Martial Law in US begins October 1 - Page 2 - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

The_Dunedan · 09-25-2008, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Do you think that there will be riots in the streets in major cities (Detroit, LA, Atlanta, Chicago,...) if Obama doesn't win?

Possibly. There's also the chance for a riot if he -does- win: fuckheads come in every skin color, and riot-prone fuckheads need little excuse. Black fuckheads may riot if Obama loses (Whitey done ripped us off again!), or if he wins (Our boy's in charge now, we can do whatever we want!). White fuckheads may riot (or worse) if Obama wins, or even if he looks -close- to winning. Either way, it's a good possibility. Hence why I live on a dead-end road in the middle of nowhere.

Quote:

Is that what they are worried about?

Not if past incidents of rioting and looting are any example. If NOLA '05 and LA '93 are anything to go by, the top priorities of Military and Law Enforcement will be:

1: Saving their own skins.
2: Going nowhere near anyone actually dangerous. (See 1)
3: Disarming the people being targeted by the looters and rioters, whom the cops and Nat'l Gaurd refuse to confront.
3a: Don't forget to keep the guns, even when several Federal courts order their return. For best results, sell aforementioned guns to drug-dealers and "coyotes."
4: Abusing, arresting, and brutalizing the now-disarmed citizenry.
5: Going on TV for 6 months afterward to praise their courage and heroism in containing the violence and preventing the outbreak of lawlessness.

jorgelito · 09-25-2008, 05:46 PM

I have not heard anything about this martial law. Is this true, can it be verified? Why isn't it in the press? If it is true then it is very disturbing and an outrage.
-----Added 25/9/2008 at 09 : 48 : 05-----

Quote:

Originally Posted by dc_dux

I think you might be standing for quite a while.

In the meantime, I would like to hear both candidate answer these questions:

Do you agree with Bush's deployment of an active duty regular Army combat unit for full-time use inside the United States to assist in respondng to emergencies, civil unrest or potential terrorists attacks How would you use NORTHCOM or would you disband it?

What role, if any, do you see for private security companies like Blackwater USA serving in any capacity inside the US? Would you rescind the of DHS/FEMA contracts for such services?

But, unfortunately, these are questions that the mainstream media will not be asking.

Why wouldn't they ask it? It would be dereliction of duty if they didn't.

I would like to hear their responses as well.
-----Added 25/9/2008 at 09 : 48 : 31-----

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASU2003

I had this thought today. Do you think that there will be riots in the streets in major cities (Detroit, LA, Atlanta, Chicago,...) if Obama doesn't win? Is that what they are worried about?

Why would there be riots? There weren't riots in the previous elections.

The_Dunedan · 09-26-2008, 05:12 AM

Quote:

Why wouldn't they ask it? It would be dereliction of duty if they didn't.

Because "Dereliction of Duty" is Item #1 in the American Mass Media Job Description. They've spent the last 30 years dropping the ball, and you don't have to re-read all of Hosts Posts to see that.

Quote:

Why would there be riots? There weren't riots in the previous elections.

Because there wasn't a black man running in the previous elections. Many urban blacks have a tendency to riot and demolish things when an issue doesn't go their way (Obama losing), and while white-initiated riots are rarer, they tend to be more destructive and homicidal (Tulsa 1927, Rosewood, Draft Riots, etc). I half expect riots no matter -who- wins; blacks rioting if Obama loses, whites rioting if he wins.

As I said below, fuckheads of any race need little excuse to smash things and steal whatever's not nailed down. And the world is, sadly, full of fuckheads.

Cynosure · 09-26-2008, 07:10 AM

I'm more concerned about possible uprisings and riots over a collapse of the U.S. financial system, than I am about possible uprisings and riots over a black man (not) winning the office of President.

Back in the 1930s, the majority of Americans were used to simple if not financially poor living. So, when the Great Depression hit, the majority of Americans were already tough and practical people. Not so with today's last two or three generations, who've grown up amidst abundance, prosperity, and over-consumerism. Furthermore, there is a sense of entitlement and individualism amongst the last two or three generations, which did not exist amongst the generations hit by the first Great Depression.

Baraka_Guru · 09-26-2008, 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cynosure

I'm more concerned about possible uprisings and riots over a collapse of the U.S. financial system, than I am about possible uprisings and riots over a black man (not) winning the office of President.

This is a good point. But I think perhaps this is more about both of these issues: The economy is hitting the skids while the next president may (or may not be) a black man. What we have here are the issue of rich vs. poor and the issue of race all coming together at once. This is shaping up to be a dire time in the U.S. And now you have domestic militarism....

Not good.

As I post this, the Dow is down 0.5% and the S&P is down 1.1%.

Cynosure · 09-26-2008, 07:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baraka_Guru

But I think perhaps this is more about both of these issues: The economy is hitting the skids while the next president may (or may not be) a black man. What we have here are the issue of rich vs. poor and the issue of race all coming together at once. This is shaping up to be a dire time in the U.S. And now you have domestic militarism....

Not good.

Yeah. This "Calvin & Hobbes" comic strip, which someone posted in another forum here, comes to mind...

Seer666 · 09-26-2008, 11:59 AM

I know I was only a squid, and not one of the guys feet to the ground, but as a former military man, I would ashamed to be part of this unit. This flies in the face of everything this counrty is supposed to be about. I'm moving to Austraila where the people are still at least some what sane.

jorgelito · 09-26-2008, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Dunedan

Because "Dereliction of Duty" is Item #1 in the American Mass Media Job Description. They've spent the last 30 years dropping the ball, and you don't have to re-read all of Hosts Posts to see that.

Because there wasn't a black man running in the previous elections. Many urban blacks have a tendency to riot and demolish things when an issue doesn't go their way (Obama losing), and while white-initiated riots are rarer, they tend to be more destructive and homicidal (Tulsa 1927, Rosewood, Draft Riots, etc). I half expect riots no matter -who- wins; blacks rioting if Obama loses, whites rioting if he wins.

As I said below, fuckheads of any race need little excuse to smash things and steal whatever's not nailed down. And the world is, sadly, full of fuckheads.

Yeah, I would agree the media has dropped their end of the bargain with rare exception (NPR, BBC are still good). Sad state of affairs that.

I'm not convinced that a "black man" running in this election will cause riots. Unless there was shenanigans going on at the ballot box but otherwise, no.

Baraka_Guru · 09-26-2008, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cynosure

Yeah. This "Calvin & Hobbes" comic strip, which someone posted in another forum here, comes to mind...

Heh, I thought of the same thing.

Farmer Brown looks a bit like McCain....

The_Dunedan · 09-26-2008, 03:29 PM

Quote:

I know I was only a squid, and not one of the guys feet to the ground, but as a former military man, I would ashamed to be part of this unit. This flies in the face of everything this counrty is supposed to be about.

You, Sir, are a credit to the Navy and the uniform you wore. Thank you for your service, and for keeping faith with the American people and the Constitution. Thank you.

ASU2003 · 09-26-2008, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jorgelito

I'm not convinced that a "black man" running in this election will cause riots. Unless there was shenanigans going on at the ballot box but otherwise, no.

I'm not either, but they ('the government') do not want to guess wrong. And after seeing what happens in poorer neighborhoods during the election, those long lines and 2 polling booths in downtown (which may or may not work) compared to 50 for about 10,000 residents in the rich suburbs. It may provide the spark.

dksuddeth · 09-26-2008, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cynosure

I'm more concerned about possible uprisings and riots over a collapse of the U.S. financial system, than I am about possible uprisings and riots over a black man (not) winning the office of President.

I'm sure alot of people are thinking it is about the election of a black man, but did anyone consider that Oct 1 is the start of the fiscal 4th quarter in financial markets? Does the government know more than they are letting on and could this be the reason for military units being deployed for 'crowd control'?

Sun Tzu · 09-27-2008, 12:17 PM

I will admit I don’t trust what the government has turned into, so I of course see this as a bad sign.

If anyone has the time; it truly is worth the read to take the free courses FEMA and your local state’s emergency management administration offer.

ASU2003 · 09-27-2008, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dksuddeth

I'm sure alot of people are thinking it is about the election of a black man, but did anyone consider that Oct 1 is the start of the fiscal 4th quarter in financial markets? Does the government know more than they are letting on and could this be the reason for military units being deployed for 'crowd control'?

It may just be that Oct 1st is the start of the next fiscal year for the US government...?

dksuddeth · 09-28-2008, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASU2003

It may just be that Oct 1st is the start of the next fiscal year for the US government...?

I hadn't thought about that. good point.

boink · 09-30-2008, 11:54 PM

I feel safer already

Willravel · 10-01-2008, 08:13 AM

Reminder: you do not currently have the right to defend yourself from law enforcement, and I would imagine that this extends to military personnel in the instance of martial law. If you are being attacked, flee to the nearest police station and try to contact an attorney as you're getting to the police station.

dksuddeth · 10-01-2008, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Willravel

Reminder: you do not currently have the right to defend yourself from law enforcement, and I would imagine that this extends to military personnel in the instance of martial law. If you are being attacked, flee to the nearest police station and try to contact an attorney as you're getting to the police station.

please refer to your particular states laws regarding this claim. I do know that some states specifically define conditions where one can indeed claim self defense against law enforcement while many other states outlaw it in any instance.

Cynthetiq · 10-01-2008, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Willravel

Reminder: you do not currently have the right to defend yourself from law enforcement, and I would imagine that this extends to military personnel in the instance of martial law. If you are being attacked, flee to the nearest police station and try to contact an attorney as you're getting to the police station.

Church, synagogue, mosque... any house of worship is where I would go before any law enforcement location...

Sanctuary... Sanctuary...

Willravel · 10-01-2008, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cynthetiq

Church, synagogue, mosque... any house of worship is where I would go before any law enforcement location...

Sanctuary... Sanctuary...

Someone tried that at my dad's church a few years back. The police walked right in and arrested him.

I don't think that works any more, even for Jean Valjean.

tisonlyi · 10-01-2008, 08:41 PM

I don't think hiding out in a church ever really worked except for a few truly Sacred places.

Cynthetiq · 10-01-2008, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Willravel

Someone tried that at my dad's church a few years back. The police walked right in and arrested him.

I don't think that works any more, even for Jean Valjean.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tisonlyi

I don't think hiding out in a church ever really worked except for a few truly Sacred places.

Still works and still happens in many cases. Maybe your police officers had a warrant, or your father didn't stand up enough to the law enforcement officers to DENY them entry to PRIVATE property.

Seems to work in the Philippines, Canda, and, Ohio, Chicago, IL...

Quote:

View: Man claiming sanctuary given OK to leave church
Source: CBC
posted with the TFP thread generator

Man claiming sanctuary given OK to leave church
Man claiming sanctuary given OK to leave church
Last Updated: Monday, December 13, 2004 | 6:30 PM ET
CBC News
A man from Bangladesh who has lived in the refuge of a church in Ottawa since July 2003 is now free to leave it, and can stay in Canada.
Samsu Mia was granted a ministerial permit by Immigration Minister Judy Sgro on Monday, allowing him to leave the First Unitarian Congregation without fear of deportation.

Mia is on his way to becoming a landed immigrant, said MP Marlene Catterall, who delivered the good news at the church in her riding.

Samsu Mia (file photo)

Mia took refuge after failing in his five-year battle for refugee status. He was facing a deportation at the time.

BACKGROUND: The church as sanctuary
Mia has said he can't go back to Bangladesh because of a government official he publicly criticized.

He worked for the Bangladesh High Commission in Ottawa. He claims he was physically and mentally abused by his employer and fears he'll be killed or imprisoned if he's sent back home.

Quote:

View: Illegal entrant claiming sanctuary in Chicago church safe — for now
Source: Azstarnet
posted with the TFP thread generator

Illegal entrant claiming sanctuary in Chicago church safe — for now
Published: 07.13.2008

Illegal entrant claiming sanctuary in Chicago church safe — for now
By Sophia Tareen
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
CHICAGO — Everyone knows where Flor Crisostomo lives, even the federal immigration officials who have ordered her deported to Mexico. The reason they haven't detained her is her address — Adalberto United Methodist Church.
Another woman famously took refuge in that church as she championed immigration reform, and at least 13 other illegal immigrants are doing the same at churches around the country. So far, they have little to fear.
U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement officials have arrested illegal immigrants by the hundreds in raids at factories, restaurants, malls, farms and meat packing plants, but they have handled cases involving churches delicately.
"Our agency takes enforcement actions when we deem it appropriate," said Julie Myers, assistant secretary of homeland security for ICE.
"I am personally not aware of an instance when ICE has gone into a church. That being said, if there was a particular, extremely egregious, ax murderer or something else, that's not to say we would not enforce the law at that time."
Avoiding churches is unofficial policy for federal immigration officials, according to Doris Meissner, a former commissioner at the Immigration and Naturalization Service, the agency that oversaw immigration until the Department of Homeland Security was formed in 2003.
Since the 1970s the unwritten rule has been "no churches, no playgrounds, no schools," said Meissner, now a senior fellow at the Migration Policy Institute in Washington.
Critics say making exceptions for churches, where immigrants openly — and in Crisostomo's case, very publicly — defy deportation, makes the agency look lax.
"These are people who deliberately violated the law," said Dave Gorak, executive director of the Midwest Coalition to Reduce Immigration. "We can't even enforce the laws without being criticized as Gestapo."
But Meissner said it wouldn't make sense for the agency to devote resources to arrest the relatively small number of people in sanctuary.
"An agency like ICE has far more work than it can possibly ever do," Meissner said.
"You want to use those resources to thwart as much as possible egregious criminal behavior. A single person in a church doesn't really measure very high on a list."
Crisostomo came to the U.S. in 2000, paying a smuggler in Mexico to get her across the border. She was arrested in 2006 during a raid at a wooden pallet company in Chicago.
She has been at the West Side church for six months, since the Board of Immigration Appeals ordered her to leave the United States, holding news conferences, writing blogs and lecturing school groups about immigration issues.
Adalberto United Methodist gained widespread attention when it offered sanctuary to another immigrant, Elvira Arellano, who used it as a base to champion immigration reform.
Arellano stayed there for a year with her U.S.-born son, and frequently spoke about immigrant rights.
She was arrested and deported to Mexico only after she left her sanctuary last August to travel to a rally in Los Angeles.
"We do conduct enforcement activities at a time and place of the government's choosing," said Myers, ICE's top official.
"With Ms. Arellano, we believe that an appropriate time was when she was kind of traveling outside of the institution."
Arellano has been lauded as a heroine of the New Sanctuary Movement, which calls for immigration reform, and Crisostomo says she's following in Arellano's footsteps.
"We have to show the government that we are many, we are strong, we are humans and that we deserve respect in this country," said Crisostomo. "This is a church that was made to help the fight of people who are undocumented."
The New Sanctuary Movement, which makes living arrangements for illegal immigrants at churches, is modeled after a similar movement for Central Americans in the 1980s.
Its goal is to call attention to immigration reform, but organizers believe sanctuary is a temporary solution, said Kristin Kumpf, a national organizer for the movement.
"The churches have been treated as sacred space," said Kumpf. But "no one can stay in sanctuary forever."

Quote:

View: Church Becomes Sanctuary after Raid
Source: Kcrg
posted with the TFP thread generator

Church Becomes Sanctuary after Raid
Church Becomes Sanctuary after Raid
By Josh Hinkle, Reporter
By Becky Ogann

Story Created: May 14, 2008 at 5:02 PM CDT

Story Updated: May 14, 2008 at 6:22 PM CDT

POSTVILLE - Officials at a Postville Catholic church say hundreds of people are hiding out there in fear of further police action.

The church has definitely become a sanctuary for Postville's Hispanic population. More than 200 people were still there on Wednesday. Many of them are staying overnight because they're afraid to go home.

They know what happened to their family members who worked at Agriprocessors when ICE raided the plant. Now they fear detention or deportation too.

Many here are living here illegally in the U.S. and most that TV9 spoke with don't speak English. Many here also just need food because the bread winner in their family might be locked up at this time.

Church officials and volunteers have stepped in to temporarily fill that void.

"The community is being broken up, families are being broken up. Small children are left alone. Where a mother is left with 2 or 3 little children and the bread winner, who they expected to come home on Monday, left in the morning in the same fashion they left everyday, and they're not coming home, they're just panic stricken," said Sister Mary McCauley, St. Bridget's Catholic Church.

I.C.E. conditionally released 3 women who are now living here because there was no one to take care of their children and one of them is pregnant. You can tell who they are by the electronic tracking devices on their ankles.

tisonlyi · 10-01-2008, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Willravel

Reminder: you do not currently have the right to defend yourself from law enforcement, and I would imagine that this extends to military personnel in the instance of martial law. If you are being attacked, flee to the nearest police station and try to contact an attorney as you're getting to the police station.

The state mandates that you do not have the right to defend yourself against the state.

Ha!

I'm glad I had the wherewithal to clobber a copper or two in the uk before taking to toes and legging it in the past.

I wonder what Republicans make of both that, and the bearing of arms by the police and citizenry. :-/

RESPONSE TO DIRECLTLY ABOVE:

If they'd stolen something, shot someone or acted against the interest of the state in some other way, I'm pretty confident the sanctity of the place of worship would be taking a back seat. Right at the back. In reality, as I would hope most people know, illegitimate labour which is not actively, brutally removed is generally acting in the interest of the powerful.

dksuddeth · 10-07-2008, 06:18 AM

ok people, since i'm currently at work and unable to view this on the servers, please take a look at this video and summarize for me. thanks.

US Congresspeople Told Martial Law Would Be Imposed if Bailout Bill Didn't Pass - Boing Boing

Willravel · 10-07-2008, 07:04 AM

I've met Congressman Shermon, I don't believe him to be a conspiracy theorist. Naomi Klein was discussing the same thing the other day, about the threat of the Dow dropping 1000 points a day and how martial law would be enforced. It's too much of a coincidence. It's also way too much of a coincidence that martial law started so close to the election.

IMPORTANT: If you see military officers a your polling place, please take cell phone pictures of them and post them online. I expect voter intimidation. If you are responsible for a polling location, do not allow soldiers anywhere near the building. I'll be at my dad's church doing the same.

Cynthetiq · 10-07-2008, 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Willravel

I've met Congressman Shermon, I don't believe him to be a conspiracy theorist. Naomi Klein was discussing the same thing the other day, about the threat of the Dow dropping 1000 points a day and how martial law would be enforced. It's too much of a coincidence. It's also way too much of a coincidence that martial law started so close to the election.

we're already under martial law?

Willravel · 10-07-2008, 07:40 AM

Martial law started about a week ago.

dksuddeth · 10-07-2008, 07:43 AM

maybe it's martial law 'lite' for now?

As far as I'm concerned, any military personnel around my area attempting to provide law enforcement will summarily be ignored. They have no legal authority.

Willravel · 10-07-2008, 08:05 AM

Yes, it's not full martial law. Still, any martial law means we're in martial law. Anywhere this military unit is, there will theoretically be martial law.

BTW, I have no idea where they are. Anyone hear anything?

Cynthetiq · 10-07-2008, 08:07 AM

a bunch of crap...

"martial law" to make the chicken littles into a new kind of sheeple. sorry that's not the martial law you are talking about... these are not the droids you are looking for...

more fear, more fear, keep pumping things up with more fear... *sigh*

Marshal Law called for Bailout Vote - ReaderRant

Quote:

Congressional Record: September 28, 2008 (House)
GPO DOCID:cr28se08-204, Pages H10303-H10304

MARTIAL LAW

(Mr. Burgess asked and was given permission to address the House for 1 minute and to revise and extend his remarks.)

Mr. Burgess: Mr. Speaker, I also come to the floor today to talk about this $700 billion bill that's in front of us. I use the term "bill" advisedly because we have seen no bill. We are here, debating talking points on, perhaps, what is the largest fundamental change in our Nation's financial system in its history.

House Republicans have been cut out of the process. Not only have we been cut out of the process, but we've also been derided by the leadership of the Democratic Party, and have been called unpatriotic for not participating.

Mr. Speaker, I have been thrown out of more meetings in this Capitol in the last 24 hours than I ever thought possible as a duly elected Representative of 820,000 citizens of North Texas.

Politics is a full-contact sport, and I understand that, but it is a full-contact sport in the light of day, in the public arena. Since we didn't have hearings, since we didn't have markups, let's at least put this legislation up on the Internet for 24 hours. That's what Thomas was made for. Let's do that, and let the American people see what we have done in the dark of night. After all, I have not gotten any more mail, any more e-mails on any other subject than this one that is before us today.

Mr. Speaker, I understand we're under martial law as declared by the Speaker last night. I think it's ironic that House Republicans have not been needed for a single thing in this House to ensure passage for the last 22 months and that, today, we're going to be asked to vote for a bill for political cover because Democrats are too weak to stand up to their Speaker.

The "martial law" Burgess was referring to was H.RES. 1514, which was introduced by Representative Louise Slaughter (D-NY 28th) on the House floor, September 27, 2008, and passed by a majority of the House on September 28, 2008 in House Roll Call Vote 666 (gasp!). Last I checked, Ms. Slaughter was not the Speaker of The House, Ms. Pelosi was, and a majority vote by the House members cannot be construed as an act of martial law without taking a giant leap out over a chasm of fantasy. The full text of the resolution:

Quote:

Quote:H. Res. 1514
In the House of Representatives, U. S.,
September 28, 2008.

Resolved, That the requirement of clause 6(a) of rule XIII for a two-thirds vote to consider a report from the Committee on Rules on the same day it is presented to the House is waived with respect to any resolution reported on the legislative day of September 28, 2008, or September 29, 2008.

dksuddeth · 10-07-2008, 08:26 AM

so, the gist of the video is burgess' 'feelings' about the house being under so much strain and stress of democrat overbearing the republicans, he feels it's martial law. what a doofus.

Willravel · 10-07-2008, 08:37 AM

Soldiers are for other places. Police are for here. When soldiers are here, acting as police, it's called "martial law".

The army has, as of October first, stationed a unit inside the US to act as an on-call federal response in times of emergency. They are trained for domestic operations. It's a dedicated assignment that's intended to deal with "civil unrest" and "crowd control".

pan6467 · 10-07-2008, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dksuddeth

ok people, since i'm currently at work and unable to view this on the servers, please take a look at this video and summarize for me. thanks.

US Congresspeople Told Martial Law Would Be Imposed if Bailout Bill Didn't Pass - Boing Boing

I like this Congressman Sherman. I watched the second part also and he had some great explanations out of the bill as to what was happening.

And I do believe Martial Law was probably threatened.

It is so sad when our leaders have become so much more influenced by money and power that they are willing to sell those that elected them and they govern down the river and not even blink.

dksuddeth · 10-07-2008, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Willravel

Soldiers are for other places. Police are for here. When soldiers are here, acting as police, it's called "martial law".

Actually, that would be called breaking the law.

Willravel · 10-07-2008, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dksuddeth

Actually, that would be called breaking the law.

Of course, it's both.

Cynthetiq · 10-07-2008, 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Willravel

Soldiers are for other places. Police are for here. When soldiers are here, acting as police, it's called "martial law".

The army has, as of October first, stationed a unit inside the US to act as an on-call federal response in times of emergency. They are trained for domestic operations. It's a dedicated assignment that's intended to deal with "civil unrest" and "crowd control".

stationed....

you've got troops stationed not 25 miles from you just like I do... it has been like that for decades.

so far, it's still a FAR cry from martial law. If we were under martial law the economic crisis we're experiencing now would be 10000x worse. I have family that has seen the president of the country declare martial law. I have family that has lost their senate and congressional seats because the president dissolved the house of congress.

this is nothing like martial law, lite or otherwise.

dc_dux · 10-07-2008, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cynthetiq

stationed....

you've got troops stationed not 25 miles from you just like I do... it has been like that for decades.

so far, it's still a FAR cry from martial law. If we were under martial law the economic crisis we're experiencing now would be 10000x worse. I have family that has seen the president of the country declare martial law. I have family that has lost their senate and congressional seats because the president dissolved the house of congress.

this is nothing like martial law, lite or otherwise.

cyn....the DEPLOYMENT of the 3rd Infantry Division’s 1st Brigade Combat Team to NORTHCOMM with a "dedicated assignment" is not the same as being STATIONED near you or me.

Beginning Oct. 1 for 12 months, the 1st BCT will be under the day-to-day control of U.S. Army North, the Army service component of Northern Command, as an on-call federal response force for natural or manmade emergencies and disasters, including terrorist attacks.

It is not the first time an active-duty unit has been tapped to help at home. In August 2005, for example, when Hurricane Katrina unleashed hell in Mississippi and Louisiana, several active-duty units were pulled from various posts and mobilized to those areas

This new mission marks the first time an active unit has been given a dedicated assignment to NorthCom, a joint command established in 2002 to provide command and control for federal homeland defense efforts and coordinate defense support of civil authorities.

After 1st BCT finishes its dwell-time mission, expectations are that another, as yet unnamed, active-duty brigade will take over and that the mission will be a permanent one.

Army Times

IMO, such a "dedicated assignment" has not been authorized by an act of Congress...I would like to see Congressional hearings to determine if there is a violation of the Posse Comitatus Act (and/or other laws)

Cynthetiq · 10-07-2008, 09:21 AM

I don't disagree with that dc, but do you or I see military patroling the streets of DC (I'm not sure of DC since it isn't a state so military may move more easily there) or NYC? do you witness any servicemen containing and controlling people, setting curfew, or controlling sections of cities?

I disagree with the sky is falling cry of declaration of martial law.

Willravel · 10-07-2008, 09:23 AM

Thank you, DC. People from Fort Bragg can't normally be deployed to do crowd control during a protest. The 1st BCT can and likely will.

smooth · 10-07-2008, 09:28 AM

The point is that Cynthetiq is correct, this is not "martial law."

Martial law usurps or is in place of civil law, it's not some quaint way of saying the soldiers are outside our houses.
Last I checked we still have all our civil laws in place...even the brigade is under control of civil authorities or in joint with them.
This folding of agencies under the umbrella of the dept. of homeland defense confuses things, but ultimately it still currently falls under civilian and not military command.

09-26-2008, 11:59 AM	#47 (permalink)
Seer666 Oh dear God he breeded Location: Arizona	I know I was only a squid, and not one of the guys feet to the ground, but as a former military man, I would ashamed to be part of this unit. This flies in the face of everything this counrty is supposed to be about. I'm moving to Austraila where the people are still at least some what sane. __________________ Bad spellers of the world untie!!! I am the one you warned me of I seem to have misplaced the bullet with your name on it, but I have a whole box addressed to occupant.

09-27-2008, 12:17 PM	#53 (permalink)
Sun Tzu Conspiracy Realist Location: The Event Horizon	I will admit I don’t trust what the government has turned into, so I of course see this as a bad sign. If anyone has the time; it truly is worth the read to take the free courses FEMA and your local state’s emergency management administration offer. __________________ *To confine our attention to terrestrial matters would be to limit the human spirit.- Stephen Hawking*

09-30-2008, 11:54 PM	#56 (permalink)
boink Addict Location: Seattle	I feel safer already __________________ when you believe in things that you don't understand, then you suffer. Superstition ain't the way.

10-01-2008, 08:41 PM	#61 (permalink)
tisonlyi Nothing	I don't think hiding out in a church ever really worked except for a few truly Sacred places. __________________ "I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place." - Winston Churchill, 1937 --{ORLY?}--

10-07-2008, 06:18 AM	#64 (permalink)
dksuddeth Junkie Location: bedford, tx	ok people, since i'm currently at work and unable to view this on the servers, please take a look at this video and summarize for me. thanks. US Congresspeople Told Martial Law Would Be Imposed if Bailout Bill Didn't Pass - Boing Boing __________________ "no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free. No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything. You cannot conquer a free man; the most you can do is kill him."

09-26-2008, 07:10 AM	#44 (permalink)
Cynosure Psycho Location: the center of the multiverse	I'm more concerned about possible uprisings and riots over a collapse of the U.S. financial system, than I am about possible uprisings and riots over a black man (not) winning the office of President. Back in the 1930s, the majority of Americans were used to simple if not financially poor living. So, when the Great Depression hit, the majority of Americans were already tough and practical people. Not so with today's last two or three generations, who've grown up amidst abundance, prosperity, and over-consumerism. Furthermore, there is a sense of entitlement and individualism amongst the last two or three generations, which did not exist amongst the generations hit by the first Great Depression.

10-01-2008, 08:13 AM	#57 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Reminder: you do not currently have the right to defend yourself from law enforcement, and I would imagine that this extends to military personnel in the instance of martial law. If you are being attacked, flee to the nearest police station and try to contact an attorney as you're getting to the police station.

10-07-2008, 07:04 AM	#65 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	I've met Congressman Shermon, I don't believe him to be a conspiracy theorist. Naomi Klein was discussing the same thing the other day, about the threat of the Dow dropping 1000 points a day and how martial law would be enforced. It's too much of a coincidence. It's also way too much of a coincidence that martial law started so close to the election. IMPORTANT: If you see military officers a your polling place, please take cell phone pictures of them and post them online. I expect voter intimidation. If you are responsible for a polling location, do not allow soldiers anywhere near the building. I'll be at my dad's church doing the same.

10-07-2008, 07:40 AM	#67 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Martial law started about a week ago.

10-07-2008, 07:43 AM	#68 (permalink)
dksuddeth Junkie Location: bedford, tx	maybe it's martial law 'lite' for now? As far as I'm concerned, any military personnel around my area attempting to provide law enforcement will summarily be ignored. They have no legal authority. __________________ "no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free. No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything. You cannot conquer a free man; the most you can do is kill him."

10-07-2008, 08:05 AM	#69 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Yes, it's not full martial law. Still, any martial law means we're in martial law. Anywhere this military unit is, there will theoretically be martial law. BTW, I have no idea where they are. Anyone hear anything?

10-07-2008, 08:26 AM	#71 (permalink)
dksuddeth Junkie Location: bedford, tx	so, the gist of the video is burgess' 'feelings' about the house being under so much strain and stress of democrat overbearing the republicans, he feels it's martial law. what a doofus. __________________ "no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free. No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything. You cannot conquer a free man; the most you can do is kill him."

10-07-2008, 08:37 AM	#72 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Soldiers are for other places. Police are for here. When soldiers are here, acting as police, it's called "martial law". The army has, as of October first, stationed a unit inside the US to act as an on-call federal response in times of emergency. They are trained for domestic operations. It's a dedicated assignment that's intended to deal with "civil unrest" and "crowd control".

10-07-2008, 09:21 AM	#78 (permalink)
Cynthetiq Tilted Cat Head Administrator Location: Manhattan, NY	I don't disagree with that dc, but do you or I see military patroling the streets of DC (I'm not sure of DC since it isn't a state so military may move more easily there) or NYC? do you witness any servicemen containing and controlling people, setting curfew, or controlling sections of cities? I disagree with the sky is falling cry of declaration of martial law. __________________ I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not. What's the best nation in the world? DO-NATION!

10-07-2008, 09:23 AM	#79 (permalink)
Willravel ... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.	Thank you, DC. People from Fort Bragg can't normally be deployed to do crowd control during a protest. The 1st BCT can and likely will.

10-07-2008, 09:28 AM	#80 (permalink)
smooth Junkie Location: Right here	The point is that Cynthetiq is correct, this is not "martial law." Martial law usurps or is in place of civil law, it's not some quaint way of saying the soldiers are outside our houses. Last I checked we still have all our civil laws in place...even the brigade is under control of civil authorities or in joint with them. This folding of agencies under the umbrella of the dept. of homeland defense confuses things, but ultimately it still currently falls under civilian and not military command. __________________ "The theory of a free press is that truth will emerge from free discussion, not that it will be presented perfectly and instantly in any one account." -- Walter Lippmann "You measure democracy by the freedom it gives its dissidents, not the freedom it gives its assimilated conformists." -- Abbie Hoffman