shards of debris hundreds of yards behind it.

I'm not saying you are a liar, and I'm not saying your friend is either. But since the FBI took all the tapes from the surrounding area, I'm betting that that is not where they stopped. Maybe your friend had a chat with someone?

I suppose he could have had a "chat" with someone. I don't know it just seems like a stretch that the US gov't would go as far as 9/11 to get everyone's attention and for what? To make us paranoid? To make us go to war with Iraq? According to Bush at the time the big issue was with Afghanistan. Was that just a stepping stone to Saddam? Sure, it was a logical leap, we were already all fired up from the "terrorists" flying planes into our shit, but it all just seems a bit too complicated. Where did all those passengers go?

Willravel · 08-31-2004, 01:37 PM

Ever seen a manefest for the plane, or any people morning their dead friends and family members? Nope. Only people involved with the people on the twin towers plane and the failed camp david plane. There probably never were passangers. There were, however, deaths at thye pentagon. This leads me to believe that we were attacked by an outside force, and the government may not want people to know how easy it is to shoot a missle into the pentagon.

the_marq · 08-31-2004, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wrkime

Where did all those passengers go?

Where did all the fuel go?

I mean, holes in walls and lack of scrapes in the ground are one thing. But several thousand gallons of burning jet fuel are another matter all together.

OpieCunningham · 08-31-2004, 01:53 PM

To fan the flames of paranoia:

There were people on a flight which never made it back to an airport for a safe landing. Those people are gone. If we are to believe that no Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon, it is possible that the flight was shot down - possibly the fear of it crashing into the White House prompted the shoot down call. Then, to cover up the shoot down, a missle/unmaned plane is sent to hit the Pentagon.

One piece of information I haven't seen here is that the area of the Pentagon that was hit was basically uninhabited due to renovations that had been going on for quite some time. Additionally, according to this page, a large number of rescue and fire vehicles "just happened" to be very close to the Pentagon for a large building fire that "just happened" to go out moments before the Pentagon crash. (That page also has reports of a C-130 plane following Flight 77 as well as Flight 92.)

Willravel · 08-31-2004, 02:05 PM

Whoa. Good explaination. I was still trying to think of a rational reason for all of this crap.

Church · 08-31-2004, 06:16 PM

http://news.uns.purdue.edu/UNS/image....pentagon.jpeg

This picture shows that there would for sure at least be some kind of damage to the lawn, be it from something else or scraping engines. Wow, they really should have thought this one out further. I guess they think we're stupid.

Rekna · 08-31-2004, 06:44 PM

except the majority of US citizens firmly believe a plan hit the pentegon. If it is true that it was a missle you would see an end to Bush's presidency. Which means if it were true then no Bush haters know of this otherwise it would have leaked.

Now lets take the shot down plane/missle theory. If the plan was shot down where did it get shot down at? Someone would have noticed a plane that size crashing, unless it was over water. But why would it have been over water? There needs to be some more evidence of the missle somewhere (if it is true).

If a plane really did hit the government could quash theorys right away by releasing all the video.

Willravel · 08-31-2004, 06:58 PM

A majority of american people think that Avril Lavigne writes her own music. We have a pretty poor record, as a whole, as far as thinking is concerned. Individually, like on this forum, we can be quite smart. No one has really been able to explain away any of the facts presented. Our theorys might be wrong, but they're theorys.
I presented pretty decent evidence of the missle theory (see my post about 8 posts up). The holes in the walls and lack of serious burns on the building pretty much convince me that no 757 hit the building. Actually, all planes have pretty much the same design with the crashdome. That rules out planes in general. So what's left? Other man made airborn technology. Was it a blimp or baloon? Nope. Was it a UFO? Heh. Was it a helicopter? Almost impossible. Was it an unmaned aircraft? Probably. What kind of unmaned aircraft has a depeleted uranium nose (something strong enough to brake through that many layers of steel reinforced walls)? Missile.
I don't hear any other plausable arguments and theorys. If this is just a fansity, let's hear you explain everything away (now directing this twards people who don't beleive, no one in particular).
Someone give me a better explaination. I'd feel a lot safer about my country if someone could give me something at all to redeeem the dishonesty.

Church · 08-31-2004, 07:00 PM

Ok, I'm not really sure what you're trying to prove with your post, but yes, releasing the video is what we want. The fact that they DON'T implies a cover-up.

Quote:

except the majority of US citizens firmly believe a plan hit the pentegon. If it is true that it was a missle you would see an end to Bush's presidency. Which means if it were true then no Bush haters know of this otherwise it would have leaked.

I like that. Its so simple! I wish it were black and white like that. But I think its a littie too simple. And yes, many people do believe that a plane crashed into the Pentagon, and that scares me.

Willravel · 08-31-2004, 08:24 PM

AND many people do believe that Avril Lavigne writes her own music, and that also scares me.

losthellhound · 09-02-2004, 10:26 AM

I hate snopes.. what could be interesting reading ends up being "of course not STUPID, how could you be so STUPID. HEY EVERYONE, LOOK HOW STUPID THEY ARE"

or something like that

pocon1 · 09-02-2004, 11:23 AM

Wow, this thread is amazing. I cannot believe that you people actually believe this shit. I don't believe a video produced in England has any idea that they know what they are talking about.
I am a personal trainer in DC. Next to Fannie Mae. One of my clients lost his wife in the plane that went into the Pentagon. One of my friends lost his friend in the plane that WENT INTO THE PENTAGON. Get a reality check, People. Like you all know what a fucking plane crash looks like. Talk to the people who's friends and family are gone.

Church · 09-02-2004, 11:34 AM

Yeah, we know that a plane did go down SOMEWHERE, but it was not the Pentagon. You just tell yourself that everything happened like old faithful CNN told you, right? Well life isn't that good. Your government, MY government, are not as they tell you in the public eye. Do you think it would be more of a tribute to the people lost on that plane to believe the lie that has been told as opposed to finding out what really happened?

pocon1 · 09-02-2004, 11:39 AM

Sure, so instead of putting a device on the plane to steer it into the Pentagon, we make a plane and its 60 something people disappear, then in broad daylight we shoot a missile into a military building in potential view of thousands of people. Riiiight. We have the technology to make unmanned planes fly. We can certainly steer a plane into a building. So instead a big cover story has been built up to do this. Like watching terrorists take out our twin towers was not enough to convince the public.

Church · 09-02-2004, 11:41 AM

lol. You have a closed mind so I'm not even going to try showing you the light. Continue watching CNN and enjoy your little sheltered life.

pocon1 · 09-02-2004, 11:48 AM

I guess in your case an open mind is an empty mind. LOL. HaHa. My little sheltered life, huh? The one that was actually within ten miles from the Pentagon? I wandered into this section from another link that pointed to this thread. That was a mistake.

Willravel · 09-02-2004, 11:49 AM

Actually I've seen the wreckage of several planes. I was there when a DC-8 cargo plane went down in Rancho Cordova in an auction yard. My friends and I followed the smoke back there just in time to get escorted off by the sheriff, but we all saw it. THERE WAS WRECKAGE EVERYWHERE. I'm entertained to see that just because you have loose connections to what happened, you know more than the experts and the firemen who were actually there. You should bother actually reading the posts before you make an utter fool of yourself. "I don't believe a video produced in England has any idea that they know what they are talking about." BWAHAHAHA. I hope you're kidding. As for people you know died in the crash, my uncle was in the building at the time and he lost friends, too. No one here is insinuating that people didn't die. What we are saying is that the facts are in stark contrast to the information released about the specifics of the crash. Any one can see that what was released differs from the truth. Something went into the Pentagon. Something killed those people, both in the Pentagon, and in the 757-200. I hope you can appreciate THIS reality check. Your eyes are closed. Open them before you walk into a wall.

Rdr4evr · 09-02-2004, 11:51 AM

I believe it 100 percent. I dont think its irrational and is very much a possibility. The govt. could have taken the passengers and exterminated them without raising suspicion. I wouldn't doubt for a second that Bush and company would not do such a thing.

pocon1 · 09-02-2004, 11:52 AM

To what purpose? Do you also doubt that terrorist controlled planes went into the towers?

Willravel · 09-02-2004, 11:55 AM

I'd rather try to formulate theorys about what really happened, then accept a baltent lie. At least Church is actually trying.

Willravel · 09-02-2004, 11:57 AM

As far as the twin towers, I have no information to contradict the information that was released. But, thgis is much different. Here we have a case where there are facts that contradict what was released. I haven't heard you explain away anything that I've stated. Good luck.

08-30-2004, 08:03 PM	#1 (permalink)
OpieCunningham Loser	Hunt the Boeing http://www.elchulo.net/files/pentagon.swf (3.5mb Flash video) (edit: - apparently a repost ... my bad)

08-30-2004, 08:46 PM	#2 (permalink)
Church Tilted F*ckhead Location: New Jersey	Thanks for the link. I've heard that theory before (and firmly believe there is something to it). I found the link pretty interesting. Thanks! __________________ Through counter-intelligence, it should be possible to pinpoint potential trouble makers, and neutralize them.

08-30-2004, 10:35 PM	#5 (permalink)
Church Tilted F*ckhead Location: New Jersey	So are you saying that every single part of the plane would burn into unidentifiable dust? __________________ Through counter-intelligence, it should be possible to pinpoint potential trouble makers, and neutralize them.

08-30-2004, 10:50 PM	#6 (permalink)
sadistikdreams lonely rolling star Location: Seattle.	Great film and all, but the music annoys the FUCK out of me. __________________ "Besides the noble art of getting things done, there is the noble art of leaving things undone. The wisdom of life consists in the elimination of non-essentials." -Lin Yutang hearts, by d.a.

08-31-2004, 02:17 AM	#12 (permalink)
ultra_agent9 Crazy Location: Tokyo Japan	interesting, it bought up some very valid points. Typical FBI- confiscating all film from nearby security cameras. Doubt we'll ever see the footage. Not in this lifetime anyway... Loved the last song, Marilyn Mansons This is The New Sh*t. __________________ Champaigne for my real friends, real pain for my sham friends.

08-30-2004, 09:25 PM	#3 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	That's what I was afraid of. The whole HUGE plane into the pentagon thing never really sounded right to me. I watched on tv as we were shown clip after clip of ground zero in new york. I probably watched about 7 minutes of footage from the pentagon. Total. And I was looking for it. See, my uncle sometimes works in that area, and I wanted to make sure he was okay. BTW, he's fine. I've flown in a 75 before. One of those things hitting the side of a building the size of the pentagon at 2 feet off the ground at full throttle (basically) would have done a hell of a lot more damage than that. People gave their lives for the USA. Then the USA covered up what really happened to them and lied to the american people and, more importantly, the families of those hurt or killed in the 'attack'. When all of this crap eventually does come out, and it probably will, things might start to get kinda ugly. I've watched as the country I love has done some pretty aweful things. When you start to put them all together, you start to wonder if the government really represents the people. The second Gulf War (or Operation Iraqi Freedom) was originally said to have begun because we had certianty that Saddam Hussen had (by had they meant has already built, bot just working on) weapons of MASS DESTRUCTION. Not some automatic weapons or gernades, but weapons of mass destruction. Then we killed a hell of a lot of Iraqui people, millitary and civilian. After the war, the government said that the war was to free the Iraqi people from tyrany. Wait, this is starting to remind me of something that happened about ten years ago... in Waco Texas. Remember that one? Wow, quite some shit. The reason the ATF was originally there was because they had a warrent to check for automatic weapons. That's it. After a hell of a lot of people died, the government said the reason they went in there was to free children who were being heald hostage. Ouch. The resembelance is astounding, as far as I'm concerned. There are a lot of other comparisons I could do, but I felt that this one really stood up. I'd like to ask Kerry if he'd be willing to tell the truth about things of this nature if he were elected. That'd actually get my ass off the couch to vote.

08-30-2004, 10:11 PM	#4 (permalink)
opackfan Tilted Location: St. Paul	do you guys understand that the only real dense part of an aircraft is the engines? the plane itself is nothing more than a aluminium tube, so travelling at top speed into the pentagon, there would be some damage where the main body hit (it would crumple up and burn) then the holes where the engines flew into. the Pentagon is not made up of the same material as the wtc, so it could stand up to the impact better than the wtc, so less damage. not putting anyone down in this post, just adding my two cents

08-30-2004, 10:52 PM	#7 (permalink)
opackfan Tilted Location: St. Paul	how much of the planes at the wtc were recovered? what about the one in pa?

08-30-2004, 11:31 PM	#8 (permalink)
braindamage351 Insane	The planes at the WTC stayed in the building, as their fuel broke free and melted the infastructure of the building. This is all many stories up. The pieces were subjected to both melting, falling an extremely long distance, and being crushed by half of one of the tallest buildings in the world. It's okay not to recover all of that one... But if you do look at the video, despite the annoying music, it's right. There is no way in hell that you could fly a 757 that close to the ground while traveling directly forward. It's ridiculous. Isn't it incredibly suspicious that all of the videos of the incident were confiscated and NEVER released, while the WTC crash is in multiple angles?

08-31-2004, 12:40 AM	#10 (permalink)
OpieCunningham Loser	I enjoyed the music. It had just the right amount of ominousness. Also, it's electronica - which everyone knows is the best form of music in the world

08-31-2004, 01:24 AM	#11 (permalink)
slimshaydee If you've read this, PM me and say so Location: Sitting on my ass, and you?	what happened to the actual plane that was said to have been hijacked then. there were people on it, and those people died. how did that happen

08-31-2004, 09:49 AM	#13 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	One of the songs was from the legendary game Star Craft (not mentioned in the end credits).

08-31-2004, 01:00 PM	#14 (permalink)
SaltPork Everything's better with bacon Location: In your local grocer's freezer.	A friend of mine was in the Gannett towers on the 22nd floor looking at the Pentagon as it was hit by the plane. It happened, sorry to ruin all of your fun, but it actually happened. __________________ It was like that when I got here....I swear.

08-31-2004, 01:19 PM	#17 (permalink)
SaltPork Everything's better with bacon Location: In your local grocer's freezer.	Let me also add that I wasn't there so I can't say for certain. All I know is what my friend told me and I don't believe that he has any reason to lie to me. Furthermore, I enjoy conspiracy theories as much as the next guy, but explain to me what happened to flight 77 then, because all of those people are gone-where did they go? __________________ It was like that when I got here....I swear.

08-31-2004, 01:25 PM	#18 (permalink)
Church Tilted F*ckhead Location: New Jersey	Yes, I meant to say 757. Habit. Also, where exactly did it hit the ground according to your friend? Because I can't see any marks whatsoever on the ground. One thing that makes me believe otherwise to what they're saying, is it looks like something blasted OUT. If an object that size hit a building, it wouldn't fling shards of debris hundreds of yards behind it. I'm not saying you are a liar, and I'm not saying your friend is either. But since the FBI took all the tapes from the surrounding area, I'm betting that that is not where they stopped. Maybe your friend had a chat with someone? __________________ Through counter-intelligence, it should be possible to pinpoint potential trouble makers, and neutralize them.

08-31-2004, 01:31 PM	#19 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Okay. There were a lot of people who saw it. It's no big secret that something crashed into the building. There was a projectile, and a loud crash and an explosion. The shock wave of the hit broke a lot of windows at the pentagon. No one doubts that something hit the pentagon. What we are talking about is that there probbly wasn't a 757 that hit the pentagon. Any structural engineer can tell you that the stats released about the crash (i.e. the speed of the plane, the distance from the ground, the damage) doesn't make any sense. The boeing 757-200 (the plane said by the government to be responsible) carries about 290 people and is about 220,000 pounds takeoff. Standard info. The firefighters reached the site very quickly and found very very little wrekage. A 220,000 pound plane leaves wrekage. If you want to argue that it was destroyed in the explosion, then why wasn't the building destroyed with it? There's more. What is important is to remember, or learn, that the nose of this plane has something called a crashdome. This is the area of the plane that is below and infront of the cockpit; the area that would first impact. This crashdone is where the plane stores electronic navigation equiptment. To enable the transmission of signals, the nose is not made of metal, but carbon. It's shape has been designed to be aerodynamic but it is not crash resistant. The inside casting, as well as its contents, are extremly fragile. The nose would crash on impact with an obstacle, not penatrate it. You NEVER find a nose in a crashsite that involves a head on colision (the type in this case). THEREFORE, it is impossible that this carbon nose punshed a perfect 2.5 yard diameter circular hole in the steel reinforced buildings. This is not improbable, it's impossible. Because of the colapsing nose, the 747-200 would have demolished the building. The momentary spread of pressure on the building would have been like hitting the hand with a hammer. It would have broken bones. In reality, the aircraft that really hit the building punctured, and later the outer uilding colapsed. The only way to puncture instead of demolish is to localize the pressure to a smaller area. Going back to the hand anaolgy, you'd need a nail on the hammer to puncture the hand and go through. What kind of aricraft has a nose that is narrow and strong enough for this? A missle. Missiles have heads that are much stronger than aircraft noses. They are made from depleted uranium and are designed for penetration. Depleted uranium is an extremely dense metal that friction heats up, increasing its penetrative capacities. Such missiles are particularly used to enter bunkers. An aircraft crashes and breaks apart whereas a missile of this type will penetrate its target.Many missles used throughout the world, let alone by the US, have decorations and colors that very closly resemble the colors of commercial airliners. Fire fighters attest to having seen part of a plane that they identify, albeit with difficulty, as an aircraft nose. The nose of an aircraft, however, would not survive such an accident. The three buildings could not have been penetrated by the nose of a Boeing. However, a missile head made of depleted uranium could well have been capable of such damage. My conclusion, wrkime, to your post is this: either your friend saw something fly by very fast that looked like if could have been a commercial plane, or you're friend was lying, or you don't have any friends. I choose to beleive the former. Last edited by Willravel; 08-31-2004 at 01:34 PM..

08-31-2004, 01:37 PM	#21 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Ever seen a manefest for the plane, or any people morning their dead friends and family members? Nope. Only people involved with the people on the twin towers plane and the failed camp david plane. There probably never were passangers. There were, however, deaths at thye pentagon. This leads me to believe that we were attacked by an outside force, and the government may not want people to know how easy it is to shoot a missle into the pentagon.

08-31-2004, 01:53 PM	#23 (permalink)
OpieCunningham Loser	To fan the flames of paranoia: There were people on a flight which never made it back to an airport for a safe landing. Those people are gone. If we are to believe that no Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon, it is possible that the flight was shot down - possibly the fear of it crashing into the White House prompted the shoot down call. Then, to cover up the shoot down, a missle/unmaned plane is sent to hit the Pentagon. One piece of information I haven't seen here is that the area of the Pentagon that was hit was basically uninhabited due to renovations that had been going on for quite some time. Additionally, according to this page, a large number of rescue and fire vehicles "just happened" to be very close to the Pentagon for a large building fire that "just happened" to go out moments before the Pentagon crash. (That page also has reports of a C-130 plane following Flight 77 as well as Flight 92.)

08-31-2004, 02:05 PM	#24 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Whoa. Good explaination. I was still trying to think of a rational reason for all of this crap.

08-31-2004, 06:16 PM	#25 (permalink)
Church Tilted F*ckhead Location: New Jersey	http://news.uns.purdue.edu/UNS/image....pentagon.jpeg This picture shows that there would for sure at least be some kind of damage to the lawn, be it from something else or scraping engines. Wow, they really should have thought this one out further. I guess they think we're stupid. __________________ Through counter-intelligence, it should be possible to pinpoint potential trouble makers, and neutralize them.

08-31-2004, 06:44 PM	#26 (permalink)
Rekna Junkie	except the majority of US citizens firmly believe a plan hit the pentegon. If it is true that it was a missle you would see an end to Bush's presidency. Which means if it were true then no Bush haters know of this otherwise it would have leaked. Now lets take the shot down plane/missle theory. If the plan was shot down where did it get shot down at? Someone would have noticed a plane that size crashing, unless it was over water. But why would it have been over water? There needs to be some more evidence of the missle somewhere (if it is true). If a plane really did hit the government could quash theorys right away by releasing all the video.

08-31-2004, 06:58 PM	#27 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	A majority of american people think that Avril Lavigne writes her own music. We have a pretty poor record, as a whole, as far as thinking is concerned. Individually, like on this forum, we can be quite smart. No one has really been able to explain away any of the facts presented. Our theorys might be wrong, but they're theorys. I presented pretty decent evidence of the missle theory (see my post about 8 posts up). The holes in the walls and lack of serious burns on the building pretty much convince me that no 757 hit the building. Actually, all planes have pretty much the same design with the crashdome. That rules out planes in general. So what's left? Other man made airborn technology. Was it a blimp or baloon? Nope. Was it a UFO? Heh. Was it a helicopter? Almost impossible. Was it an unmaned aircraft? Probably. What kind of unmaned aircraft has a depeleted uranium nose (something strong enough to brake through that many layers of steel reinforced walls)? Missile. I don't hear any other plausable arguments and theorys. If this is just a fansity, let's hear you explain everything away (now directing this twards people who don't beleive, no one in particular). Someone give me a better explaination. I'd feel a lot safer about my country if someone could give me something at all to redeeem the dishonesty.

08-31-2004, 08:24 PM	#29 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	AND many people do believe that Avril Lavigne writes her own music, and that also scares me.

09-02-2004, 10:26 AM	#30 (permalink)
losthellhound Thats MR. Muffin Face now Location: Everywhere work sends me	I hate snopes.. what could be interesting reading ends up being "of course not STUPID, how could you be so STUPID. HEY EVERYONE, LOOK HOW STUPID THEY ARE" or something like that __________________ "Life is possible only with illusions. And so, the question for the science of mental health must become an absolutely new and revolutionary one, yet one that reflects the essence of the human condition: On what level of illusion does one live?" -- Ernest Becker, The Denial of Death

09-02-2004, 11:23 AM	#31 (permalink)
pocon1 Banned	Wow, this thread is amazing. I cannot believe that you people actually believe this shit. I don't believe a video produced in England has any idea that they know what they are talking about. I am a personal trainer in DC. Next to Fannie Mae. One of my clients lost his wife in the plane that went into the Pentagon. One of my friends lost his friend in the plane that WENT INTO THE PENTAGON. Get a reality check, People. Like you all know what a fucking plane crash looks like. Talk to the people who's friends and family are gone.

09-02-2004, 11:34 AM	#32 (permalink)
Church Tilted F*ckhead Location: New Jersey	Yeah, we know that a plane did go down SOMEWHERE, but it was not the Pentagon. You just tell yourself that everything happened like old faithful CNN told you, right? Well life isn't that good. Your government, MY government, are not as they tell you in the public eye. Do you think it would be more of a tribute to the people lost on that plane to believe the lie that has been told as opposed to finding out what really happened? __________________ Through counter-intelligence, it should be possible to pinpoint potential trouble makers, and neutralize them.

09-02-2004, 11:39 AM	#33 (permalink)
pocon1 Banned	Sure, so instead of putting a device on the plane to steer it into the Pentagon, we make a plane and its 60 something people disappear, then in broad daylight we shoot a missile into a military building in potential view of thousands of people. Riiiight. We have the technology to make unmanned planes fly. We can certainly steer a plane into a building. So instead a big cover story has been built up to do this. Like watching terrorists take out our twin towers was not enough to convince the public.

09-02-2004, 11:41 AM	#34 (permalink)
Church Tilted F*ckhead Location: New Jersey	lol. You have a closed mind so I'm not even going to try showing you the light. Continue watching CNN and enjoy your little sheltered life. __________________ Through counter-intelligence, it should be possible to pinpoint potential trouble makers, and neutralize them.

09-02-2004, 11:48 AM	#35 (permalink)
pocon1 Banned	I guess in your case an open mind is an empty mind. LOL. HaHa. My little sheltered life, huh? The one that was actually within ten miles from the Pentagon? I wandered into this section from another link that pointed to this thread. That was a mistake. Last edited by pocon1; 09-02-2004 at 11:51 AM..

09-02-2004, 11:49 AM	#36 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Actually I've seen the wreckage of several planes. I was there when a DC-8 cargo plane went down in Rancho Cordova in an auction yard. My friends and I followed the smoke back there just in time to get escorted off by the sheriff, but we all saw it. THERE WAS WRECKAGE EVERYWHERE. I'm entertained to see that just because you have loose connections to what happened, you know more than the experts and the firemen who were actually there. You should bother actually reading the posts before you make an utter fool of yourself. "I don't believe a video produced in England has any idea that they know what they are talking about." BWAHAHAHA. I hope you're kidding. As for people you know died in the crash, my uncle was in the building at the time and he lost friends, too. No one here is insinuating that people didn't die. What we are saying is that the facts are in stark contrast to the information released about the specifics of the crash. Any one can see that what was released differs from the truth. Something went into the Pentagon. Something killed those people, both in the Pentagon, and in the 757-200. I hope you can appreciate THIS reality check. Your eyes are closed. Open them before you walk into a wall.

09-02-2004, 11:51 AM	#37 (permalink)
Rdr4evr Banned	I believe it 100 percent. I dont think its irrational and is very much a possibility. The govt. could have taken the passengers and exterminated them without raising suspicion. I wouldn't doubt for a second that Bush and company would not do such a thing.

09-02-2004, 11:52 AM	#38 (permalink)
pocon1 Banned	To what purpose? Do you also doubt that terrorist controlled planes went into the towers?

09-02-2004, 11:55 AM	#39 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	I'd rather try to formulate theorys about what really happened, then accept a baltent lie. At least Church is actually trying.

09-02-2004, 11:57 AM	#40 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	As far as the twin towers, I have no information to contradict the information that was released. But, thgis is much different. Here we have a case where there are facts that contradict what was released. I haven't heard you explain away anything that I've stated. Good luck.