Am I a sociopath?
 

I felt nothing when my grandmother died. But I faked the emotions I was supposed to very well.

I think I compulsively lie. That is, I often lie for no or little reason, or I lie for minor effects. Just so I'm seen in a slightly better light. I am really really good at this, do it automatically, and feel no guilt over it. I always leave out small parts of the truth, and am very quick and aware of it.

I manipulate people as an experiment. Even my own family members. I feel no guilt for this.

When I was a kid I loved killing animals (but not my own pets.) If someone elses pet threatened anything in my domain though (such as my pets) I wouldn't feel any remorse in killing them even though someone surely loves them.

I am a good thief. Never been caught. I feel no remorse over stealing from most stores or people. Won't steal from family members though.

If someone ever gives me reason enough (such as raping my mother) I'd love to hunt them down and torture them to death.

I don't care *at all* about people suffering in other countries or other parts of my country, like during major disasters.

I fantasize about stalking someone and raping them.

Hate comes easily. I find my friends more useful than "connected" with them. When something bad happens to them or their family I don't care at all and fake an emotional response.

I care almost nothing for the rights of others (only how they affect me) and will disregard them if I can get away with it.

I can't tolerate boredom.

I think of most consequences as how they'll affect me, rather than others.

I've never felt anything for either sex, romantically (just lust.)

Reasons I'm uncertain I'm a sociopath:
I've never tortured animals
violence sometimes freaks me out
I like my pets
Loyal to family in my own way

Am I just a well-adjusted (i.e. non murdering) sociopath?

The only thing I haven't done in your list is kill animals (except insects, I fucklin hate insects).

And maybe the lying, I stopped lying when I turned 17. You see, you don't have to lie to make yourself look better, cause no one (I mean NO ONE in this planet of 6 billion people) gives a shit what your stance on abortion is. That said, I still lie during job interviews and convince my prospective bosses that I really am baby Jesus.

I also wonder how old you are, anon, I honestly believe you will start developing and understanding complex emotions as you get older like myself. I too have been in a position when I only cared about myself. And don't get me wrong, you only care about yourself. The relationship you have developed with your family and emotional bonds with your pets is derived from a sense of continuous gratitude. They keep you so you keep them. If you are old and/or never change and they fail to provide you with whatever emotional sustenance that you need ... you will drop them like a hot potato. Even your mom, who it appears you will do anything for, if she fails you in some way and you no longer feel the love, that too, will change.

What I am trying to say is, if you don't change, then yes, you are and will remain, a sociopath.

I think it would depend on your answers to a couple of questions.

1. How old are you?

2. Do you believe that you're well-adjusted and otherwise without issues?

Sounds a bit sociopathic. Only a professional could tell for sure.

I am nearing 30 years old.

Not sure how to answer the second question jewels. I think fairly highly of myself.

You say you 'loved' killing animals but didn't torture them.
How many have you killed & what methods did you use to kill them?

Pellet guns and knives. Sometimes I'd pull their heads off. I must have killed 100s if not close to a 1000. From birds, squirrels, to frogs and snakes.

It seems like you have a pretty good idea of what can be considered anti-social personality traits & have spent some time looking it up on the net & such?

What is your biggest concern?
Are you worried that you might tip over into more violent or destructive behavior?

As Zeraph..said, Seeking professional advice would be wise.

A few of the sociopaths that I have known, hated the fact that they were like this & also
wished that people could..'see them coming' so to speak.

I'm not sure what else to say or ask.

I'm afraid to seek professional help cause I might be labeled. Can't think of a much worse label.

I just want to know for my own sake. If I am a sociopath then I can work toward being a good sociopath. Not for the sake of society but I fear the consequences of what might happen to me if I let my more violent impulses take control.

Heh, I just had a small chuckle because a little girl fell and hurt herself (crying loudly.) They always make so much noise and annoy me.

But I keep the facade up, I always give them their toys/balls back when they accidentally go over our fence.

Also, my cats missing. I don't really care. It'd be easier for him to disappear since he's getting old. Won't have to deal with putting him to sleep and vet bills.

Your a sociopath.

Now it seems as if you are posting to get a rise out someone.

I just had a small chuckle because you can see who is posting to this thread if you look at "who's on line." You are not cloaked there.

Goodbye.

Nope, not posting to get a rise. Its just freeing to tell the truth for once. And I also want to know for sure. Just giving more examples as some people still seemed unsure.

err is that a threat? I think this is exactly what anon posting is for.

---------- Post added at 08:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:27 PM ----------

SociopathWorld: Do sociopaths know they are sociopaths?

If you are posting to "get a rise", enjoy. I know there's an option to log on invisibly, so I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt; besides, the powers-that-be know. I enjoy playing shrink, so sue me. I wanna have fun, too.

IMO, you're not a sociopath but a pure narcissist. Lying and manipulation are experiments for you. People are here so you can test your own power. I think that killing animals may have been the same for you. Testing your strength and worth. The fact that you didn't torture them or talk about the joy it brought you gives us that subtle difference.

Thinking you're better than others is a trait that semi-intelligent people share. I say semi because most of y'all are much more educated than I am, but I still think I'm better/smarter than most people I know IRL. I think you probably come here because there are quite a few brainiacs here and you enjoy learning and sharing. That's another clue.

Not feeling a family member's death -- numbness. It could be that you just didn't like/love her, didn't know her, you're in denial, or you're glad she's no longer aging/in pain/whatever or most likely, you don't care. No matter which, it feels immature and egotistical. Not sociopathic.

You would care if someone raped your mother. Not sociopathic behavior. Rape fantasies? I've always had them. Sorry to disappoint, but nothing new. Boredom? Immaturity. Or a boring life? Back to pathological narcissism. For me, that's even scarier. I'm pretty sure it's considered a psychopathic behavior, but it should be treatable.

BTW, I don't believe that even you think you're sociopathic since you're afraid to go for help due to a potential label that you are attempting to put on yourself. A sociopath wouldn't fear a label. Granted, I'm not a psychiatrist, psychologist or social worker, so take my amateur analysis for what it's worth. However, I'd urge you to go see one since your post appears to be a cry for help.

I'm not. Ask Cynthetiq (spelling?) Cyn know who I am as I needed help posting anon. I've never once trolled or posted to get a rise. I'm a long time member of the tfp.

It brought me great joy to kill all those animals. I dissected a lot too, some were already dead. It was my favorite hobby.

err a clue for what? Yeah I'm a college graduate and usually play games that are considered "smart". A clue which way? I'd think sociopaths can be dumb or smart.

It definitely wasn't numbness. I cared not at all. Nor have I felt even a spark of caring any time her name is brought up and there is a moment of silence or something. The only thing I felt was annoyingness because I had a project to work on and I'd have to "console" my family and act all sad when all I wanted to do was homework.

Care because she is with me. She is mine. People shouldn't fuck with me if they want to live.

No, I'm honestly afraid of the label. It would ruin my charade. I'm not sure why you don't believe me. I'm not 100% sure I'm a sociopath because I'm not a psychiatrist and they have many labels but as time goes on and I think of more examples and I think I am.

If I really am a sociopath/psychopath no one must ever find out.

The times I mistook for empathy where either lust, or disgust, or something similar but not sympathy/empathy.

If I had the option to sacrifice everyone, including my family, on this world to gain immense power I would do it in a heart beat with no remorse.

Oh one more thing. I am definitely a sadist and a dom. Not saying they correlate or don't correlate to sociopathy. Just saying.

Even with pets I enjoy I like to hold them down sometimes until they freak out and yelp for help.

Boy these signs are pretty clear now. I can't believe it took me so long to see them.

Just not sure if I should seek professional help. I really don't want that label. Its worse than sex offender.

why bother with the vet bills?

cant you just take the cat out the back and pull out the pullet gun and dissecting knife?


is your reluctance for vet bills a sign that you're actually human?

Maybe, I don't know honestly. That's why I brought up this subject. Is it the risk of getting caught that stops me? Or actual emotional connection? Or a PTSD incidence. Don't know.

I don't believe that there's a Sociopath Registry. Still not getting what it is about the nomenclature ... perhaps you can enlighten further?

I found this interesting:

I Am a Sociopath. Can I Ever Learn to Love?

Well, I'm glad you posted anon. I have zero tolerance for people who hurt animals for fun.

I couldn't care less about what strangers do to each other, but animals? That's unacceptable.

You lack compassion, yet you are not devoid of it.

Can you seek to build on that?

Also, you've spoken at some length about your perspective of others. What do you think of yourself?

If you're not full of shit then you need to get yourself some professional help.

How can being labeled a sociopath be worse than being labeled a sex offender? You haven't actually done anything illegal (except for the things with the animals, which is illegal, of course). But the problem is not your fault, it's not because of something you've done. It's a neurological condition.

Posting all of this here is probably a game for you as much as anything else. We can't help you.

So, yeah, I'm not a shrink, but most of the things you describe sound like they were lifted straight from:

Antisocial personality disorder - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Of course, just like a lot of psychiatric problems, many, many people could look at this list and say "Oh, that's me!" ('promiscuity' for instance). So, if you really want to know, check it out with a shrink. Unless you convince him that you're about to go on a raping/killing spree, or tell him about crimes you've committed (save those for your priest), you'll be fine. The killing animals thing you'd probably get a pass for, as it sounds like you did it as a minor.

Consider it a challenge...it sounds like you aren't interested in getting help from a shrink, just a diagnosis. That should be easy enough if you're as good at manipulating people as you think you are.

What will you if you go to a shrink and he says "Yep, you're a sociopath."?

You are a sociopath, that simple, read a definition and you can check off everything you just said. Get therapy only thing I can say. It will not do anything for you except help monitor you, they can not build emotion that does not exist.

For those who experience empathy, it's difficult to imagine being in the mind of someone who doesn't. & vice versa.
As mixed so very well said: The problem is neurological.

I definitely have empathy for those who don't.
Interesting irony there.
I imagine living a life without feeling connected to my fellow humans beings in any way....being very lonely, frustrating & anger inducing.

People have varying degrees of anti-social behavior,
but when it gets to this point:

"If I had the option to sacrifice everyone, including my family, on this world to gain immense power I would do it in a heart beat with no remorse.".....

I focus my energies towards helping others stay safe from this type of societal menace.

Mr. Anonymous. I hear you. When you say you don't want the label of 'sociopath'
it's because you don't want anyone to interfere with your modus operandi.

It's a cruel neurological condition,
much like schizophrenia & other organic brain syndromes.

Hopefully one day.......we can fix this.

A source I trust says sociopaths cannot be treated by any form of therapy. The only effect therapy has on a sociopath is to make said sociopath more adept at working the system to their benefit. Therapy only builds a better (read conniving, sneaky, "cured") sociopath.

It makes sense, really. The general run of people have an enormous investment in energy, drive and intelligence that we allocate towards being interactive social animals. A sociopath by definition bypasses all that frou-frou of caring, empathy, yadda yadda yadda. Which means a sociopath can pour this surplus energy and focus into their own pleasure, interests, drives . . . really gives them an edge, actually.

I think the only real option for the OP is to research lines of work where high-functioning sociopaths are both successful, and cause the least amount of negative fallout from their own particular self-directed life arc. I recommend attempting the least amount of fallout course for the simple, selfish reason that it would cause them (i.e. the sociopath population) less grief in the long run. It is a poorly executed series of choices that result in spending their declining years locked into a cell 23 hours a day until they die. Trust me, society will hunt you down and lock you away if you don't show a certain degree of control and restraint when it comes to sharing this planet with us regular folk.

One problem with the ego of sociopaths is apparently their confidence in their own intelligence, and the soft-minded weak-willed stupidity of the sheep they live beside. Sociopaths often forget that we sheep have our own breeds of hunters who thrill at the prospect of tracking down and nailing oxygen thieves to the wall.

Actually I don't see a reason for the OP in the first place, except (as others point out) it is indulging in a form of trolling/game playing by Mr. Anonymous. But there is an interesting discussion taking place, and the links that ring referenced are reading for some cold winter's night.

Insightful great post, Kramus.
Thanks.

No, you're probably not a sociopath.

Go see a licensed therapist and get diagnosed so you can be properly treated. You won't regret it.

It looks like somebody's been doing some homework because half the shit you posted is on a bulleted list on the sociopath wikipedia page!

If what you say is true, you are all kinds of fucked up and need help. If you've really killed almost 1000 animals then you need to be doped up or something. Go to the doctor. Yes I know you love getting responses from us but if there's a chance you'll listen to my advice then I'll go for it.

I hate animal killers but from your point of view and your posting I can almost sympathize with you. You do these things and enjoy them and you know that it's not normal but how are you supposed to simply drop the feelings you have? How do you change who you are? Maybe 100mg of something will do the trick. Seriously, go talk to someone.

get thee to a professional and while you are out, check out a clergyperson too...

Do you fear discovering who you would be if you weren't a (whatever label is appropriate)? Do you wonder what parts of your personality would be left?
-----
Coming back, I have another thought. Perhaps it doesn't matter if you are a sociopath or a narcissist or something else. Those are just labels. Reading through your statements, it appears to me that you lack empathy. That is a condition, not a label. Even your reasoning in your mother-rape scenario has nothing to do with her; it has to do with you ("She is mine").

Can empathy be learned? I have no idea. But I believe that it would be a good place for you to start.

You're not a sociopath. You may be anti-social, a bit of a twat, and fancy yourself as being manipulative but you're not a sociopath. Sorry. I'm fairly certain you're just up to your characteristic self-indulgent games.

obviously you know this person...he is the kool aid in the poison at ugyana but not the poison...but non the less it killed the people. But he fancies himself as the agent who did the killing. What a tard...

I don't actually know this individual...but a leopard can't change it's spots. I could also be completely wrong.

Thanks guys. I don't take the negative feedback personally. I'm pretty sure a psychiatrist can't screw me over if I'm labeled a sociopath. I think I will seek help. Though I doubt I can change. Luckily I've already adjusted to this life. I no longer kill animals or anything like that (or very rarely). Although I see animals and humans on the same level and wouldn't mind...nevermind. Might be too incriminating.

Let's just say its been very tempting to 'pull' a Dexter (the tv show). However I am not admitting to anything. These are just fantasies....

I would move rule #7 to # 1


"Thirteen Rules for Dealing with Sociopaths in Everyday Life

1. The first rule involves the bitter pill of accepting that some people literally have no conscience, and that these people do not often look like Charles Manson or a Ferengi bartender. They look like us.

2. In a contest between your instincts and what is implied by the role a person has taken on -- educator, doctor, leader, animal-lover, humanist, parent -- go with your instincts.

Whether you want to be or not, you are a constant observer of human behavior, and your unfiltered impressions, though alarming and seemingly outlandish, may well help you out if you will let them. Your best self understands, without being told, that impressive and moral-sounding labels do not bestow conscience on anyone who did not have it to begin with.

3. When considering a new relationship of any kind, practice the Rule of Threes regarding the claims and promises a person makes, and the responsibilities he or she has.

Make the Rule of Threes your personal policy. One lie, one broken promise, or a single neglected responsibility may be a misunderstanding instead. Two may involve a serious mistake. But three lies says you're dealing with a liar, and deceit is the linchpin of conscienceless behavior. Cut your losses and get out as soon as you can. Leaving, though it may be hard, will be easier now than later, and less costly.

Do not give your money, your work, your secrets, or your affection to a three-timer. Your valuable gifts will be wasted.

4. Question authority.
Once again -- trust your own instincts and anxieties, especially those concerning people who claim that dominating others, violence, war, or some other violation of your conscience is the grand solution to some problem. Do this even when, or especially when, everyone around you has completely stopped questioning authority. Recite to yourself what Stanley Milgram taught us about obedience. (At least six out of ten people will blindly obey a present, official-looking authority to the bitter end.) The good news is that having social support makes people somewhat more likely to challenge authority. Encourage those around you to question, too.

5. Suspect flattery.
Compliments are lovely, especially when they are sincere. In contrast, flattery is extreme, and appeals to our egos in unrealistic ways. It is the material of counterfeit charm, and nearly always involves an intent to manipulate. Manipulation through flattery is sometimes innocuous and sometimes sinister. Peek over your massaged ego and remember to suspect flattery. This "flattery rule" applies on an individual basis, and also at the level of groups and even whole nations. Throughout all of human history and to the present, the call to war has included the flattering claim that one's own forces are about to accomplish a victory that will change the world for the better, a triumph that is morally laudable, justified by its humane outcome, unique in human endeavor, righteous, and worthy of enormous gratitude. Since we began to record the human story, all of our major wars have been framed in this way, on all sides of the conflict, and in all languages the adjective most often applied to the word war is the word holy. An argument can easily be made that humanity will have peace when nations of people are at last able to see through this masterful flattery.

6. If necessary, redefine your concept of respect.
Too often, we mistake fear for respect, and the more fearful we are of someone, the more we view him or her as deserving of our respect.

I have a spotted Bengal cat who was named Muscle Man by my daughter when she was a toddler, because even as a kitten he looked like a professional wrestler. Grown now, he is much larger than most other domestic cats. His formidable claws resemble those of his Asian leopard-cat ancestors, but by temperament, he is gentle and peace-loving. My neighbor has a little calico who visits. Evidently the calico's predatory charisma is huge, and she is brilliant at directing the evil eye at other cats. Whenever she is within fifty feet, Muscle Man, all fifteen pounds of him to her seven, cringes and crouches in fear and feline deference.

Muscle Man is a splendid cat. He is warm and loving, and he is close to my heart. Nonetheless, I would like to believe that some of his reactions are more primitive than mine. I hope I do not mistake fear for respect, because to do so would be to ensure my own victimization. Let us use our big human brains to overpower our animal tendency to bow to predators, so we can disentangle the reflexive confusion of anxiety and awe. In a perfect world, human respect would be an automatic reaction only to those who are strong, kind, and morally courageous. The person who profits from frightening you is not likely to be any of these.

The resolve to keep respect separate from fear is even more crucial for groups and nations. The politician, small or lofty, who menaces the people with frequent reminders of the possibility of crime, violence, or terrorism, and who then uses their magnified fear to gain allegiance is more likely to be a successful con artist than a legitimate leader. This too has been true throughout human history.

7. Do not join the game.
Intrigue is a sociopath's tool. Resist the temptation to compete with a seductive sociopath, to outsmart him, psychoanalyze, or even banter with him. In addition to reducing yourself to his level, you would be distracting yourself from what is really important, which is to protect yourself.

8. The best way to protect yourself from a sociopath is to avoid him, to refuse any kind of contact or communication.
Psychologists do not usually like to recommend avoidance, but in this case, I make a very deliberate exception. The only truly effective method for dealing with a sociopath you have identified is to disallow him or her from your life altogether. Sociopaths live completely outside of the social contract, and therefore to include them in relationships or other social arrangements is perilous. Begin this exclusion of them in the context of your own relationships and social life. You will not hurt anyone's feelings. Strange as it seems, and though they may try to pretend otherwise, sociopaths do not have any such feelings to hurt.
You may never be able to make your family and friends understand why you are avoiding a particular individual. Sociopathy is surprisingly difficult to see, and harder to explain. Avoid hi/her anyway.

If total avoidance is impossible, make plans to come as close as you can to the goal of total avoidance.

9. Question your tendency to pity too easily.
Respect should be reserved for the kind and the morally courageous. Pity is another socially valuable response, and should be reserved for innocent people who are in genuine pain or who have fallen on misfortune. If, instead, you find yourself often pitying someone who consistently hurts you or other people, and who actively campaigns for your sympathy, the chances are close to one hundred percent that you are dealing with a sociopath.

Related to this -- I recommend that you severely challenge your need to be polite in absolutely all situations. For normal adults in our culture, being what we think of as "civilized" is like a reflex, and often we find ourselves being automatically decorous even when someone has enraged us, repeatedly lied to us, or figuratively stabbed us in the back. Sociopaths take huge advantage of this automatic courtesy in exploitive situations.

Do not be afraid to be unsmiling and calmly to the point.

10. Do not try to redeem the unredeemable.
Second (third, fourth, and fifth) chances are for people who possess conscience. If you are dealing with a person who has no conscience, know how to swallow hard and cut your losses.

At some point, most of us need to learn the important if disappointing life lesson that, no matter how good our intentions, we cannot control the behavior-- let alone the character structures-- of other people. Learn this fact of human life, and avoid the irony of getting caught up in the same ambition he has-- to control.

If you do not desire control, but instead want to help people, then help only those who truly want to be helped. I think you will find this does not include the person who has no conscience.

The sociopath's behavior is not your fault, not in any way whatsoever. It is also not your mission. Your mission is your own life.

11. Never agree, out of pity or for any other reason, to help a sociopath conceal his or her true character.

"Please don't tell," often spoken tearfully and with great gnashing of teeth, is the trademark plea of thieves, child abusers-- and sociopaths. Do not listen to this siren-song. Other people deserve to be warned more than sociopaths deserve to have you keep their secrets.

If someone without conscience insists that you "owe" him or her, recall what you are about to read here-- that "You owe me" has been the standard line of sociopaths for thousands of years, quite literally, and is still so. It is what Rasputin told the Empress of Russia. It is what Hannah's father implied to her, after her eye-opening conversation with him at the prison.

We tend to experience "You owe me" as a compelling claim, but it is simply not true. Do not listen. Also, ignore the one that goes, "You are just like me." You are not.

12. Defend your psyche.
Do not allow someone without conscience, or even a string of such people, to convince you that humanity is a failure. Most human beings do possess conscience. Most human beings are able to love.

13. Living well is the best revenge."

If you are a sociopath I would expect you to act in your own self interest.

Posting on this forum about your 'problems,' hinting about murder, or even committing murder a la Dexter is not pragmatic, it's dumb.

He's a sociopath. You guys can try to demonize the word sociopath as much as possible but even if he hasn't killed as many animals as he says he has, he already claims to not feel anything for other human beings besides lust. Maybe he doesn't have the stones to do the things he says he's done ... maybe maybe maybe maybe, but as this is an online forum, I have to take him at face value.

So, if he doesn't have empathy, then he's a sociopath. Simple definition. Varying degrees.

Fantasies... Also, why do you assume sociopaths would automatically know they are sociopaths? I assumed everyone was like me up until this point. I have to find out someway.

Ring- See? This is why I don't want to be outed. No one would interact with me.

I've never seen this listing of sociopaths and psychopaths. Those damned doctors, breaking their hippocratic oaths!

WTF are you talking about? Even if you posted that you were diagnosed in your Anonymous status, we still don't know who you are. And you have no obligation to post a diagnosis at all.

Methinks you care too much or are having way too much fun.

I was referring to real life, and this thread being a parallel. I'm scared what the doctors and friends would do. Is being a sociopath automatically being a threat to others? Therefor they could do whatever they wanted with me.

Its a secret that I'd actually like to share. I have an inquisitive mind. Since I'm currently doing nothing illegal I'd like to explore it.

Any questions?

What are your current friendships like?
Have any of your friends or family members noticed your lack of empathy?
How do they treat you?

Friendships are based on what they can do for me. As soon as they become worthless they are no longer in my life. Luckily I'm male, so this isn't a huge change. As guys usually only have friends for specific activities. Once a friend becomes useless I manipulate them into thinking we no longer can pursue that activity for one reason or another. I've gotten extremely good at fake excuses.

So my current friendships are all based on activities that I enjoy.

Since, oh about 14 years old I've gotten good at pretending to be sympathetic. My family hasn't noticed. They thought it was depression until I mastered it.

I actually recently told two of my family members that I think I'm a sociopath and they didn't believe me! So good is my illusion of empathy.

I actually get treated better than most people because I can mirror exactly what they want in a friend. It's easier to see as a sociopath I think. Till I get what I want anyways. This isn't as bad as it sounds, often "friendships" from the outside are fairly "normal." I let them down easy because I don't like to burn bridges, never know when I might need to call on them again, or if they become useful again.

(Yes I have to admit I'm enjoying this thread.)

But none of this is my fault. I was born or raised this way. I don't think there's anything I can do. Right now I'm trying to find other sociopaths on the web and see if doctors have helped them or if there's any going back.

Probably the suckiest part of being a sociopath is I'll never experience love the same way you do. To me its just a word I have no idea of its meaning. To me it means "extremely useful."

If he was a sociopath then by definition he also wouldn't care that he's a sociopath because the very concept would be neurologically excluded to him. He displays far more in line with narcissism and antisocial personality issues than he does with actual sociopathy.

I'm experiencing the uncomfortable sensation of not caring about you. Damnit!

"I actually recently told two of my family members that I think I'm a sociopath and they didn't believe me!"

What was your motivation for telling your family?

To see what would happen and how I might manipulate the situation.

I don't think that's true. It's not like sociopaths aren't curious. We aren't devoid of all emotion, just empathy (or is it sympathy?) I'm only 90% sure I'm a sociopath. I enjoy exploring the situation and seeing people's reactions and how I might still manipulate them even if they know. Its like a challenge.

Sociopath isn't really a term used anymore, which is part of why I said probably not above. The closest thing now is antisocial personality disorder, but you need to be properly diagnosed by a licensed professional to know for sure. Self-diagnosis in psychology isn't often accurate. Once you're diagnosed, you can be properly treated.

For what it's worth, based on what knowledge I have (I am not a licensed professional), it seems unlikely a sociopath would create a thread like this. While some of what you describe could fit the diagnostic criteria of antisocial personality disorder, it's far from a certain diagnosis. Again, make an appointment with a licensed psychologist.

:paranoid:

This does not seem consistent with your post about your abusive boyfriend who you stayed with for five years.

http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/tilted-life/154033-there-such-thing-damaged-goods.html

Either some wild sarcasm was being used or there is more than one person using the account called Anonymous Member. I don't know. You tell me.

Anyone can post anonymous. So you can't exactly tell if it's them, but Admins could. However, I feel that's way off topic.

OK - I'll bite. Just this one post and then I'm not playing anymore.

So I am a psychiatrist, and yes, you probably are a psychopath.

I am a mental health professional (Kramus' "reliable source"), but the only way for you to get a reliable diagnosis is through assessment by a forensic psychiatrist specially trained in administering the Hare PCL-R - a clinician-rated psychopathy checklist. Although I find the area fascinating, I am not trained in the PCL-R and I am far from a forensic psychiatrist. You'd have to commit a crime in order to see a forensic psychiatrist, so let's try not to go there, OK?

You don't need the label - antisocial personality disorder, sociopath, psychopath - they are all the same thing, just older and newer terms. You know what traits you have, you're trying to understand them and decide what to do with them. In some ways, that's commendable - in every way, this kind of self-reflection and evaluation is understandable. Sort of cool that you're turning to TFP to act as your mirror and scope out what the common denominator looks like. The internet is amazing - I wonder how many psychopaths have had that opportunity in the past?

You are more than a Narcissistic Personality Disorder. Narcissists lack empathy and are self-centred, but they do have a moral compass and are capable of guilt and narcissistic injury. Narcissism is more like a psychological defense, an overcompensation for profound and deep seated low self-worth. Psychopaths are something entirely different - it's not a psychological defense - there is some biological aberrant circuitry going on. Have a look through Barb Oakley's Evil Genes (a fun read actually) to see the evidence for the biological loading.

So here's my take. Most clinicians see the primary defect in psychopathy as a lack of capacity for empathy (fascinating topic - mirror neurons and empathy - there are other conditions associated with hyper-empathy which can lead to pathological altruism - but that's a whole other thread). I actually think the empathy circuits must be intact - theory of mind (the ability to imagine what another feels) and empathy (to feel what others feel) are very tightly linked neurologically - and are very necessary capacities for being a good manipulator. Maybe a psychopath knows what you feel, but doesn't care - but I suspect it's got more to do with a problem in moral judgment (ability to feel guilt). Secondarily, I think the moral defect may be socially acquired.

What if the psychopath is born with a defect in the emotional attachment system (ability to form emotional bonds, another whole separate topic) - and that difference ostracizes them from their loved ones from the get go. Children need to feel attached to their parents to care about behaving well, etc. The psychopathic child must be constantly reprimanded for not caring enough to correct their behaviour, constantly told they are selfish, wrong, bad - but unlike "normal" children, the inherent selfishness which is part of being human and must socialized out of us by our parents, doesn't get socialized out of psychopaths. I wonder if all that punitive conditioning fuels cruelty, distrust and a need for control, and the chronic absence of emotional bonds fuels feelings of emptiness, which can become almost painful. In order to feel something, to test if they can feel anything, the psychopathic child tortures animals to see if some feelings can be invoked (sort of like people with borderline personality disorder, who cut themselves in order to feel something). The pattern continues into adulthood, where peers also reject and malign them (as is illustrated by the perspective of many on this thread), further fueling anti-social desires.

In short, what I'm saying is that it's not really that psychopaths are untreatable - it's that we don't understand their biology and psychology well enough to know how to treat them. The psychotherapeutic approach we've taken so far is wrong, it is based on trying to establish a therapeutic relationship and providing empathy and that only makes for a better psychopath. It is also likely delivered too late - to criminals in prison. The key may be to catch the psychopathic child and provide that child with an informed, supportive and therapeutic relationship.

- or to catch early adult psychopaths, on the cusp of self-discovery like the OP, before he's done anything serious. There you go - my attempt at being supportive and empathic with you. What you do with it is up to you - become a better psychopath or a better person. You have no real control (or blame) for how you feel, you can only control (and be accountable for) your actions.

You are a politician

I think he should run for office too.

We are suppose to teach empathy to kids. Not sure how much you can learn later in your life.

Thanks for that list, ring. I've bumped into such personality in another forum, the description fits perfectly. My method was to avoid them completely, but since this person was hoarding everyone to become a "friend", it meant, it was practically impossible to get closer with others... I'm also unsure whether it was about narcissism or something else.

Funny story I just remembered. I met another sociopath in high school though I didn't particularly realize it at the time (didn't have the concept, thought of him as more of a potential serial killer.)

He described something he did to pets that was a phobia of mine. I ironically, seriously considered murdering him. Consequences only holding me back.

I never did of course, but its a funny story, when one sociopath meets another.

funny, as in, strange? or funny ha-ha?

Hah, both I guess. Not sure. Ironic might be a better term. Either way I laugh about it now.

If thoughts could kill, the humankind would have seized to exist long time ago.

LOL!!! I had to quote this. It's just so appropriate!

Unrelated: I instantly get angry when someone asks me "Whats wrong" when I'm laughing. Since when is laughing an indication of something that could be wrong? Laughing brings you joy and if you associate humor with the "wrong" category, thats merely an indication of your own sick psyche.

OP, don't ever kill anyone or anything. This is something you will not understand and everyone else will tell you but you won't appreciate it. Human beings are capable of bonds and connections that surpass arousal. If you do kill anyone or anything, said bond will compel whoever is on the other end to hunt you down and bring you to justice.

Xerxys- I don't plan to. Consequences are too high. I'd kill myself if I had to go to prison for even a year. Besides, I'm pretty sure I have some principles, based on logic and arrogance.

Saw a professional. Turns out not a sociopath. I wished I was one because I was abused as a kid and I get that fear reaction too much and feel too strongly. I've buried my emotions for years (but still feel the physiological effects). So it appeared to me, who isn't a very good viewer, that I might be a sociopath. But I'm not, just another screwed up adult because he had bad parents.

Well, it's a nice story and all, but I'm gonna call bullshit on this one. Nice try, but your responses show clearly that you are taking what people are saying and expanding on it, either to get a rise outta people or just because you are bored and need some Lulz, either way, I don't think you are being truthful about anything you have posted.

To be fair, Anonymous did contact Cynthetiq about this thread, so i dont have reason to believe that Anonymous is being nothing but honest here since he/she disclosed their identity to staff regarding this thread.

do you have an example of this 'bullshit'?

maybe Anon is a compulsive liar? is that a part of a psychpaths repetoire?


Anon, how do you feel about the diagnosis or mis-diagnosis?

As far as I'm concerned, he would lie to the staff member just to be able to play that card and manipulate us all. He is an admitted compulsive liar and manipulator, if that's not reason enough to question everything he says, I don't know what is. I pointed out what made it sound to me like he was lying, refer to my previous post for said examples.

dlish- I feel both good and bad. I was wishing I was one because I didn't want to feel anything. But it turns out that's not even part of the definition of a sociopath. Good because I'm relieved, I don't have to worry about doing something beyond the norm later in life. Bad, because well, I have some problems and I can't blame it on something like being a sociopath.

Crimghost- err how am I posting anything to get a rise out of anyone? I'm an old member and this is my first anon post. If I was into that I would have been banned years ago. Seriously, say I was a sociopath, in what way would that be my fault? In what way would exploring that with the wise people of the TFP be "getting a rise" out of people? I really don't get where you're coming from.

Anyway, if you still truly believe I'm trolling then the best thing to do is not post here anymore. A troll without replies is just a post. Err it seemed like I had cool saying there for a second. But you get what I mean?

Without knowing who this is, I think I'd trust him with to tell us the truth more than you. He's at least responsible enough to read and respond to PM's about his behavior on TFP.

I used to think that I was a sociopath. It worried me for a while. Eventually I think I realized that there's a difference between not letting yourself feel empathy because you don't want to deal with the ramifications and not being able to feel empathy through no choice of your own.

Same here Filtherton. I imagine quite a few people have had the same concerns.
I am curious (nosey?) tho, if Anon shared the same info.with his Doc, as he did here.

It feels like none of my business & too personal question to ask.
But I guess this thread's delving into some very personal stuff already.


Unlearning some of the coping behaviors one learns at an early age growing up in a dysfunctional family can take time. Been there.

I hope you continue to talk to & trust your professional person, Anon. Best wishes to you.
http://www.mudrashram.com/dysfunctionalfamily2.html

I'm not really interested in the specific diagnosis. Do you have any steps to take towards gaining empathy? Are you going to continue to see this professional?

Hi, Anon.

You posted this thread as 'Anonymous' to avoid being ousted by people who have known you for a long time on this forum. You have succeeded in building and maintaining relationships both on this forum and in offline-life. You judge this to be a demonstration of your skills of deception and manipulation. Fair enough.

Now, you've got your professional feedback, and one outcome is that you are no longer afraid that you might do stuff which would get you into the kind of trouble you'd have imagined you'd do is you 'had' been a sociopath.

That was your stated concern, so by your own account, you are in the clear - no longer 'sociopath' but a guy whose past influenced him to be the way he is now, and whose behaviours are likely to 'fit in' well enough to evade ousting or ostracism etc.

Now that's sorted, is there anything further which is problematical in your experience? Or can we mark this thread "Solved" such that further discussion be more casual academic interest?

With or without professional help, what are your next steps?

Well my next steps are to think more with my emotions. I think the rational part of my brain is pretty much permanently like it is (cold, manipulating). Its going to be hard. But I've already started opening up to family members about how I feel for no other reason than to talk about it (no alterier motives).

Another step may be to find a job that fits me. I would think a homicide detective for instance, would be well suited. Though I have no particular interest there.

As far as solved, no not solved for me. Hopefully solved for the TFP. I'd prefer this thread to die. Now that I'm opening up in a way I almost feel guilty for some reason....not sure why, my emotional IQ isn't that high yet. Hopefully it will continue to scale, hopefully not too much damage has been done, and my emotional side can equal my cold rational side.

In the spirit of TFP though I will remain open to questions.

I suspect that once you start allowing yourself to feel again you'll find that the more you do it the easier it gets and the better you get at dealing with your emotions. You may also be surprised about the things that end up moving you.

Hi Anon

So be it, until such time as you might choose to confer again.

And all respect and best wishes for the course you're charting.