Rudius

My friends and I were drinking in a parking lot outside of our cars. The cops came and we all ran, but before we ran my friend put a case of beer in my car. Eventually we all got caught and I got charged with a MIP. What should I do? It was not my fault at all and I got charged with it...this is the last thing I need right now and I cannot pay the fines or get my license suspended. I want to request a public defender, do you think I can get off of the charge completely? I'm willing to do community service, but only if it is necessary...I am truly innocent after all.

Willravel

You were drinking. You were in possession. You are guilty. Show up on time with a nice suit and beg for community service.

Don't drink until you're 21 or off probation, whichever comes last.

Rudius

I can't drink legally, but I can legally die for my country in the military? I think that's bs.

The only reason why I was charged with possession was because my so called friend put the beer in my car. Yes I know I could have been charged because I was drinking before, but the officers did not know this. I told them I had 1-2 beers at a friend's house 2 or more hours ago. I volunteered for a sobriety test also so I could drive home, but they would not give me one.

Willravel

Principles are really hard to argue in court, especially when they run contrary to the law.
There is no way to prove the beer isn't yours (unless your friend wants to take the bullet for you, and even then you'd probably both get punished). All the sobriety tests in the world can't negate a MIP. You're charged with possession, not being intoxicated.

I'm not trying to be a dick, but seriously your best bet is the mercy of the court at this point. First time offense? Good. Good grades? Good. Willing to do community service? Good. Trying to get out of it? BAD.

surferlove007

You could always plea for them to check for fingerprints on the beer and see if they match your supposed friend. Although if you can't afford your own lawyer odds are they won't waste their time on that. This is considered a small case in the courts eyes with a bunch of guys drinking underage. Also be thankful you weren't driving or anything, that would be MUCH worse.
Running from the cops wasn't a good idea...you're lucky they didn't go ahead and charge you for evading a police officer.
Go ahead and admit you were wrong, I'm 19 dude. Don't pull that I can die for my country but not have a beer crap. I can do all that too but the law is the law and until you turn 21 that's it.
You're underage and got caught with alcohol. Deal with the consequences of your actions. Begging to get out of it only shows your lack of maturity instead of standing up and admitting you were wrong. Go to Good Will and buy a nice looking suite for court if you don't have one and get cleaned up for court. Bring school records and recommendations if you can scrape some together. Any awards help. If you're a college student mention what you want to be etc. My best advice would be to plea guilty, ask for community service and probation. Probation will probably be a short period, couple of years. Just be an adult about the situation since you consider yourself one to get into it in the first place.

Not trying to be negative...just trying to give you advice on how to handle an adult situation.

Also...what about your folks? If they're not involved with you then maybe ask them for some help too.

I've had friends in this situation, never myself.

Rudius

Please do not condescend me. Please do not do it. I like respect, either positive or negative.

The 'can die but can't drink' was just me stating an opinion. I would NEVER say that in a court of law...please I am smarter than that. I do realize what I did was AGAINST THE LAW, I do not consider it wrong, but it was indeed against the law. I am nineteen also, and sorry I will not rat on a friend no matter what. I will not hire a lawyer; I would only consider a public defender...but I doubt the judge will appoint me one for such a common misdemeanor. I would never drink and drive - I have already learned my lesson the hard way. Who said I was begging? I am merely just trying to get out of a situation that I could possibly get out of...not even that I'm just trying to get advice and I really appreciate you guys doing this. I already know what my sentence can be...a hefty fine with a mandatory one year license suspension at least. Right now my decision is to plea not guilty. I have this which could be good support for me in court. Nothing official, just something I could use to win the judge over with. I would appreciate any feedback that would tell me something I do not already know:

1.) They have no proof of me drinking (I know this could not mean anything, but it still can help in court)
2.) The beer was not mine (")
3.) I volunteered for a sobriety test (test doesn't matter just the fact that I volunteered for one)
4.) I am a clean honest man.

Right now I am not worried at all, I accept the fate that has been brought on me, I see it as a challenge. I feel that pleading not guilty would be a better choice for me rather than taking the full charges. I really don't know yet though, until I see the judge. I am hoping the judge will give me a reduced sentence or a plea bargain from the prosecutor. Otherwise, I will plea not guilty.

What ever happens to me, happens to me. I'm not scared of that. I'm just wondering what do you guys think?

P.S. Good Will?

ratbastid

My first piece of advice is: check that attitude at the courthouse door. The judge will talk to you the way he talks to you. If you take it as condescension and have some macho 19-year-old reaction, you're boned. I acknowledge that an internet forum is different from a courtroom; I'm just saying, when you're with the judge, HE gets the respect, not you.

Well, so far on this thread everything anyone has said has been responded to with, in effect, "I already know that... asshole." So I'm not confident I can tell you ANYTHING you don't think you already know. My most heartfelt apologies if that sounds condescending--I'm interested in you getting a reality check here, not in coddling your poor wounded 19-year-old pride.

Here's my feedback that tells you something you don't already know: You did a dumb thing. Your best bet here is to own up to how dumb it was, not to try to convince the judge (or us) how smart and good you really are. People (including judges) want to help people who are humble and have some awareness of their own failings. People (including judges) want not to help people who are arrogant and think they deserve better than they're getting.

These might slightly mitigate things, but in no way change the fact that you are a minor, and you were in possession. If the judge wants to apply the full force of the law, these things won't save you. You'll get a WHOLE lot farther by saying, "Your honor, I did a dumb thing, and you better believe I won't be doing it again."

Now: When I was a lad of roughly your age, I found myself one night in a public park drinking beer with some buds, one of whom was shooting bottle rockets. A motorcycle cop cruised up into the park. We coolly walked away from the beer toward our cars (and the cop). When we met him, we told him we'd seen some people there with the bottle rockets and such, but they ran off. He thanked us and drove toward where we'd left our stuff. We ran as fast as humans can run down to our cars and got the hell out of there. When he saw us running, obviously, he knew the deal and pulled us over about half a block away from the park.

Technically I was arrested, though the cop released me on my own recognizance. I was charged with minor in possession, public consumption, possession of illegal fireworks (all fireworks are illegal in Utah except for certain dates), trespassing (it was after park closing hours) and littering.

I never got in front of a judge about it. I was asked to meet with somebody from the DA's office down at juvenile hall. My parents and I went in and I got a lecture about my future and potential and what have you. The guy dropped all the charges in exchange for my agreeing to do 20 hours of community service and an appropriate display of humility.

funydjane

You can seriously get charged for underage possession of alcohol in the States?

ubertuber

I think part of the discrepancy here is that from what you said in your original post, you are most decidedly not innocent at all. That's why a lot of us think you should just own up to this and take responsibility. Ironically, that track may also get you the most reasonable treatment from the law.

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QuasiMondo

What's BS is that you can't drink legally, but you have to chip in via taxes to support this oppressive government. And you can vote.

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snowy

Sorry, but what you did is minor in possession by consumption. You got caught.

You should really know better than to be drinking out in public if you're a minor. I'm not saying minors shouldn't drink--that would be hypocritical of me. But you should do it behind closed doors. I managed to make it to 21 without an MIP, and if I did it--anyone can. All it takes is some sense.

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If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau

Cynthetiq

My parents allowed me to drink at home for that very reason. Cut down on the chances of me drinking and driving and getting a MIP.

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I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

snowy

Mine as well. In fact, we had an agreement when I was in college that they would buy me my alcohol, so long as I promised to use it and share it responsibly. It worked out well, and definitely kept me from drinking in risky situations.

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If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau

Willravel

You weren't charged with being drunk, you were charged with having alcohol in your possession.
It was in your car. That's honestly all they need. So far as the law is concerned, you committed a crime (whether you purchased the beer or not).
All this says is either you don't understand what MIP means or you were trying to trick the cop.
Most honest people don't run from the police. I'm not saying you're not a "clean honest man", but that's not going to show when the police officer says you ran from him (or her). That was certainly your biggest mistake.

This is what you should bring with you to court:
1) (presumably) You have no priors.
2) You're very sorry and will absolutely never drink underage or run from the police again.
3) You welcome any punishment the court has, and even offer to do community service.

Ustwo

Man up Nancy, you are busted, you blew it, they caught you.

Get supervision if you can.

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Willravel

BTW, Radius, once you get dealt punishment your friend will owe you one big time. Now would be the time to ask if his sister likes you or something.

vanblah

Have you actually joined the military? If you haven't then this argument is moot.

Actually, I agree with that platitude though ... if you are a responsible citizen you should have all the liberties and privileges of every other citizen (of course, then we get into the argument about what constitutes a "responsible citizen").

The problem here is MOST kids don't get any experience with alcohol until after they are out of their parents house. Then all hell breaks loose and they spend the first part of college drinking every night. IF this country had a more relaxed attitude about alcohol and other "taboo" subjects it would lose it's appeal. But again, I'm using yet another cliché ... and that's not the focus of this thread.

Will is right ... the part where you (all of you) screwed up is when you ran. Had you NOT run you MIGHT have had the chance where the cop just confiscated the beer and told you to be "good kids." I say "MIGHT" because we'll never really know for sure now.

When you ran, you made the cop have to work. I'm not saying that cops are lazy; but that you made a potentially easy situation into a potentially dangerous situation in the eyes of the cop. This made the cop enter into a different mode of thinking--one that is less lenient.

Fight it in court if you want, and you have every right to do so, but be aware that it's going to cost you a lot more; you're right that a judge is not going to appoint a defender for this ... you'll have to hire an attorney if you want representation.

You could always remember this incident as you get older and work to change those laws that you don't agree with ...

World's King

You are guilty.




Trust me. The only way you would be innocent is if you were at home doing your homework. Or at work. Or being a productive member of society instead of drinking in a parking lot.

No matter what you say or do... you were there. You can try to reason with the judge, tell her/him how unfair it is. And all they will say is, "You're underage. You were drinking in public. The fact that even if you hadn't been caught there, you would have been caught drinking and driving. And trust me... Adding a DUI to MIP isn't fun. You could have killed someone. You could have killed yourself. So don't talk to me about fair."


See, I've done all this before. I've been that cocky 19 year old that thought he new more about the law then the judge or DA. And trust me... I didn't.

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inBOIL

If you argue this in court, you will be asked whose beer it was. Since you don't want to rat out your friend, you'll have to either lie under oath, or refuse to answer the question. Lying under oath is illegal, and you won't have the right to refuse to answer the question because the answer doesn't incriminate you. And trying to be sneaky or evasive in your answer won't work, either; judges and prosecuters deal with that all the time, and they know how to counter it.

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And you believe Bush and the liberals and divorced parents and gays and blacks and the Christian right and fossil fuels and Xbox are all to blame, meanwhile you yourselves create an ad where your kid hits you in the head with a baseball and you don't understand the message that the problem is you.

Glory's Sun

Don't stress it. You'll end up with community service and maybe a fine. Big deal. Learn from it.

My only advice.. get a lawyer. They know the DA's and Judges and can do alot more than you.. and say alot more than you and get away with it. It's your only chance of getting out of it completely .. probably not going to happen but it can't hurt.

The_Jazz

You were guilty before your friend put the beer in your car. You were guilty afterwards. Your friend isn't willing to take responsibility - obviously neither are you.

Why are you guilty? You were in possession. You've admitted it. One of the problems here is that you're friends with someone willing to let you take his fall.

So now that's out of the way. As I see it, you can get your friend to stand up in court and admit his guilt, or you can take your chances yourself. There's some good information on how to lessen your punishment. I suggest you listen to that.

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Infinite_Loser

I've only got one thing to add here: Why the hell did you try to run? Don't you ever watch Cops?

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Cynthetiq

@ 1:30 of How not to get your A** kicked

"Everybody knows, if the police have to come and get you they're bringing an ass kicking with them."

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I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

Rudius

I'm not just some "macho 19 year old" or am I? I don't see it in me, maybe you do...I was just flustered. That statement was not meant to offend anyone and I apologize.


Okay let's start fresh I've thought about this with everyone's help, and when I say everyone I mean only the posts I have read so far on this forum. First off no hard feelings, you guys I'm assuming are experienced adults after all and I am just starting life...I realize where I should stand now. But don't think I'm just your average kid who thinks he can take on the world. I'm more to that, just because I see life and do life differently than some of you. See it like me which I think some of you can't do, and will criticize - but I respect that. "Even though I'm no more than a monster - don't I, too, have the right to live?". I guarantee you that I am not just your average kid.

My name is Richard, 19, I was born in Los Angeles moved to Orange county - please don't sterotype me. I go to community college, because I did not do work. I have much to say about life, but we'll save that for next time.

I would like to say that throughout my whole seeking advice adventure, this place has had the best advice. That's including all the friends with past offenses, friend's parents which are lawyers, and other various places I desperately went to.

Now back to my little situation...

California state law sentences a fine and/or classes and a mandatory 1 year license suspension.

Do you guys believe I should plea guilty or not guilty? Do you think they'll offer a plea bargain? I really am only trying to avoid the 1 year license suspension and the fine and the dent in my record...ya I know I'm dreaming...

Should I rat on my friend (please forgive me)? If I do does he have to come to court with me and will we both still get punished? How does that work? My friend is pissing me off, he thinks that he's right, and if I just didn't say it was my car we would have been fine.

I ran from the cops, because that's what stupid kids do. I did not think my friend would put the beer in my car. Too be completely honest I took another case with me when I ran and threw it they didn't know. Please don't let this addition affect the way you guys look at me. I'm just going by what the police report says, I have done other illegal things, but not on the police report.


Will and Vanblah you are WISE.

Feedback please, any kind, it is appreciated.

World's King

You are guilty.


Do what your lawyer tells you.

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heavy is the head that wears the crown

Plan9

Uhm... I don't think getting killed overseas is "legal" in that it's an acceptable practice.

...and the above statement makes me wanna choke the shit outta ignorant young'ns who equate imbibing cheap canned piss with the turbulence and danger of military service.

...

You should know that if you do join the military... beer is cheaper than water and any time you're not "overseas getting killed" you can be in a wild, inexpensive drunken stupor anytime after 1630 every day of the work week. I kid you not... AAFES prices on alcohol will have you brushing your teeth with Bacardi 151 instead of tap water.

...

Running from the cops is like running from the Grim Reaper. Why try? Neither of' em sleep. They'll get your ass.

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Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

Crack

AAFES... I once got a nice 87 year old bottle of Port when I was in the Azores at AAFES for $23. Off base, same Port was 120 euros...

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funydjane

Seriously?

snowy

Seriously.

And you can get cited for minor in possession by consumption.

In Oregon, they recently upped the penalty from being $180 to $250, and now suspend your license for six months. However, it is perfectly legal here for minors to drink in their own home under parental supervision.

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If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau

funydjane

Has that always been the law or did your civil liberties just get shafted recently?

World's King

Since the drinking age was raised to 21.

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heavy is the head that wears the crown

Rudius

Would anyone else like to share about my pleading guilty or not guilty? So far I have king.

King - when pleading guilty, what are my options? I know I can plead guilty, no contest, and I think guilty with me being able to say me story. What would be the best choice for me to get a lesser punishment?

World's King

You need a lawyer.


And pretty much do whatever the lawyer says.

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heavy is the head that wears the crown

Rudius

What if I cannot afford a lawyer?

Martian

Indeed. I don't think we have any lawyers here, so we can't give you expert legal advice.

On piece of advice I can give you is to start learning the bus routes in your town now. You did something stupid, you got caught and now you accept responsibility and face the consequences. Welcome to the adult world. Enjoy your stay.

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I get through cryin' and I'm sadder than before I wept
I get through thinkin' now, and the thoughts have left my head
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snowy

If you are a college student, your college or university may have free legal advice available on campus. I know my university has a couple lawyers that are free to students.

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If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau

World's King

Then the day of your trial you'll have to talk to the DA and hope he or she is in a good mood...



I really suggest getting a lawyer. It could prove to be less expensive in the long run.


And the bus route thing is true. You will lose your license.

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heavy is the head that wears the crown

bonehed1

You are basically SOL.

First thing, you shouldn't have ran, Stand up and take it like a man.

Secondly, doesn't matter if your friend put it there or not. It is in "YOUR" car.

Best bet is to try and get community service out of it. You can blame your friend all you want but it will not matter because you are underage and the beer was in your car.

Basically this is all you can really do:
If the car is registered to your parents and they agree to say they left the beer there and you took the car then you have a defense.

If the car is registered to you then you are in violation of the code. If convicted, you could be looking at a $1,000 fine and up to six months in jail, plus have your driver's license suspended for up to one year.

Get rid of your friend

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Stuff is Good

guyy

Oh my, kids drinking beer -- what is this world coming to? And running from the cops? Back in my day, if we ran, it was straight to the cop shop to turn ourselves in. Kids these days!

No one here ever A. drank when under age? or B., ran from the cops?

Ha!

ratbastid

Well, if you read my post, you'll see that I most certainly did do both things.

Nobody here is pulling a moral judgment on the kid. Our reaction is to the incongruity of "I was drinking beer in a parking lot, a cop found beer in my car, but I'm somehow mysteriously innocent of Minor In Possession".

From his posts, it's clear Rudius is coming around and can begin to accept his guilt. That's a good thing, because it's the only way he stands the slightest prayer of getting a light sentence.