Temporary_User

hey all, as the title states, Im an American living in Canada. I know that once people get to know me they're cool with it, but at first theres always the "oh you're American..." or some other comment/joke for awhile.
I don't really mind it, but wonder do most Canadians really dislike Americans as a group or is it just mindless humor.
Is it smart of me to let everyone know where I'm from right off the bat?

final_identity

I am a native of the USA and I lived in Toronto (yes, Ontario, Canada) for about a decade. Because of the mounting anti-American bigotry and hatred, I eventually got the ffff out. I now live in Jackson, Mississippi.

In Canada, I found that pursuing a career, getting a date, and having a normal life (at least, in the fields and circles I was moving in) were all basically impossible, precisely because my nationality made me a persona non grata. I am glad to say I survived the extremely negative experience.

I probably would never go back, except perhaps to impose even greater cultural imperialism than already exists. No, seriously, if the money were right, and I were more "established" I might return -- there are a lot of advantages. But as a beginner, it was miserable. If I had a nickel for every time someone said, "You stupid Americans. But not you. You're different." Or told that dumb (false) story about someone driving across the border at Buffalo or Fort Erie in July to go skiing. "And do we have to watch for the polar bears on the streets?"

Try saying, "But not you. You're different," when the preceding sentence uses "Ethiopian" or "Jew," and you'll see how offensive it can be to the group you're talking about. Canada has a problem -- a huge inferiority complex. It's not unreasonable for them to be defensive -- the USA is culturally expansionistic and overpowering, and many things legitimately Canadian and valuable are getting washed out by the gross middle-ization and Wal-Martification we propound upon them. Nevertheless, I'm glad to be out ...

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The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently. Friedrich Nietzsche

skier

wow. Someone got a few bad rubs from us Canadians. Sometimes, I will throw a few lighthearted jabs at Americans in general, but it's just that- a large generalization covering a Country of 300 million. Of course all americans are not stupid, or ignorant. We just make fun of the ones that are. Also, keep in mind that we have our share of the stupid and ignorant. On behalf of the moderately educated of canada, I apologize for the rough treatment you recieved from our ignorant. I just hope that you will not judge us Canadians the same way some of us treat americans- Making large, sweeping statements on the whole nation based on a few negative experiences.

To me it's just a little mindless humour. I'm pretty sure people joshing you for being american is just a way of breaking the ice, striking up a conversation. I wouldn't be concerned.

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"Asking a bomb squad if an old bomb is still "real" is not the best thing to do if you want to save it." - denim

noahfor

I would think they would respect the person's dicision to get out of America. I mean thats probably as far from an American as you can get, someone that moves out I mean.

metalgeek

honestly living abroad, and meeting people from many many countries, anti-americanism is rampant.
From Europe, Asia, Canada, Sotuh America, everywhere. It's not always Americans, it's mostly America.

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The truth is, wherever you choose to be, it's the wrong place.
Chuck Palahniuk , Diary

final_identity

I love the Canadian response -- "I sometimes make ethnic jokes, but I don't really mean it." Well, now you know how well it comes off among your intended victimlesses.

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The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently. Friedrich Nietzsche

Averett

Now come on.... You know Americans do the same exact thing. I've got Canadian friends and I do the same thing to them. The igloo jokes and such...

To me it's just friendly ribbing. It goes both ways. I've been considering moving to Canada for some time now, and if I do I won't let the good natured ribbing bother me. If it does, I'll speak up.

As far as letting people know where you're from, I don't think its a good or bad idea. Shouldn't matter. I'd never hide the fact that I'm American. No matter what, I always will be American born and bred. Does that define who I am? No. And I should hope that people wouldn't judge me on that.

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Absence is to love what wind is to fire. It extinguishes the small, it enkindles the great.

Charlatan

But... you mean... all Americans aren't ignorant hicks from the backwoods?

My world view has been shattered.


final_identity is right to some extent. We Canadians, very broadly speaking, do have an inferiority complex when it comes to the USA. To us the US is the big brother that drives the shiny new car and gets all the girls. While we as the little brother are still working out who we are we don't appear to get nearly as much notice or respect as our older brother but we take quiet comfort in the fact that we get better grades and when people get to know us they actually like us better.

Occasionally, our resentment bubbles to the surface. This is especially true when our inherently liberal nature is offended by overtly conservative posturing (i.e. electing someone like Bush and all that goes with that...).

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"My hands are on fire. Hands are on fire. Ain't got no more time for all you charlatans and liars."
- Old Man Luedecke

Yakk

http://www.elyrics.net/go/a/Arrogant...dian%20Lyrics/

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Averett

That is AWESOME!

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Absence is to love what wind is to fire. It extinguishes the small, it enkindles the great.

Polyphobic

I have visited canada a few times and have several canadian friends. Maybe this doesn't apply to me since I have never lived there. Canada doesn't seem to be that bad IMHO. Besides, it's not like we treat foreigners, immigrants, and migrant farm workers that good in this country. It's like "the pot calling the kettle black".

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<--The great infidel-->

jumprun

Temporary_User,

where are you living? that sometimes has a lot to do with it as well.

Charlatan

The Arrogant Worms are very funny.

Canada's Really Big
(spoken)
thank you very much
now we're very, uh, we're very patriotic canadians
and we'd like to take this moment to,
uh, to do our national anthem, that we wrote

When i look around me, i can't believe what i see
it seems as if this country has lost its will to live
the economy is lousy, we barely have an army
but we can still stand proudly because canada's really big
we're the second largest country on this planet earth
and if Russia keeps on shrinking, then soon we'll be first!
(as long as we keep quebec)

The USA has tanks, and switzerland has banks
they can keep them thanks, they just don't amount
cause when you get down to it, you find out what the truth is,
it isn't what you do with it, it's the size that counts
most people will tell you that france is pretty large
but you can put fourteen frances into this land of ours!
(it'd take a lot of work, it'd take a whole lot of work)

we're larger than malaysia, almost as big as asia
we're bigger than australia and it's a continent
so big we seldom bother to go see one another
but we often go to other countries for vacations
our mountains are very pointy, our prairies are not
the rest is kinda bumpy, but man do we have a lot!
(we've got a lot of land, we've got a whole lot of land)

so stand up and be proud and sing it very loud
we stand out from the crowd, cause Canada's really big


I Am Not American
I am not American,
Though I live in North America
Which is part of the Americas
Which should make me an American

Geographically Canadians,
Are certainly Americans
As are Venisallians,
But not Hawaiians

They're out in the middle of the Ocean
Just like the U.S. Virgan Islands,
Who shoudn't say they are Americans,
Or even Virgians

How could two whole continents,
Lose their name to one Constituent
Where were we when the U.S. went,
And took the word American away?

But to be fair to them,
Their other name options,
Like U.S.A.ers or United Statesians,
Were pretty bad

Still I want to be as American,
As the French are European,
Or those in Antarctica are Antarctican
Even if their just penguins

That leaves us Canadians as Northern North American,
But Alaska’s Norther curse them
We're surrounded by Americans
Americans, Americans!

I just called those U.S.A.ers Americans
A name meant for two continents not just them
For if I said I was American,
People would probably think I came from Maine

Still I think I have a plan,
Let's become Antarctican,
And join up with the penguins
For just like them, we're not American!

Averett

God that's funny. Must find their stuff!

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Absence is to love what wind is to fire. It extinguishes the small, it enkindles the great.

Yakk

More seriously, this could have to do with holding people morally responsible for the acts which their country does. Remember, you do choose your country.

Recently at least, there are alot of events involving American politicians attacking Canada, or being generally rude.

Humour would also be a part of it. Stories about the foreigner who is ignorant of local custom/mores/situations are as old as time: in the case of Canada, there is only one nation that is adjacent to it, so that will be the foreigner selected.

Some of my best friends are Americans.

(and this was an example of humour, if not mindless humour).

I don't see why you would. What you do, and who you are, seem much more important than where you are from.

If you consider your nationality a large part of your identity, more important than your profession, your hobbies, your interests and your beliefs, then I think you should expect others to view you first as a member of your nation, and secondly as an individual.

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Last edited by JHVH : 10-29-4004 BC at 09:00 PM. Reason: Time for a rest.

canuckguy

i was trying to think of a comment or something to add to the post but since i am still working through my inferiority complex that comes with being canadian all I can think of this sentence.









just kidding.









to each his own. I would not want to live in the states, and I imagine many americans would hate to live here among us hosers. were all different and weird in our own ways. what we need is to rename both countries to Club 54 and make it one big disco!

assilem

I have been all over the world. Before and after 9/11. Before and after the new Iraq war. Everyone hates us. They always have. When you are the biggest kid on the block it does not matter if you are the nicest kid. I have heard so many disparaging comments from so many different peoples of countries that I just don't talk to people when I am out of the country anymore. Only the ones I have made friends with previously.

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The mother of mankind, what time his pride
Had cast him out from Heaven, with all his host
Of rebel Angels

Yakk

And, on the tangent, Carrot Juice is Murder MP3, a classic bit of wormish fun.

(MP3 courtisy of eagle-wing -- they claim to have permission).

The worms simply kick ass live. Many of their more recent albums are recorded live, the crowd reactions are great... Especially the "mounted animal nature trail", which is a sing-along song!

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Last edited by JHVH : 10-29-4004 BC at 09:00 PM. Reason: Time for a rest.

Cosmo Girl

sorry for the bad expereience you went through but it works the other way around too, my ex boyfriend moved to america and everyone gave him a horrible time for being canadian. There are always people who joke around, but it doesn't reflect the attitude of a whole country.

:::OshnSoul:::

Every Canadian I know have been nice..........I know a few on the boards here.........

charlesesl

So americans never treaded any foreigners with disrespect?

Comon, what are you blaming Canada for? We the the last time we segregated you when you showed your american ID.

Besided, the state is a partial representation of the individual. When you see a country that is pushing every one else around, it would be logical that the individual would be much the same.

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It did not really matter what we expected from life, but rather what life expected from us.
Dr. Viktor E. Frankl

kulrblind

charlesesl, I don't think anyone is accusing Canadians of being the only ones to disrespect people from another nation (heck, we disrespect ourselves on a regional basis), just that "yes, Canadians have been known to show a lack of respect to Americans". I think it's only natural for some animosity to exist between two nations that are so interconnected.

Also - and though I love the Arrogant Worms, I wouldn't advise taking their songs as gospel when it comes to "how Canadians feel", despite any chuckles you might get from Canadians while listening to their stuff.


So, to answer your question, Temporary_User, I wouldn't bother announcing your Americanism as a prelude to any conversation, but I wouldn't hide it either. Just as I wouldn't announce "Hey, I'm Canadian, I just thought you should know" to someone I met on the street in another country. I think you'll find most are welcoming, but that there are idiots all over the place. One bad apple....

Charlatan

That seems to be a bit of a stretch...

Why would anyone equate a nation with an individual?

Yakk

You choose which nation you belong to.

As such, which nation you belong to is a partial representation of you.

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Polyphobic

Aren't you usually born into a nation? Maybe the choice lies in that you decide to stay there. However, sometimes it's not a choice. Like in North Korea.

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<--The great infidel-->

Yakk

Sure. And if America was like North Korea, not letting people leave, you'd have a point.

In Canada, 18% of the population chose to live here. The rest chose to stay here. In my province, 1 in 4 people where born elsewhere, and chose to come to Canada. And they are as Canadian as I am.

Your country is your choice. If you choose not to choose, that is your choice as well.

It isn't a huge part of one's identity, but it is part of it.

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Last edited by JHVH : 10-29-4004 BC at 09:00 PM. Reason: Time for a rest.

Polyphobic

Then there are the poor or poverty stricken class in the US. For them the country they live in is not a choice. Especially since they can barely afford to feed themselves let alone move.
That's my last thought. I think this horse has been beaten to death.

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<--The great infidel-->

Charlatan

For an immigrant yes there is some choice to the county you have chosen to live in... however, the country in which you are born is not your choice.

So although final_identity chose to live in Canada he was branded an American because a) he was born there and b) chose to identify himself as being from there.

Polyphobic also makes a very important point. For many people it is not all that easy to just up and leave your country if you don't like it. There are many reasons why you have to stay put.

__________________
"My hands are on fire. Hands are on fire. Ain't got no more time for all you charlatans and liars."
- Old Man Luedecke

pocon1

I was in Montreal and Mont Tremblant this winter for skiing and vacation. At least in the area we were in, everything was hunky-dory. The people were very friendly. they would all say "bonjour" and I would give them a big "hello", and they would switch to english. Of course, the french accents were thick, but that is ok. The only thing that bugged me is that everyone smokes and the restaurants reek of cigarette smoke. Where I live, Montgomery Co, MD has banned smoking in all restaurants.

matteo101

It happens everywhere. Have you travelled alot? Let me assume that you do not travel to other countries. You are probably just blaming Canada because it is the only country in which you have a first hand encounter of people being anti-american. In many other countries all over the world USA, is not liked, not just here in Canada. And it is true that you show us just as much disrespect as we show you, if not more. That being said, Canada doesn't have as big of a beef with the States, as you think.

canuckguy

i was lucky enough to be able to do a tour of europe with some friends just after university and the opinions of all of us north americans differ not from nation to nation but person to person. hehe i remember i met this american bloke in travellers pub near our hotel in england, nice guy shared some tips and such for our next destination france. he had a canadian flag on his backpack, asked him why since he was american. he said if he had an american flag he would be spit on my people when travelling. always made me laugh until i was in finland and some fool spit on me in a bar for being canadian. he hated the way we play hockey! lol.

afraidofninjas

I think we can chock this on up to the fact that some people are just assholes, no matter where they are from. The North American asshole tends to congregate in more urban centers. They primarily feed on bad energy and ignorance. That's the problem, I would think.

As a Canadian who talks to americans for a living... I know some of the things people think about us are true. there are people who think the traditional "live in igloos and eat hockey pucks". To them I say only in the winter. The only thing that bothers me is when people ask me where I am from and I say Canada, then they laugh like it's the funniest thing they have heard all day...

Assholes, no matter where you go, there's always one right behind you.

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I am a new tie wearink

braindamage351

It's simple really. Everyone hates our government and pop culture. People from the US probably hate it more than you.

If this was all I knew about the US I would hate everyone in it. All we ever see from arab countries is terrorists, dictators, and crazy bastards running in a circle around a giant stone. A lot of people in the country make fun of them, and if it wasn't for the whole racism stigma in the US we would make fun of them all the time.

Jam

Hmm, about announcing country of origin.. i went on a cruise to mexico, so it was like a floating usa (stupid 21 drinking age, couldnt drink between ports) and i never once said hey im from canada. although alot of the time my shirt said I AM CANADIAN, see our beer is kind of patriotic. anywho. the americans on the cruise, some were rude or arrogant, but not all, just like from anywhere.

canadas dislike of america that i would see would be mainly your governemtn, getting all pissy about us not trailing after them into thier wars as iif we were supposed to do as were told. or the taxing of lumber, hmm NAFTA anyone?

anyways BC (thats the west coast people) is apparently the most anti american province shows a sudy in maccleans

cameroncrazy822

I think it's the have/have nots syndrome. Candians should be a bit more grateful for the nation that is singularly responsible for keeping them an independent and sovereign nation all these years. Food for thought and just this American's opinion.

canucker

We could always send our navy of canoes and 22 rifles out after you!

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Go hard or go home;
Just don't go home hard.

Jennteel

I feel like Americans are the minority in USA nowadays.

Swirlie

to be honest, I dislike America.. not Americans. Your politics annoy the bejeezus out of me. Softwood lumber. Mad Cow. Grain Tarrifs. Protectionism. The war mongering. The outright lies by your current administration. The chest thumping "If you're not with us, you're against us" mentality. The list goes on and on.

However - people are people regardless of where they are from. There are a lot of people I deal with every day from both countries that I would like to kick in the ass just for being idiots and arse's.

so that's my opinion.

Jam

i agree with swirlie very much so

/me kicks swirlie in the arse

skier

Don't you think we would have put more money into our military budget if we didn't have such a powerful ally? America is great for saving money on tanks and nukes but it is not responsible for the independance and freedom we enjoy today.

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"Asking a bomb squad if an old bomb is still "real" is not the best thing to do if you want to save it." - denim