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-   -   Saudi Minister calls 244 deaths at Islamic celebration "God's will" (https://thetfp.com/tfp/general-discussion/43876-saudi-minister-calls-244-deaths-islamic-celebration-gods-will.html)

MSD 02-01-2004 02:19 PM

Saudi Minister calls 244 deaths at Islamic celebration "God'
 
http://customwire.ap.org/dynamic/sto...MPLATE=DEFAULT
Quote:

Stampede Kills 244 at Hajj Pilgrimage
By RAWYA RAGEH Associated Press Writer

MINA, Saudi Arabia (AP) -- At least 244 people were trampled to death and hundreds more hurt Sunday under the crush of worshippers in one of the deadliest disasters during the annual Muslim pilgrimage to Saudi Arabia. The stampede occurred during the stoning of the devil, an emotional and notoriously perilous hajj ritual. Pilgrims frantically throw rocks, shout insults or hurl their shoes at three stone pillars - acts that are supposed to demonstrate their deep disdain for Satan. Safety measures were in place at the site - one where fatal stampedes have been frequent - but "caution isn't stronger than fate," said Saudi Hajj Minister Iyad Madani. "All precautions were taken to prevent such an incident, but this is God's will." The stampede broke out on one of two ramps leading to the 50-foot stone pillars. Tens of thousands of people were on the uppermost ramp, which is about the width of a five-lane highway. Authorities said a few pilgrims fell, causing panic as pressure built up in the crowd behind.
Brig. Mansour al-Turki of the Saudi General Security Forces said about 10,000 general security officers were on duty in the area at the time. Their intervention "resulted in containing the pushing toward the pillar to prevent more pilgrims from falling," an unidentified Saudi Interior Ministry official said, the state-run Saudi Press Agency reported. The same area was the scene of similar deadly incidents in 1998, 2001 and last year. Sunday's tragedy marked the worst disaster at the annual hajj since 1997, when 340 pilgrims died in a fire at their tent city in Mina, near the holy city of Mecca. Most of the dead Sunday were pilgrims from inside the Saudi kingdom who may not have been authorized to participate, Madani said. It was unclear how many foreign pilgrims died, but Egypt's Middle East News Agency reported that 13 Egyptians were among the dead. Madani also said 272 pilgrims had died of natural causes during the hajj. Many participants are elderly, and Muslims believe that if a person dies while performing the pilgrimage they will go directly to heaven. About 2 million Muslims are participating in this year's pilgrimage. To control the crowd, Saudi authorities set quotas for pilgrims from each country, and also require its citizens and residents to register upon arrival. Many resident foreigners, especially those from the Indian subcontinent, cannot afford to pay the cost of an authorized pilgrimage, around $530, and perform the pilgrimage independently, despite recent laws requiring citizens and residents to join registered pilgrimage campaigns. The chaos came after a sleepless night of prayer at the climax of the hajj, when pilgrims from around the world listened to Saudi Arabia's top cleric at the Namira Mosque. On Sunday morning, they prayed at dawn then gathered pebbles to throw at the pillars. Each participant throws seven times, chanting "bismillah" ("in the name of God") and "Allahu Akbar" ("God is Great"). Calling America "the greatest Satan," Egyptian pilgrim Youssef Omar threw pebbles at one pillar on which someone had scrawled "USA." After the 1998 hajj, when about 180 pilgrims were trampled to death, religious authorities issued an edict extending the amount of time in which pilgrims could complete the ritual, hoping to spread out the crowd. A giant ramp leading to the pillars fills with pilgrims waiting to throw their pebbles, and Saudi authorities instruct pilgrims in several languages when and where to pass. Still, 14 pilgrims were trampled to death during the same ritual last year and 35 died in a 2001 stampede. The stoning ritual also marked the first day of Eid al-Adha, or the Feast of the Sacrifice, celebrated at the hajj and around the Muslim world with the slaughtering of a camel, cow or sheep. Meat is eaten and distributed to the poor. Copyright 2004 Associated Press. All rights reserved.

Spartak 02-01-2004 08:13 PM

Others will say it was "fate"... whatever floats the Minister's boat really.

yournamehere 02-01-2004 09:13 PM

And obviously, God wills it to be an annual event.

GakFace 02-01-2004 09:22 PM

hehe.. I like your poast YNH. :)... Yeah if people are dying EVERY Year from this thing.. shouldn't that speak words?

smiling_bob 02-01-2004 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by GakFace

if people are dying EVERY Year from this thing.. shouldn't that speak words?
Sounds more like Darwin's will.

moot1337 02-01-2004 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by smiling_bob
Sounds more like Darwin's will.
just what I was gonna say.... :)

Slims 02-02-2004 12:26 AM

Dumbass,

By that reasoning, so was the Iraq War.

Spartak 02-02-2004 02:29 AM

No, that was because of fraudulent intelligence.

/me ducks for cover

aarchaon 02-02-2004 03:54 AM

Quite obviously God dislikes it when his followers show their disdain for Satan. Take that christian beliefs!

onetime2 02-02-2004 04:48 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Greg700
Dumbass,

By that reasoning, so was the Iraq War.

Yep, exactly. Of course, that will never be said.

skysooner 02-02-2004 08:05 AM

It was the line that said that fatal tramplings are frequent that told me all I needed to know about this.

Jonah Hex 02-02-2004 03:14 PM

sounds more like "gods lack of will".

or perhaps hes doing them a favour and getting them to heaven quicker because they deserve to get there before others.

God be praised

World's King 02-02-2004 03:37 PM

It might have been "God's Will" but who's God is still up in the air.

absence_of_color 02-02-2004 03:39 PM

That is extremely sad. :(

I dont have a response for the religion aspect.

ChrisJericho 02-02-2004 04:32 PM

LOL I find it entertaining when gods kill their followers.

milkyp 02-02-2004 05:56 PM

praise allah.

moonstrucksoul 02-02-2004 06:05 PM

ummmm, survival of the fittest?

tinfoil 02-02-2004 07:08 PM

Why do I think that the cleric is trying to save face? God's will, I don't think so.

/me kicks into son of preachers mode:

God's will was to flood the earth. He did so to teach a lesson to the few remaining survivors, and it wasn't about the joys of sushi. I can think of no lesson here, other than perhaps a lesson to teach organizers to plan more carefully next time.

/me sets mode -son-of-preachers

Is it God's will to make these people stupid / blind? I mean, seriously, a little bit of care would have saved the dead.

wry1 02-02-2004 07:31 PM

Hey, if "God's Will" doesn't work as a defense when I'm fighting a speeding ticket, what makes this dumbass think it'll work now???


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