Creating a mega-city in China

Source: China to create largest mega city in the world with 42 million people - Telegraph
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To be honest, articles like this fascinate me to no end. Part of the reason why I'm in Geographic Info Systems as a major is so that one day I can do urban planning as a profession. I'm always going into Google Maps and looking at the layouts of major metropolises such as the Greater Tokyo Area, Dubai, Los Angeles, Seattle, Toronto, etc. I also like to research the economies and transport layouts of these cities.

The fact that China could accomplish this at just a little over one trillion GBP seems too good to be true. Considering China's public debt is less than 15%, they could just do one massive push if they so chose (and it's possible that's what they will do). And why not? The economic incentives from increased efficiency seem like they would pay for themselves over a few decades, not to mention the renewed development that will happen between the former cities as they become one.

Finally, the prospect of urbanizing the entire region, and creating a Megalopolis of close to 260 million people...no other country in the world (except maybe India) would be able to come close. It blows my mind.

SO yeah, Superpower China Discussion Thread.

 

Lots of people. I don't know how they deal with all the waste...

NYC has different boroughs I've heard. It sounds like this would be similar.

 

The Northeast "megalopolis" (Washington DC - Baltimore - Philadelphia - New York - Boston) accounts for 50+ million people (or close to 20 percent of US population) as well as around 20 percent of US gdp.
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NYC dumps its waste in Fresh Kills in Staten Island, compacts it and sends it to South Carolina.

 

That would still be a fraction of the proposed 260 million Megalopolis, though. Second, the distance from Boston to DC is nearly 500 miles. While it could qualify as a Megalopolis, it hardly qualifies as a MegaCity, meaning that your argument is invalid. The Pearl River Delta would still be the largest in the world.

 

If you are really interested, I would suggest reading "Megalopolis: The Urbanized Northeastern Seaboard of the United States." While it is a bit dated, its characterization of the Washington DC-Boston urban corridor as the "Main Street of America" still holds true in many respects (even more so today where distance is less relevant), particularly in its economic impact.

And South Carolina is still the pay toilet of the nation (not that it is relevant to this discussion)
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My issue with China is not this "mega- city" but rather holding China accountable to WTO trade rules and standards and the best way to accomplish this w/o a trade war which I fear would result from some Republican proposals floating around.

 

The air pollution being generated in the Pearl River Delta is astounding. I can remember visiting Hong Kong a couple years after the hand over and the air was always clear (or as clear as a big city can be). Now? The smog is crazy. Friends who live there celebrate when the wind changes direction and gives them clear skies.

I can only imagine the kind of intensification that is about to happen in the region will only add to this. I also have to wonder how much arable land will be consumed for industry?

 

It's kind of an interesting project, in the abstract, but practically speaking, it doesn't seem like a very bright idea. Aside from human rights, China doesn't have a very good track record with the environment. Seems hard to believe they'd be likely to make this mega-city particularly environmentally-friendly...if such a thing is even possible. Maybe if they cleaned up the area and greened the cities they're planning around first, I might be more inclined to believe they could do this without making it a legendary environmental disaster.

Also, I am just unclear on what the benefits would be to the people living in this mega-city. From the sound of things in the original article, the same basic benefits could be achieved by lowering telecommunications prices and building some high-speed transit...and, of course, easing up on China's system of internal passports and movement regulations.

 

But you don't get property taxes from parks, forests, and even farms. You get a lot more money from homes, apartments, and companies.

Yes, China does need to address the air pollution issues they have first. But, they are doing more in solar hot water heaters than all other countries combined.

 

Yes, you do get more taxes... but industry and housing doesn't feed a nation. The Pearl River Delta has been some of the most fertile land in China. It used to grow much of their rice.

I know they are working on alternative forms of power but the coal fired plants that are currently in place are not doing their health or property values any favours.

Who wants to live in a city without parks or green space?

 

The last two cities I've lived in.

$$$ above environment/farms all the time.

 

I know what the reality on the ground is with regards to economics. I am talking about long term sustainability and quality of life.

People on the way up will put up with a lot shit to make money, but at some point, it becomes less about another industrial park and more about balancing it with a good quality of life. This usually happens when you have a strong middle class that becomes a sizable portion of your population. This is where China is headed and you can already see the impact in places like Shanghai.

The Bund, once a jewel had become a wasteland of highways and industry. Over the past ten years it has been transformed into the gem it once was. The highways and industry have moved elsewhere. This was done (amongst other reasons) because there is a stronger middle class in Shanghai and they want a better quality of life.

 

The middle class and wealthy are able to move when conditions from their previous decisions becomes bad enough. You see this in places like Detroit here, where the money leaves when it can, leaving behind the poor and furthering the problem. The industry and people moved elsewhere, leaving behind the wreckage.

I think that the plan for the GOP on climate change is to invade Canada in a few years as an example. They are able to make enough money to buy cars/SUVs and would adapt if they had to.

 

I agree that China's economic development is not all that different from what the US experienced post-WW II, where US GDP was growing at rates of 5-8 % annually and occasionally exceeding 10% through the 70s.

And we suffered the adverse environmental impacts - increasingly dangerously unhealthy air, polluted waters, etc. - which resulted in the comprehensive environmental legislation of the early 70s. The question is whether China will make the same commitment to balancing economic and environmental sustainability.

Hell, we're not doing so great ourselves these days if the conservative push-back against even the most reasonable efforts to limit our own spewing of 1+ billion of metric tons of anthropogenic CO2/greenhouse gas emissions annually is any measure.

The water supply issue is a separate issue and not just for China and this mega-ctiy. Ask folks in the US west/southwest.

 

True. They can move, but it's better to build a city that can be sustainable in the long run. A place where the middle class *wants* to live. Detroit's issues aren't so much that the city was poorly planned but rather that the industry that supported it dried up. It was also victim to the same economic forces that saw most US cities emptied out in favour of the suburbs. Unlike other cities where their cores are reviving, Detroit didn't get its shit together in the same way.

Don't laugh about the invasion of Canada... given the amount of fresh water Canada is sitting on and the fact that climate change is likely to make much of which is way too cold much of the year start to look like North Carolina, I think there is a very good case to be made for American incursions in the future (after all, the only nation to ever invade Canada was the US).