Scorps

Well this thing has been running like shit for a long time now so before I drive it off a cliff I have decided to do the top end, I will be ordering a new cam and lifter kit(timing chain, lifters, cam, gaskets and gears) I got the stock intake, the person who rebuilt this engine back i like 88 had put a drag intake on it and I think it has finally plug up. The Holly 650 will be replaced by a quadra jet 4 barrel. I haven't had a lot of time to look closely at the heads but my dad has been saying for some time that it has to be a burnt valve, and well cyl 4 has always had plugged up spark plugs so Thursday of Wednesday I will be pulling the heads(just to see what they look like) If I got a burnt valve I will just have that valve replaced, If I take the time and money to have the heads rebuilt that will be to much compression for the bottom end and I don;y have enough cash to replace the crank and all 8 pistons!

I will post as much pics as I can.

Pic1:

And the anti-freeze leaked in when I pulled the intake off!

KrazyKracka

that valley area looks pretty clean inside there.... do you run synthetic oil? Don't worry about a little antifreeze, just be sure to change the oil more frequently for a little while. Of course, don't run the oil that's in there now, but I'm sure you know that

netnut

The redness in the lifter galley looks like rust. Is it? If it is, you have bigger problems. Though it could be just a leaking intake manifold or manifold gasket.

Just as a personal preference, I prefer the Holley over the QJ because of tunability. Though you will get better mileage with the QJ due to the smaller primary butterflies. Less air, less fuel.

How many miles on it?

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Scorps

Ya I know to change the oil, and no I just ran normal Quaker State 10W40.

The Red colour is what colour the block used to be back in the late 80's, I have never heard of someone painting the inside of there block before! Also the Holly will not bolt up to my different intake, the Holly was designed to bolt onto the Drag intake it came off so I have no real choice but to go with the QJ, unless I want to cash out another 600+ dollars for a new Holly carb.

And for millage this thing was a US van to start off but the dash cluster shorted out 7 years ago and sense then has had 2 other clusters in it the current millage is 188,769 (CDN) but I'm saying the engine is up around 250,000 and the van is gotta be well over 300K.

merkerguitars

Well pain train to answer your confusing ordeal with the carb...there are generally two types of bolt patterns for carb's square bore and spreadbore, quadrajets are spreadbore and most holley,edelbrock, are square...take pictures of your intake and carbs and I can help decipher them for you....Also carbs are cheap if you need parts call the lady I got my mustang parts from...just say you know merker.....1-715-381-6940

Supposedly if you paint the valley pan area it makes oil run into the oil pan faster :S

Also for your heads...find a good machine shop and and tell them you just want a good set of heads...they will go through...check tolerances and get them fixed...its worth all the money.

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Scorps

Thanks for the info just calling all the way to your city just to get part might get a little high in cost! and I don't want to even think about new heads until I see what is wrong with them first(still need to pull them). Might do that tomorrow! My dad was saying he checked the wet and dry compression when i was at work and said they where getting the same numbers a new stock engine would get...so right now I don't know what the hell is wrong....my mechanics scoped the cam and said I needed a cam last Sept(03') But my dad thinks I don't need one because we ran the engine with the rocker covers off and all the rockers seemed to be moving there full travel. But I want to put a new cam and lifters in and I just hope it only the valve seals....at least I can do that....If I can find someone with a spring compressor! I hope the price doesn't get to high

Also Merker I will post pics but I need to get some new batteries for my camera first!

Scorps

Well here we go:

What was on the engineHolly Carb and Weiand - X-Celerator Aluminum intake(dragracing))

Carb Top:

Carb Bottom:

Intake:

Scorps

And whats going on

Quadrajet Carb, "Old" Stock intake.

intake:

carb top:

carb bottom:

spacer:


What I want to know is the old intake worth getting cleaned up? or should I just take some cash and put it down on a nice new one? Because the old stock one looks like its from the 60's and well, its got some rust on the inside, where there shouldn't be rust!

merkerguitars

You don't need that spacer.....the spacer is just an adapter to put the holley carb on the factory intake.

If you want a good stock setup the factory intake would be easy to clean..buy a cheap right angle die grinder and buy some scotch brite rotary pads that you can put on the grinder....it may cost money but you'll be able to clean up the gasket surfaces in about 5 minutes...if not find somebody that has access to a sandblaster..then paint with a $5 can of engine enamel..it will be like new.

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Scorps

Ya i wish I knew people like that...I would sand blast the block also...But I'm in the middle of pulling the head to day...Hope to get the last of the lower head bolts out after a quick supper then next week take them in to get them cleaned and get the valve seals replaced!

But that die grinder idea seems like a good idea....I could have used a cutter today..."damn exhaust bolts!"


todays progress, pulled all rockers, rods and lifters out...hope to have picks of the heads off tomorrow or as late as wednesday!

Scorps

Well my dad took the head into the shop on Monday and the exhaust ports on both heads where cracked so time for some new heads, my dad told me today that it would cost $200+ (CDN) to get these heads fixed and then they will probably crack again so I'm going to get a used set for between 300 and 400 and thats the heads and them being cleaned up.

Scorps

So I finally will have some newer heads next week hope by Tuesday they should be here, my dad knows a guy in Toronto that had a set sitting in the back of his shop so 200 bucks I got some new heads. Next is clean the block and paint it then hopefully we can start putting it back together, I miss my van so much!

Also by pulling the cam which is fine and I don't need a new one, that is a very good thing, The timing chain is worn out so I will get a new chain and gears. my job today is to start the cleaning before it snows here!

Headless Block:



Cam:



Pullies:


Timing Chain/gear:

merkerguitars

Looks like your on the right track...if you want to you could replace the cam and lifter...the place i get my car parts from was able to get a crane cam and lifters for a chevy small block for like $150 for the whole kit....also double check your harmonic balancer..mine on my mustang was scary looking..the rubber between the outer and inner part was all dry rotted...i didn't trust it one bit.

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Scorps

Ya the balancer is a little worn out and will get another one of those, but for the cam I don't want to change it if I don't have to! But I will be getting new lifters there was 2 that the inside was seized and not moving so I will replace them all along with the chain and gear.

Scorps

Well another up date:

new intake(300 dollars for a new one, but got it for 150 cash)

New lifter:

new heads I got for 200 dollars cash

BigTruck1956

yo the dual plane intake was a good choice, since i assume you wont be running the beast upwards of 4000 rpm consistently. you will get better bottom end torque as well as better mileage. good luck, man

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Scorps

Ya the guy who built this engine before put that shit intake on it...dumb move!

merkerguitars

Yeah good choice on the intake it will help you out in the following ways.
1. Stock intakes usually have so much extra shit on the for emissions etc. So it will make your engine look more organized.

2. Also installing a factory cast iron intake can be a fucking pain in the ass, especially in the vehicle...so it will make your like a bunch easier

New lifters are good choice too...I know some people that are such cheap bastards and reuse lifters..then they wonder why they have weird assss problems.... make sure you check your rods for straightness and if not replace....new pushrods are cheap insurance. That weiand intake wasn't bad...it's just if a holley carb isn't tuned worth a shit it, it will run like ass.

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Scorps

The holly was fuct thats why it ran like shit and I had to replace 3 lifter do to them not pumping oil at all so I went for all 16, and the rods are all good I checked them with a streight edge! today I will be setting the rockers and I put the thermostat housing on but forgot the thermostat....I guess I needed sleep!

Scorps

Well its all back together and this is where I need your guys help.

The thing is turning over and spitting gas out of the carb, it was flooded the first time then I dried out the chambers and the plugs and tryed again, I got flames coming out of the carb but still will not catch and stay running.

The timing is set, and the disturbuitor is in the old spot I even tried moving it around as I turned the key and nothing happened, so I need some ideas.

Right now I'm right pissed off

merkerguitars

Well for one even if you put your distrubutor in the same spot it could be totally wrong spot. One your replace our your timing chain (when it wears it gets alot of slack that can mess up timing, also make sure your timing chaining was correctly lined up). you'll have to figure out where to put your carb. The easiest way to get it running with is have somebody crank the engine while one person rotates the distributor back and forth and once it is running keep the distributor there. I had the problem when I first got my mustang. It would sputter and shoot out flames and not stay running. Also you have to make sure your sure it's firing on the compression stroke instead of the exhaust stroke which is a common problem. I've redone alot of heads on vehicles and you always think if you put the distributor back to where it was it would be ok...but damn i've been wrong many of times, you'll get it the worse that'll happen is your learn more!

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Scorps

Well I have tried moving the disturbtor around and I still get nothing, And I know I got it at TDC, I double checked that, I tried again this morning I had the distrubutor turn almost around like 350 ans still no catch, It almost started this morning when I first tried I pumped it once held the pedal to the floor but I couldn't keep it going. The gears are also set right, because GM the dots line up and they where, so now that my Dad has gone away for like a month or 2 I stuck here alone with a van that will not start, so next wednesday when I get off work I'm calling the tow truck, I need a mechanic to take care of this damn thing!...I already got pissed and punch the dash board and almost broke my hand!

I don't know what could be wrong, I got a new Carb, Intake, Lifters, Timing gears and chains and new(rebuilt) heads.

merkerguitars

Ok, your valvetrain seems to be all OK to me. And seems to me that you getting fuel. Did you try swings the distributor back and forth constantly while someone cranks the engine over? (that is how people in engine building time trials do it also) Thats the way i've always done it and then fine tune the timing by ear.

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Scorps

Talked to a guy at work and it seems when my dad put the disturbetor back in he didn't put it back to TDC on piston 1, so I'm going to try that today!



if the sun comes out