kramus

There are lots of different opinions about what is intriguing, or a waste of time. Is this piece amateurish, or juvenile. Is that one fun and playful. Are these ones too opaque, or inaccessible. Would that be a direction you would like to see me pursue. Is this really good, and that not so good.
I am putting up a fair bit of my output over the last few years and I am hoping that some of the good folk here at TFP would take the time to tell me what you like, or don't like. I have my own ideas and they evolve, but I have been working in a vacuum of sorts, without enough broad-based give and take from the public. This is where you guys come in. Tell me what you think. Not just the nice stuff either. If I find myself out in the cold, cold world there will be critics who will gladly point out where I have fallen short. With your hard critiques I hope to make fewer fumbles and mis-steps.
So, to get on with it.

Centre - pencil
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Mary 1 hour - colour pencils.
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Mary Completely Different - conte and pencil
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Woman In Chair - pencil & colour pencil
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Seated Woman - pencil & colour pencil
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Seated Woman2 - pencil & colour pencil
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Seated Woman3 - pencil & colour pencil
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Seated Woman4 - pencil & colour pencil
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Seated Woman5 - pencil
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Seated Figure Gesture - pencil
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Reclining Figure - pencil
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Seated Figure - pencil & colour pencil
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Blue Model - colour pencil
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Seated Male Model - pencil & colour pencil
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Mark Mixing Tracks - pencil
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Game Stand - pencil
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Tree in Yard - pencil
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Boy on Beach - pencil
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Tree Trunk - pencil
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Frog - rapidograph ink pen
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Punkinhead - pencil
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Window View - pencil
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Tamarack Trees - pencil
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Family Home at 88 - pencil
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ATree Knits the Sky - pencil
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Tree Frog - pencil
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Slain Dragon - pencil & technical marker
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Genie & Dragon - rapidograph pen
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Book Dragon - rapidograph pen
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Colourful Fellow - colour pencil & technical marker
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A Fine Fellow - colour pencil & rapidograph pen
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Dragon Perch - rapidograph pen
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Tree Snake - rapidograph pen
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Fish - rapidograph pen
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Light - technical marker
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Hiccup - rapidograph pen
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Turtles & Longneck - rapidograph pen
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Preflight Dragon - rapidograph pen
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lowercase "a" - pencil
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Seasonal Snoozer - rapidograph pen
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Wants to Play - pencil and technical marker
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Marine - rapidograph pen
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Onlooker - technical marker
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Look - rapidograph pen
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A Fine Fellow - colour pencil and technical marker
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Sessile Roots - pencil
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Sessile Place - pencil & technical marker
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Sessile Growth
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Sessile Concept1 - pencil
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Sessile Concept2 - pencil
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Sessile Concept3 - pencil
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Sessile Concept Blue - pencil & conte
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Thinking Place - pencil & rapidograph pen
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Atypical Sessile
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Seeker Moon Concept - pencil & technical marker
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Seeker Concept - pencil
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Seeker Concept 2 - pencil
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Seeker Journey - pencil
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Wind - pencil
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Smoke Goddess - pencil
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Flower Woman - mixed media
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Sprite - mixed media
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Water Reed Woman - mixed media
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Tummy Thumb - pen
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In The Grip - pencil & technical marker
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Tree Dancer - pencil & colour pencil
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The Dancer Held - pencil & colour pencil
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Tree & Sky - mixed media
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Pensive Figure - pencil & colour pencil
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Languid Tree Figure 1 - pencil & colour pencil
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Languid Tree Figure 2 - pencil & colour pencil
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Languid Tree Figure 3 - pencil & colour pencil
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Off To School - mixed media
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Off To School Again - mixed media
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Interleaving - pencil
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The Road - pencil
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Night Bird - pencil
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Keep Right - pencil
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In the Same Place - pencil
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Icons With Water Element - pencil
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Wetlands - pencil
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Yellow Sky Beastie - acrylic
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Landing - rapidograph pen
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Paul - pencil
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Leah - pencil
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Mark - pencil
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Gregory - pencil
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Elizabeth - pencil
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Cindy - pencil
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Curves - pencil
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I hope that those who hung in for the complete download enjoyed the show. Please let me know what you think.

__________________
And now to disengage the clutch of the forebrain ...
I'm going with this - if you like artwork visit http://markfineart.ca

tecoyah

As always Kramus....freakin' amazing skills....fantastic

__________________
Holding onto anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned. - Buddha

noodle

Kramus, I want to put you in Mixed Media's art appreciation thread.
I love your fanciful creatures and the personality you give to every piece.

__________________

amonkie

Kramus, first off - the digital online files do NOT do these images justice, after having the extreme pleasure of seeing these pieces in person.

That being said. I think the first time I was suprised was that your work was able to evoke reaction in me. The pieces that did that were often unposed, felt natural, and just pulled at me. While I love the sun piece.. It is very hard to do it time as an art piece because there is so much going on. This isn't a piece I'd keep on the wall, its one I'd have in my lap to keep looking at all the details.

The women figures... while they are pretty, they still feel too posed. I have seen you look at the same thing I am and sketch it, and when you add your insight in the view... that is when I feel you seperate yourself from merely a sketch done in color. I hope that makes sense. The pieces where you have invested a part of yourself are easy to pick out, and those are the ones that I enjoy the most.

__________________
Calling from deep in the heart, from where the eyes can't see and the ears can't hear, from where the mountain trails end and only love can go... ~~~ Three Rivers Hare Krishna

ngdawg

I agree with Fredweena, et al. I know it's almost a requirement to do model poses-it keeps one's vision lucid, helps with proportional exercises, etc. If you are to hawk your work, leave those out; just keep doing them for the 'practice'(like you need practice).
What's so fantastic about your work is, beyond any technical applications, is the desire of the onlooker to keep looking, finding new details to intrigue and keep the eyes glued.
Your best work are those not in color-the colors don't enhance the otherwise beautiful lines. And that blue model....how'd you see me sitting there??
I would love to show your work to the gallery owner I deal with. Hm...I do have that piece here at home....
A suggestion to get this stuff out there: Check around the galleries and art associations(everything you can reasonably drive to) and see if there are juried shows for you to enter. Join every art association you can, too. Put yourself on mailing lists for these places so you know everything that's coming up. Join any free artists sites you see, even those that have 'trial periods', like Yetty or ArtPromote.
Consider places like Cafepress, where you can start a store free of charge and put things on shirts, mugs, posters, etc.

kramus

Thanks Tec - It is a pleasure when somebody seems to "get" everything


Hey - that is a real cudo fredweena!
I do try to make the things I draw real in my own way, and it is a gladsome thing that you find the pieces work for you.


Thanks amonkie. It was a real treat to have you make it to the art show, not to mention that first Rochester get-together
Now, posed vs unposed - if you could give me examples? I am so close to these things that what may be obvious to you is not so clear to me. I feel like a dog who knows a ball is somewhere in the grass, and I am circling around with my nose to the ground and meanwhile there it sits in plain sight. Are pieces overworked? Too mannered in some way? Is it the fact that the models actually are posing, or that I draw inspiration from places like the Titty Board, which is another form of posing? Enquiring minds want to know


Thanks, ng. Re the model poses - I remember someone in a gallery telling me "Nudes are really popular" so I have kept some of the posed work in my portfolio. It would be nice to sell it, but I do enjoy the craft and exercise of figure drawing. Plus the fact of course that I am a huge fan of the female form. It would be cool to draw you with or without a blue pencil
I am torn about the colour thing. It seems that if I want to make any money I need to get painting. Which I intend to do, and will find very enjoyable. But the fine, detailed drawing is such a pleasure as well. You help encourage me to keep doing that.
I did a brief search for Yetty and ArtPromote. For Yetty I came up dry - could you maybe send me a link? ArtPromote seems like a really expensive place. I would need to think about that one. But thanks for the suggestions and the CafePress idea. I have that bookmarked now.
Thanks again, everyone, for taking the time to look and respond. That is why I started this beast of a thread

__________________
And now to disengage the clutch of the forebrain ...
I'm going with this - if you like artwork visit http://markfineart.ca

doodlebird

if you're looking for "hard critiques" you'll get no harshers criticism from me other than this...

the quick figure poses don't measure up to the rest of your work.
if i were you, i'd leave them out.

when a ballet dancer goes up for an audition,
i doubt she says "hey look, i can stretch! i can touch my toes!"
for me, figure drawings are like stretching - they are just an exercise to sharpen your skill.

and your skill is evident in your other pieces.

i am continually drawn to your trees. the way you show/draw trunks grabs me everytime. i think you might be part tree.

if i had to pick a favorite (and i have many) i think i like "off to school"
with honorable mention going to...
wants to play
marine
tree snake
dragon perch

i think you've got the makings of a killer portfolio in here.
could you narrow it down to 20?
i don't know if that's necessary,
but forcing yourself to eliminate some might help you in picking your own style / strength that you want to pursue more.

but enough praise!
since you're looking for critique, i'll get back to that.
for the most part, i don't think color added much -
but i do like your palettes for the languid tree figure series.
see - your work is too good to not say nice things about it.
good luck with your soon to come international fame.

__________________
xoxo
doodle

Fly

i really like this one kramus.....this is my fav style of yours


you watch or read much Clive Barker by chance?







and this old house is fantastic........

__________________
BASTARD

SterlingStudios

Sun Tzu

Those are fantastic pieces. I love your work. I say pursue whatever direction that keeps the fire going in soul. Your work will start to show if the fire burns out. I dont have any where near the skill you have in drawing, but from what I think contour drawings are essential in building skill, is that true?

__________________
To confine our attention to terrestrial matters would be to limit the human spirit.- Stephen Hawking

kramus

Thanks for the comments doodlebird. You help me pare down the presentation possibilities. I was at a seminar today about portfolio building and I told the group about your analogy to a ballet dancer showing she could touch her toes. The group (and the seminar leader) thought that was a very good analogy.

Hi Fly - I haven't encountered Clive Barker
I put a lot of work into Centre, and into the Family Home too. I'm glad you like them. I do wish that that fellow hadn't run Centre through the laminator without a protective film on it - it has never been the same since.

Thanks for the comments Sun Tzu. I don't know if blind contour would be absolutely necessary for building skill, but it is a key way to learning to look at things while creating line. I haven't done much of it myself, but you do get some interesting effects. They are pretty unmistakeable drawings when you see them too, with the meandering, almost anal line they have.
I remember years ago holding off from drawing because it was not involving me - no "fire". Now I hold off because I have so many places I could put my energy but no place I can set up and leave my work unattended. That is due to change in the very near future.

Thankyou everyone for your input and comments

__________________
And now to disengage the clutch of the forebrain ...
I'm going with this - if you like artwork visit http://markfineart.ca

troit

An amazing....amazing set of drawings. I would like to actually study them a bit more and will then comment.

__________________
I've yet to dephile myself...

jewels

Wow! I'm not a critic or an artist, just a layperson.

Simply beautiful and amazing! I'd think you should have no problem doing whatever you want to do.

Khazuko

I sort of get an Alex Grey vibe from the more abstract pieces, especially the very first one. You can't ever go wrong with a good ol' dragon and they seem to jump to life right out of the screen. And in some of them, namely "Keep Right" and "In the same place", I like how you have the faces/figures fading in from the background.

genuinegirly

Off to School again is my favorite - i love the idea of riding a dinosaur!

__________________
"Sometimes I have to remember that things are brought to me for a reason, either for my own lessons or for the benefit of others." Cynthetiq

"violence is no more or less real than non-violence." roachboy

Spritebox

you're really talented.

__________________
it's all nice on ice alright
and it's not day
and it's not night
but it's all nice on ice alright

kramus

Thanks for taking the time to look and comment, folks
I wonder, do some of the drawings seem rather dark in spirit? I don't really think of them as being that way, but I've asked why I don't concentrate on the fun, whimsical things such as "Back to School". I have been told that "Keep Right" seemed downright creepy - which goes to show you never really know what a reaction may be until you put your work out there. At times I have been told that some of my art can come across as immature or juvenile, the sort of subjects or approach a teenager may take. I never felt that way, but it is important to hear the different perceptions and the comments about what some folks see as warts in my work. I would have to stop creating though, if I didn't get some very nice comments such as those I've received here
Please, is there something that you feel is a bit of a dead-end perhaps? I know the comments about the value of figure poses are appreciated. I guess if I want to produce those they ought to look like more than exercises, eh?
Anyways, thanks again for looking and commenting - and please comment further anyone who happens to browse this thread

__________________
And now to disengage the clutch of the forebrain ...
I'm going with this - if you like artwork visit http://markfineart.ca

thebeat

wow absolutely awesome!

__________________
random

doodlebird

if your ultimate goal is to show publicly,
it's a good idea to have a unified theme and or style.
i wouldn't dare say that any one of your styles is better than another,
but i could say which appeals to me more.
and i'd say that knowing that there is for certain a group who likes your other stuff better.

but which brings YOU the most happiness, the most fulfillment upon completion? once you've answer this question, i think it will be evident in your work. and you will have found your style. once you've exhausted that style - move on.

and i don't believe that you need to hear this, but there was something troubling your last post, something that made it sound like you were going to stop drawing... don't ever let anyone else's criticism affect whether or not you create. do you make this for them? or for yourself?

__________________
xoxo
doodle

thebeat

I actually looked at these again today, and just wanted to say again, those are absolutely awesome.

__________________
random

kramus

Doodle, the thing is I would become very insular if I heard too much negative commentary about my art. Not very many people would see it, and it wouldn't be on display at even home because I don't need to know folks around me trash-talk what they see in my home. On the other hand, a positive response is like a smile machine. It makes me smile. Smiling releases endorphins and such, which in turn make a person feel better. Win win.
What gives me the most pleasure? Lots of different things, actually. That is why I am asking for input, because I find myself like a donkey starving between 2 piles of hay. I would like to do this kind of work, and that kind of work - with no clear preference the end result is that I end up doing chores or reading and no art happens. What do you like to see more of? Not to say it is a deciding factor, but I started this thread to get any sort of critique or input.
Thanks thebeat for the double looksee - you'll have to tell me your callsign and let me know if your station is online. Maybe I can enjoy a radio personality from a bit further afield, eh?

__________________
And now to disengage the clutch of the forebrain ...
I'm going with this - if you like artwork visit http://markfineart.ca

roachboy

kramus--the craft behind these is imposing...thanks for putting them up. there is alot of information to process, so after my first go-through, i kinda prefer center and the "cindy" piece--there are a bunch of others that i liked, but if i want to write this i have to stop scrolling up and down..so i'll come back and maybe say other things about other pieces.


the other thing...

aside:
i have a difficult time putting things out into the world.
i tell myself i'm going to do it, and often i start, but then things get blurry--not physically, but more as a project.
i dont know why this is exactly: i can't quite figure it out.
i feel like i'm doing stuff now that need to have their own lives, so am thinking about this all over again.

the thing:
i wouldn't necessarily choose between styles--i would just alternate between them. make a rotation-like. if you want to go in direction x or y, feature it more for a while and then let it slide back into a routine. it seems to me that maintaining routines--practice--is the central thing. if what you're doing refers mostly to how you get to the place of doing it, then it hardly matters what other folk think of it---not that it isn't nice to hear folk like stuff and a drag to hear they don't---but the motor is your own work, what you do.

on why other people can't tell you if your work is any good or not.

besides, often what people say is a function of being polite as much as anything else--if you come offstage after a performance, everyone who is inclined to talk to you will tell you they liked it. and that's nice---but they can't tell you how it was, can't tell you if your work was as you'd like it to be, if you felt that piece a or b "hit" in ways that other pieces didn't. so there's always a distance between folk's perception of your stuff, and within that their selection of pieces or elements that they like, and how you might think of a particular piece, or of your own stuff more broadly.

it seems like the nature of the beast. you have to figure out for yourself what you want to work on, which way you want to go, etc..other people can't decide. they can just say i like x or i like y.

random personal aside
i like stuff that has a good craft base behind it. i like other things too, but i dont know, i respect craft and people who pursue it.

synthetic part
all the above is cheerleading.


the other thing
alot of the images look like they'd be happy living in books as much as living on walls--do you do anything in that format?

personally, i think you might consider a broader approach to getting stuff out into the world, in more places, via more routes.

grand conclusion drawn from anecdotal evidence
galleries--->strange business.
they seem mostly about which parties you get invited to.
it's most odd, that world.

__________________
a gramophone its corrugated trumpet silver handle
spinning dog. such faithfulness it hear

it make you sick.

-kamau brathwaite

little_tippler

Hey kramus, I really owe you one here because a while back you asked me for some advice and at the time I was unable offer it.

I like your nude sketches but I don't think they have much of the soul of your work that is present in other pieces. Out of all of them though, this is the one I think is the best:


I love punkinhead, or at least the style of the drawing, and there isn't another quite like it. Of course, this is not the most commercial work, it would be perfect as an illustration though. I do feel that a lot of your work is more suited to illustration:


Out of the dragon drawings, this one I like best - because it's not so direct, it turns into an abstract at times, and the composition is exciting:


This one is also intriguing:


I also think conceptually your Sessile series has some strength:


My favourite pieces are the following ones. They have the most movement, dynamic and freshness:

Of course I'm partial to the more abstract work because I work on a daily basis with contemporary art. I feel strongly though that there is a place in contemporary art, or there should be, for key elements of figuration. They give works a greater strength, because it helps the viewer to "enter" the work, but also then to journey through it into other possibilities.

I think you are a very skilled artist, and you have some beautiful works here, but the works here suggest you are still finding a path for yourself. Recurring are elements of nature such as trees, and also dragons, and I think these may be your key structures. I think you have a concept for your work but it's still not clearly transmitted to your audience. I'd love for you to tell me more about where you are going with your work. I also think that in your work you need to accent composition more - looking at the works, each one is quite uniform, elements don't stand out from each other strongly enough, for me anyway. I like the coloured pieces but I think it's just icing, and that's not what you need to develop. I also like the delicate quality of your work, there is a softness that is very attractive.

Keep up the good work - I know how hard it is to take criticism from others, but you must always believe in your work and keep doing it, for as long as it brings you happiness.

__________________
Whether we write or speak or do but look
We are ever unapparent. What we are
Cannot be transfused into word or book.
Our soul from us is infinitely far.
However much we give our thoughts the will
To be our soul and gesture it abroad,
Our hearts are incommunicable still.
In what we show ourselves we are ignored.
The abyss from soul to soul cannot be bridged
By any skill of thought or trick of seeming.
Unto our very selves we are abridged
When we would utter to our thought our being.
We are our dreams of ourselves, souls by gleams,
And each to each other dreams of others' dreams.

Fernando Pessoa, 1918

Shauk

I'm not an artist, and am lucky to even get good at drawing something along the lines of a stick figure, but I'm more the musical type.

now, what you're describing about wanting to pick multiple types of styles or whatever, like someone said earlier, you don't have to make a choice.
you may very well be a split personality artist, you could just do like many musicians do and use different conduits (or stage names even) to release the works for critique.

I don't know if that makes sense but lets just say Moby, Voodoo Child, Barracuda, Brainstorm, UHF, The Brotherhood, DJ Cake, Lopez, Mindstorm, and Pippy Baliunas, are all actually the same person.

yellowgowild

Thank you for bringing up the standards in this forum. You would make an easy fortune in the field of architecture, doing hand renderings.

kramus

Thanks for the detailed response roachboy.
The 2 pieces you mention are variations on narrative pieces. I enjoy that sort of work very much, and am thinking they represent the archetypal place for the art that grows both within oneself and on the paper. The drawback to too much growing on the paper is the lack of production while lingering over textures and details that may never be noticed.


Ditto, with bells on


It looks that way – the reason the question has been raised is the outside world seems to want some sort of consistant package or presentation. Maybe the answer is to merely produce everything, and if there is enough quantity to make a showing of one “style”, then do so.
What you say about comments from outside of the brainbox rings true. I see what I see, and that differs in ways immeasurable from what a random person notes when they walk up to a drawing on a wall.


You see that also, then. Amonkie said the same thing, I think – the work may do better when you hold it in a book. (/me loves books, illustrations, and all things that can fit cozily in your lap).
You have found alternative venues for your different work, I think. I wonder how to do the same. That is something perhaps that can be answered by some serious networking. Thanks, rb – a very appreciated post.

…………..

Hi little_tippler
That drawing was probably what I feel was my most successful sketch in a long, long time. /me loves your eye.


Illustration – that is a common thread in comments and advice I receive. There are lists of publishers I am part way through preparing presentations for (some snail mail others email depending on their stated preferences). I think I can approach them with more confidence, considering the input you and others have given me.


You wouldn’t know the place these two piece came from, but they are related in that they each are a “snapshot” of sorts of an inner landscape that is always there, and that I occasionally tap into and put on paper. I find that very, very interesting.


Big smile here. I like to think that there are real possibilities with Sessile. Long term projects.


These pieces have some of that inner-landscape vibe as well – except that Stay Right is heavily filtered through the biker-world motif I considered exploiting a few years ago.


Lots to think about, little_tippler. Truth and insight (and complimentary words -have no worries about critiquing when it's asked for. The figurative element is a key element that underlies a lot of the work I do. Your advice about composition and creating more strength and dynamic direction is well noted.
Thanks for the detailed comments. You came through beautifully

Hi Shauk - I like the "different conduits" phrase. I won't be labelling myself a "Moby" though (kidding - I know what you are saying and it is an interesting consideration)

Thanks yellowgowild - the fortune wouldn't happen until the process got sped up a fair bit. That piece took a lot of days, sitting in the yard when it was nice and trying not to stick to the paper when it wasn't - I lived in that attic in the drawing and it gets pretty damned hot, I can tell you.

__________________
And now to disengage the clutch of the forebrain ...
I'm going with this - if you like artwork visit http://markfineart.ca

little_tippler

I just wanted to say, in response to your comments on what I said, that I understand your attraction to figuration. I also am very attracted to it. Sadly, these days it's pretty hard to get respect for figuration, unless it's something wildly different from the norm.

I'm pretty sure that's why people point you towards illustration, the amount of detail and suggestion of strong three-dimensionality is more well-accepted in illustration and in that world there is still room for it.

Aslo, what you said about the package - that's another thing most professional artists learn the hard way. Not all of us can be Gerhard Richter, and often to stay in the public eye an artist has to try and grab the audience with something all his own, and then repeat it until it's drummd into people's heads...that's the ignorant world we live in. Though I do respect artists who have their own unique style, the ones I respect the most are those that still surprise me from time to time, while still maintaining a sense of self.

__________________
Whether we write or speak or do but look
We are ever unapparent. What we are
Cannot be transfused into word or book.
Our soul from us is infinitely far.
However much we give our thoughts the will
To be our soul and gesture it abroad,
Our hearts are incommunicable still.
In what we show ourselves we are ignored.
The abyss from soul to soul cannot be bridged
By any skill of thought or trick of seeming.
Unto our very selves we are abridged
When we would utter to our thought our being.
We are our dreams of ourselves, souls by gleams,
And each to each other dreams of others' dreams.

Fernando Pessoa, 1918