[040804-21:55:03] <Mephex> Sucks tho, as I'm such a freak, hard to find someone who can satisfy that.
[040804-21:55:16] <denim> what kinda freak are you?
[040804-21:55:25] <denim> Like feet?
[040804-21:55:32] <Mephex> no.
[040804-21:55:34] <denim> Rubber/leather?
[040804-21:55:36] <denim> B&D?
[040804-21:55:39] <ngdawg> just porn in general?
[040804-21:55:51] <denim> Big (o)(o)?
[040804-21:55:56] <Mephex> I lean more towards general.
[040804-21:56:00] <cardfrek>
http://abc.go.com/specials/nick_jessica.html oh man
[040804-21:56:22] <Mephex> B&D is fun, rubber/leather, all good, toys, shocking etc
[040804-21:56:24] * sadistikd (sadisticwe@SF-A93BCB.client.comcast.net) has joined #tfp
[040804-21:56:27] * sadistikd is now known as sadistik
[040804-21:56:37] <ngdawg> ok.....american television is really looking desperate
[040804-21:56:38] <denim> fantasy rape?
[040804-21:56:43] <sadistik> huh?
[040804-21:56:52] <Mephex> If she was raping me, that'd be a blast.
[040804-21:56:55] <ngdawg> hi, sadistik
[040804-21:56:56] <Mephex> But not the other way around.
[040804-21:56:57] <denim> We're listing perversions that Mephex might have.
[040804-21:57:09] <denim> Make sure you get the right address. <grin>
[040804-21:57:10] <ngdawg> group sex?
[040804-21:57:17] <denim> swinging
[040804-21:57:24] <Mephex> Never tried it, but it's on the list
[040804-21:57:24] <denim> threesomes
[040804-21:57:28] <sadistik> ooooooooooooooooooo
[040804-21:57:45] <ngdawg> group is on the list?
[040804-21:57:51] <Mephex> Group, threesome, swinging
[040804-21:57:53] <sadistik> paddle spank, than anal penetration?
[040804-21:57:53] <Mephex> You name it.
[040804-21:58:06] <denim> oral?
[040804-21:58:07] <ngdawg> make sure you're not drunk or stoned......
[040804-21:58:15] <denim> aural?
[040804-21:58:17] <Mephex> lol
[040804-21:58:21] <sadistik> hehe
[040804-21:58:21] <ngdawg> sucks that way
[040804-21:58:32] <denim> Have to have a little dick to fuck her ears.
[040804-21:58:53] <ngdawg> jeez.just saw sadistik's.......
)~
[040804-21:58:53] <sadistik> mhm. i dont ear-fuck.
[040804-21:59:05] <ngdawg> who ear fucks????
[040804-21:59:05] <Mephex> That's never crossed my mind either.
[040804-21:59:11] <Mephex> Maybe I'm not creative enough.
[040804-21:59:11] <denim> read one a long time ago where she would take out her glass eye and stick his dick in there.
[040804-21:59:16] <Mephex> !!!!
[040804-21:59:18] <ngdawg> she could get two guys to do it and fuck her brains out....
[040804-21:59:19] <Mephex> damn
[040804-21:59:31] <denim> Another one where she had her teeth pulled so she could give better blow jobs.
[040804-21:59:38] <denim> How true? Who knows.
[040804-21:59:42] <ngdawg> teeth work WITH bj's...
[040804-22:00:07] <denim> dawg, that's something I'd have to experience.
[040804-22:00:13] <denim> :-D
[040804-22:00:20] <denim> More research is needed!
[040804-22:00:23] <ngdawg> saw a vid of a very fat woman having her navel fucked....
[040804-22:00:32] <denim> Others are into amputees.
[040804-22:00:33] <ngdawg> what, teeth?
[040804-22:00:37] <Mephex> well, they do say to find a roll
[040804-22:00:40] <denim> yeah, teeth.
[040804-22:00:45] <ngdawg> lol-i heard that too
[040804-22:00:47] <denim> some are into chocolate
[040804-22:00:59] <ngdawg> you never had teeth used???
[040804-22:01:07] <Mephex> elaborate on that
[040804-22:01:08] <denim> Not sure, it's been too long.
[040804-22:01:10] <denim> :-(
[040804-22:01:14] <sadistik> hmmmmm
[040804-22:01:24] <sadistik> i gots gold teef, bitch
[040804-22:01:30] <ngdawg> lightly dragging the teeth up and down....
[040804-22:01:35] <denim> I used to know a woman who was into peanut butter.
[040804-22:01:41] <ngdawg> what, are you, like 16 or something? LOL
[040804-22:01:41] <Mephex> whoo, nice
[040804-22:01:54] <sadistik> who
[040804-22:02:03] <denim> You want perversions, you be in the right place. <grin>
[040804-22:02:13] <ngdawg> ever hear the story of the woman and her dog with peanut butter??
[040804-22:02:16] <denim> animals
[040804-22:02:25] <Mephex> that just sounds nasty ng
[040804-22:02:27] <ngdawg> no animals.....
[040804-22:02:34] <sadistik> eeewww
[040804-22:02:37] <sadistik> no scat either
[040804-22:02:48] <denim> there are some nasty ones out there, yeah.
[040804-22:02:52] <denim> "Scat", yeah, that was the next word I was looking for.
[040804-22:02:56] <denim> snuff
[040804-22:03:15] <sadistik> damned snuff
[040804-22:03:21] <denim> whatsherface..... tub...
[040804-22:03:30] <ngdawg> it's funny-don't know it's true or not, but seems she smeared pb on her twat to get the dog to lick her....turned on the light in the room and a few dozen people yelled SURPRISE as she was standing there neked with pb calling her dog over....
[040804-22:03:31] <denim> can't say it here.
[040804-22:03:48] <denim> oh no.
[040804-22:03:55] <denim> That's AWful!
[040804-22:04:07] <cardfrek> hah
[040804-22:04:08] <sadistik> human soapy soaking pit woman?
[040804-22:04:08] <denim> If it'd been me on the light switch, I'd've just turned it off again.
[040804-22:04:09] <Mephex> ohh, now that would be funny
[040804-22:04:09] <ngdawg> funny as hell if it's true
[040804-22:04:25] <denim> How 'bout the batman one?
[040804-22:04:35] <ngdawg> what's that?
[040804-22:04:47] <sadistik> BATMAN?!
[040804-22:04:50] <denim> he ties her up, then dresses as BatMan, gets knocked unconcuious.
[040804-22:05:04] <denim> Now she's tied up, can't do ANYTHING about it.
[040804-22:05:11] <denim> and he's on the floor.
[040804-22:05:20] <denim> When the firemen got there... well...
[040804-22:05:21] <ngdawg> who knocked him out???
[040804-22:05:38] <denim> knocked his head on something when he jumped off a piece of furnature.
[040804-22:05:44] <ngdawg> RFLOL
[040804-22:05:56] <denim> common sense is RARE
[040804-22:05:59] <ngdawg> "i'm batman"........THUNK
[040804-22:06:23] <denim> "I'm batman, I'll save you!" thunk
[040804-22:06:36] <Mephex> "Holy cocknballs batman!" THUNK
[040804-22:06:36] * ngdawg has the giggles now
[040804-22:06:41] <ngdawg> rflol
[040804-22:06:45] <denim> someone heard her calling for help, you see.
[040804-22:06:52] <ngdawg> ahhhh
[040804-22:07:11] <denim> Wouldn't want to be him when he wakes up.
[040804-22:07:17] <denim> Anyway, others?
[040804-22:07:34] <sadistik> goatse.
[040804-22:07:41] <denim> can't say that one either.
[040804-22:07:42] <sadistik> EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW
[040804-22:07:45] <sadistik> why?
[040804-22:07:47] <ngdawg> what is that nayway?
[040804-22:07:49] <denim> Goes with Tub.
[040804-22:07:59] <sadistik> But why cant you say those?
[040804-22:08:05] <ngdawg> anyway too
[040804-22:08:08] <denim> They're just banned. Ask Halx.
[040804-22:08:09] * Paq_ (Paq@SF-21FED067.comporium.net) has joined #tfp
[040804-22:08:14] <ngdawg> hi, paq!
[040804-22:08:21] <denim> EEEEEWWWWW is the word, fer shur.
[040804-22:08:24] <sadistik> ooh. like tavoo
[040804-22:08:28] <denim> And there's a third one I will not name.
[040804-22:08:47] <ngdawg> i can't say stuff that's banned but i don't know what it is, so how will i know if i get banned or not?
[040804-22:08:55] <denim> They'll let you know.
[040804-22:09:04] <sadistik> banned from TFP
[040804-22:09:06] <ngdawg> yea and off i go into chat sunset....
[040804-22:09:08] <Paq_> ???
[040804-22:09:08] <sadistik> ?
[040804-22:09:13] <Paq_> what are y'all talking about
[040804-22:09:16] <denim> Paq knows.
[040804-22:09:17] <ngdawg> talking bad words, paq
[040804-22:09:28] <denim> First we were listing perversions one of us might have.
[040804-22:09:37] <denim> Now we've bumped into the tubg and the goat.
[040804-22:09:37] <Paq_> eek
[040804-22:09:39] <Paq_> haha
[040804-22:09:43] <Paq_> WWWHHHAATT??
[040804-22:09:52] <denim> can't say 'em.
[040804-22:09:53] <ngdawg> ok.......PM me with'em... i HATE Not knowing shit
[040804-22:10:00] <sadistik> whats the third?
[040804-22:10:05] <sadistik> pm me too
[040804-22:11:04] * Paq_ is now known as Paq
[040804-22:11:37] <Paq> so wait
[040804-22:11:41] <Paq> words are banned in chat?
[040804-22:12:06] <denim> nonono. you KNOW that tubgirl is banned.
[040804-22:12:09] <sadistik> dont think so, just taboo
[040804-22:12:19] <denim> okay, taboo then.
[040804-22:12:36] <Paq> who is tubgirl
[040804-22:12:37] <ngdawg> well, don't blame that decision then
[040804-22:12:49] <ngdawg> you don't wanna know LOL
[040804-22:13:09] <Paq> why
[040804-22:13:17] <sadistik> she's a poor lady who had horrible things done to her.
[040804-22:13:18] <denim> just trust us.
[040804-22:13:22] <ngdawg> it's gross
[040804-22:13:42] <denim> Some things are best not known.
[040804-22:13:45] <Paq> aww
[040804-22:13:49] <Paq> poor girl
[040804-22:13:56] <denim> This is why they're taboo. Mention them, then someone gets curious and looks.
[040804-22:14:06] <denim> and regrets it.
[040804-22:14:59] <sadistik> they're in a thread somewhere, "most disturbing things"... look if you want, but i really really suggest against it. ALright, back to perversions... Can anyone guess mine?
[040804-22:15:12] <ngdawg> that's ok, denim
[040804-22:15:39] <ngdawg> well, i know it ain't that stuff....
[040804-22:15:44] <sadistik> hah
[040804-22:15:52] <denim> uh, anal?
[040804-22:16:00] <Mephex> that's not a perversion
[040804-22:16:01] * denim is clueless
[040804-22:16:05] <denim> To some it is.
[040804-22:16:07] <Mephex> that's a good time!
[040804-22:16:12] <ngdawg> am i the only Y chromosome speaking?
[040804-22:16:14] <sadistik> naaaaawwww
[040804-22:16:18] <sadistik> Y?
[040804-22:16:24] <denim> no, we're all Y. You're X.
[040804-22:16:27] <ngdawg> oops XX LOL
[040804-22:16:29] <Mephex> hehe
[040804-22:16:33] <ngdawg> daaaaaaaaaah
[040804-22:16:42] <ngdawg> damn fingers....
[040804-22:16:44] <Mephex> duuuuuuh ?
[040804-22:16:48] <sadistik> im a dude
[040804-22:16:51] <ngdawg> that too
[040804-22:16:51] <denim> There are other X people on, but they're being very quiet.
[040804-22:16:54] <sadistik> i have a wang
[040804-22:17:00] <Mephex> chung
[040804-22:17:07] <ngdawg> surprising......
[040804-22:17:19] <denim> Probably not really at their computers, just left them signed in.
[040804-22:17:21] <Mephex> i'd going to say, you like screwing watermelon
[040804-22:17:32] <denim> ooo, missed that one!
[040804-22:17:37] <denim> sex with fruit
[040804-22:17:44] <Mephex> what is this, family feud ?
[040804-22:17:48] <denim> or "food", in general.
[040804-22:17:50] <sadistik> oh yeah.
[040804-22:18:11] <denim> okay, I *did* mention chocolate and peanut butter.
[040804-22:18:19] <denim> Those are special.
[040804-22:18:25] <ngdawg> and not perverted
[040804-22:18:26] <sadistik> no peanut butter or chocolate.
[040804-22:18:27] <Mephex> okay sadistik, what is it ?
[040804-22:18:35] <denim> Again, to some they are.
[040804-22:18:41] <denim> There are some very narrow people out there.
[040804-22:18:50] <denim> Oh, didn't mention "gay".
[040804-22:18:56] <sadistik> aaaaaaahhhhhhhhhh
[040804-22:19:00] <Mephex> you like shaving your legs, wearing nylons, and getting tied up
[040804-22:19:06] <sadistik> GOTH!!!!!!!!
[040804-22:19:09] <denim> crossdressing, didn't mention that either.
[040804-22:19:14] <Mephex> Goth is a perversion ?
[040804-22:19:22] <sadistik> i like goth girls,
[040804-22:19:25] <denim> Goth strikes me as "silly", not really perverse.
[040804-22:19:26] <Mephex> To be Goth, is to be perverted ?
[040804-22:19:35] <ngdawg> to some, anything other than missionary is perverted...
[040804-22:19:37] <denim> Kinda like body piercing.
[040804-22:19:40] <Mephex> Interesting.
[040804-22:19:47] <Mephex> I'm a fucking pervert.
[040804-22:19:49] <Mephex> Nummy.
[040804-22:19:50] <sadistik> eeeeeehhhhh/
[040804-22:19:53] <sadistik> piercing
[040804-22:20:04] <denim> Now, if you want to be perverse, do an abdomen pierce, with something like rebar.
[040804-22:20:10] <ngdawg> LOL
[040804-22:20:11] <Mephex> omg
[040804-22:20:12] <sadistik> hehe
[040804-22:20:17] <denim> front to back, or side to side.
[040804-22:20:23] <denim> THAT would be perverse.
[040804-22:20:30] <ngdawg> it'd hurt....
[040804-22:20:35] <Mephex> You mean, not to pierce, but to get impaled ?
[040804-22:20:36] <denim> not for long
[040804-22:20:45] <sadistik> vampiric shit...
[040804-22:20:49] <ngdawg> well, nothing hurts after death....
[040804-22:20:50] <denim> Okay, so you want to call it impalement. Whatever. <grin>
[040804-22:20:52] * sadistik sucks somebodys blood
[040804-22:20:59] <ngdawg> is that it?
[040804-22:21:03] <Mephex> Freak
[040804-22:21:11] <denim> LOL
[040804-22:21:12] <ngdawg> lol
[040804-22:21:14] <ngdawg> perv
[040804-22:21:14] <sadistik> aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
[040804-22:21:15] <Mephex> lol
[040804-22:21:22] <sadistik> i gotta goooooOoOOo
[040804-22:21:36] <ngdawg> but is that the one?
[040804-22:21:48] <denim> need to do a photochoppin' with this idea.
[040804-22:21:50] <Mephex> Wow
[040804-22:21:54] <denim> rebar piercing.
[040804-22:21:56] <Mephex> per?vert ( P ) Pronunciation Key (pr-v?
[040804-22:21:56] <Mephex> tr.v. per?vert?ed, per?vert?ing, per?verts
[040804-22:21:56] <Mephex> To cause to turn away from what is right, proper, or good; corrupt.
[040804-22:21:59] <ngdawg> lol
[040804-22:22:08] <Mephex> That's harsh.
[040804-22:22:16] <Mephex> It's like saying to be perverted is to be teh debil.
[040804-22:22:23] <sadistik> YOUR FRIED
[040804-22:22:24] <denim> what's your point?
[040804-22:22:28] * sadistik (sadisticwe@SF-A93BCB.client.comcast.net) Quit (Quit: )
[040804-22:22:58] <ngdawg> so perverted is subjective....just as good is
[040804-22:22:59] <denim> you want perverse? Find out what the prim and proper lady does in private.
[040804-22:23:10] <ngdawg> but it's good sometimes to be perverted....
[040804-22:23:20] <Mephex> Deviating from what is considered right and correct
[040804-22:23:21] <denim> not gonna argue with that one. Can't.
[040804-22:23:31] <Mephex> that I can handle, but to cause to turn away from what is right ?
[040804-22:23:32] <Mephex> Please.
[040804-22:23:42] <denim> That's what they mean by it.
[040804-22:23:53] <denim> "Moral Majority".... crap.
[040804-22:23:53] <ngdawg> well, it's an archaic example
[040804-22:24:10] * Paq is now known as Paq_
[040804-22:24:11] <denim> and they call "anal" sodomize
[040804-22:24:22] * Paq_ is now known as Paq
[040804-22:24:26] <denim> and it is or at least *was* illegal in Georgia.
[040804-22:24:28] <Mephex> I sure do have a lot to learn.
[040804-22:24:32] <ngdawg> anthing other than penis to vagina is sodomy...
[040804-22:24:39] <denim> fine.
[040804-22:24:52] <ngdawg> paq??
[040804-22:25:05] <Mephex> Wasn't it in the midevil japanese culture that the men would have sex with other men for fun, and women to procreate ?
[040804-22:25:25] <ngdawg> never heard that one
[040804-22:25:26] <Mephex> So why would another nation decide that such activity is illegal ?
[040804-22:25:38] <denim> Or was that the Greeks?
[040804-22:25:45] <ngdawg> cuz it's another nation
[040804-22:25:47] <denim> I'm sure it was the Greeks, but maybe the Japanese too?
[040804-22:25:48] <Mephex> Who knows, it was probably a lot of cultures.
[040804-22:25:50] <ngdawg> lol, denim
[040804-22:26:19] <denim> What? I'm serious.
[040804-22:26:32] <ngdawg> about the greeks?
[040804-22:26:33] <denim> It's not a stereotype.
[040804-22:26:36] <denim> yeah.
[040804-22:26:45] <denim> Not sure how true it is these days.
[040804-22:27:11] <ngdawg> dont know any greeks, per se, but i did think it was just an old stereotype
[040804-22:27:17] <Mephex> What was that one movie, that was done by penthouse. Oh, those were romans.
[040804-22:27:23] <denim> Old, yes. True? Not sure.
[040804-22:27:28] <ngdawg> galigula
[040804-22:27:36] <Mephex> yeahh, what a strange film
[040804-22:27:40] <denim> Romans, yes, who got a LOT from the Greeks.
[040804-22:27:41] <ngdawg> really....
[040804-22:27:43] <denim> Caligula.
[040804-22:27:47] <denim> Roman emperor.
[040804-22:27:49] <Mephex> woah
[040804-22:27:50] <Mephex>
http://www.sodomylaws.org/sensibilit...troduction.htm
[040804-22:28:00] <ngdawg> rflol-ok, i spelled it like saying it drunk
[040804-22:28:11] <denim> Nasty fucking character. Glad he's not with us anymore.
[040804-22:28:18] <denim> I forget who killed him.
[040804-22:28:38] <denim> His guard?
[040804-22:28:40] <Halx>
http://home.no.net/shorts6/southparkjoke.wmv holy shit
[040804-22:30:01] <denim>
http://www.roman-empire.net/emperors/caligula.html
[040804-22:32:11] <denim> holy shit, Halx.
[040804-22:32:17] <ngdawg> lol
[040804-22:32:28] <denim> Is that part of the new ep??
[040804-22:32:36] <denim> I haven't watched it yet.
[040804-22:32:48] <ngdawg> that was harsh-even for southpark
[040804-22:32:53] <denim> yeah.
[040804-22:33:12] <denim> Okay, that had a few perversions we didn't list.
[040804-22:33:18] <denim> kids,
[040804-22:33:19] <ngdawg> rflol!!!
[040804-22:33:31] <Mephex> grosssssssss
[040804-22:33:46] <denim> incest
[040804-22:34:03] <ngdawg> it ahd everything but the family dog....
[040804-22:34:03] <denim> :-D
[040804-22:34:10] <denim> We mentioned animals.
[040804-22:34:27] <denim> Only Cartman would come up with that kinda thing.
[040804-22:34:39] <denim> stuffing the baby back where it came from? Nasty.
[040804-22:34:49] <Mephex> It woulda been funnier if the circus music was playing
[040804-22:34:56] <denim> yup.
[040804-22:35:04] <denim> might have been too hard to hear Cartman, though.
[040804-22:35:30] <denim> Halx, got any more for the list?
[040804-22:35:42] <ngdawg> i know he talks fast, but maybe that was even faster so some wouldn't get it all?
[040804-22:36:02] <ngdawg> any more? what's left?
[040804-22:36:19] <denim> dunno, but I thought we'd been pretty exaustive before Halx mentioned that one.
[040804-22:36:25] <denim> So there's certainly more.
[040804-22:36:31] <ngdawg> LOL
[040804-22:36:42] <denim> "exhaustive"
[040804-22:37:01] <denim> maybe different positions?
[040804-22:37:08] * MSD (none@SF-30F28024.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #tfp
[040804-22:37:16] <ngdawg> standing on one's head....
[040804-22:37:36] <denim> well, it's not "missionary", so maybe they'd consider that "perverse".
[040804-22:37:44] <ngdawg> i'm sure...
[040804-22:37:53] <BoCo> hello
[040804-22:37:54] <peetster> Hi BoCo
[040804-22:38:04] <BoCo> that was quick, peet
[040804-22:38:08] <denim> Anyone else got something for the list?
[040804-22:38:21] <BoCo> what list?
[040804-22:38:27] <ngdawg> personal perversions list
[040804-22:38:31] <MSD> uh ...
[040804-22:38:35] <BoCo> haha
[040804-22:38:40] <denim> we were making a list of possible perversions that Mephex might subscribe to.
[040804-22:38:43] <MSD> wtf?
[040804-22:38:44] <ngdawg> i can't think of one i would have....
[040804-22:38:47] <ngdawg> i'm dull
[040804-22:38:49] <denim> Probably should just start a thread about it.
[040804-22:38:57] <BoCo> sexual perversions?
[040804-22:38:57] <ngdawg> good idea-you start it
[040804-22:39:02] <ngdawg> yea
[040804-22:39:08] <Mephex> Oop, beer, brb
[040804-22:39:18] <ngdawg> lol- CHICKEN
[040804-22:39:44] <Halx> that southpark clip was cut from an episode of SP
[040804-22:39:51] <Halx> i have no idea why
[040804-22:39:52] * BoCo is completely normal; no perversions here. No sir-e-bob.
[040804-22:39:56] <ngdawg> i cn see why....
[040804-22:40:10] <ngdawg> screwing the baby....
[040804-22:40:36] <Halx> no.. it's 'cause cartman was disrespecting the jew
[040804-22:40:37] <Halx> that's why
[040804-22:40:47] <ngdawg> huh???
[040804-22:41:03] <BoCo> i think most of my perversions would be considered completely normal by most guys
[040804-22:41:15] <ngdawg> like what, boco?
[040804-22:41:35] <BoCo> giving a gooey facial
[040804-22:41:59] * MSD doesn't see how that can be appealing
[040804-22:42:17] <BoCo> my last g/f did
[040804-22:42:23] <BoCo>
[040804-22:42:37] <ngdawg> i'm not fond of it....but it's ok in the scheme of things...
[040804-22:43:29] <ngdawg> but what's the attraction to that?
[040804-22:43:40] <BoCo> i modified my error 404 page for my site. wanna see it?
http://www.projectbigbrother.com/tfp-is-schweet
[040804-22:43:44] <Mephex> bah, maybe when you're really relaly done
[040804-22:43:53] <Mephex> but i find that it makes a mess too early
[040804-22:44:00] <ngdawg> i would think guys would prefer it to .i don't know.....be sucked into something LOL
[040804-22:44:13] <denim> looks like a lot scrolled off before I captured it. I'll put in what I've got.
[040804-22:45:31] <BoCo> Jay Leno: "The good news is, The Matrix was released on DVD today; the bad news is, it's the same version that was shown in the theaters."
[040804-22:45:34] <denim>
http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...threadid=51842
[040804-22:46:05] <ngdawg> my mozilla went to sleep or something....
[040804-22:46:16] <BoCo> wake it up
[040804-22:46:24] <Mephex> that's huge denim
[040804-22:46:24] <ngdawg> it won't wake up, i'm trying
[040804-22:46:28] <Mephex> you want it verbatim ?