hahaha

subaru > mitsubishi
evo > WRX
for the money 1st gen dsm>evo

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"find what's good and make it last"
-Bouncing Souls

Elitegibson

You know, I've got to agree with you totally on that one, except swap STi for WRX. A used WRX might be more cost effective than an Evo, and definitely easier to find than a quality 1st gen dsm.

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-Erik

Stupid people shouldn't breed.

RemyLebeau97

If a Geo Metro was used in The Fast and the Furious everyone would be sweatin it.

Lestat

A little off topic...

I think it's pretty cool that people here can have an intellegent conversation without turning it into a "my Mustang can smoke your ricer any day" thread. This shows the intellect of the members here and what makes TFP a very special place.

Thank you

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I hope life isn't a big joke, because I don't get it. - Jack Handy

Elitegibson

I don't know man. I just saw 2F2F and it had that convertible eclipse, and I'm not drooling over it. I wouldn't kick it out of bed though.

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-Erik

Stupid people shouldn't breed.

Scorps

A guy at work has one of them and they look sharp.

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A.K.A. PainTrain

tj2001cobra

ehhhh ...

I'll line up against any of them..... Straight line or on the twisties.

iwishiwascool

It makes baby jesus cry when people act as authorities on subjects on which they have NO knowledge on. Step away from the import thread and get back to your displacement fixation.

What is different from the OZ edition and the Evo?
Motor, tranny, driveline, suspension, ECU... need I continue. It shares maybe 3 parts with the OZ edition. Wanna see the CAPS on it?

The Evo is based on the infamous 4g63. Infamous for 2 reasons: 1, The DSM 2g crankwalk, in which, due to improperly designed oil squirters the crank, over time, was able to move back and fourth... often just enough to take out the Crank angle sensor rendering the car immobile (Yes I was a victim). 2, for being one of the most resilient inline 4 motors ever (1g). Withstanding 450 hp in OEM form not many motors are half as bullet proof.

And sorry mr Tj, your stang wouldnt stand a chance in the twisties with either of these cars. You might even struggle to keep up with their mid 13 second 1/4 mile times if you are in stock 14.0 second 01' cobra trim.

Mustangs turning.... that gave me a chuckle.

Rippley

If its just factory rice, why do WRC cars have the wings? They've gotta be good for something...

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roadrazer - 300kgs, 300hp = pure fun.

Pragma

WRC cars have wings to produce downforce, because they frequently travel at 100+ KPH through very twisty roads.

Your average streetcar, on the other hand, won't need it. Also, at least with the WRX, the factory wing and the wing used in the WRC cars is different.

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Eat antimatter, Posleen-boy!

bad30th

Firstly congratulations on coming off like a complete elitist asshole.

Secondly, thank you for assuming you know something about someone that you have NO knowledge about (wait...thats what you were accusing ME of? I'm confused.....) And how the fuck do you know whether or not I am an ASE certified mechanic and have worked on hundreds of Mitsubishis??? You fucking dont.

Thirdly, I said NOTHING about displacement....you brought it up. I might say that you have displacement envy, but displacement doesnt matter at all for imports right? Or maybe it just doesnt matter to you. I dunno...I'm confused again....

Hmm. OK. So lets just pretend for a minute that you are right and the Evo and the econo-box Lancer are NOT the same car. Does tthis also mean that the 03 Mustang GT and the 03 Mustang Cobra are NOT the same car? The Camaro V6 and Z28 are NOT the same car? The Eclipse GS and GSX are NOT the same car?

Give me a fucking break. The latter are all just bigger badder versions or THE SAME CAR. But I guess the Evo is special because you said so....

I am sorry but this little speech of yours proves nothing, except the fact that you have the uncanny ability to look information up on the internet. Amazing.

You directly contradicted yourself as well. #1 is EXACTLY why the 4g62 is NOT "one of the most resilient inline 4 motors ever." Nice try tho.....

You ever been AutoCrossing?? (read: "twisties" ) Guess who owns.....Miatas and fucking F-bodies. And guess who owned EVERYONE at the last meet.... a fucking Mustang Cobra. Notice that all these cars are RWD. And why? because a well-driven RWD car is actually BETTER in the "twisties" than AWD. AWD is just easier for a novice to be decent. Pretty much the only time the AWD cars own on an AuotX course is WHEN ITS FUCKING SNOWING.....

But I must be full of shit because no car can beat the EVO!!!

I wont even mention the fact that you are obviously defending this car because you are a Mitsu lover (why I dont know....).....oh wait...I just mentioned it. Oops.

And I also love how people are so quick to jump on the EVO bandwagon....people are sheep.

Elitegibson

If you were at an autocross where a Mustang beat an Evo, either the Mustang driver had vastly superior skill, the car was heavily modified, or you were smoking some nitrus.

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-Erik

Stupid people shouldn't breed.

bad30th

so whats your point.

yes that is true...either the car was better or the driver was better.............weird.

MSD

It looks like this thread has been thrown off course, and that certain people need to take a deep breath before clicking "Submit Reply." Keep it somewhat on topic, keep it civil.

Both the Lightning and Cobra R will have this feature, which designers claim will give the car a 30-second boost of around 50HP.

iwishiwascool

1) Youre not a certified mechanic or you would know that what I said was true: That the motor, the suspension, and the driveline and even the interior are completely different. Just as in a GS to a GST the engine, tranny, suspension is completely different. Im looking at the CAPS (mitsubishi parts look up program) for the Evo now. That washer that you use on the turbo to manifold bolt... you can use that on the stereo harness on the lancer.... so yeah I guess youre right, exactly the same.

2) Youre not a certified mechanic or you would know that it is a 4g63 motor, not a 4g62... and that the problem I mention plagued the USDM spec 4g63 for exactly 4 years. That motor was made for 11 and only a fraction of them were mfgd in Normal Illinois.

3) You dont know anything about autocross. You honeslty just said a stock fbody would beat a stock evo in an autocross event. I dont think i even need to rebuttle that.

bad30th

1.) You havent proven a goddm thing

2.) You still havent proven a goddam thing, except that I accidentally hit a 2 and not a 3....

3.) Where once did i say "stock"? The car is only as good as the driver.

Buuut I'm gonna go ahead and take MrSelfDestruct's advice and end this by saying....

You are right in all things you have said, are saying, and will say.

Argument over. You win.

clonmult

I love the naming of some of the current UK models.

We have the cleverly named Evo VIII FQ 300.

And now there is the FQ 330.

The numbers denote the power.

The FQ stands for farkin' quick. Which I won't argue with.

There is something almost agricultural in the sound of these things when they fly past you .... I'd love to have one. Couldn't afford the fuel bills though.

madsenj37

It is true that fluids can not be dripped onto the track. Subaru knows this and has made the water cooled intercooler sealed so that fluids are not dripped.

The WRX is not the STI first of all. Second of all they all have AWD, so saying that the wrx/sti is not ready for the strip means the evo is not ready also.

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"Only two things are certain: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not certain about the universe."
-- Albert Einstein

Blahman

What?!? Do you know that Mitsu has a lower IQS 'Initial Quality Study' (lower is better) than Subbie? Do you know how many detonation problems are being reported on the Sti? Do you even know who had an AWD Lancer in the WRC first?

Or are you one of the public who still thinks that the Evo was derived from the US Lancer?

Bring your STi. I'll run it against my Evo any day of the week.

Blahman

Another one, completely clueless.

The Evo 8 is still an Evolution. It's not a suped up Lancer. It is NOT converted from 2WD to AWD. Period. End of story.

Reliabilty on performance enhancements to Mitsu's engine? Have you ever heard of the 4g63? Probably one of the most reliable, upgradable engines EVER. Know what a DSM is? Know what kind of power you can get from them? SAME ENGINE!

About the looks...well, at least our 16yr old kid knew how to put a functional hood on, and a wing that doesn't flap in the wind past 50mph.

ace81385

The evolution is awesome i really wanna get one. According to car and driver it can be compete with cars that cost like 15k more. Also it handles well and it looks nice , and if u want to could upgrade it even more!!

Epidemic

First of all let me state that I own a Mitsubishi Lancer(yes the eco-box) and my best friend owns a Mitsubishi Evolution.

American Lancer is based off the mirage and cedia platform. 4g94 2.0 SOHC engine, based off the 1.5 and 1.8 4g93 engine.

American Evolution is based off the 4g63 2.0 DOHC engine. This engine has gone through many changes in the the past 12+ years it has been out. The version in the Evolution has been tested to push over 550 hp with stock internals and no known engine problems. The only problem with this car (AND YES IT IS A HUGE PROBLEM) is the clutch. Mitsubishi really did a fucked up job and lined up the tranmission in a way that puts extra stress on the clutch. My best friend burned his clutch at 7500 miles, another one of my friends burned his out at 1500. Then Mitsubishi tears down the tranny looks at the blue and purple clutch and tells the customer it is due to them racing it, makes them pay for the new one(that costs over 2000 for the clutch and install), then waits until they do it again.

The only thing the two cars share is the sound system, basic body parts(the evo has aluminum fenders and hood for weight), and the interior is the same.

My friend's best times on a few mods (intake, exhaust, SAFC, boost controller, Fuel pump, 6-puck racing clutch) have been in the mid to high 11's.

I have not driven a STI, but I have heard MANY good things about them. The only problem that I have heard about is detonation problems. The transmission seems to be bulletproof though.

Either way both cars are great choices. They are both in the same price range, so why not take both for a spin. Just remember the upkeep of the car is what is going to kill you. Tires go out every year, clutches are a pain in the pocket, and Mitsubishi makes you do you oil changes with them or they void you warranty.

Elitegibson

Road and Track just finished their 1 year long-term review on the Lancer Evolution. They drove it 30,000 miles and had no clutch problems. They drove it hard too. The thing is that they know how to drive hard correctly. I'm not gunna say that your friends drive crappy, but killing a clutch that quickly is their fault. Mitsubishi said he raced it, and hey look, he's been drag-racing it, you even give his times. Not good for clutch. Don't blame the car for your friends being dumb with their clutch.

http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....rticle_id=1296

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-Erik

Stupid people shouldn't breed.

Atomic Pinkie

Please, correct me if I am wrong, I don't race, my high speeds are usually long highway stretches, but i've got a FWD car, i've noticed that the back end sometimes feels a bit loose when cornering, would an increased downforce in the rear not help alleviate this situation?

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Where dem bitches at?

bad30th

Holy back-from-the-dead Batman!


If youre cornering at 150 mph, yes.

lazyaznguy

I think both cars are great cars for $30k.
I read somewhere that the Evo runs a faster 1/4 than the STI. Anyone know if it's true?

Elitegibson

They run it really close. The STi is quite a bit more powerful, but it has an extra gearshift to make down the quarter mile, so they're within a tenth of eachother.

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-Erik

Stupid people shouldn't breed.

Jackebear

I like the Evo VIII but as of now I would rather have the STi. That Car and Driver comparison was so close that either could have won it. But the STi won the online contest on Road and Track for best new car in 2004 according to the voting public.

HOWEVER, I would love to get my hands on a genuine Nissan Skyline GT-R. I heard through the grapevine that Nissan is thinking of bringing it to N.A. in the next couple of years...maybe.

I saw it in Japan a few months ago and it made my mouth water...it is awesome. I am not allowed to post attachments yet but maybe somebody will do it for me. Check it out.

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Life's jounney is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn-out shouting, "Holy sh*t! What a ride!" - unknown

Zoom

EliteGibson, the STi can handle much more powa than the Evo can on stock internals because the engine is beefier and built a little better. while the Evo is running 20psi stock to barely make 230-250 hp at the wheels, the Sti only runs around 14-16 psi stock to make around 260-275 hp with room for much more.

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ZOOM ZOOM

HunterDevourer

AFAIK the first few series of the lancer evolution were sort of based upon the lancer body, similar shape with upgraded components and the wing etc added. However, with the new series there are some body changes, different shapes, smaller size I think, etc.
Comparison is easy when you see Lancers with evo bodykits compared to the real thing.

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Viva La Muerte

Elitegibson

I'm not sure I buy that. The 4g63 is about as beefy as 4-cylinders come. You can raise the boost to supreme levels with the stock internals and get to around 500 (just not with pump gas). The STi's advantage is it's not boosted to high heaven from the factory and can take more before detonation becomes a problem.

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-Erik

Stupid people shouldn't breed.

etla

WRC uses a dogbox or sequential shift yes. SCCA and CARS (US and Canada) don't allow them in most classes; only open in the US IIRC. Group N for sure doesn't and that was where Subaru USA was paying ProDrive to change transmissions during service.

A lot national level and lower sanctioning bodies restrict transmissions cases or gear sets or both to try and keep costs down. A good percentage of performance rally around the world is equivelent to Show room stock + Cage, Belts, Seats, and Cell.

If I had to choose I'd go with the Evo if only 'cause it's cooler to say and WRXs are everywhere up here. 'Course if I was dropping C$35G+ on a car I'd be sitting in a Hemi 300C AWD

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Subvert the Dominant Paradigm

Moonduck

Had an Evo come into the shop for some work after a collision. red one. Had the single WORST paint I have ever seen from facotry. It had so much orange peel that it looked like the whole car had been coated in rockguard.

As to the clutch comment earlier, the guys at our Mitsi dealership tell me that they put a lot of clutches in these things. Average is 10k miles. It is so bad that rumour has it they're considering loosening the warranty restrictions on em. It would follow in line with Nissan admitting that the front ends on 350z's are horribly designed and eat tires constantly.

Personally, I wouldn't touch a new Mitsi of any type. They're unreliable, have shite paint, and uninspired design. I would happily jump on a 1st gen DSM AWD turbo as they're great fun to tune. The 4g63 is one of the all-time great mills, and is easily the SBC of the import world.

c-dog81

GET A SRT-4!!!

silent_jay

It was included because that is the title of the car the Lancer OZ Rally Edition, where as you were just mentioning parts on your car.


So if the STI was RWD then the wing would be justified? Give your head a shake, I suppose that the FIA WRC cars have no need for the wings they use, or are they in a separate catageory? You seemed so sure of yourself, yet you were so wrong

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Absence makes the heart grow fonder

bad30th

its unbelievable how a thread this old can be brought back from the dead, and how people keep making asenine comments about things already debated so long ago.

cmon jay...... find another car to defend/degrade. This ones been beaten to death.

Kurant

Doesn't Mitsubishi claim that wing is functional like at 92 MPH?

BTW I really laughed when someone said the Evo is just a bigger and better OZ Edition Lancer, just after calling someone an elitist asshole. Too funny.

bad30th

EDIT: This in response to Kurant, who edited his post above to make himself look like less of a dick.....

riiiiiiiiight

As should you. But thanks I'll keep that in mind, oh mighty one.


Yeah. It is. Go back and read the rest of the thread, realize that we have been over this topic quite extensively, and then realize that you are completely awesome for reviving a dead thread just so you can attempt to assert your knowledge over someone else's, on an internet forum. YAY!

Get off it dude.

Kurant

You need a serious reality check, bro.

It's not about being less of a dick. I didn't want to litter message boards with personal attacks and bullshit, which is what you praise on apparently.

bad30th

To quote myself.....

Flame away. I'm done with you.