kl0pper

there are huge numbers of alcoholics in the world
and an alcoholic is more dangerous and annoying than someone who is addicted to cigarettes

and booze does have an odor
youre just used to it

floydthebarber

I don't think anyone said there were no alcoholics in the world. I agree that they tend to more dangerous (drunk driving) and they can be annoying (fuck off you pisstank), but a smoker filling my air with their smoke is way more annoying.

While I agree that booze has an odor, I'd dare to say that most people think cigs stink a hell of a lot more than booze so I don't see a double standard.

__________________
wish you were here

hulk

I'm not too sure there's that much of a similarity between smoking and drinking. I believe people just make them out to be the same thing. Let's look at coffee. Addicting? Yes. Dangerous to your health in large quantities? Yes. Will one cup a day do anything to hurt you? Very probably not (unless you burn yourself). It's far more accurate to compare booze and caffiene. Yet nobody does. Why? Dunno.

__________________
"'There's a tendency among the press to attribute the creation of a game to a single person,' says Warren Spector, creator of Thief and Deus Ex."
-- From an IGN game review.

kl0pper

a cup of coffee a day in the long run is bad for your heart and nervous system
caffiene in general shouldnt be a regular part of your day... its not particualy healthy
and youll be more rested if dont drink it
because your body cant rest with it in your system
and it stays there for a few days

hulk

Yet a glass of red wine a day has been proven to generally improve health, and could increase life expectancy by up to ten years. There are little to no health risks invovled with responsible alchohol use. The problem is the inherent lack of responsible people. Don't blame the bottle =D

__________________
"'There's a tendency among the press to attribute the creation of a game to a single person,' says Warren Spector, creator of Thief and Deus Ex."
-- From an IGN game review.

tspikes51

Holy Thread Revival Batman!!! (I know I'm talking to myself)

I found this while searching for something, and find it interesting. While at the other places I've lived, this is true, it seems to be just the opposite here in the Bluegrass. Here's what I usually say about it: Central Kentucky is the only place where blowing smoke in a baby's face is more acceptable than having a beer. It's true. The place is really church-driven (people might not go there but they're still really judgemental), and the Catholics here don't like drinking much either. You can smoke outside of church and nobody will even pay it notice, but if you have a twelver in your fridge, you risk excommunication.

So the double standard does exist, but in reverse here.

__________________
"I'm telling you, we need to get rid of a few people or a million."
-Maddox

Nazggul

No, it's being completely self centered and not giving a crap about the people in the world around you.

__________________
"If something has to give then it always will."

-- Editors

skinnymofo

ok i couldnt read through all 3 pages of this without having to comment on the first couple posts
i am in complete agreement with this statement, something new causes cancer every week and then its harmless again a month later.
These People are morons and have no fucking clue what causes cancer.

As for smoking without being addicted i too have an occasional cig for the buzz, shit why not its a good immediate stress reliever.
i will usually buy a pack have one, (if im not drinking, if im drinking probably 4-5) give out a couple and not touch the pack again for a long time until deciding i need to smoke the rest of the pack to get my moneys worth before they are completely stale.
that usually happens after they sit around for a month.
i have more to add but i lost my train of thought.

edit- i didnt even realize this thread was a year old nevermind on the more to add

analog

So... what you're saying is... the american CANCER society has no idea what causes cancer... and in some fantasy world you've created for yourself, they've rescinded a cancer warning for something they once said was cancerous and then suddenly... what? Changed their minds?

Smoke is smoke. If you inhale, it affects you. The american CANCER SOCIETY has nothing to gain by spending shitloads of money to make a statement like __________ causes cancer. THEY DON'T MAKE MONEY. They aren't rallying for support for anything. They're there to try to better understand and treat CANCER, a disease. They don't need your ham-handed "i call bullshit on them" opinion about being... what? Biased? Not independent in their research? They don't give a shit about anything but curing diseases.

Go tour a children's cancer ward some time and try to give them your bullshit about how cancer is a farce and the american cancer society is fudging studies to make everything appear more cancerous. Or, better yet, the cancer ward for adults. See the old man smoke through his trache ring. That's a real sight to see.

Wow. What a horribly misguided post.

skinnymofo

whoa,
im saying 2nd hand smoke is far overated as a huge cause of cancer
im fully aware and in agreement that inhaling smoke of any sort is not good for the human body

Most of my family has died from cancer when theyve passed.
I am of the belief that doctors dont really know all that much about cancer or how to cure it.

if i get lung cancer later on im not going to blame people who smoke ciggs around me


im saying they have in the past, said somethings cause cancer and then a short time later saying oh wait no it doesnt.

Suave

Completely ignoring the second hand smoke factor, which has already been brought up (and with which I do not believe you are concerned anyway), there is a bit of a double standard between smoking and drinking. Smoking has been so stigmatized that people, most of whom are not (despite the propagandist ads) well informed on it, believe that smokers are addicts. This is not necessarily true, however, it is impossible to know whether or not one is addicted until one attempts to stop using something.

This double standard is not without its own support though. Socially, drinking is a ritualistic part of general social activity. Smoking, on the other hand, is no longer used in this context to nearly the same extent. If everyone accepted smoking socially, or you were part of a group of people that smoked, then it could be considered in the same way as drinking. However, this is not so to my knowledge, or at least is a rarity.

__________________
"Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are even incapable of forming such opinions." - Albert Einstein

"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." - Plato

greytone

I have to admit that I have not read every word of the above posts, but I feel like I need to put a little science into the discussion. I am a physician and I really don't see a double standard because cigarettes and alcohol are absolutely not the equivalent.

People who drink in moderation live longer than abstainers. Small amounts of alcohol can have benificial health effects that we don't fully understand. Maybe people who drink responsibly are just less uptight than those who don't drink at all, or maybe the effect on cholesterol is enough to explain the mortality benefit. Most people can drink responsibly. About 10% are prone to alcoholism. For them, avoiding all alcohol is obviously the best choice. For the rest of us, it is OK. If someone at the next table is drinking quietly and not acting like a mean drunk, then there is no impact on me.

ALL smoking is bad for you. There is no safe amount of tobacco. I realize we all know people who smoked until they were 90, but statistic show that half of all smokers die prematurely. I am sorry if it upsets you, but those odds suck. I can not think of any other voluntary human activity with that kind of mortality risk. Still, if you want to smoke, I don't care. I will take care of you to the best of my ability. Just don't keep whining about how you don't understand why you can't get better and you are always short of breath......all with the cigarettes still in plain view in your shirt pocket. What those of you who don't smoke don't understand is how bad you smell, or how annoying your second hand smoke is to the rest of us. In my opinion, your smoking in public is the cultural equivalent of holding someone down while you fart in their face. The safety data on second hand smoke is controversial, but who cares. It is just plain disgusting and that should be enough for any civilized person.

__________________
I was there to see beautiful naked women. So was everybody else. It's a common failing.
Robert A Heinlein in "They Do It With Mirrors"

MacGuyver

Heres how it goes.

In today's modern, educated society, most smokers know what the fuck they are 'doing' to themselves. They know that it's not good for them, and that there's cancer risks, and all the other statistics that we learned in health class. Most smokers don't give a shit, otherwise they wouldn't still be smoking. It's a casual activity that lots of people enjoy. Deal with it.

On the other hand, if you didn't drink, and you went into a bar, would you start rattling off facts about alcohol poisoning and whatnot? Of course not. People who drink know in excess know that it's probably not the best idea, but they just want to do what they want to do.

Now back to second-hand smoke, I smoke outside. I smoke walking from one place to the next, or by the ashcan. If you don't want to catch my smoke, then don't stand near the ashcan. Basically, it comes down to, if you're going to bitch and moan about second hand smoke, DON'T HANG AROUND SMOKERS OR PLACES WHERE PEOPLE ARE ALLOWED TO SMOKE. If it bothers you that much, then go away. I wouldn't intentionally smoke in a place where I shouldn't. If I am at a freinds house who smokes and we light up, people bitch, but you know what? It's his house, and he and I can smoke if we want to, because it's his own fucking house. If you don't like it, go away.

As far as smelling smoke on people clothes and whatnot, so what? You're not going to get second hand smoke from the scent on someone's clothes. Thats like going to the gas station and bitching about it smelling like gasoline. You're not going to affect your health from a scent.

__________________
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence then, is not an act, but a habit.
---Aristotle

Deeds, not words, shall speak [for] me.
---John Fletcher