Ustwo

Oil is finite unless we enter another carboniferioius era and have a few million years to wait. So we will run out. The fall of eastern block and degradation of Chinese communism has spurred on prices and hastened the date we 'run out' (damn you global prosperity, damn you to hell!) but it was still going to happen.

So other than spend the billions spent on alternative energy source development, what more do you want to do?

I know doom and gloom is the general feeling for this sort of thing, and there will be some gloom, but I think its quite exciting because as prices rise so does the incentive to make a viable alternatives.

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Willravel

Reduce use. If you live 2 minutes from the drug store and you need to get some soap, walk. Work a few miles from home? Bike. Live near public transportation like a light-rail? Use it.

Improve efficiency. Absolutely no one needs a Hummer H2. There's no excuse for driving it. Hybrids and high mpg vehicles are trendy. Get a Civic Hybrid instead of getting a Dodge Durango.

Support those who are involved in change. Solar panels will soon be able to pay for themselves in a few years. Most diesel cars can run on biodiesel. And don't forget protesting.

Ustwo

Rather than figuring out how to limit ourselves, I like to expand the possibilities. For example as a start.

The 2008 Tahoe Hybrid, available in two- or four-wheel drive, provides the power and capability you expect from a utility vehicle while offering fuel efficiency you never imagined — an outstanding EPA estimated MPG of 21 city, 22 highway for 2WD models, and 20 city, 20 highway for 4x4. In fact, 2008 Tahoe Hybrid 2WD offers the same EPA estimated city fuel efficiency as a four-cylinder Toyota Camry

A hybrid tahoe. I prefer ways that maintain or increase comfort levels. I don't think a hybrid tahoe is a solution, it still uses oil, but its the kinda direction I'd like to see.

I'll get right on that.

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dc_dux

Conversion to more hybrid vehicles.....one of the reasonable recommendations of the most recent IPCC report (that you repeatedly mock) that will lessen CO2 emissions and supports both environmental and economic sustainability.

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Baraka_Guru

Do you have more examples? Do you realize that switching to a hybrid will only affect a small proportion of the oil the average North American consumes? I would like to hear more about the initiatives you would support.

* * * * *

This in the news; though, if you haven't heard about it yet, it's because the American media practically ignored it:

Saudi King says keeping some oil finds for future (Reuters)

The kingdom has entered preservation/conservation mode with this decision. With peak oil becoming more evident, are we going to have the time to find solutions on our own terms, or will we fall into a life-changing crisis?

Are we doing enough? Do you even know where the oil is going? (It isn't just your fuel tank.) I think we'll need to make far more significant decisions above and beyond the "hybrid or no hybrid?" question. Peak oil will increase the cost of living for all of us. The use of oil affects virtually all aspects of our daily living. Are we coming up with solutions or are we dropping the ball here?

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highthief

Interestingly, as we are using more and more bio-fuel, there is concern that the use of such organic material is now contributing to the explosion in world food prices. The average westerner might not notice if a bit of corn costs a bit more, but in the poorer countries we are seeing riots as people living on less than a dollar a day are suddenly being asked to pay 50% more for staple food items.

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Baraka_Guru

Also, do you know how much oil goes into the growing, refining, and transportation of corn crops?

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Knowing that death is certain and that the time of death is uncertain, what's the most important thing?
—Bhikkhuni Pema Chödrön

Humankind cannot bear very much reality.
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pai mei

Oil hits record above $132 on weak supply
http://money.cnn.com/2008/05/21/mark..._eia/index.htm

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...Co&refer=india
Arabian oil is no longer in demand. Seems they have run out of "light crude" oil. Or they are pumping less and less of it. Same thing about Iran, they have full reservoirs, even put their oil in tanker ships that wait in the harbor. Nobody wants "heavy crude", not all the refineries can handle it.
And new refineries have not been built for decades.
That is why the prices are going up with 1 or 2 $ a day, and it will accelerate.

I look at the old posts here and I think those were good times, we had time to speak about economics, alternatives and other stuff Not anymore, now I think every new post will include a new and "improved" price of oil

Two forums for anybody interested in this oil stuff :
http://www.peakoil.com/forums.html
http://www.doomers.us/forum2/

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Manuel Hong

Just a fun fact for those of you buying the scam about hybrids:
We have a 15 year old car that gets 45 miles to a gallon. A Honda Civic.
I recall back in the 70's and 80's that some cars would get 54 on the highway. Now tell me, is 45 mpg in a Prius really GREEN?!
No. It's not. It's a bunch of bullshit.
The technology DOES exist for regular cars to get much better gas mileage than what they are selling us today.
Price of fuel is up in England to about $11 per gallon according to the NPR report I heard today. Of course, they aren't all driving around in SUV's either...

for my next rant, ethanol! More fucking bullshit!

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monokrome

This ignores the fact that many of the other countries are mostly not even close to their peak, even though a select few of them produce plenty anyway.

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pai mei

Runaway oil prices pass $135
http://edition.cnn.com/2008/BUSINESS....ap/index.html

monokrome can you give me a list with those many other countries that still "produce plenty" ? List of countries and their peak year :


Russia :
http://www.turkishpress.com/news.asp?id=225762
Oil comes in many varieties, same like coal. The "light crude" oil is what people want, that is why prices go up. Did you read the article from above ? Yes Arabia has plenty of oil but it's "Heavy crude" and not needed. Most refineries cannot handle it, so in the best case I predict gas rationing until refineries are upgraded

Price history : 20$ in 2000, 80$ at the end of 2007, 135$ today.
There also is the "Export Land Model". Countries that today export will be keeping their production for themselves:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Export_Land_Model

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pai mei

Report urges fuel revolution - CNN.com
This report by the IEA is the recognition the we passed peak oil. Suddenly with no sign of peak we are moving down hill

IEA Report
What does 6.7% decline means :
100
93.3
87.05
81.22
75.78
70.7
65.96
61.54
57.42
53.57

So in 10 years production will be down 50%. Oil does not sit like a huge reservoir under ground so we can keep producing 80 million barrels a day until we run out. Oil just gets harder and harder to extract so we are maybe hundreds of year away from really ending producing. But we will be producing 10% of what we are today.

Add Export Land Model to the problem :
Export Land Model - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
So there will be no "we" producing. There will be some producing, and they will only be able to keep it for themselves if they have enough weapons See Iraq. Think USA will let them sell oil to anyone else ?
I am sure that we can live very well consuming less oil. We will not, the ones in power will do everythnig to maintain that power, no matter if the system collapses :

http://www.chrismartenson.com/crashc...r-17a-peak-oil

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ASU2003

Al Jazeera English - Business - China agrees $3bn Iraq oil deal

Actually China is going to be taking some of the oil from Iraq. And the American oil companies are going to get their share too.

Texas Co. Signs Iraq Oil Deal With Kurds , With No National Iraq Oil Law Passed, Kurdistan Region Makes Its Own Rules - CBS News

Pentagon Hands Iraq Oil Deal to Shell | War on Iraq | AlterNet

I think one of the unmentioned goals of the Iraq war was to denationalize Iraqi oil. And to keep them selling the oil in dollars instead of in euros.