the best form of Economy... - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

irateplatypus · 03-27-2005, 12:36 PM

*i did a search, but didn't find a poll similar to this. sorry if this has been done before.*

what do you think is the most desirable economic system? keep in mind that this isn't a poll of what you think would be the best abstract utopian ideal... treat this question as if the answer would be implemented on real people, including you and your family.

criteria i would use in answering:

what would best promote justice?
how would it fare as far as stability is concerned?
what leads me to believe that this would work?
etc...

classical choices are the textbook versions...

if you choose socialism but have reservations about pure distilled socialism, then select the second socialism choice and describe your choice in more detail.

Strange Famous · 03-27-2005, 12:47 PM

socialism and communism are the same thing, although Lenin made a false differentation between the "lower" form of communism which would exist immediately after the revolution and true communism which would be created by the revolution.

My answer is obviously communism, but what "classic communism" means canot be defined in a capitalist society. Certainly it is my belief than within 50 years the government of this would WILL be communist.

tecoyah · 03-27-2005, 01:42 PM

Socialism would be far more stable both socially and economically. The standard model of socialist governance would need be modified....but I will refrain from believing I am capable of explaining the details of the How.

irateplatypus · 03-27-2005, 02:04 PM

i accidentally titled this thread with the word "government" instead of "economic system". mods please feel free to change the title. also, i realize that it's difficult to answer this poll in a multiple choice format. that's why i devoted nearly half the slots to personalized responses. mods are welcome to edit poll options if some glaring omission has been made.

superiorrain · 03-27-2005, 02:56 PM

Capitalism works, if there were a better system for the current time then it would be in place now. The fact is if it ain't broke why fix it, okay sure it's not perfect but then again you'll never get perfection in your life so you just have the get the best you can. Socialism has been tried and tested, so far has failed in most countries and even china in my opinion will in 10 to 20 adopt true capitalism. So the perfect mixture is a bit of both, like JD and coke, small amount of socialism with a large amount of capitalism.

Locobot · 03-27-2005, 03:03 PM

hmmm, I don't really see most of these choices as economic systems. How does Fascism differ from capitalism in monetary terms? I also fail to see a difference between unbridled capitalism and complete anarchy in terms of commerce.

I see capitalism as a natural state of humanity, a product of our evolution (no shitting). As such it's inescapable in many respects. The poll is a little too flawed for me to vote.

filtherton · 03-27-2005, 03:08 PM

The one where everyone gets what they need to survive and no one group or person is able to amass more resources than they are entitled to.

flstf · 03-27-2005, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Poll question:
something else that the world hasn't seen before (except for the description below.

A utopia, once we have all become enlightened.

roachboy · 03-27-2005, 03:30 PM

1. i dont recognize any seperation between economic, social and political orders.
2. i do not understand the point of utopian thinking. this even after reading bloch.
3. if there were to be something on the order of a revolutionary movement right now, it would in all probability come from the right. simply because they have a mobilized poppulation, for better or worse, and one that is active on the basis of an ideology that systematically blurs the line between descriptive and normative elements--so it is entirely possible that the right could pull off something on the order of a revolution and not really notice it.
4. if such a movement were to occur, the outcome would be fascism. that is the least desirable imaginable political/social/economic order. i mean, look around.
5. there is no contradiction between fascism and capitalism. there is no contradiction between capitalism and any number of authoritarian regimes. capitalism requires social stability to operate, and some kind of state action to maintain that stability across the continuous disruptions that the capitalist mode of production generates.

i like democracy....i think it would be nice to have in america. i expect that democracy would be classified as communism in some quarters.

Pacifier · 03-27-2005, 04:14 PM

social market economy (strong focus on "social"), the german system for years. now we skip the "social" part an go for capitalism with no limits which is a bad thing. capitalism needs limits otherwise it ends in exploitation.

View Poll Results: best economic system
classical unbridled capitalism	3	16.67%
capitalism with modifications described below	6	33.33%
classical fascism	0	0%
fascism with modifications described below	0	0%
classical communism	1	5.56%
communism with modifications described below	0	0%
classical socialism	3	16.67%
socialism with modifications described below	3	16.67%
complete anarchy	0	0%
something else that the world hasn't seen before (except for the description below )	2	11.11%
Voters: 18. You may not vote on this poll

03-27-2005, 12:36 PM	#1 (permalink)
irateplatypus can't help but laugh Location: dar al-harb	the best form of Economy... i did a search, but didn't find a poll similar to this. sorry if this has been done before. what do you think is the most desirable economic system? keep in mind that this isn't a poll of what you think would be the best abstract utopian ideal... treat this question as if the answer would be implemented on real people, including you and your family. criteria i would use in answering: what would best promote justice? how would it fare as far as stability is concerned? what leads me to believe that this would work? etc... classical choices are the textbook versions... if you choose socialism but have reservations about pure distilled socialism, then select the second socialism choice and describe your choice in more detail. __________________ If you will not fight when your victory will be sure and not too costly, you may come to the moment when you will have to fight with all the odds against you and only a precarious chance for survival. There may even be a worse case. You may have to fight when there is no hope of victory, because it is better to perish than to live as slaves. ~ Winston Churchill Last edited by irateplatypus; 03-27-2005 at 12:44 PM..

03-27-2005, 12:47 PM	#2 (permalink)
Strange Famous follower of the child's crusade?	socialism and communism are the same thing, although Lenin made a false differentation between the "lower" form of communism which would exist immediately after the revolution and true communism which would be created by the revolution. My answer is obviously communism, but what "classic communism" means canot be defined in a capitalist society. Certainly it is my belief than within 50 years the government of this would WILL be communist. __________________ "Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate, for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain without being uncovered." The Gospel of Thomas

03-27-2005, 01:42 PM	#3 (permalink)
tecoyah Illusionary	Socialism would be far more stable both socially and economically. The standard model of socialist governance would need be modified....but I will refrain from believing I am capable of explaining the details of the How. __________________ Holding onto anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned. - Buddha

03-27-2005, 02:04 PM	#4 (permalink)
irateplatypus can't help but laugh Location: dar al-harb	i accidentally titled this thread with the word "government" instead of "economic system". mods please feel free to change the title. also, i realize that it's difficult to answer this poll in a multiple choice format. that's why i devoted nearly half the slots to personalized responses. mods are welcome to edit poll options if some glaring omission has been made. __________________ If you will not fight when your victory will be sure and not too costly, you may come to the moment when you will have to fight with all the odds against you and only a precarious chance for survival. There may even be a worse case. You may have to fight when there is no hope of victory, because it is better to perish than to live as slaves. ~ Winston Churchill

03-27-2005, 02:56 PM	#5 (permalink)
superiorrain Psycho Location: London	Capitalism works, if there were a better system for the current time then it would be in place now. The fact is if it ain't broke why fix it, okay sure it's not perfect but then again you'll never get perfection in your life so you just have the get the best you can. Socialism has been tried and tested, so far has failed in most countries and even china in my opinion will in 10 to 20 adopt true capitalism. So the perfect mixture is a bit of both, like JD and coke, small amount of socialism with a large amount of capitalism. __________________ "The only way to discover the limits of the possible is to go beyond them into the impossible." - Arthur C. Clarke

03-27-2005, 03:03 PM	#6 (permalink)
Locobot is awesome!	hmmm, I don't really see most of these choices as economic systems. How does Fascism differ from capitalism in monetary terms? I also fail to see a difference between unbridled capitalism and complete anarchy in terms of commerce. I see capitalism as a natural state of humanity, a product of our evolution (no shitting). As such it's inescapable in many respects. The poll is a little too flawed for me to vote.

03-27-2005, 03:08 PM	#7 (permalink)
filtherton Junkie Location: In the land of ice and snow.	The one where everyone gets what they need to survive and no one group or person is able to amass more resources than they are entitled to.

03-27-2005, 03:30 PM	#9 (permalink)
roachboy Super Moderator Location: essex ma	1. i dont recognize any seperation between economic, social and political orders. 2. i do not understand the point of utopian thinking. this even after reading bloch. 3. if there were to be something on the order of a revolutionary movement right now, it would in all probability come from the right. simply because they have a mobilized poppulation, for better or worse, and one that is active on the basis of an ideology that systematically blurs the line between descriptive and normative elements--so it is entirely possible that the right could pull off something on the order of a revolution and not really notice it. 4. if such a movement were to occur, the outcome would be fascism. that is the least desirable imaginable political/social/economic order. i mean, look around. 5. there is no contradiction between fascism and capitalism. there is no contradiction between capitalism and any number of authoritarian regimes. capitalism requires social stability to operate, and some kind of state action to maintain that stability across the continuous disruptions that the capitalist mode of production generates. i like democracy....i think it would be nice to have in america. i expect that democracy would be classified as communism in some quarters. __________________ a gramophone its corrugated trumpet silver handle spinning dog. such faithfulness it hear it make you sick. -kamau brathwaite

03-27-2005, 04:14 PM	#10 (permalink)
Pacifier undead Location: Duisburg, Germany	social market economy (strong focus on "social"), the german system for years. now we skip the "social" part an go for capitalism with no limits which is a bad thing. capitalism needs limits otherwise it ends in exploitation. __________________ "It seems to me that the idea of a personal God is an anthropological concept which I cannot take seriously. I also cannot imagine some will or goal outside the human sphere. Science has been charged with undermining morality, but the charge is unjust. A man's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties and needs; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death — Albert Einstein Last edited by Pacifier; 03-27-2005 at 04:16 PM..