Strange Famous

Jinn - it is rather strange that you would choose to criticise the best quality big handgun which is made.

I suppose you want to be "edgy" and "counter-intuitive" by making unexpected comments - but in all seriousness - the Desert Eagle is a premium weapon - capable of shooting a man to death who is the other side of an interior wall.

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

telekinetic

He's not being edgy or counter-intuitive at all. Desert Eagles are heavy, overpriced, tactically-useless, unreliable, and have low magazine capacity. They are not used by any combat or police force that I am aware of, and are primarily owned by posers with more dollars than cents, or ironically.

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twisted no more

Shadowex3

The Deagle's a horrible overweight, overpenetrating, underperforming piece of crap. The only thing I can see it genuinely useful for other than an "OSHITABEAR" emergency backup is for some kind of pseudo anti-material purpose and even then I'm pretty sure there is something else would work better. I thought it would be cool to make a magazine fed revolver and even I know this.

You guys keep him for the same reason someone might have a Judge loaded with flares, for entertainment, right?

__________________

telekinetic

From his posting history in this subforum (and being from the UK), he doesn't seem to have any real gun experience, but somewhere along the lines lost his saving throw vs. IMI propaganda. It's kind of like a guy arguing with a bunch of girls about what vibrator is best based on what he's seen in porn.

__________________
twisted no more

Shadowex3

Woah now, lets not badmouth the wrong company. Israeli Weapon Industries just made one or two last minute changes before taking the contract to manufacture them, the gun was Magnum Research's design. Blaming the Israelis for this one is kinda like blaming a fab lab in china for your pentium thinking .49999958 is close enough when talking about caliber.

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Strange Famous

Perhaps I know less about vibrators than telekinetic, I dont know what his knowledge base is, but no girl I was seeing has ever needed one as far as I'm aware

But thats not got anything to do with guns.

The fact I have never fired a gun doesnt mean that I dont have an opinion about them, just the same as I dont need to wrestled a pitbull to know thata 300 lbs is stronger than a 100 lbs dog.

It is widely accepted by all experts in the field that IMI are the best gun manufacturer in the world. The Desert Eagle is an iconic and extremely powerful hand gun. IMI make more reliable smaller handguns, but in the aspect the Desert Eagle is designed for - the maximum power for a handgun - it is second to none. The wide usage of this gun in video games and movies is evidence of its peerless design and functioning capability.

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

Shadowex3

My god it's like popping a front-wheelie on a bicycle right before endoing, I know what's going to happen but I just can't stop myself...

A titanium machete weighs a lot less than a wrought iron one and you can use the former to cut the latter in half...

Being a great manufacturer means their parts quality and QA is great, it doesn't mean that someone else's terrible design will magically stop sucking. If it worked like that we could end world hunger by having McDonalds touch everything and suddenly everyone would get fat.

IWI (they changed names) does design some of their own guns and they usually are pretty damn good given what's required of them, but the Deagle was not one of their in-house designs.

Furthermore it's not the maximum power for a handgun as there are many others of greater power, higher caliber or both.

Lastly the wide use of it in videogames and movies means really fuck all since pretty much every videogame will alter performance to suit game balance needs and movies will also show you able to fire any gun for pretty much as long as you want without reloading. According to movies the Mac10 has the highest magazine capacity of any man-portable weapon in existence since characters regularly fire upwards of 5,000 rounds from them before reloading.

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The_Dunedan

Name one. Name me an expert in the field who has said this. Citations would be nice, but let's just hear the name.

You're way behind the times. Ever heard of the Smith & Wesson X-Frame revolvers? The .500 and .460 S&W Magnums are both vastly more powerful, the .500 Magnum horribly unpleasantly so. With a 325-grain projectile, the .50 Action Express generates 1229 ft/lbs of energy at the muzzle, which is quite a lot. However, the .460 develops 2826 ft/lbs with a 300-grain bullet, and the .500 gets 3031 ft/lbs from a 350-grain bullet. So using projectiles in the same weight-for-charge range, the .50 Action Express (the Desert Eagle's primary round) is at a nearly 3/1 disadvantage. Both of these hip-howitzers have been around for about five years now. They're not good for much except bear protection and long-range big-game handgun hunting (popular for wild hogs, elk, etc), but they're -very- good for that.

Strange Famous

I dont think there is any gun which can be used one handed by an average person which has the same power. Obviously you could shoot a shotgun one handed and claim its a more powerful handgun, but youd likely break your wrist or something.

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

The_Dunedan

What in the world made you think an average person can use the Desert Eagle effectively with one hand? Watching Snatch one too many times? It's not designed for that, and most people are simply not -capable- of that. Trust me on this one, Strange; I'm the guy who gets the trade-ins. And by the way, who's that expert I asked about? Answer the question, if you please.

Strange Famous

The experts I speak of are the professionals who actually use guns - rather than private individuals who have to take into account things like cost that lead them to buy a cheap Austrian gun like a Glock for example

For example, you only need to check Wikipedia:

"The Uzi has been exported to over 90 countries.[2] Over its service lifetime, it has been manufactured by Israel Military Industries, FN Herstal, and other manufacturers. From the 1960s through the 1980s, Uzi submachineguns were sold to more military and police markets than any other submachinegun ever made."

I suppose those people bought Uzi's because it was the best gun made by the best manufacturer.

Would you deny that Israel is the best equipped military force in the middle east? No doubt this is because they have access to IMI weapons

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

The_Dunedan

You mean like soldiers, cops, professional competition shooters, gun-shop owners, gunwriters...? Name one.

You mean like the IDF...the Israeli Defense Force? You know...the lads and lassies who carry Glocks. You've been caught spouting this before, y'know: Wikipedia supports that the 941 is issued to the Israeli Security Forces. However, this is the Israeli equivalent of Scotland Yard or the FBI. The IDF issues and fields the Glock Mdls 17 and 19, which are also the most popular weapons among reservists according to my suppliers at FAB Defense and MAKO Group in Tel-Aviv. And as for private shooters having to take cost into account: you have no idea how much help and sponsorship a truly competitive shooter can get in the US, do you? Suffice it to say that if Todd Jarrett or Rob Leatham was to endorse IMI and use a Jericho in races and demos, they'd be all set. Gun, mods, clothes, mags and ammo: all paid for. Gun companies pay these guys a lot of money to advertise their product and use it in international competition. Ask yourself why, if the Glock/1911/CZ is so inferior, are the pros using it and not the IMI? Especially when any gun company in the industry, IMI included, would happily crunch their own balls in a vise to get an endorsement like that?

As for your wikipedia link: yes, the Uzi may have been the most widely exported handgun from 1960-1980. However, as you've perhaps noticed, it is not 1980. It is now 2010, and the Uzi has largely been left in the market's dust. HK ate their lunch a long time ago.

Not for a moment.

No, this is because they have access to American money, weapons, and technology at cut-rate prices or for free.

I'm calling Troll here unless you can produce some actual sources. Names, links, articles, something to back up what you say. Produce an expert: lots of people in Tilted Weaponry read the international tactical/law-enforcement press, you'd be surprised who's names we'd recognize.

Strange Famous

If you dont believe it from me, go and read the wikipedia page for IWI

Obviously people have different opinions about what the best is, but clearly anyone who knows about guns would agree that IWI are amongst the most respected manufacturers.

If anyone is trolling, it is the guy claiming the Desert Eagle is a hopeless gun. It may be true that there are some other guns of similar power, but the differences are not material . The Desert Eagle has been reported to have caused fatality of someone shot through a wall - this is as much power as anyone needs. A Glock might be a good target shooting gun

But in fact a gun that is good for accuracy may not have the most power. This trade off between power/accuracy is well known amongst gun experts. So for a target shooter perhaps a Glock is suitable for them. For a person who wants a gun for self defence or criminal violence then they would probably prefer a gun they know has the power to kill whatever threat they face.

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

The_Dunedan

Name one. You know, like you said: someone who uses guns for a living. A soldier, a cop, a professional competitive shooter, a gun-shop owner, and gun-magazine writer, SOMEBODY.


Then I'm sure you'll have no trouble at all finding a few examples of military or police units which use the .50 Desert Eagle. Since, after all, they are very much interested in self defense and criminal violence.

So have .22 squirrel-guns. So have .38 Specials, .380s, 9x19, .40 S&W, 10mm, .45 ACP...

Face it, Strange, you can't produce any sources to back up your assertions because there aren't any. You insist that experts back you up, but can't name any. You insist that the .50AE is a superior round for self-defense against criminals, but I'll bet you anything you like you'll not be able to find a single police or military unit, anywhere in the world, that uses it. Even the IDF, your boys/girls in Israel, use Glock 17s in 9x19mm. You have no argument, and you're no longer even any fun to play with. I'm done.

Strange Famous

No, I dont say a Desert E .50AE is necessarily the best gun to use in self defence or criminal violence, just that it is the best at what it is supposed to be - an over powered handgun which has a stylish appearance.

And in fact all I would need to do to prove my case in this discussion is to prove that it isnt the worst gun at what it does, which is what this thread is supposed to be about.

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

telekinetic

Quote from "Guns of the Matrix" by Mad Ogre, emphasis mine.

THE GUNS OF THE MATRIX

Credentials of author:
Also, here's an "Ask a Rabbi" article about whether a Desert Eagle is a good purchase:
(again, emphasis mine)
GunOwnersAlliance.com - Ask the Rabbi: Desert Eagle .50 AE

Rabbi Mermelstein's qualifications:

__________________
twisted no more

Strange Famous

You genuinely give credibility to the claim that one of "mad ogre's" qualifications to speak about this subject is "I am an American"?

The guy is entitled to an opinion, but I would say one quite strong argument against him being a credible voice is that his name is "Mad Ogre"

He is just a guy, who has an opinion. As the Rabbi clearly admits also to being.

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

telekinetic

This is an honest question here...are you intentionally trolling at this point?

__________________
twisted no more

Strange Famous

I am pointing out that this character is listing some things about himself:

1 - he owned a cgun
2 - he is part of a gun club
3 - he has at some point trained bodyguards
4 - he is American
5 - he used to be in the army

You have stated that these are his "credentials" by which I should take seriously his negative opinion of the Desert Eagle

To state my case more clearly, I can say

1 - gun ownership in America is not remarkable
2 - being a member of the NRA doesnt signify any special knowledge, just that he has paid a membership fee
3 - training bodyguards might require some knowledge of how to use a gun tactically, but no particular knowledge of how guns work or which is best
4 - I dont see the relevance of this point at all, perhaps you will advise why this is a credential? Or perhaps just accuse me of "trolling"
5 - Being in the army I would imagine you are restricted to army issue weapons. He would have to have a good working knowledge of one or two particular guns that were issued to him - in terms of how to clean it etc, but not real technical knowledge about guns in general

Now, this "Ogre" guy might know a lot about guns, but nothing he said or that you have said about him gives me the reason to think so. The Rabbi sounded far more knowledagble, and what he stated was that in his personal opinion the Desert Eagle wasnt a good gun for use in self defence because it was tempermental and required a lot of looking after

And you know, a Ferrari requires a lot more looking after than a Ford. That doesnt mean that in every way a Ford is a better motor than a Ferrari, does it?

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

telekinetic

So if you do not consider NRA member, gun owner, pistol instructor, personal protection instructor, and former Light Infantryman valid qualifications for evaluating a firearm, what exactly would you consider? You have provided no more qualified opinions other than your own hearsay, and you lack all of the above.

He said that it had poor ergonomics, that there were better alternatives with similar power, and that it was unreliable to the point that he would never consider owning one. He didn't say anything about self defense, other than the fact that it was in response to a question regarding one.

Who do you think has gotten more military contracts, Ford or Ferrari? Ferraris, while completely impractical, at least wins races with their cars, while no one serious uses Desert Eagles in any kind of competition. Unless you were just trying to equate them to each other as 'expensive impractical toys', which I'll happily concede.

Do you even know what you're arguing any more? You've evolved your stance from:

("it's the best quality!")
("It's made by the best company, and it's iconic, with peerless design and function!")
(It's the most powerful!)
("Maybe some other guns are as powerful. But it's powerful enough to shoot through a wall! It may not be accurate, but it has enough power for self defense and those intending criminal violence to kill people with!")

A side note here: Because of the fixed barrel design, these pistols (when loaded with the right ammo) are actually quite accurate...on the first shot. Due to their size and weight, and the power of the 50AE, getting back on target for follow up shots, however, is slow and difficult, compared to conventional calibers. Sorry for the actual firearm information threadjack.

("I didn't say it was the best...just that it's powerful and stylish. And that it isn't the worst!")

So which is it: It's the best, or it's not the worst? Or it's the best at "what it's supposed to be," which is a bit ambiguous? What exactly is it the best at? What situation, exactly, is it a better tool for than any other more mainstream firearm? Or are you, in a roundabout way, conceding that it's an interesting looking toy, but completely useless as a working gun, thus giving complete credence to the fact that it is primarily owned by people who don't plan on using their guns for any useful purpose beyond going 'bang'.

I've provided what I consider to be expert opinions on the subject matter (although The_Dunedan's is equally qualified, in my mind), I would like to see you produce some of your own.

__________________
twisted no more

Strange Famous

I cannot imagine that anybody uses a gun for any other purpose than to go "bang" or carry the threat of doing so.

I am stating that the Desert E is the best gun of its type in terms of design.
That in material terms it more powerful or as powerful as any other gun
That because it is made by one of the best manufacturers of small arms, it is of the highest quality

Yes, because it is such a big beast there is some trade off in terms of its accuracy and the level of care needed for it, but this is the same for any very powerful gun.

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

The_Dunedan

So let's review.

The Desert Eagle is very accurate, has a detachable magazine, and fires a very powerful round.

However:

The ergonomics are hardly practical for fast reactions.
It is too powerful to be practical for defense against humans.
It is too unreliable to be practical for defense against anything big enough to require such a powerful round.

Therefore:

Yes. Except for a very limited number of applications (handgun hunting on non-dangerous game, long-range target shooting) the Desert Eagle sucks. In all respects, it is totally outclassed by large revolvers offered by Smith & Wesson, Colt, Ruger, and even IMI (with the BFR.)

telekinetic

Then why are you even engaging in this discussion?

Reasons people need a gun other than going 'bang' (also known as plinking):

IPSC competitions
Home/business defense
Self Defense
Military use
Law enforcement use
Professional personal protection
Hunting

The Desert Eagle is ill-suited to all of these with the possible exception of the last, and that only because hunters enjoy a challenge. People will try hunting with anything (crossbows? bows? Absurd revolvers? 22 pistols?), particularly if it adds to the difficulty!

What does that mean? What is it designed to do, that it is the best at?
Measurably false. 500 S&W Magnum, .454 Casull and the .460 S&W Magnum are all more powerful. In 50AE, it might have the dubious niche title of "highest ft/lbs of force produced by a large-run production semiautomatic handgun when loaded with handloaded hot ammunition". It's not even the only gun in that caliber, though.

OK. It's made by a good manufacture. Does that make it a "good gun" (meaningless without a context of something it is 'good at'), or counteract its known unreliability or pickiness about ammunition? An unreliable design manufactured with high-quality processes doesn't magically become more reliable.
Again, a lack of accuracy is ironically the one this pistol is not accused it of--Because of the fixed barrel, it can be very accurate. Statements like this show you are just talking out of your ass, rather than relaying any kind of actual knowledge. Unless you can you outline WHY exactly we are accusing it of being unreliable, your assertions that these factors are invalid don't carry much weight (there are specific reasons inherent to the design that make it unreliable). Your apologies for its lack of accuracy show you do not understand its design. I'm not sure what else to add here.

---------- Post added at 03:06 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:18 PM ----------

For the peanut gallery, and Strange Famous, a quick lesson in the Desert Eagle's action:



The tealish barrel assembly is fixed to the brown frame. There is a thin passage through the barrel assembly all the way to the end, which allows gases produced by a cartridge's ignition to push back a piston, green. What's not totally clear from this cutaway view is that the green piston is attached to the green bolt/slide assembly outside the frame, and those two parts are the only bits of the pistol that recoil. Here is a picture of it in its 'cocked' condition (pardon the watermark) which shows how the piston is attached to the bolt and slide:


Here's a picture from the patent that makes it more clear:



The advantage to this mechanism is the barrel remains fixed at all times, improving accuracy, and you can use high power rounds which would overpower a more traditional cycling method. The disadvantage is that you have a thin gas inlet to a tiny gas pathway right next to your feed ramp, and if your ammunition has a particularly 'dirty' burn, or if the projectile is soft enough that small fragments might be scraped off as the bullets are chambered, this passage can become blocked, and the pistol will stop feeding new rounds.

Edit: I forgot, a second disadvantage is your pistol needs to be large and heavy to accommodate the gas piston mechanism.

__________________
twisted no more

Strange Famous

It is quite simple really to understand why the accuracy is questionable. Because of the power the gun has a powerful kick and it is harder to aim and fire rapidly.

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

telekinetic

It apparently ISN'T simple, as you don't seem to understand it. Rate of fire has nothing to do with accuracy, and (as long as someone is an experienced shooter who hasn't developed a trigger-flinch) neither does power or 'kick'.

The kick and weight make it harder to bring quickly to a target, and bring back to a target for followup shots, but the design of the gun is inherently MORE accurate than, say, a Glock/1911/etc...on par with revolvers, in fact, if not slightly better, due to lack of variability caused by the forcing cone.

Here is a Desert Eagle modified with a longer barrel and scope for either long range target shooting or hunting, specifically because of the inherent accuracy.

__________________
twisted no more

ChrisJericho

This gave me a good laugh, thank you.

__________________
"A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows us that faith proves nothing." - Friedrich Nietzsche

KirStang

Respectfully SF, why do you keep taking up arguments which are not only wrong but completely ignorant?

The Desert Eagle is not 'one of the best quality big handguns made.' Nor is the popularity of the Desert Eagle in media evidence of its quality. You forget that in the media, silencers make a 'pew' sound, good guys can hit anything while diving and running, and nobody ever needs to reload. However, in real life, the majority of suppressed guns are many dBs above the hearing threshold of pain(with the exception of some subsonic round/suppressor combos) and it's also near impossible to shoot accurately while moving.

Which is to say, the media knows squat about firearms and a firearm's popularity with the media is not an accurate barometer of its design.

Shadowex3

Again I'm going to have to differ from both of your opinions here and point out that it's not that difficult to do better than someone whose primary strategy is to run at the enemy and then blow themselves up.

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wraithhibn

SF how many guns have you shot to compare to shooting the DE50? To make all of the claims that you make, you need to post your own qualifications for making these claims when you are discredditng others. I've shot a good number of different weapons, I prefer Smith and Wesson because they make quality products and have good customer service. What are your experiences with iWI?

__________________
If you won't dress like the Victoria Secret girls, don't expect us to act like soap opera guys.

Strange Famous

I have never fired a gun in my life... as a UK citizen this is not surprising.

I dont know why there is this obsession with thinking you have to practically have done something to have knowledge about it.

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

telekinetic

Because it's usually true--and in this instance, demonstrably so.

Arguing that you shouldn't have to have to have experience to have knowledge about something rings a little hollow in a thread where your opinions (presented as unnamed expert-sourced knowledge, which, when pressed, you refuse to provide citations for) about the topic in question have been systematically and comprehensively proven to be false, over and over.

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twisted no more

Strange Famous

How have I been proven wrong?

I stated that the Desert E was not the worst gun of its kind, and most people in this thread agree with me.

Through the application of common sense and widely accepted knowledge, one can come to the correct and factual conclusions without having to have fired weapons yourself. In fact you will see on the weapons forum many times when I have had to correct errors made by people who have far more practical experience than me.

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

The_Dunedan

BAHAHAHAHAHAAAA!

Oh GAWD you're funny! Please, please, I'm begging you; what are these errors? Who were these people you "corrected?" I'm dying to know, Strange; show us where you "corrected" all these people and who they were. Be specific and show the sources/links. You've now made a demonstrable claim that is 103% bullshit, and I'm calling you on it.

Here's a hint: When you're asserting that something is "common sense" and you find that this "something" is rejected universally by people who work in a given field or who are recognized as authorities therein by those who do, it's probably -not- "common sense." Likewise, when you assert that something is "widely accepted knowledge" but find that, again, it is rejected by experts/authorities in the field, it's a clue that either your "knowledge" is not widely accepted or that your "knowledge" is crap. And since you've yet to produce any support whatsoever, from any quarter, for any of your ridiculous ideas, you might wish to consider where this motivates informed people to file your "knowledge".

Walt

I retract my previous statements.

SF's opinions are valid due to the mere fact that he has gone to the trouble of forming them. He needs to offer no support of his arguments and opinions; he weighs 300 lbs. Should any of you express an opinion formed through personal experience or professional training, know that your opinions are no more valid than SFs. If any of you are unenlightened enough to ask SF to support anything he says, you obviously are lacking in the application of common sense and widely accepted knowledge. Armed with a stout wooden staff, he is more than capable of killing a 100 lbs pit bull (he weighs 300 lbs) whilst pleasuring any and all women he encounters. Were he not so busy correcting errors of folks who possess more practical experience than he does, he would single handedly put the UK vibrator manufacturers out of business.

You all should be ashamed (I'm looking at you Dunedan).

__________________
Calmer than you are...

longbough

Well put.

But SF has been pretty successful as far as 12 year old trolls go ....

__________________
"I do believe that, where there is only a choice between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence. Thus when my eldest son asked me what he should have done, had he been present when I was almost fatally assaulted in 1908, whether he should have run away and seen me killed or whether he should have used his physical force which he could and wanted to use, and defended me, I told him that it was his duty to defend me even by using violence." - Mahatma Ghandi

telekinetic

Moving the goalposts, really? Are you lying about your original point to try to avoid admitting you were wrong, or do you actually somehow believe that anyone in this thread agrees with you about anything regarding the Desert Eagle? Let me just state to remove all ambiguity: I do not agree with anything you have said about the Desert Eagle in this thread.

At this point I am no longer assuming good faith on your part, as I can't comprehend someone with your posts in this thread looking at the replies and declaring 'most people in this thread agree with me' without being intentionally trolling (that is, lying intentionally to stir up controversy) or so disconnected from reality that nothing else I/we post will be able to penetrate your bubble of delusion.

Walk with me through three of your post fragments, in chronological order...

Enhance!
ENHANCE!
So, based on this...am I correct in saying that, in your mind, "best" and "second to none" are suddenly synonymous with 'not the worst'?

In that case, I am the world's best lover, the world's best MMA fighter, the world's best pickup artist, and my ability to fly jets and my personal net worth are second to none.

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twisted no more

Strange Famous

If you cut and paste three word quotes you can make almost anything up. I think it is quite clear what I have said, and it is pretty hard for anyone to dispute it

(hence all of these comments about vibrators, calling me a 12 year old troll, etc)

The Desert Eagle is the best designed weapon in its class in terms of its appearance. This is subjective, and some would disagree - but the fact that so many video games and movies use this shooter it shows that a lot of people agree with me

The Desert Eagle is the maximum power range of a single handed pistol. There may be some very expensive and specially modified guns that have theoretically more power, but the Desert E has as much power as it is materally comprehensible for a firearm of this kind to possess

I state quite simply that the Desert E is the best in these criteria, which are the criteria it iself aims to be judged by

Because it is made by IWI it also happens to be exceptionally well engineered.

_

As a target practice pistol is it the best? No

But to carry on the analogy others have used, that would be like saying a vibrator is useless because it cannot bring a woman the same level of sexual satisfaction that I can.

This is true, but to women who are single and who have boyfriends who are not skillful lovemakers - vibrators may prove valuable indeed for the job intended.

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

rahl

I've stayed out of this discussion so far, but can't take it anymore.

I have been a gun owner for over 25 years. I have had extensive tactical training with a handgun in the private sector.

I know absolutely nothing about the DE. Never shot one, nor care to. Not knowing anything about it, I can't possibly put forth an opinion that should be taken seriously.

This is something that you need to learn strange. You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about, and are being proven wrong consistantly by people who actually do know what they are talking about. One can only assume that you are trolling, hence the comments.

What does a video game have to do with real life weapons? How does using one in a virtual/fictional setting give you any knowledge about it in the real world?

__________________
"Your life is Yours alone...Rise up and live it"

Walt

Don't forget "obese".

We're still waiting, Strange.

__________________
Calmer than you are...

longbough

SF, you're just a troll.

I'm sure you do appreciate the aesthetics of firearms from the standpoint of anyone who watches Hollywood films or videogames ... but, unlike most folks, you don't seem to acknowledge that the real world is much different.

As you have never so much as handled or even touched a firearm in your life - your opinion on the matter is about as relevant as sex advice from a virgin who only watches porn.

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"I do believe that, where there is only a choice between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence. Thus when my eldest son asked me what he should have done, had he been present when I was almost fatally assaulted in 1908, whether he should have run away and seen me killed or whether he should have used his physical force which he could and wanted to use, and defended me, I told him that it was his duty to defend me even by using violence." - Mahatma Ghandi