Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community - View Single Post - Can God make a rock big enough so that he cannot move it?

Mantus · 02-24-2004, 08:23 PM

Let me try this again, maybe it will be easier to understand.

Either it is possible that a being which can lift any rock exists or a rock that cannot be lifted to exists. Either one or the other, both cannot exist in the same universe.

Concept 1.

- Objects that cannot be lifted are possible.
- A being that can lift any object is impossible.
- God is omnipotent and can do anything logically possible.
- God can create anything logically possible.
- It is logically impossible for God to lift a rock that cannot be lifted.
- It is logically possible for God to create a rock that cannot be lifted.
- Therefore it is logically possible for god to create a rock that he cannot lift and remain omnipotent.

Concept 2.

- A being that can lift any object is possible.
- Objects that cannot be lifted are impossible.
- God is omnipotent and can do anything logically possible.
- God can create anything logically possible.
- It is logically possible for God to lift any rock.
- It is logically impossible for God to create a rock that cannot be lifted.
- Therefore it is logically impossible for God to create a rock that he cannot lift.

As you see the outcome of the answer depends on whether the universe contains beings that can lift any object or objects that no being can lift.

Asaris,

I don’t believe there is any difference between what you call “naturally possible” and logically possible. Anything that is actually possible is also logically possible. If you cannot do something naturally (actually) you cannot do it then logically as well.

For example, I cannot fly at this moment. It would be impossible to conceive of an argument, which proves that I can indeed fly at this moment without running into a fallacy. That is unless there is some knowledge we are not aware off which would indeed make me able to fly at this moment. In such a case the act becomes both naturally and logically possible.

Further, the only way that an invalid question can occur is if its results somehow became unwanted. For example, you took a survey and the wording in one question lead you to answer in a certain way. If the people doing the survey were looking for impartial answers then they would render you answer and the question invalid.

02-24-2004, 08:23 PM	#57 (permalink)
Mantus lascivious	Let me try this again, maybe it will be easier to understand. Either it is possible that a being which can lift any rock exists or a rock that cannot be lifted to exists. Either one or the other, both cannot exist in the same universe. Concept 1. - Objects that cannot be lifted are possible. - A being that can lift any object is impossible. - God is omnipotent and can do anything logically possible. - God can create anything logically possible. - It is logically impossible for God to lift a rock that cannot be lifted. - It is logically possible for God to create a rock that cannot be lifted. - Therefore it is logically possible for god to create a rock that he cannot lift and remain omnipotent. Concept 2. - A being that can lift any object is possible. - Objects that cannot be lifted are impossible. - God is omnipotent and can do anything logically possible. - God can create anything logically possible. - It is logically possible for God to lift any rock. - It is logically impossible for God to create a rock that cannot be lifted. - Therefore it is logically impossible for God to create a rock that he cannot lift. As you see the outcome of the answer depends on whether the universe contains beings that can lift any object or objects that no being can lift. Asaris, I don’t believe there is any difference between what you call “naturally possible” and logically possible. Anything that is actually possible is also logically possible. If you cannot do something naturally (actually) you cannot do it then logically as well. For example, I cannot fly at this moment. It would be impossible to conceive of an argument, which proves that I can indeed fly at this moment without running into a fallacy. That is unless there is some knowledge we are not aware off which would indeed make me able to fly at this moment. In such a case the act becomes both naturally and logically possible. Further, the only way that an invalid question can occur is if its results somehow became unwanted. For example, you took a survey and the wording in one question lead you to answer in a certain way. If the people doing the survey were looking for impartial answers then they would render you answer and the question invalid.